Finnegan Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 9 minutes ago, shen said: Says the Welsh Liechester supporter, with a five-figure post count on a message board, is seen as a Football Manager guru on here and has a tendency to have hipster crushes on foreign cultures And is a season ticket holder living in the city of the club for about twenty years. 1
shen Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 Just now, Finnegan said: And is a season ticket holder living in the city of the club for about twenty years. Couldn't resist it 1
GingerrrFox Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 (edited) People saying Sturaro ain’t good enough Iborra is as good as off this summer. So on that basis he automatically becomes our 2nd best option as a defensive midfielder in a 4-2-3-1 alongside Ndidi if we sign him. Edited 14 June 2018 by GingerrrFox 1
STUHILL Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 Just now, GingerrrFox said: People saying Sturaro ain’t good enough Iborra is as good as off this summer. So on that basis he automatically becomes our 2nd best option as a defensive midfielder in a 4-2-3-1 alongside Ndidi. Agreed. Think people are over-estimating Choudary due to a couple of OK performances towards the end of the season. He certainly has potential and should be around the first team squad, but I'd be concerned if he is higher than 4th/5th choice CM for us next season. Even if Iborra stays, I still don't think he is capable of playing 38+ games for us and I still have suspicions that Silva will struggle with the physicality of DCM. We absolutely need another decent option at CM and Sturaro will likely be an upgrade on James, King, Mendy and Choudary. For James, King and Mendy - we will likely get well over 20m EURO, so we are upgrading for no cost. Would I prefer someone who has rave reviews? Absolutely, but perhaps our scouts have seen a real opportunity here to snag a player who at 25 can still reach their potential they showed only a couple of years ago, where he was being lauded as the next Gattuso. CM options next season of - N'didi, Sturaro, Silva, Iborra - with Choudary given a handful of games too. That would certainly help us push for top 6/7th finish. 2
OhYesNdidi Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 1 minute ago, STUHILL said: Agreed. Think people are over-estimating Choudary due to a couple of OK performances towards the end of the season. He certainly has potential and should be around the first team squad, but I'd be concerned if he is higher than 4th/5th choice CM for us next season. Even if Iborra stays, I still don't think he is capable of playing 38+ games for us and I still have suspicions that Silva will struggle with the physicality of DCM. We absolutely need another decent option at CM and Sturaro will likely be an upgrade on James, King, Mendy and Choudary. For James, King and Mendy - we will likely get well over 20m EURO, so we are upgrading for no cost. Would I prefer someone who has rave reviews? Absolutely, but perhaps our scouts have seen a real opportunity here to snag a player who at 25 can still reach their potential they showed only a couple of years ago, where he was being lauded as the next Gattuso. CM options next season of - N'didi, Sturaro, Silva, Iborra - with Choudary given a handful of games too. That would certainly help us push for top 6/7th finish. I doubt we'd get anything for James. His injury record, along with the wages he'd be on means that we won't get a fee, same with Andy King. No team after those players with be able to pay their wages let alone pay a fee for them anyway. Also, I can't see us making our money back on mendy. The best we can hope for is £5-8m for mendy + them all off our books. 1
STUHILL Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 Just now, OhYesNdidi said: I doubt we'd get anything for James. His injury record, along with the wages he'd be on means that we won't get a fee, same with Andy King. No team after those players with be able to pay their wages let alone pay a fee for them anyway. Also, I can't see us making our money back on mendy. The best we can hope for is £5-8m for mendy + them all off our books. I think King still would have some value. I imagine a team like Huddersfield/Brighton etc all paying around 8-10 Million for him. He's 29 (Prime for CM) International with bags of Prem experience. No idea what wages he is on, but wouldn't think that would be too much of stumbling block for us if really wanted to shift him. i.e contribute a % Agree on Mendy and James though and likely to get very little for James. Mendy £5-8m about right abroad. Anyway, all I was suggesting is that once we shift some of these players on, the £20m EURO or £17.5m that Juve are apparently asking for, would be offset by departures and so we would be upgrading our CM for very little outlay. Many people have questioned the fee, but I don't see a problem with that.
Ric Flair Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 23 minutes ago, GingerrrFox said: People saying Sturaro ain’t good enough Iborra is as good as off this summer. So on that basis he automatically becomes our 2nd best option as a defensive midfielder in a 4-2-3-1 alongside Ndidi if we sign him. What's the reasoning behind this, has he just not settled here or is he not happy he didn't play every game? Iborra's danger from corners and crosses will be missed as much as his calming influence and general play.
