Teachers Strike March 26th

[Haydos]

Anyone that willingly spends 50+ hours of their week working is ****ing insane.

Work to live, don't live to work.

Fair enough if you're doing overtime in spells to save for a holiday or a car or something but doing it indefinitely and just accepting it?

Fuuuuck no.

 

Agreed, bit odd when people boast about the amount of hours they work and come very close to looking down on people that work normal hours. 

[ADK]

Anyone that willingly spends 50+ hours of their week working is ****ing insane.

Work to live, don't live to work.

Fair enough if you're doing overtime in spells to save for a holiday or a car or something but doing it indefinitely and just accepting it?

Fuuuuck no.

 

 

This.

[Thracian]

You really think that literacy is poor because teachers aren't working hard enough? I think it has more to do with the educational system they are forced to operate in.

 

 

Did I say that? Not at all and nor did I mean or imply it. I simply said they'd be better off working harder to improve the situation rather than causing further, and doubtless politically motivated, disruption.

 

My mother was a teacher and I know exactly when and why standards started to fall. I also try to look after a couple of deprived families whose kids hardly ever do any homework and never enjoy the peace and quiet necessary to make homework effective in any case.

 

Kids need a good example for a start and this strike is anything but. Even the NUT referred to "a general election being just around the corner". I really don't remember socialist administrations being so marvellous for the advancement of learning, quite the contrary in far too many instances.

 

Couldn't agree more with AoWW's comment about "amazing" teachers. And they're the ones who should be best rewarded - the people who put in the effort and improve their charges most effectively.    

[Rincewind]

Some of the hours people do are illegal. There are supposed to be so many hours between shifts. Think its about seven. But it seems they have to be done to pay bills and people dare not object for fear of losing their job.

[leicsmac]

Did I say that? Not at all and nor did I mean or imply it. I simply said they'd be better off working harder to improve the situation rather than causing further, and doubtless politically motivated, disruption.

 

My mother was a teacher and I know exactly when and why standards started to fall. I also try to look after a couple of deprived families whose kids hardly ever do any homework and never enjoy the peace and quiet necessary to make homework effective in any case.

 

Kids need a good example for a start and this strike is anything but. Even the NUT referred to "a general election being just around the corner". I really don't remember socialist administrations being so marvellous for the advancement of learning, quite the contrary in far too many instances.

 

What exactly do you suggest they do that they're not doing already, other than obviously not strike?

 

You say you know exactly 'when and why standards started to fall'? Please, go ahead and enlighten. It would be interesting.

[Rincewind]

Obvious. When Labour was in power.

[Guest MattP]

What exactly do you suggest they do that they're not doing already, other than obviously not strike?

 

You say you know exactly 'when and why standards started to fall'? Please, go ahead and enlighten. It would be interesting.

 

When is indisputable, it dropped severly from 2000-2007. You can find 100 articles and external audits showing it. It has still been falling in the last few years.

 

Ed Balls was involved with the education secretary ffs, is it really surprising standards fell?, the guy is the opposite of King Midas, everything he touches turns to shit, the bloke could fcuk up a cup of coffee.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1571444/Britain-nosedives-in-education-league-tables.html

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-24433320

 

The only country falling faster than us is the USA.

 

 

How the hell you spot it I have no idea, with inferior cultures like the American one influencing children, reality TV "stardom" becoming the aspiration of most and the horrific scene of technology exceeding the human brain to an extent people would rather have a conversation on a phone than face to face, I dread to think what a solution is.

Obvious. When Labour was in power.

 

Absolutely, it's not a secret, the figures and facts are there.

[leicsmac]

When is indisputable, it dropped severly from 2000-2007. You can find 100 articles and external audits showing it. It has still been falling in the last few years.

 

Ed Balls was involved with the education secretary ffs, is it really surprising standards fell?, the guy is the opposite of King Midas, everything he touches turns to shit, the bloke could fcuk up a cup of coffee.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1571444/Britain-nosedives-in-education-league-tables.html

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-24433320

 

The only country falling faster than us is the USA.

 

 

How the hell you spot it I have no idea, with inferior cultures like the American one influencing children, reality TV "stardom" becoming the aspiration of most and the horrific scene of technology exceeding the human brain to an extent people would rather have a conversation on a phone than face to face, I dread to think what a solution is.

 

Absolutely, it's not a secret, the figures and facts are there.

 

 

Fair enough. Is that to do with the teachers do you think, or political meddling? 

[Guest MattP]

Fair enough. Is that to do with the teachers do you think, or political meddling? 

 

I think it's a combination of everything.

 

Mobile phones, text speak, culture, television, politicians, target setting, lack of discipline. Too many to go through when I'm sat typing on a Mobile. Teachers do seem inferior though to my day, some of the ones on my timeline on Facebook are, to put it bluntly, "thick as pigshit". A teacher on my timeline last year said the education system paid for itself as they "pay tax as well" - Where do you start with that sort of belief?

