Trump Triumphs

[EnderbyFox]

 

[EnderbyFox]

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[Guest]

18 minutes ago, Watson said:

This is interesting too

 

I wonder is those polls are similar to the UK brexit polls. So the media says all people that voted brexit are uneducated, yet I know some fairly well paid people who voted to leave.

[GazzinderFox]

Sage advice to liberals from the Guardian's (of all places) comments section...

 

"This is really so easy. This could have ALL been avoided. How to stop Trump:

1. STOP, for the LOVE of GOD, STOP peddling identity politics. Trump voters - working class people - despise it. They know what you're doing - it's obvious.

2. STOP treating ethnicity, gender, sexuality and religion as a proxy for class warfare; you are trying to displace them by creating a new under-class and stoking ethnocentrism, gynocentrism and tribalism for the purpose of manufacturing a new electorate and a globalised, supranational governance that NO-ONE wants.

3. STOP speaking about groups, start speaking about individuals (you know, actual liberalism).

4. Stop polarising ALL debate. Just because you aren't rabidly pro-feminism, it doesn't make you a misogynist. Just because you aren't rabidly in favour of the EU, it doesn't make you a fascist. Just because you don't support black lives matter, it doesn't make you a white supremacist. Just because you don't support SSM, it doesn't make you a homophobe.

5. Stop pushing mass immigration for the purposes of creating a new electorate. They know what you're doing. Every minority group in the UK is opposed to mass immigration. Even Hispanics are opposed to mass immigration, and are more conservative - on a policy basis - and religious than white males.

6. Stop preaching cultural relativism; if you oppose something for one identity, oppose it for ALL identities. Murder doesn't suddenly become more acceptable because the perpetrator is Islamic; sexism doesn't become more acceptable because the perpetrator is female; racism doesn't become more acceptable because the hatred is being spewed at white men.

Get it? Until all of this STOPS, until we start to assign rights and responsibilities at the level of the individual and not the group, until all of the incessant shaming, self-loathing and guilt-tripping subsides, this will get infinitely worse."

[WarehamFox]

58 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Yeah, because the "right" really didn't flip out at the idea of a black President and what is being discussed re Trump now wasn't said by them too when Obama was in office.

 

Attempting to claim some kind of moral high ground is laughable.

Read my post and I never said anything about the "right", I replied to a quote saying the "democratic lefties" are calling for Trump to be shoot. I'm neither left or right when it comes to politics. So please don't miss quote me, go and read post again and you can have your moral high ground. 

[Richard]

8 minutes ago, Shaneb said:

I wonder is those polls are similar to the UK brexit polls. So the media says all people that voted brexit are uneducated, yet I know some fairly well paid people who voted to leave.

the sample size is so small it's almost impossible to read anything meaningful from it

[Guest MattP]

 

6 minutes ago, GazzinderFox said:

Sage advice to liberals from the Guardian's (of all places) comments section...

 

"This is really so easy. This could have ALL been avoided. How to stop Trump:

1. STOP, for the LOVE of GOD, STOP peddling identity politics. Trump voters - working class people - despise it. They know what you're doing - it's obvious.

2. STOP treating ethnicity, gender, sexuality and religion as a proxy for class warfare; you are trying to displace them by creating a new under-class and stoking ethnocentrism, gynocentrism and tribalism for the purpose of manufacturing a new electorate and a globalised, supranational governance that NO-ONE wants.

3. STOP speaking about groups, start speaking about individuals (you know, actual liberalism).

4. Stop polarising ALL debate. Just because you aren't rabidly pro-feminism, it doesn't make you a misogynist. Just because you aren't rabidly in favour of the EU, it doesn't make you a fascist. Just because you don't support black lives matter, it doesn't make you a white supremacist. Just because you don't support SSM, it doesn't make you a homophobe.

5. Stop pushing mass immigration for the purposes of creating a new electorate. They know what you're doing. Every minority group in the UK is opposed to mass immigration. Even Hispanics are opposed to mass immigration, and are more conservative - on a policy basis - and religious than white males.

6. Stop preaching cultural relativism; if you oppose something for one identity, oppose it for ALL identities. Murder doesn't suddenly become more acceptable because the perpetrator is Islamic; sexism doesn't become more acceptable because the perpetrator is female; racism doesn't become more acceptable because the hatred is being spewed at white men.

Get it? Until all of this STOPS, until we start to assign rights and responsibilities at the level of the individual and not the group, until all of the incessant shaming, self-loathing and guilt-tripping subsides, this will get infinitely worse."

Spot on, I've ran out of rep points, but I would want to give you ten.

[MPH]

4 hours ago, leicsmac said:

Despondent. Utterly, dreadfully despondent.

