Gilette Advert

[lifted*fox]

I have no problem with large corporations using their platform, marketing outreach and money to remind some people how to behave. 

 

No, we're not all idiots who need telling how to shape the fvck up but there's plenty of dickheads out there who do need a reminder. 

 

Many companies (including Gilette) have spent years telling men to be manly and have bravado and basically be full of shit so, in my opinion, in this day and age of mental health issues where men feel like they're under constant pressure to be a rock and not be open and talk about problems I find it quite reasonable that a company like this feels a duty to remind them that it's OK and that they can be better people.

 

another reason for the 'PC gone mad / our identity as men is under attack' crowd to cry off about something though. 

 

 

[Nalis]

24 minutes ago, Langston said:

 

Does Merse actually appear in the Skybet ads? Genuine question.

I don't think I've ever seen him in one. Thompson, Nicholas and Le Tissier yeah, but not Merson.

Its an old one but there are others, like the Skybet 'boost' ad

 

 

[Babylon]

13 hours ago, StanSP said:

you don't have to listen to them or obey them!? It's just an additional message they want to use to reach out to their key demographic i.e. men. 

Yes, as a company selling razors or shaving products etc it may not be their place, but they're using their popularity to try and put a message out on what they think is acceptable. And given the way that some men, especially celebrities, have been acting and being portrayed in the media, why not send a message out?

 

This is hardly indicative of the 'world going mad', either.

 

Can think of numerous other examples of that but saying to men not to sexually harrass someone and just be generally be a good person and not act like a douche around women and to get men to set better examples to their kids (sons) is hardly the world going mad?

If you are the sort of person they describe, are you going to take the blindest bit of notice of what a razor company thinks? You're more likely to get annoyed about it and give the Mrs an extra hard slap tonight.

 

The "Men Stop Being Shits" angle is just a bit odd when your customers, those buying your product are men. We mostly aren't shits, we're mostly fairly normal, non bullying, non groping, not the slightest bit rapey.

 

The whole thing is plain odd IMO, to wrap that message in an advert. If you actually wanted to do something about it and to help spread a perfectly fine message, there are other ways of going about it. Or as someone else mentioned, how about championing men's issues rather than pointing a finger at men and wagging it.

[leicsmac]

The argument that the blokes who really need to hear this message aren't going to be listening is a salient one.

 

However, knowing that to be true...what do we do about such guys, when the problem - though not as ingrained as it used to be - is still unacceptably widespread, given the amount of women who have experience shit behaviour from such blokes?

 

Just keep taking every small success as it comes and build a fairer world bit by bit?

[Jattdogg]

19 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

The argument that the blokes who really need to hear this message aren't going to be listening is a salient one.

 

However, knowing that to be true...what do we do about such guys, when the problem - though not as ingrained as it used to be - is still unacceptably widespread, given the amount of women who have experience shit behaviour from such blokes?

 

Just keep taking every small success as it comes and build a fairer world bit by bit?

If possible Call them out on it and hold them accountable. Its common sense to call people out respectfully when they are in the wrong. 

 

Cant be scared or hide from it. It defeats the purpose but part of the problem is people dont  call others out for many differing reasons.

Edited 16 January 2019 by Jattdogg

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, Jattdogg said:

If possible Call them out on it and hold them accountable. Its common sense to call people out respectfully when they are in the wrong. 

 

Cant be scared or hide from it. It defeats the purpose but part of the problem is people dont  all others out for many differing reasons.

Agreed, but what makes you think such guys would listen to you any more than they'd listen to the ad?

[Jattdogg]

21 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Agreed, but what makes you think such guys would listen to you any more than they'd listen to the ad?

Chances are they wont if im being honest. Getting geown men to change macho behavior is a tough sell

[Footballwipe]

It's a well produced advert. Smacks more to me of "It's likely we have many customers who are arseholes and this advert shows how much we corporately disassociate ourselves from this customer base" more than trying to change the world.

 

Always like the giggle though. Helps reinforces that people who scream "snowflake" are, in fact, probably the biggest "snowflakes" of the lot.

[leicsmac]

5 minutes ago, Jattdogg said:

Chances are they wont if im being honest. Getting geown men to change macho behavior is a tough sell

An incredibly tough sell, yeah.

 

Maybe the gradual shift in attitudes that (seems) to be happening is the way it gets done.

[urban.spaceman]

Think I’ll stick with the beard, thanks.

[StanSP]

15 minutes ago, Jattdogg said:

Chances are they wont if im being honest. Getting geown men to change macho behavior is a tough sell

But Gillette have a much bigger reach than you. A tough sell indeed, but Gillette have more chance of making that message heard, agreeable one or not, than your average person on the street. 

