Covid Vaccine

[UniFox21]

47 minutes ago, Out Foxed said:

covid kills at risk people

 

we don't need a ****ing vaccine, same as not needing flu shots. 

Please tell me this is satire

[yorkie1999]

I wonder if it will be compulsory to have the vaccine.

[UniFox21]

11 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

I wonder if it will be compulsory to have the vaccine.

I doubt they'd be able to. I assume it'll be highly recommended and maybe a few "you can do X after having the vaccine" but i don't believe they can force it on anyone.

[yorkie1999]

7 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

I doubt they'd be able to. I assume it'll be highly recommended and maybe a few "you can do X after having the vaccine" but i don't believe they can force it on anyone.

Just wondering as they’ve managed to force lockdowns and all the other stuff on people

[UniFox21]

1 minute ago, yorkie1999 said:

Just wondering as they’ve managed to force lockdowns and all the other stuff on people

It's one thing to force people to stay inside, whole different thing to force medication into someone. Given hospitals need permission to operate etc, 

[yorkie1999]

1 minute ago, UniFox21 said:

It's one thing to force people to stay inside, whole different thing to force medication into someone. Given hospitals need permission to operate etc, 

It is, but these are unprecedented times. I’m sure someone told me they do it in Africa and the government have a disclaimer if something goes wrong

[fuchsntf]

On 25/10/2020 at 13:57, Izzy said:

Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you 

They had already " Got me".  but I escaped...

I Stole the Paper of proof, its all recorded on Black Sabbaths's Paranoid...

[fuchsntf]

Enjoy the last 45 years of my life...

 

 

[Bryn]

39 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

I wonder if it will be compulsory to have the vaccine.

 

I'd be very surprised. Consent is a huge part of medical treatment. Further, mandatory vaccination/treatment is explicitly excluded in Public Health legislation which Coronavirus laws are based on.

Even if the Government tried this, I think the judiciary and the overwhelming majority of health professionals will stand in their way.

[Strokes]

1 hour ago, reynard said:

Indeed it was a scandal and a tragedy. I would have to say that it was also the catalyst to the transformation of clinical trials and the reporting and study of such trials which are now far more rigid.

Whilst I quite agree, we didn’t know that they needed to be more rigid, until after this event did we? Me taking this vaccine has very little reward with a (hopefully) just small bit of risk, to me it’s unnecessary. So why should I take it?

Let those at risk take it and those not worried first and if they don’t turn into zombies or gremlins and it’s still necessary for whatever reason that me and my kids take it, I will.

[Bryn]

Just now, Strokes said:

Whilst I quite agree, we didn’t know that they needed to be more rigid, until after this event did we? Me taking this vaccine has very little reward with a (hopefully) just small bit of risk, to me it’s unnecessary. So why should I take it?

Let those at risk take it and those not worried first and if they don’t turn into zombies or gremlins and it’s still necessary for whatever reason that me and my kids take it, I will.

You need to have a little bit of a read about herd immunity and why it's vital to protect the "at risk", many of whom are immunosuppressed. I pray to God none of your children ever get cancer, require chemo and are dependent on their classmates having their jabs to ensure they have any form of protection.

You want to be a selfish ballbag, fine, but don't pretend like there's a rationale.

[Strokes]

1 minute ago, Bryn said:

You need to have a little bit of a read about herd immunity and why it's vital to protect the "at risk", many of whom are immunosuppressed. I pray to God none of your children ever get cancer, require chemo and are dependent on their classmates having their jabs to ensure they have any form of protection.

You want to be a selfish ballbag, fine, but don't pretend like there's a rationale.

I was listening to you until this....

but if you want to be a cùnt about people having genuine fear, then try a different method to get through to them.

[Guest Fktf]

2 hours ago, Strokes said:

I was listening to you until this....

but if you want to be a cùnt about people having genuine fear, then try a different method to get through to them.

http://vk.ovg.ox.ac.uk/vk/herd-immunity

 

A decent description/video here, albeit based on measles as an example. There was a measles out break in Wales - probably over 5 years ago now - all caused by a lack of herd protection. Lots of people not taking kids for mmr jab, the virus spread through schools, and eventually found transmission links to babies, who are a) very susceptible to measles, and b) too young to be vaccinated, and so rely on herd immunity (I.e. siblings getting vaccinated so they dont bring it home with them)

 

What that link will miss with regards to covid is the pressure on the nhs. The vaccine might create herd immunity in terms of protecting people who can't have it (just like measles, if enough people take it), but it will also mean that the people who take the vaccine are personally protected, and therefore not likely to be hospitalized - and it is reducing icu beds taken up by covid patients that is going to be the key to no more lockdowns.

[Bayfox]

For those in favour in a vaccine, todays study showing that immunity could only last a few months is a bit of a blow. Meaning it could lead to regular 6 month injections. Good for the drug companies I guess.

Edited 27 October 2020 by Bayfox

[Collymore]

4 minutes ago, Bayfox said:

For those in favour in a vaccine, todays study showing that immunity could only last a few months is a bit of a blow. Meaning it could lead to regular 6 month injections. Good for the drug companies I guess.

