Steve Cooper SACKED! OFFICIAL!

[AKCJ]

41 minutes ago, Chrysalis said:

There is nothing to support this theory.

Other than the fact that under Cooper we'd conceded the 3rd most in the league, conceded first in 84% of our games, conceded the 2nd most shots and attempted the 2nd fewest shots.

Edited 23 April by AKCJ

[everton carr]

On 21/04/2025 at 20:56, honeybradger said:

Thanks Cooper for getting outplayed by one of the worst sides in PL history then getting bailed out by a red card and Fatawu who he had benched for no reason

Bailed out by the red card hardly it was 2 all when they went down to 10 men

[Phenom]

9 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

There is nothing to support this theory.

A Cooper fan boy? Are you ****ing kidding me?!

[teblin]

22 minutes ago, everton carr said:

Bailed out by the red card hardly it was 2 all when they went down to 10 men

He was sent off 73mins we equalised 74 from the resulting penalty I believe. 
 

Just before that might have been just after we were very very lucky to for Ayew to get away will pull a Southampton player back in the box.

 

That said, maybe cooper was a lucky manager. Might have been in his favour.

Edited 24 April by teblin

[The Doctor]

9 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

There is nothing to support this theory.

You mean aside from the performances being shit under Cooper and us barely deserving the points we did get? Let's look at the underlying stats for Coopers reign: understat for xpts, fbref for shooting stats

 

The worst expected points tally at 9.14, so 0.76pts per game, marginally worse than his actual points per game record of 0.83pts per game. From that, we'd be looking at 24 - 27 points currently. Ok, marginally better than current but still cut massively adrift and nailed on to be relegated this weekend, is surviving for one week more actually significantly better? And that's without considering that Cooper had played both of the other two newly promoted sides, who are also cut adrift. Those games contributed 3.79 of the xpts and 4 of the actual points, so lets take them out of the tally for now since we've not played them again yet, and against the other 17, his xpts per game becomes 0.535, and his pts per game becomes 0.6, which would be 16 - 18 points from those other 30 games, so we'd be at 20 - 22 points currently, barely ahead of where we are currently and still relegated last weekend (for reference, RvNs expected points per game is 0.62, so marginally better than Coopers if the stat padding v Southampton and Ipswich is discounted)

 

Lets consider chance creation. Under Cooper, discounting penalties we took 115 shots in 12 games (only managing more than the opposition vs Ipswich and Southampton), with 33 on target. For the full season we're on 289 with 91 on target, with the caretaker Brentford match adding 7 shots, 3 on target. So under RvN we've taken 167 shots in 20 games and gotten 55 on target. 1.2 less shots per game under RvN, same amount on target per game (2.75 each). We weren't really creating much under Cooper, there's no evidence that this tail off in goals wouldn't have happened under Cooper given our chance creation hasn't significantly changed since he left.

 

Meanwhile chances against - 556 shots allowed, 185 on target in 33 games. 13 (6 on target) from the caretaker Brentford game, 210 (66 on target) under Cooper, 333 (113 on target) under RvN. comparatively then 16.7 shots per game faced under RvN to 17.5 per game faced under Cooper, 5.65 on target per game under RvN to 5.5 on target per game under Cooper. The defence has barely shifted under RvN versus Cooper, the difference is that Cooper had an inform Hermansen, while RvN has had a Hermansen who came back from injury and hasn't recovered form, a rushed back from injury Stolarcyk and the worlds worst goalkeeper impersonater Danny Ward.

 

The underlying stats for both managers are very similar, the truth is both are crap and we'd have gone down with a whimper if we'd kept Cooper as much as we have having sacked him.

[Finnegan]

10 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

you said your sentence without saying Ruud was a downgrade on Cooper.

 

I literally did the opposite? 

 

[CosbehFox]

Cooper was not a leader by any stretch. Almost too honest. A lot of the journos have shared below, so no harm. 

 

The Edouard deal he wanted, then back out of, and then wanted. Then didn't play him. Club were very apologetic 

 

Other time wheeling out the analysts in front of the media after Palace away like a conspiracy theorist about the 2-2 equaliser being offside. 

 

You've had half of the Championship with jobs and he hasn't been touched. 

Edited 24 April by CosbehFox

[JimJams]

11 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

There is nothing to support this theory.

There kind of is. Cooper picked up points against Bournemouth, Saints, Ipswich, Spurs, Everton and Palace. Totalling 10 points. Ruud has yet to play the first 3 so the remainder is 3 points for Cooper on those same fixtures, 3 points for Ruud.

