The VAR thread

[st albans fox]

2 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

Not quite sure what you have read but may well be worth while providing a link because the law as written makes no reference to deliberate nor does the IFAB

If you are correct then how would PGMOL accept the Bowen incident isn’t a foul ??

[Terraloon]

6 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

If you are correct then how would PGMOL accept the Bowen incident isn’t a foul ??

The PGMOL statement acknowledges the decisions where at this point do they say that the decision was wrong? Sky are stating that but that’s not what PGMOL are saying

 

PGMOL said in a statement: “PGMOL acknowledge the incidents to disallow the goals in the Chelsea v West Ham and Newcastle v Crystal Palace fixtures.

“We will fully co-operate and collaborate with the Premier League and their request to review these two particular incidents, using the outcome as part of the ongoing assessment of weekly performances and the development of our match officials going forward.”

 

My point is and still remains no where in the law 12 save handball does the wording refer to intention or deliberate 

 

Edited 4 September 2022 by Terraloon

[st albans fox]

20 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

The PGMOL statement acknowledges the decisions where at this point do they say that the decision was wrong? Sky are stating that but that’s not what PGMOL are saying

 

PGMOL said in a statement: “PGMOL acknowledge the incidents to disallow the goals in the Chelsea v West Ham and Newcastle v Crystal Palace fixtures.

“We will fully co-operate and collaborate with the Premier League and their request to review these two particular incidents, using the outcome as part of the ongoing assessment of weekly performances and the development of our match officials going forward.”

 

My point is and still remains no where in the law 12 save handball does the wording refer to intention or deliberate 

 

Ok - I’m a victim of sky then

 

Will assume Gallagher will agree with you tomorrow then 

[Twitcher]

Everyone going on about Newcastle and West Ham, Leeds should equally feel aggrieved.

It took 3 minutes for VAR to tell the ref. to go look, then he deliberated for a fair while. Clear and obvious? Should never have been told to go look at the monitor.

[Aus Fox]

Almost got lost in the celebration of a great win last night, but how on earth did we not get a penalty?

Barnes has a shot, Cook has his arms out, uses his arms to block the ball that is heading towards the goal and the ref didn’t even take a looks.

For me, this was as stonewall as handball penalties come - unless I’ve missed something? 
It didn’t effect the result in the end, but when you are talking two teams battling at the wrong end of the table decision like this are potentially worth millions of pound notes and a lot of people’s jobs. VAR simply has to do much better

[davieG]

5 minutes ago, Aus Fox said:

Almost got lost in the celebration of a great win last night, but how on earth did we not get a penalty?

Barnes has a shot, Cook has his arms out, uses his arms to block the ball that is heading towards the goal and the ref didn’t even take a looks.

For me, this was as stonewall as handball penalties come - unless I’ve missed something? 
It didn’t effect the result in the end, but when you are talking two teams battling at the wrong end of the table decision like this are potentially worth millions of pound notes and a lot of people’s jobs. VAR simply has to do much better

If I recall correctly he gave a free kick for a very similar offence later on in the game in a dead field area.

 

Sitting in the East Stand he also gave 2 throw-ins, one each to the wrong team and a goal-kick instead of a corner for  us.

[Les-TA-Jon]

12 minutes ago, Aus Fox said:

Almost got lost in the celebration of a great win last night, but how on earth did we not get a penalty?

Barnes has a shot, Cook has his arms out, uses his arms to block the ball that is heading towards the goal and the ref didn’t even take a looks.

For me, this was as stonewall as handball penalties come - unless I’ve missed something? 
It didn’t effect the result in the end, but when you are talking two teams battling at the wrong end of the table decision like this are potentially worth millions of pound notes and a lot of people’s jobs. VAR simply has to do much better

The most bizarre element of this for me, was that they showed it on the big screen. Often they don't show the marginal/controversial ones during the game, so as soon as the replay started I presumed that it was going to obviously show the ball coming off his leg or something. 

 

But then it showed him basically saving it and the crowd and players were in disbelief!

[st albans fox]

cook’s hand/arm has to be extended outside his normal silhouette for it to be handball 

 

it looked like he has his hand  just above his shoulder but need to see it again 

 

they would probably argue that he was too close to the shot to have been able to withdraw it but then don’t have it up in the first place ! There are arguments about natural position re balancing too 

Was just great to celebrate goals last night and not worry about var 

 

[AllGoneTitsSchlupp]

the mad thing was that daka got penalised for handball later in the game for running towards henderson and being about the same distance away

[davieG]

34 minutes ago, AllGoneTitsSchlupp said:

the mad thing was that daka got penalised for handball later in the game for running towards henderson and being about the same distance away

That's the one i was talking about. What was the difference?

