Scottish Independence Poll

[Guest MattP]

No.  Incorrect.  There are plenty.

 

The last UK general election, in Scottish constituencies, the Conservatives got 412,855 (compare that with SNP: 491,386)

 

It's just that the first past the post system gave labour so many Westminster seats.

 

I didn't know that, the Tories were within 2% of the Liberals and the SNP yet get one seat compared to 18 for the other two.

 

Just shows how fcuked up FPTP is really.

[Kopfkino]

There was a good article in the NYT yesterday by  Paul Krugman who is one of the world's leading economists. Most of what he said has already been covered to death but still a good read.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/08/opinion/paul-krugman-scots-what-the-heck.html?_r=0

[Alf Bentley]

I thought it was a bit immature for the 'better together' campaign to decide to refuse to let UKIP join it, school playground tactics and given that UKIP got 10.5% of the vote in Scotland it's very possible that segment of society could even be the deciding factor given how close the vote is now.

 

Scare tactics and smear, let's be honest It's all I've come to expect from the Westminster elite these days whether it's campaigning against UKIP, the SNP, the Scots, the Greens etc etc. It seems to be pretty much all they have, I just hope they use the same tactics when it comes to the EU referendum as well.

 

Shall we annex Dumfries, Clydedales and Tweedale if they vote Yes? I think it's the right thing to do given the circumstances, these people have never wanted to live under and Labour/SNP government and given the importance the SNP has put on that factor being part of the Yes vote they surely give them the right to allow it to join England?

 

 

Perhaps a civilised swap could be arranged? Dumfries and Galloway could join the Thatcherite Kingdom of England while Leicester secedes to the Socialist Republic of Scotland? 

[Vacamion]

I didn't know that, the Tories were within 2% of the Liberals and the SNP yet get one seat compared to 18 for the other two.

 

Just shows how fcuked up FPTP is really.

 

 

Conservatism is a toxic brand in Scotland, but is is Eton/Bullingdon/Westminster Conservatives that they hate.

 

Ruth Davidson (leader of the Scottish Tories) is quite well liked and respected, like her predecessor Annbel Goldie, although I would admit that few people up here shout about the fact that they vote Tory. 

 

Cameron has, wisely up until now, stayed out of it and left Labour to run things in Better Together.  Goodness knows what he thinks he will add by coming North.

 

The tweet from Hugo Rifkind earlier - that Cameron / Miliband are hoping for a rough reception from rabid socialist Yessers, to scare neutrals into voting No - may not just be a humerous aside.

[ADK]

It's always difficult to defend an establishment, we have seen that with Clegg trying to defend the EU. Even so I don't think the yes campaign was taken seriously enough. I'm not sure having every politician rush up to Scotland a few days before the poll is going to work or the government offering last minute bribes.

[leicsmac]

I don't know.... Apparently, Cameron, Miliband & Clegg are all going up to Scotland together tomorrow, and Farage will be leading a UKIP rally for the Union in Glasgow. All that should give the "Yes" campaign a big boost! 

 

To be fair to Farage, he's probably doing it deliberately to encourage a "Yes" vote, which would allow UKIP south of the border to formally become the English (or English & Anglo-Welsh) party that it essentially is. What the other 3 clowns think they're going to achieve other than handing more votes to Salmond, I don't know.

 

I hate what I've seen of the "No" campaign: scare tactics, Westminster sneering & doom and gloom, no positive vision at all....but maybe those fear tactics will work when people actually enter the polling booth and are faced with a ballot paper?

I know that if I were an undecided voter, all that negativity would make me more likely to vote "Yes"..... "You say we can't do it and we'll fvck it all up?! Well, fvck you, we can do it and we will!" would be my response.

 

I hope they do vote "No", though. Quite apart from potential Anglo-Scottish tensions if there's a "Yes" vote, the rump UK could become as politically polarised as the USA. We all know that there are a lot of right-wingers in England who, deep down, see "English" as a synonym for "Thatcherite" and do not accept people with left-wing sympathies as valid English/UK citizens (aware I'm ignoring Wales & N. Ireland, there, but they'll have little influence next to a country of 50m or whatever).

