IF Ranieri HAS lost the Dressing Room, How Did This Happen?

[Kitchandro]

Whatever the reason, if any, it is inexcusable. In most situations like this and want the manager to go but you can't blame him for the players not being biothered or losing confidence.

 

The lack of effort is across the board and regardless of what manager is here I expect them to work for their money.

 

I can't bring myself to want Claudio sacked when it would just be so wrong for these players to get away with it if another man comes in and they improve.

 

10 minutes ago, sm1 said:

When he came here Marcel Desailly said that Ranieri gives the impression of being laid back and gentle, but he's a real aggressive and ruthless cvnt when he wants to be. He's older now, but I can't believe he's become a door mat in his older age. I genuinely believe that Ranieri doesn't know what the problems are, which is most worrying.

 

Marcel Desailly is one of the stupidest people alive though. And he's French, and let's face it, French players have a terrible attitude.

[HoustonFox]

I posted my hypothesis in another thread (there are so many) but I think it is down to lack of ambition and the drive to build a dynasty and and legacy.  In their minds, (all of them) they have already achieved it, so why do it again?  That's not the foundation of greatness, and great teams.  Think about it. Ranieri has won the only thing he had never won (a league title), the players have won what they thought they would never win (apart from Huth), and instead of saying things like "we are going to build on this and establish", and "now we know we can achieve it, we want it again and again", we hear things like, "let's enjoy Europe", "if you just climbed Everest and then been told to do it again".   These are not the things that winners say.  I'll point again at Kante leaving.  Why?  Because he probably saw and heard all this, and saw that no one else (apart from him) really wanted it again.  They had done it.  It's like becoming a millionaire, there are two real ways (excluding inheritance) to do it: hard work and endeavor, and winning the lottery.  People who achieve through the first continue to strive, achieve and grow.  Do people who win the Euromillions keep playing? 

 

I really don't know if he has lost the dressing room, or it is just that no one can get up for it.  I think it is the latter. They seem to smile and have great fun training, but look at the effort and intensity on the training ground and on the pitch.  Who are the ones putting it in?  Ndidi was by far our most committed player on Sunday, he showed he wants it.  Kasper wants it.  That's about it though.  Maybe Albrighton (in terms of effort, his ability seems to have dropped off but it's probably because the others aren't busting a gut to get onto throughballs and crosses). 

 

Happy for someone to tell me I am in cloud cuckoo land and point out where I am not seeing things in the right way.

[Donut]

Just now, Babylon said:

You don't have to have a rift with him to lose faith in his management. I love him but I've lost all faith in him this season.

 

Whether it's confusing tactics, refusal to change then flipping to changing every game.

 

If the Ulloa story is true, perhaps he does say one thing but do another.

 

His pigeon English might be funny when going well, but bloody frustrating and confusing when you need clarity.

But if we are to believe what comes out in the media (which is probably tosh but as its our only source we go with it), he had a meeting with the players and THEY were the ones that wanted to keep the same tactics. He put the ball in their court. He didnt make them do something they didnt want to do? plus its a straight 4-4-2, its not a Guardiola-eque reinvention of the wheel?

 

The pigeon english is one thing. But there are loads of staff here that have been here in the good times. Theres Pearson staff here.

 

If there WAS a blazing row at half time at Southampton (Wes says there was. Who knows?), then have the players just fallen out with themselves?

 

I just dont see what would cause you to lose faith in what was clearly a fantastic formula we had going. Im totally perplexed

[spudfox2911]

8 minutes ago, Goober said:

I just think the players have lost faith in his attempts to turn us into an 'Italian' type team and are tired of his negative tactics, setting us up for a point everywhere and not giving the players enough freedom. If it's anything like the players no longer caring because they're on big money now, then they ought to be ashamed, but personally I trust these players and don't believe that's the case. 