 

Though that could be a combination of me growing up myself and the fact I went to a pretty decent school. Let's face it if you can't come across as bright and intelligent to a load of 11-16 year olds when you are a fully grown adult you never will.

[Thracian]

What exactly do you suggest they do that they're not doing already, other than obviously not strike?

 

You say you know exactly 'when and why standards started to fall'? Please, go ahead and enlighten. It would be interesting.

 

 

 

If you think I'm going to write a condensed book on educational reform you've got no chance. I've done quite enough of my own teaching thanks - both in schools and elsewhere - without needing or presuming to lecture others on the subject.

 

My comments were intended to relate to the strike - not to be the blue touchpaper for a debate on all that's right and wrong within our schools and colleges. 

 

Suffice to say my eldest grandson will be doing his degree courses in Madrid - and even I'm excited by the opportunity they're offering.      

[leicsmac]

I think it's a combination of everything.

 

Mobile phones, text speak, culture, television, politicians, target setting, lack of discipline. Too many to go through when I'm sat typing on a Mobile. Teachers do seem inferior though to my day, some of the ones on my timeline on Facebook are, to put it bluntly, "thick as pigshit". A teacher on my timeline last year said the education system paid for itself as they "pay tax as well" - Where do you start with that sort of belief?

 

Though that could be a combination of me growing up myself and the fact I went to a pretty decent school. Let's face it if you can't come across as bright and intelligent to a load of 11-16 year olds when you are a fully grown adult you never will.

 

I reckon the inferior teachers were around before too...they were just much less difficult to get to know about outside of their individual schools. 

 

Do agree that the massively changing technological culture has made a big difference to modern society including teaching. Some of it is for the better, some of it for the much worse - how much of each depends on who you talk to. I do think there is far more superficial bullshit now than there was, but then people who remember when they had good times always view change suspiciously and the new is never as good as the old. That's been humans all the way down.

 

The "public workers paying tax" thing does sound absurd, but honestly I think education (and health, come to that) is something that is beyond monetary value anyway. It's a fvcking cold world if we put a material price on someones health, life or acquisition knowledge - but that is just the way it is, I guess. Governments always seem to find money to pay the military contractors, but when the school needs new books the coffers apparently seem to be empty.

[leicsmac]

If you think I'm going to write a condensed book on educational reform you've got no chance. I've done quite enough of my own teaching thanks - both in schools and elsewhere - without needing or presuming to lecture others on the subject.

 

My comments were intended to relate to the strike - not to be the blue touchpaper for a debate on all that's right and wrong within our schools and colleges. 

 

Suffice to say my eldest grandson will be doing his degree courses in Madrid - and even I'm excited by the opportunity they're offering.      

 

Fair enough - perhaps I came across as confrontational there but the absolutist tone of your post with no evidence written down to back it up riled me some. Obviously you know and have experience of the education industry that's led you to believe what you believe...but others think differently.

 

FWIW I agree with you in that strike action probably going to help matters, but (unrelated to that) I honestly don't know what more ordinary teachers can do to improve school standards.

[Captain...]

As I said in another thread, I do believe the education of our young to be far more important than people who move money around, and it should be paid well to reflect that, so many of today's problems can be traced back to poor education.

 

If the teachers believe that these changes being imposed on them are going to negatively affect their ability to teach then I support them in voicing their frustration, but when the government isn't listening then they are only left with the option of industrial action, as unfortunate and frustrating as that may be.

 

Teachers are in a much better position to judge this impact than anyone else on here, and this trend for teacher bashing is an odd one, it is an incredibly tough job and one that should be monitored heavily to ensure a high quality of teaching.

[Guest MattP]

FWIW I agree with you in that strike action probably going to help matters, but (unrelated to that) I honestly don't know what more ordinary teachers can do to improve school standards.

 

Given that most teachers who are in the professional today have been the ones who have presided over the nations decline in International standards over the last 10-12 years, why should the public hold the belief they have any idea how to improve standards?

[Christoph]

As a someone that is currently working as a teacher...I'm very surprised by the amount of teacher bashing in here. It is a very hard job and like someone said, you'd be surprised by the amount of people that drop out of it. It can become very stressful and I'm not sure most people really understand it. 

[leicsmac]

Given that most teachers who are in the professional today have been the ones who have presided over the nations decline in International standards over the last 10-12 years, why should the public hold the belief they have any idea how to improve standards?

 

You do actually have a point there. They shouldn't need to have ideas on how to improve standards, because that isn't their job. Their job is to educate and assess as best they can in a constantly changing educational system. They should be left to actually teach, not having to come up with radical new ideas to 'raise standards' and then get pilloried when it doesn't happen.

 

Why should the public be going after teachers for something that is not their responsibility? 

 

People grossly overestimate the power of teachers and underestimate the power of politics and parents in todays educational system. Teachers aren't the ones making educational curricula and policy, nor should they be. But the public seems to think they're the only ones responsible for the 'decline in standards' caused by the constantly changing educational system of the last decade and a half or so.