OhYesNdidi Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 1 minute ago, STUHILL said: I think King still would have some value. I imagine a team like Huddersfield/Brighton etc all paying around 8-10 Million for him. He's 29 (Prime for CM) International with bags of Prem experience. No idea what wages he is on, but wouldn't think that would be too much of stumbling block for us if really wanted to shift him. i.e contribute a % Agree on Mendy and James though and likely to get very little for James. Mendy £5-8m about right abroad. Anyway, all I was suggesting is that once we shift some of these players on, the £20m EURO or £17.5m that Juve are apparently asking for, would be offset by departures and so we would be upgrading our CM for very little outlay. Many people have questioned the fee, but I don't see a problem with that. No chance we get anything near £10m IMO. The fact he's in his prime makes me think he won't get a premier league move as he hasn't made a big enough impact at this level. Shame Derby seem to have stopped throwing money about.
STUHILL Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 3 minutes ago, OhYesNdidi said: No chance we get anything near £10m IMO. The fact he's in his prime makes me think he won't get a premier league move as he hasn't made a big enough impact at this level. Shame Derby seem to have stopped throwing money about. £8-10m in today's market is nothing. He went straight into Swansea's team and I expect he would start at places like Huddesfield and Brighton. £8-10m for a starting CM in the Prem is good value. Obviously I don't really rate him, but I still think the general perception of him is that he is a solid CM at Lower Prem level and I can see there being some interest.
MC Prussian Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Ric Flair said: What's the reasoning behind this, has he just not settled here or is he not happy he didn't play every game? Iborra's danger from corners and crosses will be missed as much as his calming influence and general play. Perhaps Puel just isn't a fan, and the player seemingly not overly happy at the club adds to it. Seemed like a strange signing at the time and we grossly overpaid for his services, that can't be denied. Quality player at times, but nowhere near the £15m we had to dish out. My guess is he'll return to his boyhood club Levante and we'll get somewhere near the £8m-£9m mark in return. Covers our losses to some extent. Currently, there's talks of him going out on loan there as a first step. Edited 14 June 2018 by MC Prussian
Gerard Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 Just now, MC Prussian said: Perhaps Puel just isn't a fan, and the player seemingly not overly happy at the club adds to it. Seemed like a strange signing at the time and we grossly overpaid for his services, that can't be denied. Quality player at times, but nowhere near the £15m we had to dish out. My guess is he'll return to his boyhood club Levante and we'll get somewhere near the £8m-£9m mark in return. Covers our losses to some extent. Levante's record transfer is under £3m, they won't be spending £8m+ on a 30 year old. If we sell him to Levante this summer we'll have to take a huge hit on him.
STUHILL Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 5 minutes ago, MC Prussian said: Perhaps Puel just isn't a fan, and the player seemingly not overly happy at the club adds to it. Seemed like a strange signing at the time and we grossly overpaid for his services, that can't be denied. Quality player at times, but nowhere near the £15m we had to dish out. My guess is he'll return to his boyhood club Levante and we'll get somewhere near the £8m-£9m mark in return. Covers our losses to some extent. Currently, there's talks of him going out on loan there as a first step. Shame if true. I think he did well adjusting to Prem football and thought he was likely to be even better next season for us. I didn't have him down as a starter but certainly a very decent 3rd choice and a player who could come on and make an impact. I remember when he joined and he alluded to the fact that it was a financial decision i.e big wage increase and maybe last big pay day for his family. I actually think he will stick around one more season as long as Puel isn't actively trying to shift him. Surely he won't take a wage cut after just one season. Stay with us Iborra you dreamboat!
STUHILL Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 Season long loan deal with agreed fee at end of season would be ideal for this one.
Ric Flair Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 25 minutes ago, Gerard said: Levante's record transfer is under £3m, they won't be spending £8m+ on a 30 year old. If we sell him to Levante this summer we'll have to take a huge hit on him. I was just about to say the same thing, other than 5-6 Spanish clubs none of the others pay more than a few million for players and certainly not players of his age. Therefore I think he won't be allowed back home for a few years, he's hardly been a failure.