 

What else need be said? The pollsters got it horrifically wrong, and I did too.

 

I really hope that I am also wrong about what I envision from the next four years for the US, because if I'm not then people I know personally - people important to me - are going to have their lives made a lot more difficult, being marginalised once again. And no snide bollocks about "bringing down the system" it's worth the price that those people will have to pay for it.

 

And with a Repub controlled Congress and a newly minted Supreme Court judge coming soon, where exactly are the checks and balances?

 

For the first time, I fear what I might find if and when I move next month.

 

 

I really wouldnt worry too much... one thing trump has said on social issues is that he wants to leave the decisions to the individual states.so the chances are if you are going to a liberal leaning state then it will always be so..

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Richard said:

the sample size is so small it's almost impossible to read anything meaningful from it

Ah yeh I guess they just get what they want from it and nothing else.

[leicsmac]

8 minutes ago, WarehamFox said:

Read my post and I never said anything about the "right", I replied to a quote saying the "democratic lefties" are calling for Trump to be shoot. I'm neither left or right when it comes to politics. So please don't miss quote me, go and read post again and you can have your moral high ground. 

Oh, I do apologize. I figured given your disparaging comments regarding "Democratic lefties" that you belonged on the other side of the spectrum. Pardon my assumption.

 

Surely in the interests of even handedness (if you're neither left or right), pointing out a the same behaviour on both sides (as has been pointed out happens) is better than picking one side alone? But guess that's another discussion.

[leicsmac]

8 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

 

I really wouldnt worry too much... one thing trump has said on social issues is that he wants to leave the decisions to the individual states.so the chances are if you are going to a liberal leaning state then it will always be so..

An argument I've heard before. But I'm not worried about myself or the state I'll be living in. I'm worried about my good friends of varying demographics in various states that could be in trouble.

[Alf Bentley]

8 minutes ago, Shaneb said:

I wonder is those polls are similar to the UK brexit polls. So the media says all people that voted brexit are uneducated, yet I know some fairly well paid people who voted to leave.

 

The poll compares voting percentages to income not education, though there's obviously a fair correlation between education and income.

 

@Watson's figures show something different, though, if the polling is accurate:

- Those on high incomes voted narrowly for Trump

- Those on low or below average incomes voted strongly for Clinton (though maybe not as strongly as before? Comparison with 2012 would be interesting...)

- Middle-income earners ($50k-$99k) were the income group who voted most strongly for Trump - so not those on their uppers, but those with something to lose, fearful of their prospects?

 

Excellent, if rather scary article here:  http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-the-united-hates-of-america-has-raised-its-middle-finger-to-the-world-1.2861122

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, GazzinderFox said:

Funny how many of the democratic left are calling for Trumps assassination... 

Literally who?

 

A few leftie-by-numbers barmpots on Twitter. Well Quelle fvcking surprise.

 

Hardly makes them representative of "the democratic left" does it?

[Nick]

9 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

Literally who?

 

A few leftie-by-numbers barmpots on Twitter. Well Quelle fvcking surprise.

 

Hardly makes them representative of "the democratic left" does it?

Yeah, who'd do that?

 

Ridiculous.

 

[ousefox]

13 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

The poll compares voting percentages to income not education, though there's obviously a fair correlation between education and income.

 

@Watson's figures show something different, though, if the polling is accurate:

- Those on high incomes voted narrowly for Trump

- Those on low or below average incomes voted strongly for Clinton (though maybe not as strongly as before? Comparison with 2012 would be interesting...)

- Middle-income earners ($50k-$99k) were the income group who voted most strongly for Trump - so not those on their uppers, but those with something to lose, fearful of their prospects?

 

Excellent, if rather scary article here:  http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-the-united-hates-of-america-has-raised-its-middle-finger-to-the-world-1.2861122

Some more stats here

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-37922587?intlink_from_url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/election-us-2016-37899679&link_location=live-reporting-story 

 

18% of respondents who felt that Mr Trump was not qualified to be president nonetheless voted for him, as did 20% of those who felt he did not have the necessary temperament

[Bob Weasel Fox]

4 hours ago, Webbo said:

I remember all the same panic and scaremongering when Reagan got elected and that turned out alright. I doubt there'll be much noticeable difference to us, it won't be a disaster.

Yep I agree Webbo

 

my wife was typically over the top this morning bless her and started saying "well that's the end of the world then"

 

perspective people (including the wife  )

[GazzinderFox]

1 minute ago, Voll Blau said:

Literally who?

 

A few leftie-by-numbers barmpots on Twitter. Well Quelle fvcking surprise.

 

Hardly makes them representative of "the democratic left" does it?

Do barmpots not count then? Don't move my goalposts.

