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Leicester_Loyal

The Politics Thread 2020

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14 minutes ago, BKLFox said:

Quit pro quo Clarice 

Think you might need to see the whole interview because for the first time as far as I’m aware the media are reporting a car crash for Keir.

TBH Strokes it just confirms to me that [insert all parties] are ALL full of shit and that it’s easy to offer this and offer that prior to picking up the reins and purse and having to make good on those offers.

 

I wouldn’t disagree with any of that. I’ll watch the interview tomorrow and I’ll let you know what I think then.

 

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4 hours ago, BKLFox said:

Strokes I’m nearly asking what people’s thoughts are now that he has dropped going after FoM, skirted around his free broadband for all pledge for example & agrees schools should try to stay open amongst other things, which are all things that have been used in argument against the government on this forum in the past week alone.

 

My thoughts:

 

- Dropping Freedom of Movement: Correct policy. No shame in changing your policy in response to a changed reality. He supported FoM, but by the next election, we'll have had 4 years without FoM - and it's unlikely voters or the EU will want FoM put back on the table. Unless there's an unexpected groundswell for FoM or treaty renegotiations, working within the existing treaty - and to improve its application/detail, where possible - makes sense politically & electorally. In 10 years, things might be different....

 

- Free broadband for all: Makes sense instead to focus on what matters now - provision of laptops & broadband access for pupils at a disadvantage during lockdown. What purpose would it serve for an opposition leader to promise free broadband for all 4 years before the next election? Would be meaningless populist rhetoric to appeal to the Corbynistas (presumably why he included it in his leadership platform!). Who knows what the situation will be in 4 years? If such a pledge seems a good idea then, he can always resurrect it.....pointless pandering to Left and dangerous to credibility to do it now.

 

- Wanting schools open for almost as long as Boris: Bang to rights on this one - and Marr did well pointing out that the teaching unions (& some health experts) had called for at least a delayed reopening of schools a fortnight earlier. To be fair, Starmer has a tricky tightrope to walk: criticise govt policy too much & he'll be accused of cynical opportunism, even irresponsibility at a time of national crisis. He was probably also concerned at media tying him in with the unions. But he was too cautious & stayed too close to the Govt on schools reopening and needs to be bolder than that. It's a reasonable priority by Govt & opposition to want schools open if at all possible, but Starmer should have parted paths with Johnson much earlier. Even if he took some flak for "being in the pocket of the unions", Covid events would've proved him right, I think - as they did before when he called for an earlier autumn circuit breaker & opposed a 5-day Xmas free-for-all (not necessarily popular positions at the time).

 

Although he didn't exactly put his hands up and say "I was wrong" over schools reopening, his comments said almost as much - quite refreshing to see a politician (almost) admit he'd got something wrong, even if he tried to put his error in a good light.

 

Starmer will need to offer more than "cautious competence" in 2024 - especially as I expect the Tories to have a new leader by then. Some positive vision and vote-winning policies will be needed. But almost 4 years is a long, long time in politics even in normal times. At times like these with all the uncertainties of Covid, Brexit, the national economy, the global economy, national debt, Scotland/N.Ireland & 4 years of Tory Govt.....it would be madness to be writing the next manifesto now. A long, long way to go, but I think he's doing well so far.

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1 hour ago, BKLFox said:

Quit pro quo Clarice 

Think you might need to see the whole interview because for the first time as far as I’m aware the media are reporting a car crash for Keir.

TBH Strokes it just confirms to me that [insert all parties] are ALL full of shit and that it’s easy to offer this and offer that prior to picking up the reins and purse and having to make good on those offers.

 

I just watched it, and it appears I seen much more than I realised.

So my opinion hasn’t changed but then I’m looking through a different looking glass to labour supporters. So it will be interesting to hear their views.

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Not sure I'd describe Marr/Starmer as a "car crash" but he certainly wasn't at his best. It's not brilliant that he's dropping FoM (something I very much support) but sadly he's just being realistic about what he has to do to win an election. Our electoral system means he needs votes in places where that wouldn't go down well and this means accepting the state of play as it is now - rather than what it was pre-Brexit/pre-deal. If that means ruling out FoM or closer links with the EU for now then so be it.