 

So in terms of comparing the same teams, we can dismiss results against teams Cooper didn't get to play and we can dismiss the games against opposition Ruud has yet to play.

 

Even, total shite, Stevens.

 

[everton carr]

2 hours ago, teblin said:

He was sent off 73mins we equalised 74 from the resulting penalty I believe. 
 

Just before that might have been just after we were very very lucky to for Ayew to get away will pull a Southampton player back in the box.

 

That said, maybe cooper was a lucky manager. Might have been in his favour.

Yes sent off when we got the penalty so 2 all when the game restarted with them.being down to 10

[AKCJ]

2 hours ago, everton carr said:

Bailed out by the red card hardly it was 2 all when they went down to 10 men

Technically it was 2-1 when they went down to 10 men.

[Chrysalis]

20 hours ago, Phenom said:

A Cooper fan boy? Are you ****ing kidding me?!

No, just we never went on anything like that run during his reign, so nothing was pointing to it happening.

 

You seem a bit offended I am trying to point out irrational points of view?

[Chrysalis]

19 hours ago, The Doctor said:

You mean aside from the performances being shit under Cooper and us barely deserving the points we did get? Let's look at the underlying stats for Coopers reign: understat for xpts, fbref for shooting stats

 

 

Yes because I judge on results, not perceived performances.

 

You dont win or lose games, get relegated, win titles based on whether you supposedly deserve it, its all done on results.

 

The chances were also better under Cooper no matter how rough we looked otherwise, which is why we scored more goals  under him than Ruud.

Edited 25 April by Chrysalis

[The Doctor]

4 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

Yes because I judge on results, not perceived performances.

 

You dont win or lose games, get relegated, win titles based on whether you supposedly deserve it, its all done on results.

 

The chances were also better under Cooper no matter how rough we looked otherwise, which is why we scored more goals  under him than Ruud.

except generally speaking, your results trend towards your performances, not the other way around. None of the underlying data has changed, we were absolutely crap in coopers final days. RvN took us down with a whimper, how we were playing under cooper and the results we were getting would have us doing the same

[cropstonfox]

On 24/04/2025 at 08:16, The Doctor said:

You mean aside from the performances being shit under Cooper and us barely deserving the points we did get? Let's look at the underlying stats for Coopers reign: understat for xpts, fbref for shooting stats

 

The worst expected points tally at 9.14, so 0.76pts per game, marginally worse than his actual points per game record of 0.83pts per game. From that, we'd be looking at 24 - 27 points currently. Ok, marginally better than current but still cut massively adrift and nailed on to be relegated this weekend, is surviving for one week more actually significantly better? And that's without considering that Cooper had played both of the other two newly promoted sides, who are also cut adrift. Those games contributed 3.79 of the xpts and 4 of the actual points, so lets take them out of the tally for now since we've not played them again yet, and against the other 17, his xpts per game becomes 0.535, and his pts per game becomes 0.6, which would be 16 - 18 points from those other 30 games, so we'd be at 20 - 22 points currently, barely ahead of where we are currently and still relegated last weekend (for reference, RvNs expected points per game is 0.62, so marginally better than Coopers if the stat padding v Southampton and Ipswich is discounted)

 

Lets consider chance creation. Under Cooper, discounting penalties we took 115 shots in 12 games (only managing more than the opposition vs Ipswich and Southampton), with 33 on target. For the full season we're on 289 with 91 on target, with the caretaker Brentford match adding 7 shots, 3 on target. So under RvN we've taken 167 shots in 20 games and gotten 55 on target. 1.2 less shots per game under RvN, same amount on target per game (2.75 each). We weren't really creating much under Cooper, there's no evidence that this tail off in goals wouldn't have happened under Cooper given our chance creation hasn't significantly changed since he left.

 

Meanwhile chances against - 556 shots allowed, 185 on target in 33 games. 13 (6 on target) from the caretaker Brentford game, 210 (66 on target) under Cooper, 333 (113 on target) under RvN. comparatively then 16.7 shots per game faced under RvN to 17.5 per game faced under Cooper, 5.65 on target per game under RvN to 5.5 on target per game under Cooper. The defence has barely shifted under RvN versus Cooper, the difference is that Cooper had an inform Hermansen, while RvN has had a Hermansen who came back from injury and hasn't recovered form, a rushed back from injury Stolarcyk and the worlds worst goalkeeper impersonater Danny Ward.