 

What prompted me to make that remark was that several people had just made that very suggestion on the thread. I can't be arsed to look but I'm sure a cursory glance around tinternet would affirm what I have said. Why don't you look for me? I want you to find out for me what percentage of all people who have commented about assassination are on the 'democratic left' seeings as you are obviously far more aware about the average internet trolls political leanings than I do. I'm sure t'would be great fun.

 

But hey, I suppose the ones who have said it are all automatically lumped into the category of discredited nutter according to you eh? 

[Guest MattP]

4 minutes ago, Bob Weasel Fox said:

Yep I agree Webbo

 

my wife was typically over the top this morning bless her and started saying "well that's the end of the world then"

 

perspective people (including the wife  )

This.

 

One guy on my Facebook timeline is seriously considering building his own bomb shelter.

[purpleronnie]

40 minutes ago, GazzinderFox said:

Sage advice to liberals from the Guardian's (of all places) comments section...

 

"This is really so easy. This could have ALL been avoided. How to stop Trump:

1. STOP, for the LOVE of GOD, STOP peddling identity politics. Trump voters - working class people - despise it. They know what you're doing - it's obvious.

2. STOP treating ethnicity, gender, sexuality and religion as a proxy for class warfare; you are trying to displace them by creating a new under-class and stoking ethnocentrism, gynocentrism and tribalism for the purpose of manufacturing a new electorate and a globalised, supranational governance that NO-ONE wants.

3. STOP speaking about groups, start speaking about individuals (you know, actual liberalism).

4. Stop polarising ALL debate. Just because you aren't rabidly pro-feminism, it doesn't make you a misogynist. Just because you aren't rabidly in favour of the EU, it doesn't make you a fascist. Just because you don't support black lives matter, it doesn't make you a white supremacist. Just because you don't support SSM, it doesn't make you a homophobe.

5. Stop pushing mass immigration for the purposes of creating a new electorate. They know what you're doing. Every minority group in the UK is opposed to mass immigration. Even Hispanics are opposed to mass immigration, and are more conservative - on a policy basis - and religious than white males.

6. Stop preaching cultural relativism; if you oppose something for one identity, oppose it for ALL identities. Murder doesn't suddenly become more acceptable because the perpetrator is Islamic; sexism doesn't become more acceptable because the perpetrator is female; racism doesn't become more acceptable because the hatred is being spewed at white men.

Get it? Until all of this STOPS, until we start to assign rights and responsibilities at the level of the individual and not the group, until all of the incessant shaming, self-loathing and guilt-tripping subsides, this will get infinitely worse."

I don't agree but I guess it is indicative of how radical movements have been adopted by liberal capitalism.

[Babylon]

17 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

@Watson's figures show something different, though, if the polling is accurate

When was the last time a poll was accurate?

[ealingfox]

Its a nation of sheep and cows electing a lion to lead them because he said he'd stop chickens from eating the grass.

[purpleronnie]

So with so many European elections next year will we continue to see the right dominate?

 

Time for the left to mobilize....but they won't.

[ozleicester]

If you havent watched Iddiocracy, now would be a very good time.  

 

 

 

[Voll Blau]

3 minutes ago, GazzinderFox said:

Do barmpots not count then? Don't move my goalposts.

 

What prompted me to make that remark was that several people had just made that very suggestion on the thread. I can't be arsed to look but I'm sure a cursory glance around tinternet would affirm what I have said. Why don't you look for me? I want you to find out for me what percentage of all people who have commented about assassination are on the 'democratic left' seeings as you are obviously far more aware about the average internet trolls political leanings than I do. I'm sure t'would be great fun.

 

But hey, I suppose the ones who have said it are all automatically lumped into the category of discredited nutter according to you eh? 

You said "many of the democratic left". That's clearly not the case is it, in the same way that I don't believe "many of the democratic right" want Clinton executed in spite of a few posts I've seen on the internet.

 

The reality in both cases is "a few twats of [insert political leaning here] wish death upon someone who has the opposing views to them". Not exactly a shock in my book, and certainly not worth tarring more people than necessary of any persuasion with that brush.

[The Doctor]

1 hour ago, WarehamFox said:

Also shows who's supporters are more normal, law abiding citizens. The left don't have it their way and throw dolls out the pram. The Republicans lost the last two elections to the first black president and he's still alive! Shock horror.

Trump suggested people should assassinate Hilary before the vote even happened, theres really no high ground in supporting a candidate who's got out of a child rape trial because the accuser is too scared to appear in public after death threats from his supporters: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-elections/donald-trump-rape-claim-allegation-jane-doe-suit-dropped-us-election-a7401411.html%3Famp?client=ms-android-samsung