It's difficult to point the finger at anyone thing, but I agree completely, I remember him saying he would slowly bring the Italian style (boring and negative) into our play, but last season there was no need, hate to say it, but I'm starting to believe our approach last season was a strategy born from accident rather than design. Now he's had the summer to try to instill italian influence of sitting back, not pressing the ball or the opponent. we just look lost, no desire or commitment, no work rate, berift of ideas other than what they are being told to do, being absolute to that philosphy just set up negative try to not concede...hes gone full Italian 90's football style in one summer, it clearly isn't working.

why change it if it isn't broke? Why not revert to our style that provided success after half a reason of abject performances? Love him and defend him, but Christ.... everyone can see we have ability but no aptitude

[Kitchandro]

4 minutes ago, HoustonFox said:

I posted my hypothesis in another thread (there are so many) but I think it is down to lack of ambition and the drive to build a dynasty and and legacy.  In their minds, (all of them) they have already achieved it, so why do it again?  That's not the foundation of greatness, and great teams.  Think about it. Ranieri has won the only thing he had never won (a league title), the players have won what they thought they would never win (apart from Huth), and instead of saying things like "we are going to build on this and establish", and "now we know we can achieve it, we want it again and again", we hear things like, "let's enjoy Europe", "if you just climbed Everest and then been told to do it again".   These are not the things that winners say.  I'll point again at Kante leaving.  Why?  Because he probably saw and heard all this, and saw that no one else (apart from him) really wanted it again.  They had done it.  It's like becoming a millionaire, there are two real ways (excluding inheritance) to do it: hard work and endeavor, and winning the lottery.  People who achieve through the first continue to strive, achieve and grow.  Do people who win the Euromillions keep playing? 

 

I really don't know if he has lost the dressing room, or it is just that no one can get up for it.  I think it is the latter. They seem to smile and have great fun training, but look at the effort and intensity on the training ground and on the pitch.  Who are the ones putting it in?  Ndidi was by far our most committed player on Sunday, he showed he wants it.  Kasper wants it.  That's about it though.  Maybe Albrighton (in terms of effort, his ability seems to have dropped off but it's probably because the others aren't busting a gut to get onto throughballs and crosses). 

 

Happy for someone to tell me I am in cloud cuckoo land and point out where I am not seeing things in the right way.

I did think this early on tbh. I was very concerned at the apathy from everyone at the club, including the fans.

 

Some don't realise what a massive opportunity we've wasted to establish ourselves further at the higher echelons of this league. We've blown it totally.

 

The bad mentality crept in from an early stage and has only got worse.

[spudfox2911]

2 minutes ago, Kitchandro said:

I did think this early on tbh. I was very concerned at the apathy from everyone at the club, including the fans.

 

Some don't realise what a massive opportunity we've wasted to establish ourselves further at the higher echelons of this league. We've blown it totally.

 

The bad mentality crept in from an early stage and has only got worse.

I'm an offender, I just wanted to believe so much that our future was being built upon and we could actually be the club that broke the rules and became a top side domestic and european, so, hands up in the air and time to admit that my Loyallty was, although sincere, misplaced.

 I (and several others) were wrong, we aren't even treading water, we are sinking and fast. Why can't the gaffer see it? It's glaring at us all and has been for sometime. 

 

[Booko]

Southampton seem to do alright after continually selling their best players for big bucks, not saying I wanted Vardy and Mahrez to leave in summer, but, maybe we bumped their wages up too quickly, nothing left to motivate them to earn a better contract (if that us their motivation) also unlikely to repeat what was achieved last season.

[nnfox]

Momentum has a lot to answer for in football.  Last season we had it and rode it perfectly.  This season we started off on the wrong foot.  By that I mean that the players and management knew that retaining the title would be impossible and even getting top four was probably out of the question but the genuinely believed that as Champions, we could just turn up and get the results that ensured a solid season, safe in the knowledge that they would all be remembered for ever in Leicester.  Turns out though that actually, the Premier League is actually quite tough and you can't just turn up and give 75% and expect to win.  Now, that momentum that did us so well last season has turned against us and we are too far adrift to simply change direction, we'll have to ride it out and see where we get to.  The players have let their game drop too far and Ranieri let his drop too but he can see what is happening, I'm not sure the players do.

 

It would be really sad if Ranieri has lost the dressing room, I don't understand why.  The players should be worshipping the ground he walks on - make no mistake about it, he made them all legends last season and they should thank him daily for the plaudits, adulation and pay rises they got.  If he has lost the dressing room then the players should be absolutely ashamed of themselves and when they look back on their career in 10 or 20 years from now, they will be.

 

[john ridley]

1 minute ago, Booko said:

Southampton seem to do alright after continually selling their best players for big bucks, not saying I wanted Vardy and Mahrez to leave in summer, but, maybe we bumped their wages up too quickly, nothing left to motivate them to earn a better contract (if that us their motivation) also unlikely to repeat what was achieved last season.

