Insomnia Thread

[Raj]

Try cdb oil

[Crinklyfox]

16 hours ago, Buce said:

 

The Long Read:

 

Finally, a cure for Insomnia?

 

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/sep/14/finally-a-cure-for-insomnia

I agree with his conclusion that it's a mental disorder.  For those who sleep easily the bedroom is a restful place, for insomniacs going to bed can raise anxiety levels at the struggles of the night to come which in themselves make sleep difficult.  

[SpacedX]

I liken insomnia to an infrequent bus or train service. You get one opportunity to fall asleep and transition into deep sleep and it you miss that, it can be hours waiting for the next one to come along - if at all. On some nights, it may never arrive in the first place. 

 

I was afflicted by this for almost a decade - following the birth of my daughter who never settled at night until she was four and irregular working hours. I found nytol and herbal tablets initially quite effective - although much of that was undoubtably a placebo and if I forgot to take them, I was screwed. I reasoned that the causes were psychological.

 

The solution for me lay in reducing the hours of sleep that I did have and was aiming for, regimenting my sleep patterns and conditioning myself to empty my mind of thoughts. I now suffer from this about half a dozen times a year instead of three or four nights a week which was utterly debilitating. 

[Bellend Sebastian]

 

 

Did anyone else have 5 Live on this morning?

 

They had some neurologist on going on about how important getting enough sleep is, and rather frighteningly for me drew my attention to the wealth of research that has concluded that not getting enough kip dramatically increases the risk of getting Alzheimer's. Christ.

 

Apparently it's no surprise that Thatcher and Reagan, both famous for getting by on very little sleep, went on to develop the disease.

 

I'm going to listen to it again later as apparently there were some sleep tips in it

 

 

[Izzy]

I read recently that we’re actually neurologically wired to need two sleep patterns in 24 hours. One ‘main’ sleep at night and also a shorter nap during the day.

 

Not always possible or practical in today’s society I know, but the Spanish have got it right with their siestas apparently.

[Guest Kopfkino]

18 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

 

 

Did anyone else have 5 Live on this morning?

 

They had some neurologist on going on about how important getting enough sleep is, and rather frighteningly for me drew my attention to the wealth of research that has concluded that not getting enough kip dramatically increases the risk of getting Alzheimer's. Christ.

 

Apparently it's no surprise that Thatcher and Reagan, both famous for getting by on very little sleep, went on to develop the disease.

 

I'm going to listen to it again later as apparently there were some sleep tips in it

 

 

Is it Matthew Walker. His book is great and there's a few good podcast interviews with him. Find it somewhat haunting that he describes being awake as low level brain damage. 

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

I have suffered terribly from anxiety for years which had led to years of restless nights, I rarely have a problem getting off to sleep but always wake up in the middle of the night unable to get back to sleep, I’ve found taking a Phenergan pill helps a lot and have actually almost slept through a couple of times.

I know it’s not a cure for the underlying anxiety issues I have but everything seems a lot better with a decent nights sleep.

[Bellend Sebastian]

2 hours ago, Kopfkino said:

Is it Matthew Walker. His book is great and there's a few good podcast interviews with him. Find it somewhat haunting that he describes being awake as low level brain damage. 

Don't know for sure, but having just read the description of his book, could well be

[Parafox]

10 hours ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

I have suffered terribly from anxiety for years which had led to years of restless nights, I rarely have a problem getting off to sleep but always wake up in the middle of the night unable to get back to sleep, I’ve found taking a Phenergan pill helps a lot and have actually almost slept through a couple of times.

I know it’s not a cure for the underlying anxiety issues I have but everything seems a lot better with a decent nights sleep.

I too suffer from anxiety related to my job and long term issues with my daughter who has Bi-polar disorder and ADHD and I think I may have a degree of PTSD. 

I have had at last found a counsellor/life coach who has adjusted my thinking processes and I find it easier to sleep for at least 4 hours before waking. When I do wake I am able to use the methods she has taught me to enable myself to wind down again and I generally get back of to sleep.

In the past anxiety has caused me to vomit most mornings. Now I feel more in control of my mind.

Maybe a decent counsellor will help you manage your anxiety problem, assuming you haven't already tried that. 

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

13 hours ago, Parafox said:

I too suffer from anxiety related to my job and long term issues with my daughter who has Bi-polar disorder and ADHD and I think I may have a degree of PTSD. 

I have had at last found a counsellor/life coach who has adjusted my thinking processes and I find it easier to sleep for at least 4 hours before waking. When I do wake I am able to use the methods she has taught me to enable myself to wind down again and I generally get back of to sleep.

In the past anxiety has caused me to vomit most mornings. Now I feel more in control of my mind.

Maybe a decent counsellor will help you manage your anxiety problem, assuming you haven't already tried that. 