OhYesNdidi Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 I hope we keep Iborra. £15m was a bit expensive but i think it was a good signing. We could have easily been with King & Ndidi right through till January had we not signed him. Do people not remember us getting battered in midfield vs Huddersfield & Bournemouth? If he were to go, we'd need to buy another CM who is also a calm presence in the middle of the park, we don't need any more energetic tacklers like that guy from Juventus.
KansasFox Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 14 hours ago, Mark said: looks like he'll get our possession stats back down to where they were when we won the league!
Mike Oxlong Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 14 hours ago, Mark said: If he was Brazilian he’d be called Juniorio Luiso. GERRIMMIN !
Gerard Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 9 minutes ago, OhYesNdidi said: I hope we keep Iborra. £15m was a bit expensive but i think it was a good signing. We could have easily been with King & Ndidi right through till January had we not signed him. Do people not remember us getting battered in midfield vs Huddersfield & Bournemouth? If he were to go, we'd need to buy another CM who is also a calm presence in the middle of the park, we don't need any more energetic tacklers like that guy from Juventus. I don't know how anyone can say £15m for Iborra was a good signing. He's a decent enough player but was never bought as or has ever proven to be an automatic first choice player. We knew everything about Iborra, he was a squad player at Sevilla and was six months from his 30th birthday. He was never going to improve and we bought him at his peak price and like buying a brand new car his value was sharply on the decrease the moment he signed for us which will become apparent if he moves this summer. Whoever thought this was good business by us and sanctioned the transfer should be shot with shite. He was moments away from joining Sunderland for £7m the season before and his price doubles despite not improving and being a year older. I bet Sevilla's board were high fiving all round when us mugs with more money than sense turned up. 1
AlloverthefloorYesNdidi Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 5 minutes ago, Gerard said: I don't know how anyone can say £15m for Iborra was a good signing. He's a decent enough player but was never bought as or has ever proven to be an automatic first choice player. We knew everything about Iborra, he was a squad player at Sevilla and was six months from his 30th birthday. He was never going to improve and we bought him at his peak price and like buying a brand new car his value was sharply on the decrease the moment he signed for us which will become apparent if he moves this summer. Whoever thought this was good business by us and sanctioned the transfer should be shot with shite. He was moments away from joining Sunderland for £7m the season before and his price doubles despite not improving and being a year older. I bet Sevilla's board were high fiving all round when us mugs with more money than sense turned up. I remember the media reporting the transfer like we'd done the savviest deal of the window at the time
Gerard Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 Just now, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: I remember the media reporting the transfer like we'd done the savviest deal of the window at the time I was against it for most of the reasons I stated above. We were buying a player who was surplus at Sevilla with too big a price tag and little room for improvement and that's pretty much what we got. He's a decent enough player but we already knew we'd never see the vast majority of that transfer fee back and he was going to improve the squad rather than the team. It was terrible use of resources.
AlloverthefloorYesNdidi Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 1 minute ago, Gerard said: I was against it for most of the reasons I stated above. We were buying a player who was surplus at Sevilla with too big a price tag and little room for improvement and that's pretty much what we got. He's a decent enough player but we already knew we'd never see the vast majority of that transfer fee back and he was going to improve the squad rather than the team. It was terrible use of resources. He's not a bad player, but have to admit long term it hasnt looked like the smartest buy. I like the guy, but as you say maybe money could have been better spent elsewhere.
FoxinNotts Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 If we’re after a centre midfielder that we can afford to be a squad player and rotate, then we should go for Wilshere. He’s proven his fitness when he’s away from the hospital that is Arsenal (season at Bournemouth) and he’ll be free at the end of the month. He also has a good relationship with Vardy by all accounts.
STUHILL Posted 14 June 2018 Posted 14 June 2018 7 minutes ago, Gerard said: I was against it for most of the reasons I stated above. We were buying a player who was surplus at Sevilla with too big a price tag and little room for improvement and that's pretty much what we got. He's a decent enough player but we already knew we'd never see the vast majority of that transfer fee back and he was going to improve the squad rather than the team. It was terrible use of resources. If he stays, I still think we can make good use of him next season. He really shone in a handful of games for us last season and he is always a threat from a set piece. I imagine if he does stay, he will be 3rd or 4th choice CM and to have the quality on the bench will no doubt help us. Price was on the high side but he certainly can still be a useful signing for us. I particular enjoyed how vocal he was right from the start and constantly trying to organise us. We have to be realistic what 15million buys us in today's market.
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