Yes they seem to do alright , but they haven't got  remotely  close to winning the league. 

[Thracian]

When things are going well a manager's job is easy.

 

When they go wrong the players look to the manager for answers.

 

From what I read there have been several "clear the air" dressing room meetings this season and while some might think this a good sign when "one" becomes "two" or "three" then it suggests to me that the manager's been found wanting. 

 

I don't say a manager shouldn't engage with players or keep himself aware of any developing undercurrents.

 

But really, it's in a crisis that a good manager emphasises his abilities not by calling on "the floor" to come up with solutions but by quietening the room, explaining exactly what's going wrong and what's to be done about it.

 

Quite often there might be little to say before a match.

 

Preparation should all have been done at the training ground so all that's required before kick-off is to fuse the spirit of togetherness, to ensure every players understands 100% what his job is for the day and to let everyone know you think the world of them and have every confidence in their ability to entertain the fabulous fans who pay to watch them.  

 

Half time is when the manager mattters.

 

He's analysed the game and his responsibility is clear.

 

To ensure any winning impetus is maintained or, if the opposition is winning or dominating, to totally de-mystify why that's happened and exactly how the players are going to put it right.

 

There's no blame game, no breaking of what might already be fragile confidence.

Just a massive motivational boost for the team via the manager's assurance on exactly what's needed to turn the game round and his unwavering certainty that his "Chosen Men" can make his revised instructions prove his point. 

 

The problem comes if the manager can't read the game, doesn't have a plan and fails to show faith in his players ability to put the wrongs right. . 

 

It's the manager makes the mood if he's any good. And right now, in the Leicester camp, the mood needs to change for the better and we won't do that with guesswork, compromise or constantly moving the goalposts in terms of tactics or  personnel. 

 

A disjointed team can't cope with that. They need a system they understand, team-mates  who compliment one another and the benefits that come with constancy. 

 

Surely we learned most of that last season. Quite why we went off at a tangent instead of evolving naturally, I've no idea.  

 

.  

 

            

     

[spudfox2911]

2 minutes ago, Thracian said:

Quite why we went off at a tangent instead of evolving naturally, I've no idea

This

[Stadt]

There's a few reasons, the first being that I don't think we can play at the same intensity as we did last season. We were praised for how hard we worked and our sports science set up were highly acclaimed with them hosting a seminar as we were the pinnacle, apparently; our preseason was all about publicity and maximising revenue which aren't bad things but they are when it comes at the cost of fitness and the preparation of the players. The early defeat to Hull was evidence of the lack of fitness as the players simply could not compete physically. 

 

The team spirit is broken, for a few years we'd had a relatively low turnover of players and alongside triumphing in the face of adversity (Watford play off heartbreak and the great escape) had created a resolve in the players which I haven't seen anywhere else in football - hard to quantify but the mental strength and the team spirit was in part what turned the Villa, Stoke, Spurs and Southampton games around last year and were instrumental in winning the league. Through a combination of new players, players which don't seem to have as good attitudes as previous buys, lucrative and naive contracts handed out and a feeling of never, ever being able to top this has culminated in the degradation of our team spirit and destroyed our revered desire.

 

Amongst other reasons our transfer dealings were decidedly terrible. Slimani is a decent player but it's obvious that he doesn't suit the balance of the side - both he and Vardy are No. 9's and we have nobody linking the play when they're both up front meaning we're static and one dimensional. The absence of foresight during the summer is embarrassing us now. We broke our transfer record on a player that doesn't fit which is at complete odds to our former method of finding undervalued players (not just their transfer fee but their contribution). The team lack players with genuine class on the ball, none of our summer signings were creative and nor did we buy somebody to even attempt to fill Kante's role in the side. There's been a systematic failure all the way through the club and such chronic mismanagement off the pitch is only being compounded on it.

 

Personally I'm disgusted with how we've failed to capitalise on our best position as a club ever.

[lgfualol]

Money and fame. Everyone busy trying to make money while they are still relevant.

 

Also "Band of Brothers", well that doesn't seem to have lasted very long. Bet they turned on each other rather quickly when new contracts and money came along.

 

Can you imagine being Huth, Ulloa and Okazaki, while everyone else gets pay increases, they don't despite being similar ages? Can you imagine how chavs like Simpson feel earning probably half of what Mahrez does? 

 

Bet it is causing issues amongst bad form. Just a theory.