 

The underlying stats for both managers are very similar, the truth is both are crap and we'd have gone down with a whimper if we'd kept Cooper as much as we have having sacked him.

Or both are crap.and so are most of the players.Not sure any Manager could have kept up this bunch of deluded useless

*****.

 

 

 

[foxinsocks]

3 minutes ago, cropstonfox said:

Or both are crap.and so are most of the players.Not sure any Manager could have kept up this bunch of deluded useless

*****.

 

 

 

There was no way fwd with cooper.   He'd lost the dressing room and his results were poor.

I have no idea if he is a good manager but it didn't work out... more time would not have helped.

Frankly ruud's impact was poor... I have no idea if he is a good manager... not sure klopp could have done better.

We can let ruud try... but I suspect a clean start is best for all

 

[Claridge]

far rather have cooper in the championship than Ruud .Probably his level to be fair

[Motty]

12 hours ago, Claridge said:

far rather have cooper in the championship than Ruud .Probably his level to be fair

Well we have paid him prem wages for 2 seasons so no manager wages in the accounts if you got him back.

[Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot]

It’s not irrational at all to say he couldn’t possibly have done any worse. I was totally underwhelmed by the appointment and more than glad to see the back of him but anyone saying we’ve done better under Ruud needs their heads looking at. Plus with money so tight his pay off meant we almost had literally no money in Jan. with hindsight don’t see the difference it would have made keeping him on, we’d have 15 points instead of 17 or 25 maybe, we’d still be down with a whimper either way.

[Claudio Fannieri]

On 25/04/2025 at 03:56, Chrysalis said:

Yes because I judge on results, not perceived performances.

 

You dont win or lose games, get relegated, win titles based on whether you supposedly deserve it, its all done on results.

 

The chances were also better under Cooper no matter how rough we looked otherwise, which is why we scored more goals  under him than Ruud.

We are already on a slump 1 draw against 10 man Ipswich and 5 defeats in his last 6 games, conceding chances for fun and creating very little by the time he was sacked. Cooper was an appalling appointment as has proven to be Ruud. The top and bottom of it is neither were the right man at the right time and just further demonstrates the appalling decision making at the club. 

[J. James]

On 22/04/2025 at 09:53, AKCJ said:

I think our record would have been just as bad if we hadn't sacked Cooper.

A saying l love is "It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt." (Mark Twain)

In managerial terms we will never know for sure if Cooper would have kept us up - very unlikely with our useless players and hapless board, but van Rooney is definitely the fool who opened his mouth!

[Sol thewall Bamba]

Crazy that we're still speaking about this bum. Ruud is shit but that doesn't distract from how shit we were under Cooper. He should never have been anywhere near the 5th most successful football club of the millennium.

[tinpot_fox]

13 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

Crazy that we're still speaking about this bum. Ruud is shit but that doesn't distract from how shit we were under Cooper. He should never have been anywhere near the 5th most successful football club of the millennium.

Unfortunately being the 5th most successful (IK?) football club of the millennium did not translate into having the 5th most profit or whatever to pay the 5th highest wage bill.

 

p.s I still think Cooper had some luck and got points when (especially with hindsight) we weren’t good enough to get the points, but if that’s what’s gets points to stay up, then get the points and stay up. We were starting to be on an unlucky run, not picking up the undeserved we had been, the question is could Cooper have changed things or got lucky again? I don’t know and realistically we wouldn’t have stayed up because Wolves finally got their act together so it will likely be a big gap between safety and relegation at the end of the season 

[coolhandfox]

47 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

Crazy that we're still speaking about this bum. Ruud is shit but that doesn't distract from how shit we were under Cooper. He should never have been anywhere near the 5th most successful football club of the millennium.

Honestly it crazy people are still defending him, shouldn't have even got an interview.

[Bilo]

So many of our problems from this season stem from him.

 

A horrible preseason, incoherent policies from the outset, huge amounts of money and wages spent on absolute pony and, of course, the severance payout meaning that our abilities in the transfer market were so severely limited. With hindsight, we were relegated from the moment he took the job and he should never have got an interview. 

 

Neutrals will say that he would have kept us up because he did with Forest, but ignore how incredibly fortunate they were to survive and how horrific the football was. Look at what they've done since him with only one good transfer window and summer - albeit also with a huge dollop of good fortune. That gives the biggest indicator as to Cooper's abilities.

Edited 26 April by Bilo

[moore_94]

Prem experience hard on meaning we get stuck with the likes of Reid, Ayew, and Skipp

 

Pr!ck