[CosbehFox]

It's the inconsistency again isn't it? Chelsea got one in similar circumstances this season and Man City got one with Praet in a free kick with us. 

 

Is it a handball? Probably not but very little consistency. In European competition, it would have been given 

[st albans fox]

6 minutes ago, davieG said:

That's the one i was talking about. What was the difference?

My recollection was that daka had his arm outstretched above his head as he charged down the kick out whereas cook was leaning back with his arm closer to his body and possibly not above his shoulder 

 

apart from that they were identical 

[StanSP]

1 hour ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

The most bizarre element of this for me, was that they showed it on the big screen. Often they don't show the marginal/controversial ones during the game, so as soon as the replay started I presumed that it was going to obviously show the ball coming off his leg or something. 

 

But then it showed him basically saving it and the crowd and players were in disbelief!

I imagine this was an accident and wasn't meant to be shown. The ref only seemed to indicate it was being checked once the replay had finished. 

[davieG]

2 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

My recollection was that daka had his arm outstretched above his head as he charged down the kick out whereas cook was leaning back with his arm closer to his body and possibly not above his shoulder 

 

apart from that they were identical 

I thought Cook had his hands above his shoulders one in front of his face and one to the left of his face, but it's in the past now so we move on.

[Staff]

What about the clear elbow on Castagne yesterday too?

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, davieG said:

I thought Cook had his hands above his shoulders one in front of his face and one to the left of his face, but it's in the past now so we move on.

Different recollections! 

[davieG]

Just now, st albans fox said:

Different recollections! 

That's football. 

[st albans fox]

Just now, davieG said:

That's football. 

just saw it on the post match thread - pen!

[davieG]

1 minute ago, st albans fox said:

just saw it on the post match thread - pen!

Pretty much as I remembered it then but I had a great view from H Block left of centre in the East Stand.

[The Quick Brown Fox]

3 hours ago, AllGoneTitsSchlupp said:

the mad thing was that daka got penalised for handball later in the game for running towards henderson and being about the same distance away

Difference was Dakas arms were up in an unnatural position. I'd have been raging if a pen was given against us for the same thing. 

[SemperEadem]

Saturday's decision must have been one of the longest we have had to wait to date.

[HybridFox]

Standard of officiating is getting more dire by the game

[justfoxes]

4 minutes ago, TK95 said:

Standard of officiating is getting more dire by the game

So incompetent it’s as if they are incapable of using the technology correctly In The way it was bought in for and for John Moss to not draw the lines to check for offside but try and judge for himself is incompetent, what if that decision he made was the difference of a team being relegated therefore losing Funds etc and having to streamline work force within the club it’s diabolical, I still say ex players and Computer nerds should be employed by VAR PGMOL rather than these incompetent arrogant officials !

Edited 13 February 2023 by justfoxes

[Chelmofox]

12 minutes ago, TK95 said:

Standard of officiating is getting more dire by the game

I think its just becoming too complicated and in that moment the officials are tying themselves in knots. Personally, time to sack off VAR for anything other than clear and obvious errors until they have tested new tech for off-sides somewhere else. I don't think the PL should be a testing ground for the tech right now. Getting old men to draw lines on monitors during fast paced games is a crazy system. 

[majaco]

17 minutes ago, justfoxes said:

So incompetent it’s as if they are incapable of using the technology correctly In The way it was bought in for and for John Moss to not draw the lines to check for offside but try and judge for himself is incompetent, what if that decision he made was the difference of a team being relegated therefore losing Funds etc and having to streamline work force within the club it’s diabolical, I still say ex players and Computer nerds should be employed by VAR PGMOL rather than these incompetent arrogant officials !

I was delighted that John Moss retired as a ref .   I thought he would stop,ruining games.

 

As a ref, I always felt that he credited hi,self to apply common sense beyond the rules.  He prided himself on, being an ex player, understanding the game.   He didn't seem to grasp that refereeing is about applying the laws of the game.

 

'It's alright, Lee.  We don't need to draw the lines.   I've got my eye in.'