[China Black]

This team so far, is performing as if they threw away their greatest opportunity of achieving glory with a couple of games to go last season, and are still feeling the negative effects of that lost opportunity.

 

A team that won the league last season, should be playing a lot better and with confidence, gained from the experience of winning something as important as the league. They are not performing in the way that befits the status of Champions of England.

 

The players are letting everyone down big time.

[gw_leics772]

If he has lost the dressing room and the players really arent trying hard enough, im more in favour of a revolution in terms of the playing staff than the manager.

 

In short. How ****ing dare thye.

 

Im not saying ranieri is blameless. If Danny Murphy can rip our game to shreds and get it so spot on after sunday, it was obviously crap, but i dont give a **** if they dont understand where they are supposed to be

 

Press for the ball. Try to win it with the intensity of last season.

 

I remember reading about beck? at Cambridge dragging a player off if he tried to score rather than booting it into the corner.

 

If the players cared, they should show us the fans. If ranieri dragged off the wrong player, like the gray moment, he would get himself sacked but anyone trying to get him sacked at the expense of our club, they can **** right off.

 

Maybe ranieri will have to go, but if the players then magically turn it back on, i think that will make it even worse in my opinion.

 

Tldr; pull your ****ing socks up the lot of you. (Players and manager)

 

[HoustonFox]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

You don't have to have a rift with him to lose faith in his management. I love him but I've lost all faith in him this season.

 

Whether it's confusing tactics, refusal to change then flipping to changing every game.

 

If the Ulloa story is true, perhaps he does say one thing but do another.

 

His pigeon English might be funny when going well, but bloody frustrating and confusing when you need clarity.

Come on Babs, his English is pretty darn good.  I don't think they have any trouble understanding him.  We're talking about footballers.  Simple English  

[ZeGuy]

1 hour ago, Kitchandro said:

Whatever the reason, if any, it is inexcusable. In most situations like this and want the manager to go but you can't blame him for the players not being biothered or losing confidence.

 

The lack of effort is across the board and regardless of what manager is here I expect them to work for their money.

 

I can't bring myself to want Claudio sacked when it would just be so wrong for these players to get away with it if another man comes in and they improve.

 

Marcel Desailly is one of the stupidest people alive though. And he's French, and let's face it, French players have a terrible attitude.

- Blame is to share between players and coach. One doesn't go without another. The players might haven't given their all on the pitch, tactics and sorting out the best starting XI are on him. 

 

- Awesome use of baseless clichés.

[StriderHiryu]

1 hour ago, Lako42 said:

Players stabbing a great man in the back because they are a bunch of bedwetting big time Charlie's.

 

They all need to grow some bollocks and stop feeling sorry for themselves, especially DD as I don't think I can put up with looking at his smacked arse of a face.

 

 

Pull your ****ing socks up.

Pretty much this. A team shouldn't fall  apart so badly in such a short space of time after losing one player. 

 

You can criticise Ranieri but the players have let fame go to their heads. 

 

 

[Struwwelpeter60]

17 minutes ago, China Black said:

This team so far, is performing as if they threw away their greatest opportunity of achieving glory with a couple of games to go last season, and are still feeling the negative effects of that lost opportunity.

 

A team that won the league last season, should be playing a lot better and with confidence, gained from the experience of winning something as important as the league. They are not performing in the way that befits the status of Champions of England.

 

The players are letting everyone down big time.

The same happened to Chelsea last season.

Why?

[Struwwelpeter60]

9 minutes ago, HoustonFox said:

Come on Babs, his English is pretty darn good.  I don't think they have any trouble understanding him.  We're talking about footballers.  Simple English  

I doubt, that the English of Mahrez, Slimani, Okazaki, Mendy, Ulloa, Ndidi, Musa, Kapustka

or Benalouane is any better. And Schmeichel, Huth, Fuchs and Zieler are also

not native speakers.

[Donut]

4 minutes ago, Struwwelpeter60 said:

The same happened to Chelsea last season.

Why?

The Chelsea example, although a shocking decline, had some visible signs to it though.

 

Mourinho and the Eva Carneiro incident, then throws his captain under the bus away at Man City at half time. He subs Matic on, and then takes him off and criticises one of his best players in Hazard. Then publically says his players "betrayed" him after we played them. He also conducted himself like a man with problems with spiky interviews for TV and bizarre touchline behaviour. So there were very clear fractured relationships happening and getting rid was probably the only way to fix it.