 

It'd be borderline lunacy to start advocating policies for 2024 when both the country, and the world, is in such an uncertain place now. So far I think he's, on balance, done OK and been ahead of his opposite number's thinking on coronavirus (and, as yesterday proved, actually been willing to hold his hands up if he's got it wrong). He does still come across a bit wooden at times, but I think that's something that'll naturally improve with time. As with all Labour leaders, he needs to avoid making the mistake of fighting the previous election when the time comes. At least he's actually making clear he wants to be Prime Minister, something his predecessor spectacularly failed to do.

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23 hours ago, fuchsntf said:

What home truths...??

Admired his forward planning in already losing the next election. Remarked how they have replaced an un electable 70 yr old with an unelectable 50 something. Dullest politician ever, hopefully labour will replace him before the next election, because the Tories won’t hesitate to replace Blojo if he can’t win

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Not much chat about the sham of a private company raking in profits from sorting out Free School Meals. Instead of the £30 food voucher, they've swapped that for about a fiver's worth of food for families. Some of the pictures flying around on social media are terrible - parents expected to feed themselves and their kids on a few bits of fruit, tin of beans, potatoes and a few other bits for a good few days. About a fiver for that, and £30 in total for the taxpayer. Wouldn't surprise me if the private company was owned by a mate of a Tory MP and given a multi-million pound deal to organise it and promptly making a shitshow of it but still rakes in the money...:unsure:

 

I (and probably the many families receiving this) clearly don't expect a banquet, but no doubt they should be getting much, much better than this...

 

 

 

 

Would be good to see how far they 'look in to it'...

 

 

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29 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Not much chat about the sham of a private company raking in profits from sorting out Free School Meals. Instead of the £30 food voucher, they've swapped that for about a fiver's worth of food for families. Some of the pictures flying around on social media are terrible - parents expected to feed themselves and their kids on a few bits of fruit, tin of beans, potatoes and a few other bits for a good few days. About a fiver for that, and £30 in total for the taxpayer. Wouldn't surprise me if the private company was owned by a mate of a Tory MP and given a multi-million pound deal to organise it and promptly making a shitshow of it but still rakes in the money...:unsure:

 

I (and probably the many families receiving this) clearly don't expect a banquet, but no doubt they should be getting much, much better than this...

 

 

 

 

Would be good to see how far they 'look in to it'...

 

 

Christ they should get gusto to do it. That’s absolutely horrific.

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9 hours ago, StanSP said:

Not much chat about the sham of a private company raking in profits from sorting out Free School Meals. Instead of the £30 food voucher, they've swapped that for about a fiver's worth of food for families. Some of the pictures flying around on social media are terrible - parents expected to feed themselves and their kids on a few bits of fruit, tin of beans, potatoes and a few other bits for a good few days. About a fiver for that, and £30 in total for the taxpayer. Wouldn't surprise me if the private company was owned by a mate of a Tory MP and given a multi-million pound deal to organise it and promptly making a shitshow of it but still rakes in the money...:unsure:

 

I (and probably the many families receiving this) clearly don't expect a banquet, but no doubt they should be getting much, much better than this...

 

 

 

 

Would be good to see how far they 'look in to it'...

 

 

That very vague definition from the DfE means you could at a push argue that that package does have variety and nutrition. But its not £30 worth and its not enough for a week.

 

Maybe it shouldn't be a weekly budget and be a monthly one. I know some weeks my shopping costs more because I make a purchase of something like rice, pasta etc that'll last weeks or months. Is this £30 only intended for the weekly basics like bread, milk, etc?

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10 hours ago, StanSP said:

Not much chat about the sham of a private company raking in profits from sorting out Free School Meals. Instead of the £30 food voucher, they've swapped that for about a fiver's worth of food for families. Some of the pictures flying around on social media are terrible - parents expected to feed themselves and their kids on a few bits of fruit, tin of beans, potatoes and a few other bits for a good few days. About a fiver for that, and £30 in total for the taxpayer. Wouldn't surprise me if the private company was owned by a mate of a Tory MP and given a multi-million pound deal to organise it and promptly making a shitshow of it but still rakes in the money...:unsure:

 

I (and probably the many families receiving this) clearly don't expect a banquet, but no doubt they should be getting much, much better than this...