 

This. 

 

I didn't know that, the Tories were within 2% of the Liberals and the SNP yet get one seat compared to 18 for the other two.

 

Just shows how fcuked up FPTP is really.

 

And this.

[bovril]

Every time I see 'Better Together' I think of that god awful Jack Johnson song then it gets stuck in my head all day. So now I just associate the pro-Union side with indie-shmindie Waitrose-folk.

[breadandcheese]

Conservatism is a toxic brand in Scotland, but is is Eton/Bullingdon/Westminster Conservatives that they hate.

 

Ruth Davidson (leader of the Scottish Tories) is quite well liked and respected, like her predecessor Annbel Goldie, although I would admit that few people up here shout about the fact that they vote Tory. 

 

Cameron has, wisely up until now, stayed out of it and left Labour to run things in Better Together.  Goodness knows what he thinks he will add by coming North.

 

The tweet from Hugo Rifkind earlier - that Cameron / Miliband are hoping for a rough reception from rabid socialist Yessers, to scare neutrals into voting No - may not just be a humerous aside.

 

 

Scottish independence will be the rebirth of the Scottish Tories.  Maybe not at first, but in a few years, as the SNP's lies about oil money covering increased public spending become apparent. Scotland will be forced to choose between high taxes (strangling growth) or austerity.  There will be no opportunity to blame Westminster.

[Webbo]

 There will be no opportunity to blame Westminster.

I bet they still try.

[ADK]

Of course there will be a right wing party, whether they call themselves conservatives or not.

[Guest MattP]

My Lord.

I've just actually witnessed Gordon Brown say live on television he is going to lecture people on pensions.

[PAPA LAZAROU]

 

 

 

No change then .

[Guest MattP]

 

 

(Not sure how many actually think they do get a vote mind)

[PAPA LAZAROU]

Well as conspiracy goes I have a feeling the Tory government  have deliberately mucked this up. Everything is to their advantage for it to go to a yes result. No more Scotland bleeding us dry . no more Scottish socialist swinging the vote Labours way in general elections ( wave good by to 59 of their MP's ) and a chance to consolidate our own future without the burden of worrying what the Scottish will think or moan about.

 

I think a yes vote would be good for us the English as a nation, What exactly will we lose from this so called union ? The good side for us is not having to hear or see anything about the Scottish football leagues on OUR tv  or having to listen to drunken jocks all over England lamenting about " Bonny Scotland " because we can now tell them to take their foreign ars*ses back home then. It 's a big YES from me.

[Guest MattP]

Well as conspiracy goes I have a feeling the Tory government  have deliberately mucked this up. Everything is to their advantage for it to go to a yes result. No more Scotland bleeding us dry . no more Scottish socialist swinging the vote Labours way in general elections ( wave good by to 59 of their MP's ) and a chance to consolidate our own future without the burden of worrying what the Scottish will think or moan about.

 

I think a yes vote would be good for us the English as a nation, What exactly will we lose from this so called union ? The good side for us is not having to hear or see anything about the Scottish football leagues on OUR tv  or having to listen to drunken jocks all over England lamenting about " Bonny Scotland " because we can now tell them to take their foreign ars*ses back home then. It 's a big YES from me.

 

Exactly why I'm completely behind this, we really can't lose. It will barely make a difference to anyone down here in reality of their day to day life, if they balls it up then so be it, we can just watch and it will probably just be like having another Ireland next to us but a bit more poorer.

 

If it does become a wonderful successful land with huge riches then we can all just wander up there to live in it anyway, they have an intention to join the EU so they are going to have to play by the open border rules anyway.

 

We're on a winner either way, the risk is all theirs.

[Guest]

Well as conspiracy goes I have a feeling the Tory government  have deliberately mucked this up. Everything is to their advantage for it to go to a yes result. No more Scotland bleeding us dry . no more Scottish socialist swinging the vote Labours way in general elections ( wave good by to 59 of their MP's ) and a chance to consolidate our own future without the burden of worrying what the Scottish will think or moan about.