I’ve never even thought of going down that route, similar to you my anxiety and lack of sleep is largely due to work and family issues, although I have never reached the stage of vomiting like yourself. My anxiety is often over such silly things as I’ve been in my current employment for a long time and am pretty good at what I do, 

I’ll think about a lifestyle coach, and thanks for your reply. 

[Bellend Sebastian]

No booze yesterday, no coffee since mid afternoon, turned the PS4 off well before bedtime and a better night's sleep than I've had for a while (despite my daughter getting up at 3am AGAIN).

 

Going to repeat this again for a few days and see if it genuinely makes a difference

[Izzy]

56 minutes ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

No booze yesterday, no coffee since mid afternoon, turned the PS4 off well before bedtime and a better night's sleep than I've had for a while (despite my daughter getting up at 3am AGAIN).

 

Going to repeat this again for a few days and see if it genuinely makes a difference

I don't drink booze or coffee but I drink loads of tea. 

 

I drink Yorkshire tea all day but after 6pm I drink Tetley's de-caf instead. Still tastes O.K. but I'm not buzzing at bedtime and manage to get a decent nights kip.

 

Good luck over the next few days 

[Buce]

48 minutes ago, Izzy said:

I don't drink booze or coffee but I drink loads of tea. 

 

I drink Yorkshire tea all day but after 6pm I drink Tetley's de-caf instead. Still tastes O.K. but I'm not buzzing at bedtime and manage to get a decent nights kip.

 

Good luck over the next few days 

 

Ah, Yorkshire - that centre of tea growing excellence.

[Izzy]

56 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Ah, Yorkshire - that centre of tea growing excellence.

Yorkshire Tea is now the nation's second favourite brew

https://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/foodanddrink/yorkshire-tea-is-now-the-nations-second-favourite-brew-a3628526.html

 

With mine and others help, we'll get it to number 1 spot soon 

 

[SouthStandUpperTier]

16 minutes ago, Izzy said:

Yorkshire Tea is now the nation's second favourite brew

https://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/foodanddrink/yorkshire-tea-is-now-the-nations-second-favourite-brew-a3628526.html

 

With mine and others help, we'll get it to number 1 spot soon 

 

No way. Yorkshire people are insufferable braggarts at the best of times. PG Tips for me.

[The Horse's Mouth]

PG Tips is elite tier, Yorkshire tea isnt strong enough

[Izzy]

3 minutes ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

PG Tips is elite tier, Yorkshire tea isnt strong enough

Just leave the tea bag in a bit longer 

[Buce]

8 hours ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

I’ve never even thought of going down that route, similar to you my anxiety and lack of sleep is largely due to work and family issues, although I have never reached the stage of vomiting like yourself. My anxiety is often over such silly things as I’ve been in my current employment for a long time and am pretty good at what I do, 

I’ll think about a lifestyle coach, and thanks for your reply. 

 

7 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

No booze yesterday, no coffee since mid afternoon, turned the PS4 off well before bedtime and a better night's sleep than I've had for a while (despite my daughter getting up at 3am AGAIN).

 

Going to repeat this again for a few days and see if it genuinely makes a difference

 

Have you tried having foods rich in tryptophan before bedtime? It's a natural precursor to serotonin which helps to calm anxiety. Try having a banana and a handful of cashew nuts with a glass of warm milk - it works well for me.

[Bellend Sebastian]

14 hours ago, Buce said:

 

 

Have you tried having foods rich in tryptophan before bedtime? It's a natural precursor to serotonin which helps to calm anxiety. Try having a banana and a handful of cashew nuts with a glass of warm milk - it works well for me.

Well I did have a banana and some milk before heading off, and on top of the no caffeine and alcohol think I slept even better, so I think you're on to something

[Buce]

36 minutes ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

Well I did have a banana and some milk before heading off, and on top of the no caffeine and alcohol think I slept even better, so I think you're on to something

 

We have examined the link between nutrition and sleep in some detail in a previous Insomnia thread.

This is what I posted back then:

 

On 29/03/2018 at 09:42, Buce said:

 

I have suffered from periods of chronic insomnia for years but I think I've finally found a dietary remedy for it. About an hour before bedtime I consume food rich in tryptophan (a precursor to serotonin) and approx 100 grams of broad beans (rich in L-DOPA, which your body converts to dopamine). There are supplements available for both tryptophan and L-DOPA if you would prefer but I am of the opinion that you should try to get everything your body needs from natural sources in a balanced diet.

 

I have slept better than I have for decades since beginning this regime and it appears to also have a positive effect on my occasional low moods too.

 

On 30/05/2018 at 08:41, Buce said:

 

Tryptophan?

 

It's contained in most high-protein foods (egg whites, red meat, cheese being particularly rich) but you may not want to be eating that heavily late at night. Personally, as a vegan, those sources are not available to me anyway, so I make a thick smoothie containing oat milk, walnuts, cashews, sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds and a banana. Although banana has negligible amounts of tryptophan, it is rich in potassium and magnesium, which are both muscle relaxants.