 

 

 

 

Would be good to see how far they 'look in to it'...

 

 

It's a national disgrace.

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On 10/01/2021 at 18:03, Abrasive fox said:

What's my party?

 

This is a strange take given it completely misses the point 🤣

It doesn't miss the point at all.  You are pointing to flaws of the Conservative government and saying people would vote for them regardless, and I am pointing out that there are broader underlying beliefs and values which underpin our two major parties which drive people to vote for them despite short term policies or people / leaders who they might not agree with.  I might like Starmer and detest Boris, but it doesn't mean I am going to vote Labour, because i know that the party is based on some underlying principles which I don't find very important or valid, despite what Starmer might be saying this week.

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2 hours ago, Facecloth said:

That very vague definition from the DfE means you could at a push argue that that package does have variety and nutrition. But its not £30 worth and its not enough for a week.

 

Maybe it shouldn't be a weekly budget and be a monthly one. I know some weeks my shopping costs more because I make a purchase of something like rice, pasta etc that'll last weeks or months. Is this £30 only intended for the weekly basics like bread, milk, etc?

 

Presumably this is supposed to replace only the lunch the kids would be getting at school, so 10 lunches.  My two would eat this in 2 or 3 days so I have no idea how it is supposed to last anyone a week let alone two. 

Cost wise someone has clearly failed to see that providing this for someone to make their own at home is a ****load cheaper than having hot and cold food prepared fresh daily and delivered to every school.

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Just now, Jon the Hat said:

 

Presumably this is supposed to replace only the lunch the kids would be getting at school, so 10 lunches.  My two would eat this in 2 or 3 days so I have no idea how it is supposed to last anyone a week let alone two. 

Cost wise someone has clearly failed to see that providing this for someone to make their own at home is a ****load cheaper than having hot and cold food prepared fresh daily and delivered to every school.

Of course, I'm thinking of all meals rather than just lunch for some reason.

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25 minutes ago, StanSP said:

 

 

 

 

What a surprise. 

 

I'd love to hear our right wing friends' defence of the continued and disgraceful levels of nepotism with multi-million - even billion - pound contracts during the current regime. 

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1 minute ago, Facecloth said:

Of course, I'm thinking of all meals rather than just lunch for some reason.

it is still pretty shit.  Hopefully most people are getting more than this.  Our primary school is doing made up lunches each day from their kitchen for parents to walk round and collect, but then they use a local firm not chartwells.

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Just now, RoboFox said:

What a surprise. 

I'd love to hear our right wing friends' defence of the continued and disgraceful levels of nepotism with multi-million - even billion - pound contracts during the current regime. 

Chartwells part of a large, successful existing food service provider to schools among many others.  Presumably you would prefer the government to throw money are an unproven company who never fed kids before?  I mean it worked so well for PPE and Ferries.  FFS at least kick them for the actual incompetence.  

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7 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

Chartwells part of a large, successful existing food service provider to schools among many others.  Presumably you would prefer the government to throw money are an unproven company who never fed kids before?  I mean it worked so well for PPE and Ferries.  FFS at least kick them for the actual incompetence.  

They do get kicked for it but then there's always people ready to defend them at any length :dunno:

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12 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

Chartwells part of a large, successful existing food service provider to schools among many others.  Presumably you would prefer the government to throw money are an unproven company who never fed kids before?  I mean it worked so well for PPE and Ferries.  FFS at least kick them for the actual incompetence.  

A £5-odd food parcel being charged £30 to the national purse.

 

500% profit. 

 

It's cronyism and disaster capitalism on an unbelievable scale. 

 

But you're right, in this particular instance they seem to have got it bang on. 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

£30 for that is an absolute disgrace and it makes me sick. Someone is seriously profiting off all of this, heads need to be rolled.

It is not even close to the list on the Chartwell site of what they provide for 2 weeks, someone has ****ed up clearly. 

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3 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

It is not even close to the list on the Chartwell site of what they provide for 2 weeks, someone has ****ed up clearly. 

To be fair I didn't read the thread, just saw the original post and I've just heard it on the news earlier.

 

I hope you're right and we'll get to the bottom of it in the coming days. It said on the news it comes to about £6 in Asda, mental.

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