 

I think a yes vote would be good for us the English as a nation, What exactly will we lose from this so called union ? The good side for us is not having to hear or see anything about the Scottish football leagues on OUR tv  or having to listen to drunken jocks all over England lamenting about " Bonny Scotland " because we can now tell them to take their foreign ars*ses back home then. It 's a big YES from me.

 

That's not a surprise given your "nationalist" stance.

[PAPA LAZAROU]

That's not a surprise given your "nationalist" stance.

 

Hush now you are starting to bore again.

[Trav Le Bleu]

Exactly why I'm completely behind this, we really can't lose. It will barely make a difference to anyone down here in reality of their day to day life, if they balls it up then so be it, we can just watch and it will probably just be like having another Ireland next to us but a bit more poorer.

 

If it does become a wonderful successful land with huge riches then we can all just wander up there to live in it anyway, they have an intention to join the EU so they are going to have to play by the open border rules anyway.

 

We're on a winner either way, the risk is all theirs.

 

Whisky could be more expensive.

 

Though if the British Pound is substantially stronger than the Scottish Groat, then it could be much cheaper!

[glen parva fox]

Think there are more scots in England than in Scotland, if they leave they are not part of the eu, can we kick them all out!

[PAPA LAZAROU]

That's a thought will all scots who are registered as born in Scotland have to have a Scottish passport  ? Will those living in England have to make a choice to hold a UK passport or a Scottish one ?

[Rincewind]

Will I have to get a passport just to go to Scotland? mine needs needs renewing.

[I am Rod Hull]

Nearly there. Come on Scots get those yes votes out.

Bye bye Labour party The ball and chain around the neck of England could soon be gone.

 

Maybe the reason why Labour party officials where touring shitehole countries looking for retarded thinking people that they could pack into our towns and cities for a guaranteed vote was a reaction to an unlikely YES vote? If they did vote YES then they have to replace those votes somehow .

 

The Labour Party will never go away, they have gone from defenders of the working class to the defenders of the lazy and immigrant.

 

I fooking hate the Labour party with a passion you could only dream of......

[Smudge]

Exactly why I'm completely behind this, we really can't lose. It will barely make a difference to anyone down here in reality of their day to day life, if they balls it up then so be it, we can just watch and it will probably just be like having another Ireland next to us but a bit more poorer.

 

If it does become a wonderful successful land with huge riches then we can all just wander up there to live in it anyway, they have an intention to join the EU so they are going to have to play by the open border rules anyway.

 

We're on a winner either way, the risk is all theirs.

I hope you're joking Matt, if the market goes into a tailspin and the pound takes a dump, we'll all be effected.

My sterling in the UK is already worth less than it was because of this.

[johnny the fox]

Will I have to get a passport just to go to Scotland? mine needs needs renewing.

yip..and when you go up to sweaty sock country, customs up there will have a big ginger cant (in a skirt) shoving his fist up your arse up to the elbow looking for contraband ..

[The Railway Man]

Maybe the reason why Labour party officials where touring shitehole countries looking for retarded thinking people that they could pack into our towns and cities for a guaranteed vote was a reaction to an unlikely YES vote? If they did vote YES then they have to replace those votes somehow .

 

The Labour Party will never go away, they have gone from defenders of the working class to the defenders of the lazy and immigrant.

 

I fooking hate the Labour party with a passion you could only dream of......

 

It's the one thing that does worry me about it, if after voting yes that lot somehow did manage to get a majority I can imagine they would be up to all sorts, public sector engorgment again, get as many people on the dole as possible and get them breeding, open borders to anyone who falls into their voting demographic, no doubt they would do it again. I just have to trust the English not to be so stupid as to elect that weird cult again.

 

I hope you're joking Matt, if the market goes into a tailspin and the pound takes a dump, we'll all be effected.

My sterling in the UK is already worth less than it was because of this.

 

The markets won't go into a tailspin over it, it might be bad for a few days or weeks but it will soon recover, I'm no economic wizz but I've already seen enough over the last 10-15 years to see that happen again and again. The economic benefits would far outweigh the negatives in the long term given the Scots we've had to endure destroying our own economy over the recent past.