 

Here though......i just dont see what can have caused this meltdown within the camp.

 

I dont think its a new signings issue. You could put a team out of ten of last years first choices and a Kante replacement, in 442, and i guarantee they would be nowhere near the level of last year even with the same game plan. Some of that IS Kante of course, but they would be way off the levels.

 

I dont see Ranieri really criticising individuals. Quite the opposite. He takes the blame himself when some of that blame should definitely lie with players who for whatever reason, have all decided they cant give a shit.

 

Im watching Fuchs play and at times i think hes a drunk man whos playing at Hackney Marshes. Hes gone that far backwards in a few months its staggering.

 

Its just baffling.

[HoustonFox]

40 minutes ago, Struwwelpeter60 said:

I doubt, that the English of Mahrez, Slimani, Okazaki, Mendy, Ulloa, Ndidi, Musa, Kapustka

or Benalouane is any better. And Schmeichel, Huth, Fuchs and Zieler are also

not native speakers.

English is the official language of Nigeria so they are ok.

 

Schmeichel pretty much grew up in the UK, Huth is pretty darn fluent, as is Fuchs.  Zieler struggles a little, but has very soft hands, so that makes up for it... (@The_77)

[Struwwelpeter60]

6 minutes ago, Donut said:

The Chelsea example, although a shocking decline, had some visible signs to it though.

 

Mourinho and the Eva Carneiro incident, then throws his captain under the bus away at Man City at half time. He subs Matic on, and then takes him off and criticises one of his best players in Hazard. Then publically says his players "betrayed" him after we played them. He also conducted himself like a man with problems with spiky interviews for TV and bizarre touchline behaviour. So there were very clear fractured relationships happening and getting rid was probably the only way to fix it.

 

Here though......i just dont see what can have caused this meltdown within the camp.

 

I dont think its a new signings issue. You could put a team out of ten of last years first choices and a Kante replacement, in 442, and i guarantee they would be nowhere near the level of last year even with the same game plan. Some of that IS Kante of course, but they would be way off the levels.

 

I dont see Ranieri really criticising individuals. Quite the opposite. He takes the blame himself when some of that blame should definitely lie with players who for whatever reason, have all decided they cant give a shit.

 

Im watching Fuchs play and at times i think hes a drunk man whos playing at Hackney Marshes. Hes gone that far backwards in a few months its staggering.

 

Its just baffling.

 

 

At the beginning of last season it was a team without stars.

All were earning, more or less, the same money.

At the end of last season that had changed.

Vardy, Mahrez, Kante and Drinkwater were in the 

limelight, all the others in the shadow.

Vardy, Mahrez and Drinkwater got big, new contracts.

Others, like Huth, Ulloa and Okazaki, not.

That was a huge mistake.

The great team spirit, that won us the title, was

replaced by envy and resentment.

 

I don't think, there is a problem between the team and the

manager. 

I fear, there is a falling-out between the players.

And that is much more dangerous. 

[kingfox]

Seems we are having the same effect as Chelsea did last season, they had to sack Mourinho for things to turn around.

 

There's certain players who are guaranteed to give 100% whether they are playing well or not. Right now though some aren't, some look like they can't be bothered and have lost all motivation, it so happens three of them were key to our title success last season, Drinkwater, Mahrez & Vardy, all of which have done fvck all this season apart from a few highlights here and there. Those three players make us tick, when they aren't playing well the whole team doesn't seem to play well.

 

Ranieri is too soft in my opinion, after matches, in Pre Match conferences on a Thursday or Friday he looks at a loss, everything went right last season, he could sit, have a laugh, have a joke but when we're in the predicament we are now, we aren't going to see that from him, his gone from happy Claudio to broken Claudio. He seems to be putting all the blame on himself and not the players when it's a bit of both.

 

If he's afraid to give them a kick up the backside then he has to go, or we'll be in the relegation zone before we know it. Find your backbone, get that passion back we saw last season on the touchline or hand in your resignation.

[Struwwelpeter60]

8 minutes ago, kingfox said:

There's certain players who are guaranteed to give 100% whether they are playing well or not. Right now though some aren't, some look like they can't be bothered and have lost all motivation, it so happens three of them were key to our title success last season, Drinkwater, Mahrez & Vardy, all of which have done fvck all this season apart from a few highlights here and there.

Why do you think, that attitude would change under a new manager?