Drinkwater

[dannythefox]

19 minutes ago, Viva said:

 

Let's see what James does in the Premier League first. So far he has done next to nothing, whereas Drinkwater was a key member of a title winning team. Form is temporary, class is permanent. 

Your one of the ones that's  forgot how good james was before his injury then, keeping Drinkwater on the bench!

[Viva]

1 minute ago, dannythefox said:

Your one of the ones that's  forgot how good james was before his injury then, keeping Drinkwater on the bench!

I've not forgotten at all. Drinkwater was comfortably the better player in the Championship and in the season we just survived, most of the team was distinctly average at best. James has never shown the best form that Drinkwater has. As I said, I need to see James perform well in the Premier League before rating him anywhere near Drinkwater. 

 

 

[Viva]

13 minutes ago, dannythefox said:

Your one of the ones that's  forgot how good james was before his injury then, keeping Drinkwater on the bench!

https://www.foxestalk.co.uk/topic/101253-lcfcratings-season-summary-part-4-player-by-player-review/?tab=comments#comment-3454490

 

Maybe you are one of the ones that look at him a little with rose tinted glasses on? Yes in that particular season he was probably slightly better than Drinkwater. Still very average though. Drinkwater in the season before and after this, showed how good he can be. James certainly needs to step up if he is going to have break into our team regularly. 

[Jacnah]

On 03/08/2017 at 10:36, Strokes said:

Sell Drinkwater get Delph, upgrade and profit.

do you think they are similar players? I haven't seen a huge amount of Delph, so am not sure - he's perhaps made some bad choices that have hindered his progression and recognition

[The Floyd]

29 minutes ago, Viva said:

 

Let's see what James does in the Premier League first. So far he has done next to nothing, whereas Drinkwater was a key member of a title winning team. Form is temporary, class is permanent. 

James has outperformed Drinkwater in every season that he's been fit. The high praise for Drinkwater's apparent creativity derives from a season where he created 7 assists, which is even less spectacular when you consider that he was paired next to one of the best defensive CMs in the world. 

[CyprusFox]

41 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Every club sells players.

Yeah, even Barcelona!

[Viva]

.

[Viva]

3 minutes ago, The Floyd said:

James has outperformed Drinkwater in every season that he's been fit. The high praise for Drinkwater's apparent creativity derives from a season where he created 7 assists, which is even less spectacular when you consider that he was paired next to one of the best defensive CMs in the world. 

No he hasn't. Drinkwater was the better player in the Championship and James was marginally better in the one season in the Premier, but was still very average as the link I posted above shows. Schlupp, King and Moore were ranked as having a better season than him! He has not shown the level of Premier League form required yet for our team, so we need to wait and see if he can improve a lot. 

Drinkwater is proven. Quite simple really.

[lcfc sheff]

we might not be able to get an English replacement for drinkwater at the price of £37m... but we can certainly get two replacements who are foreign for that price! n'didi is proof there is still value in this market if you look hard enough

[CyprusFox]

10 minutes ago, Jacnah said:

do you think they are similar players? I haven't seen a huge amount of Delph, so am not sure - he's perhaps made some bad choices that have hindered his progression and recognition

Injuries certainly hindered his progression, but still a very good player when at Villa. Never really got his chance at Man city.

[lcfc sheff]

1 minute ago, CyprusFox said:

Injuries certainly hindered his progression, but still a very good player at Villa.

delph would offer great balance to a three man midfield, got the tenacity to win the ball but also the pace to take it forwards, kinda a shit kante in some sense

[CyprusFox]

1 minute ago, lcfc sheff said:

delph would offer great balance to a three man midfield, got the tenacity to win the ball but also the pace to take it forwards, kinda a shit kante in some sense

More skillful than Kante but a totally different type of player.

[lcfc sheff]

Just now, CyprusFox said:

More skillful than Kante but a totally different type of player.

in terms of tackles and interceptions, yes they are miles apart, but no one comes close to that freak either way, but I meant in terms of bringing the ball forwards and passing it to more gifted attacking players

[SheppyFox]

54 minutes ago, Viva said:

 

Let's see what James does in the Premier League first. So far he has done next to nothing, whereas Drinkwater was a key member of a title winning team. Form is temporary, class is permanent. 

Drinkwaters one season(down to kante anyway imo) of form certainly has been temporary  

[CyprusFox]

3 minutes ago, lcfc sheff said:

in terms of tackles and interceptions, yes they are miles apart, but no one comes close to that freak either way, but I meant in terms of bringing the ball forwards and passing it to more gifted attacking players

Yeah, see what you mean.

[Viva]

5 minutes ago, SheppyFox said:

Drinkwaters one season(down to kante anyway imo) of form certainly has been temporary  

It wasn't all down to Kante. One season of title winning form that would have got him into most teams can't just be forgotten. 

[WigstonWanderer]

Oddschecker has Drinkwater at 1/2 on to go to Chelsea, but the only odds shown are for Skybet. I think someone above said that Skysports were one of the only sources claiming that this move was on.

 

Does my one else find that suspicious?

[Guest ttfn]

1 hour ago, Viva said:

 

Let's see what James does in the Premier League first. So far he has done next to nothing, whereas Drinkwater was a key member of a title winning team. Form is temporary, class is permanent. 

People always say "form is temporary, class is permanent" when talking about a player getting back up to a previous level, as if its taken as read that the "class" of the player reflects the good performances earlier in his career.

 

What if the "temporary" element was his fantastic form in the 2 league winning seasons and the "permanent" part the rest of the time when he's fluctuated between fairly decent and totally ineffectual?

[SheppyFox]

1 hour ago, Viva said:

It wasn't all down to Kante. One season of title winning form that would have got him into most teams can't just be forgotten. 

Not all but it's all an unknown, he hasn't been great without him

[CyprusFox]

14 minutes ago, SheppyFox said:

Not all but it's all an unknown, he hasn't been great without him

He's been poor without him.

[SheppyFox]

Just now, CyprusFox said:

He's been poor without him.

I have to agree, id take the 37m, couple that with our own financial firepower and we'd surely strengthen the squad to a point that is better than with him alone? 

[CyprusFox]

1 minute ago, SheppyFox said:

I have to agree, id take the 37m, couple that with our own financial firepower and we'd surely strengthen the squad to a point that is better than with him alone? 

I think so

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, WigstonWanderer said:

Oddschecker has Drinkwater at 1/2 on to go to Chelsea, but the only odds shown are for Skybet. I think someone above said that Skysports were one of the only sources claiming that this move was on.

 

Does my one else find that suspicious?

Several posters have said they heard of Chelsea's interest away from the usual twitter and SSN sources 

 

Barclay isnt a holding midfielder and I don't believe Arsenal would sell the ox to them (he isn't a holding player either) 

 

drinky is the only DCM linked there at the moment 

[KingsX]

I've been watching the Shed End on this for a couple days.  Nearing 200 posts and most take it seriously.  For whatever that's worth.

 

Whether smoke or fire ... 37M strikes me as absurd.  But every player has a price.

 

Given your perception of his future value, homegrown and/or PL-buyer "bonus", and the cost to replace him ... if you were Rudders what would your "drop dead" price be, where at the end of the day you would sell?

 

I'm thinking 25M and probably lying to myself ... might take a bit less if my job was making the hard decisions.

 

 

[Vardinio'sCat]

 

I'd rather keep him, but if he wants to go, we will need big money from Chelsea. They are not getting another bargain, NG already won them the bloody league for well under what he was worth.

 

I wonder if they might have Riyad as well. Then they might just change their name to Leicester City and be done with it...