 

I also roast 100 grams of broad beans for the dopamine boost (100g might sound like a lot but they shrink down to the size of peanuts). I buy them frozen by the kilo from asda, and the method I use is to boil them for five minutes, toss them in olive oil and lo-salt, then lay them on a baking tray to cook (180C for 25 mins).

 

On 30/05/2018 at 11:12, Buce said:

 

It's also worth mentioning that sleep disturbance is also often linked to a deficiency in zinc and magnesium (ironically, both are depleted by stress and - as anyone who suffers from insomnia will know - not sleeping is hugely stressful). Magnesium deficiency, in particular, is common as a result of poor modern eating habits (the best sources are whole grains, pulses, dark green vegetables and nuts). For anyone who doesn't get enough dietary magnesium (and who doesn't want to change their eating habits), you may want to consider a magnesium supplement. Zinc is less likely to be an issue if you eat meat, but my smoothie mix contains usable amounts from the nuts and seeds. Be wary of supplementation with zinc as it is quite easy to build up a toxic amount.

 

On 30/05/2018 at 15:25, Buce said:

 

Thing is with refined flour, by removing the husk they are removing all the healthy bits; same with white rice. You'll note the added iron, niacin and thiamin? How ridiculous is that when it was in the whole grain product in the first place?

 

 

Broad beans are unique in providing usable amounts of L-dopa, which the body converts into dopamine; there are other dietary sources but you'd have to eat an insane amount. They are cheap, too - I get a kilo for £1.25, so 12p a night. The only thing to be wary of is if you are taking SSRIs or MAOIs - check with your Dr first.

 

Interestingly, L-dopa is what they treat Parkinson's Disease with, only they use a synthetic form so that it's standardised.

 

https://www.foxestalk.co.uk/topic/115339-insomnia-thread/#comments

 

Edited 10 June 2019 by Buce

[Stadt]

Suffering from it this week. Feels like any little thing can stop me sleeping. Got some sleeping pills (herbal, valerian root) but they aren’t doing much 

[MPH]

i’m on two different prescription medicines that are supposed to help me sleep and SOME nights they do.... i work long and very labour intensive shifts at work so i get plenty of exercise and i STILL can’t get a good nights sleep! no hope for me! lol. 

 

They did a sleep study on me and told me i have sleep apnea ( where i apparently stop breathing during my sleep - had to be off medications for the study) and this is what is apparently waking me up, so i have to wear a CPAP machine at night. that’s supposed to help me but it really doesn’t.  I get annoyed at this stupid mask on my face and end up taking it off.

 

 

im doomed!

[Bellend Sebastian]

Without wishing to make anyone on here envious, for a week or two I've been enjoying my best sleep for many, many months.

 

Cannot be 100% sure of the reasons for this, but given little else has changed in my life (I'm as disposed to misery and stress as ever) the only thing I can attribute it to is the work I've been doing to try and ease tension in my muscles.  This started by using a foam roller to break down the muscles in my lower body to help with running, but it became apparent that my upper body muscles were also generally extremely stiff and inflexible.  I've done loads of foam rolling on my whole back, tried to do a bit on my neck, and lo and behold, sleep has been LOADS better since I started doing this.

 

Maybe not too surprising as waking up in the night feeling incredibly tense phsyically was a regular thing for me.  I'm still waking up with reasonable frequency, but it's loads easier to fall back to sleep again

[Shane]

4 hours ago, MPH said:

i’m on two different prescription medicines that are supposed to help me sleep and SOME nights they do.... i work long and very labour intensive shifts at work so i get plenty of exercise and i STILL can’t get a good nights sleep! no hope for me! lol. 

 

They did a sleep study on me and told me i have sleep apnea ( where i apparently stop breathing during my sleep - had to be off medications for the study) and this is what is apparently waking me up, so i have to wear a CPAP machine at night. that’s supposed to help me but it really doesn’t.  I get annoyed at this stupid mask on my face and end up taking it off.

 

 

im doomed!

Have you looked into trying the sleep apnea mouth guard? Apologies I don’t know the correct term for the device! But some people use the mouth guard instead of the machine. 

[Carl the Llama]

Bump. Having knocked weed on the head for a while (been 4 weeks now if my maths is correct) it's gotten bloody tricky to fall asleep again.  I get proper lethargic in the evenings when it's a bit early still to drop off, but I'll get a burst of energy once it gets to around 10pm and can't sleep until well after midnight.  If I try to get an early night to compensate it seems I can only get 2-3h in before waking up around midnight with too much energy to drop off again until 3/4ish.  On my days off I'm able to catch up somewhat by sleeping up to 10h on and off until the early afternoon (sometimes with a solid couple hours activity before another solid wave of fatigue to take advantage of), but then I'm in a haze for a few hours before getting that adrenaline kick in the late evening and the cycle begins again.  Fun times.  At least I'm getting better at cross-stitch lol.