[Guest MattP]

You do actually have a point there. They shouldn't need to have ideas on how to improve standards, because that isn't their job. Their job is to educate and assess as best they can in a constantly changing educational system. They should be left to actually teach, not having to come up with radical new ideas to 'raise standards' and then get pilloried when it doesn't happen.

 

Why should the public be going after teachers for something that is not their responsibility? 

 

People grossly overestimate the power of teachers and underestimate the power of politics and parents in todays educational system. Teachers aren't the ones making educational curricula and policy, nor should they be. But the public seems to think they're the only ones responsible for the 'decline in standards' caused by the constantly changing educational system of the last decade and a half or so.

 

Agree on the top part.

 

The public aren't going after teachers because of that, they are going after them because they are having to lose a days wages themselves to look after their own children because some of them want to stay off for a day because they now have to pay the same in contributions in pensions as everyone else does, that is going to stir up the blood. One was moaning about pay freezes, that shows the planet these are living on given the decline in wages over the last few years.

 

The real blame lays at Brown's door though, he promised these completely unaffordable pensions and they signed up to it (as anyone would have given that a 30 year old was were buying a pension for about £70,000 that cost more than double that on the private market), just another in the long list of people who he tried to bribe to stay in power, the man who stole your age. We'd probably be retiring at 75 had he got a second term.

 

We get a "I'm going on strike but" which appears have becomes the public sector's version of the "I'm not racist but" as I think a lot of them realise it's not really the right thing to do, using children as pawns in a personal or political war isn't right.

 

From what I read the teaching unions hold far too much power in our educational system. There is clearly a need for reform so we can have a much more flexible education policy that can change and adapt to 21st century needs. The Unions are getting in the way of that change.

 

It's important to mention though that most teachers will not be striking tomorrow. They are in the main good people who really care about their profession.

[Parafox]

 

It's important to mention though that most teachers will not be striking tomorrow. They are in the main good people who really care about their profession.

 

Only one union is striking tomorrow, the rest will be at work. 

 

I think you'll find that otherwise, most teachers would have been out tomorrow

 

[Parafox]

damn this slow computer

[Jon the Hat]

Doesn't seem to be a strike at my daughters fee paying prep school.

[cambridgefox]

Daughters school striking( senior)

Sons school not striking( primary)

[Foxhateram]

Given that most teachers who are in the professional today have been the ones who have presided over the nations decline in International standards over the last 10-12 years, why should the public hold the belief they have any idea how to improve standards?

The goal posts of achieving higher levels have changed dramatically in those years, therefore unfairly skewing any facts about international standings. Furthermore, the expectation from OFSTED and other governing bodies has risen two and fold recently, meaning that teaching is BETTER now than it has previously been.

I'm not going to rant here because ignorance among lots of you towards teaching is clearly evident and to be honest I don't and shouldn't have to explain myself to you. However, I would like to say that I do more than 60 hours a week, my pension contributions for my age are already fecking huge ( not ever going to get all my money back if I can't retire till I'm 68 am I?) and the job is ridiculously stressful, harder than anything else I have tried which includes many career attempts. The expectation and workload means that it is impossible not to do a 60 hour week.

I put in extra hours that are not appreciated or paid for, I put in my own money which is not accounted for and I work through pretty much 90% of these holidays that you are all quoting ( it is more of a planning week, than a holiday). I also get paid far less than the hours I work and in all honesty get paid jack all considering what I have to do for these kids on a daily basis.

I have become Dad pretty much to these kids, I have to assess them for mental health issues, I have to nurse them if their ill, care for them if they have an accident, assess if they have a special need, support them if they have extra needs, council so,em of them to build self esteem, council others for behavioural issues ( While being punched and kicked) and on top of all this, yep thats right I have to get them to reach ever increasing and unrealistic targets.

Performance pay will be based on wether the kids make outstanding progress in a year and meet national average, this doesn't take into account any of the extras I have listed above, doesn't take into account that actually a child is a living thing and therefore many factors that are out of my control could be affecting their progress, and it also assumes that all children are from a supportive background. Well as I'm sure you've guessed I don't work with kids that fit in that category, so it's fair that I don't get my pay rise?

You try doing all of those jobs in one day, then tell me that I don't deserve a small amount of holiday, a decent pension and the right to reject kids having to spend more time at school when we already burn them out by expecting too much of them in our current school day. That doesn't account for the extra stress and workload it puts on an already straining set of staff members.

Ok so I ranted, but some of you need to get your facts straight before writing stereotypical shite!

Written on my ipad in a hurry so punctuation and spelling is attrocious. Aplogies.

[AoWW]

Written on my ipad in a hurry

 

Lazy, good-for-nothing, whinging teachers shouldn't have luxuries such as ipads.

[Saxondale]

My misses isn't striking.

She'll be in the classroom, as usual, trying to teach 35 hyperactive little cretins whilst playing diplomat to the jumped-up, pampered animals and trying to avoid being kicked and bitten.

She'll then have parents evening, during which a bunch of uneducated parents will tell her how to do her job and refuse to accept any comments about their children that contradict the idea that they are faultless angels.

[fleckneymike]