[Jattdogg]

49 minutes ago, StanSP said:

But Gillette have a much bigger reach than you. A tough sell indeed, but Gillette have more chance of making that message heard, agreeable one or not, than your average person on the street. 

Thats if people watch tele lol.

 

I dont have standard cable/tv service so never see commercials etc. And when i do i mute them or dont watch.

 

I do have to say though if every ad turns into a company going on about this it would be annoying fast. I think its just a marketing ploy of some kind for gilette. Id prefer to see how they are changing things at gilette to make things better then to be preached too

[Innovindil]

The part I'm finding ironic about it all is the people advocating men sharing their feelings more are the ones using terms like "cry off" and "snowflake" to describe the people sharing their feelings over it. 

 

Brilliant stuff. 

[Captain...]

2 hours ago, Babylon said:

 

The "Men Stop Being Shits" angle is just a bit odd when your customers, those buying your product are men. We mostly aren't shits, we're mostly fairly normal, non bullying, non groping, not the slightest bit rapey.

But we all allow that behaviour by not calling people out on it. Even defending it sometimes. 

 

I’m sure you’ve been in the pub and a mate or mate of a mate has said or done something pervy and you’ve not said anything or just laughed. 

 

The culture we need to break is that of it being acceptable. You’ll never stop people being dicks, but if you call them out on it then they might think twice before being a dick around you. They might then start to think twice about being a dick full stop.

 

If you compare it to racism and how it went from being generally acceptable to not it was a cultural change to make sure everyone got the message that certain words and actions are not acceptable. It didn’t happen overnight but the change came when decent people felt empowered and right to call people out on racist behaviour and felt that they would get backed up by their friends. That was the change, when racist people stopped assuming everyone thought like them and that it was acceptable to say these things in decent company. “Lads” think it is ok to be “lads” because it is just what “lads” do and if you don’t then you’re the odd one out not them.

 

If the ad does one thing I hope it gives people more courage to call people out on unacceptable behaviour. It may not be the watershed moment but it is further support to those who believe that the majority of men are not violent aggressive misogynistic perverts and we should no longer accept this cultural norm where it is acceptable for men to behave that way.

[leicsmac]

11 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

The part I'm finding ironic about it all is the people advocating men sharing their feelings more are the ones using terms like "cry off" and "snowflake" to describe the people sharing their feelings over it. 

 

Brilliant stuff. 

The same irony that those men sharing their feelings are usually the ones most ready to call others "snowflakes", it would seem.

[Guest MattP]

8 minutes ago, Captain... said:

But we all allow that behaviour by not calling people out on it. Even defending it sometimes. 

 

I’m sure you’ve been in the pub and a mate or mate of a mate has said or done something pervy and you’ve not said anything or just laughed. 

 

The culture we need to break is that of it being acceptable. You’ll never stop people being dicks, but if you call them out on it then they might think twice before being a dick around you. They might then start to think twice about being a dick full stop.

You aren't going to ever live in a world where groups of men don't make comments about women and vice versa - that's not even comparable to things like racism.

 

You need to come down extremely hard on people who do genuinely perverted things that harm women, but you aren't going to turn people into robots.

[Costock_Fox]

This is all massively racist to those of us that can’t grow a beard.

[Innovindil]

14 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

The same irony that those men sharing their feelings are usually the ones most ready to call others "snowflakes", it would seem.

Gratz, the people claiming to have the highest morals happy clapping that they are on par with the shitters. Chance for world peace yet. 

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, Innovindil said:

Gratz, the people claiming to have the highest morals happy clapping that they are on par with the shitters. Chance for world peace yet. 

Lack of nuance all round, yeah.

 

Can only speak for myself but I'd like to see  more equitable friendliness and less antagonistic domineering BS going on between different groups of whoever out of utility, rather than morality. IMO it ain't moral to be a decent person to someone else (though as morality is subjective you could make the argument that it is and that's fair enough) - it's necessary.

[Babylon]

32 minutes ago, Captain... said:

But we all allow that behaviour by not calling people out on it. Even defending it sometimes. 

 

I’m sure you’ve been in the pub and a mate or mate of a mate has said or done something pervy and you’ve not said anything or just laughed. 

 

The culture we need to break is that of it being acceptable. You’ll never stop people being dicks, but if you call them out on it then they might think twice before being a dick around you. They might then start to think twice about being a dick full stop.