Not good for people with a fear of needles! 

[UniFox21]

Positive news continues to rise around the Oxford/AZ vaccine. 

 

@Strokes this will give you a bit more information on how the vaccine has been produced. 

[UniFox21]

1 hour ago, Bayfox said:

For those in favour in a vaccine, todays study showing that immunity could only last a few months is a bit of a blow. Meaning it could lead to regular 6 month injections. Good for the drug companies I guess.

Just to clarify a few things fron what you've posted.

 

So studies have shown that the level of antibodies has fallen by 26% in those tested, this was most found in the over 65s. Interesting that health care workers didn't see a drop as defined potentially due to consistent exposure to the virus. The drop was also less prominent in younger people.

 

But they're currently speculating that the fall in antibody level removes immunity, it's usually a good indicator, but not certain by any means.

Scientists also don't know how the antibody level fades after a vaccine compared with catching the strain itself, there could potentially be a difference. 

 

Suggestion there could be a need to "top up" your antibodies after a certain period of time, just as with the flu vaccine.  But none of what they've found is conclusive, they can't draw any huge conclusions yet. They have just found that antibody levels fall.

 

BBC News - Covid: Antibodies 'fall rapidly after infection'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54696873

 

Here's the BBC article for anyone interested.

[Guest Fktf]

1 hour ago, UniFox21 said:

Just to clarify a few things fron what you've posted.

 

So studies have shown that the level of antibodies has fallen by 26% in those tested, this was most found in the over 65s. Interesting that health care workers didn't see a drop as defined potentially due to consistent exposure to the virus. The drop was also less prominent in younger people.

 

But they're currently speculating that the fall in antibody level removes immunity, it's usually a good indicator, but not certain by any means.

Scientists also don't know how the antibody level fades after a vaccine compared with catching the strain itself, there could potentially be a difference. 

 

Suggestion there could be a need to "top up" your antibodies after a certain period of time, just as with the flu vaccine.  But none of what they've found is conclusive, they can't draw any huge conclusions yet. They have just found that antibody levels fall.

 

BBC News - Covid: Antibodies 'fall rapidly after infection'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54696873

 

Here's the BBC article for anyone interested.

Is not the case that some vaccines can also give us better immunity than a natural infection? 

[Guest Markyblue]

3 hours ago, Bayfox said:

For those in favour in a vaccine, todays study showing that immunity could only last a few months is a bit of a blow. Meaning it could lead to regular 6 month injections. Good for the drug companies I guess.

It means nothing of the sort , just because anti bodies decrease does not mean they dont reappear if the body is under attack again, even this report states they dont know if they will reappear if needed.

[dsr-burnley]

They must know what happens to antibodies in all the other diseases that we get immunity from.  Measles, for example.  Does the body retain a large store of antibodies for ever, or do the antibodies fade but the body remembers how to produce them in a hurry?

 

[Edit] I found this sentence in an article about measles.  (I include the source for completeness.  It may tell us more about measles than we want to know!)

 

"Although the titer of vaccine-induced antibodies [after vaccination] is lower than that following natural disease, both serologic and epidemiologic evidence indicate that vaccine-induced immunity appears to be long-term and probably lifelong in most persons. Most vaccinated persons who appear to lose antibody show an anamnestic immune response upon revaccination, indicating that they are probably still immune. Although revaccination can increase antibody titer in some persons, available data indicate that the increased titer may not be sustained. Some studies indicate that secondary vaccine failure (waning immunity) may occur after successful vaccination, but this appears to occur rarely and to play only a minor role in measles transmission and outbreaks."

 

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/meas.pdf

 

What it's saying is that in measles, number of antibodies may fall after vaccination but you're still immune.

Edited 27 October 2020 by dsr-burnley

[Nalis]

Everyone should have a choice on a vaccine but anyone who doesnt want it should have their rights to NHS access revoked in respect of covid related treatment and rely soly on self paid private health care instead.

[dsr-burnley]

6 minutes ago, Nalis said:

Everyone should have a choice on a vaccine but anyone who doesnt want it should have their rights to NHS access revoked in respect of covid related treatment and rely soly on self paid private health care instead.

If you hold a gun to someone's head and tell them that they have a choice whether to give you their wallet or you will shoot, then you aren't giving them a choice.

[martyn]

4 hours ago, Bayfox said:

For those in favour in a vaccine, todays study showing that immunity could only last a few months is a bit of a blow. Meaning it could lead to regular 6 month injections. Good for the drug companies I guess.

Pretty sure i read somewhere recently (just tried to find article but couldn't), that a vaccine might reasonably be expected to provide an increased duration of immunity over having had the infection.

[Nalis]

6 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

If you hold a gun to someone's head and tell them that they have a choice whether to give you their wallet or you will shoot, then you aren't giving them a choice.

Bit of an imaginative analogy

[danny.]

4 hours ago, Nalis said:

Everyone should have a choice on a vaccine but anyone who doesnt want it should have their rights to NHS access revoked in respect of covid related treatment and rely soly on self paid private health care instead.

I assume the same will go for people who smoke, drink, don't exercise, eat poorly and are overweight?