 

If you compare it to racism and how it went from being generally acceptable to not it was a cultural change to make sure everyone got the message that certain words and actions are not acceptable. It didn’t happen overnight but the change came when decent people felt empowered and right to call people out on racist behaviour and felt that they would get backed up by their friends. That was the change, when racist people stopped assuming everyone thought like them and that it was acceptable to say these things in decent company. “Lads” think it is ok to be “lads” because it is just what “lads” do and if you don’t then you’re the odd one out not them.

 

If the ad does one thing I hope it gives people more courage to call people out on unacceptable behaviour. It may not be the watershed moment but it is further support to those who believe that the majority of men are not violent aggressive misogynistic perverts and we should no longer accept this cultural norm where it is acceptable for men to behave that way.

Like I said, I have no problem with the message,  I just don't like the way it was packaged. With about 50 really shitty blokes and kids and about 5 nice people, who apparently only existed after the me too movement when "something changed". If you want to appeal to men to do the right thing, then it might be wise to not dump on them and act like they are mostly all shits other than a few.

 

I'm in marketing and I'm looking at it from that side of things and I just think the balance was well off.

[Captain...]

18 minutes ago, MattP said:

You aren't going to ever live in a world where groups of men don't make comments about women and vice versa - that's not even comparable to things like racism.

 

You need to come down extremely hard on people who do genuinely perverted things that harm women, but you aren't going to turn people into robots.

It’s not about stopping people talking about women. It is about understanding where the line is and calling people out when they cross it, or when they start getting close to it.

 

It is also about reassessing what you think is acceptable and isn’t. If you see a “fit bird” there is nothing wrong with thinking she’s fit, but is it ok to stare at her? to nudge your mates so then she has a whole table of guys staring at her? To make a comment to your mates so then she has a whole table of guys staring at her sniggering? To then make a comment as she walks past so she can hear? Then go over and ask her for her number then get all pissy when she says no and call her a lesbian? Then follow her out the pub as she leaves?

 

At what point will you get shit off your mates for saying something? It’s not an exact thing and it is not a simple thing the Gillette advert highlights many aspects of toxic masculinity the take away from it should be that maybe we need to reassess what we deem as acceptable behaviour and when we see someone crossing the line or getting close to it we should call them out. That line is obviously subjective and a little blurred but if we all reassess it a little then that might go a long way.

[Captain...]

12 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Like I said, I have no problem with the message,  I just don't like the way it was packaged. With about 50 really shitty blokes and kids and about 5 nice people, who apparently only existed after the me too movement when "something changed". If you want to appeal to men to do the right thing, then it might be wise to not dump on them and act like they are mostly all shits other than a few.

 

I'm in marketing and I'm looking at it from that side of things and I just think the balance was well off.

Fair enough I agree it is pretty crass and heavy handed and could have done with more focus rather than trying to cram all of man’s ills into one advert, then if it wasn’t would it have got as many people talking?

 

Also from a marketing point of view would it have made more sense if the arseholes all had scraggy unkempt beards and the good guys were all immaculately smooth?

[StanSP]

2 hours ago, Jattdogg said:

Thats if people watch tele lol.

 

I dont have standard cable/tv service so never see commercials etc. And when i do i mute them or dont watch.

 

I do have to say though if every ad turns into a company going on about this it would be annoying fast. I think its just a marketing ploy of some kind for gilette. Id prefer to see how they are changing things at gilette to make things better then to be preached too

Lol true, I saw it on Twitter as I rarely watch ads on TV ?. Which in itself shows how social media can be used to a company's advantage to reach out to more people... 

[Detroit Blues]

This thread is proof that the advert worked.

 

Same thing with all the conservatives in America that had their feelings hurt when Nike put Colin Kapernick in a commercial. How did they respond? By going on TV, radio, etc and giving Nike more free ad time debating the merits of the commercial. 

 

Edit - by the way, that's why companies make these types of commercials. When your commercial goes viral/becomes newsworthy, it generates excitement about your brand. That translates into an actual increase in sales.

Edited 16 January 2019 by Detroit Blues

[Jattdogg]

8 minutes ago, Detroit Blues said:

This thread is proof that the advert worked.

 

Same thing with all the conservatives in America that had their feelings hurt when Nike put Colin Kapernick in a commercial. How did they respond? By going on TV, radio, etc and giving Nike more free ad time debating the merits of the commercial. 

 

Edit - by the way, that's why companies make these types of commercials. When your commercial goes viral/becomes newsworthy, it generates excitement about your brand. That translates into an actual increase in sales.

Im not going to buy any more gilette  products or suddenly be more aware though (because i already am aware). if you do buy more product because of this then you are a stupid simpleton (i dont mean you personally unless of course you ordered 20 blades last night from walmart)

Edited 16 January 2019 by Jattdogg