Claude Puel defends his Leicester City record

[STUHILL]

It's interesting reading the two sides of the argument on here. I consider myself pretty moderate (some may disagree!), in that, I want Puel to get until the end of the season and then we can evaluate everything he is doing, good and bad, and make a timely and sensible/planned decision then. 

 

I'll admit I am more on the critical side of Puel right now though and certainly think he is making basic mistakes that make no real sense to me. I also see a man who is so stubborn and set in his ways in terms of how he wants us to play, that I believe it is, and will continue to be detrimental to our future.

 

I genuinely don't see a way that his system/style/approach, can reap consistent (keyword!) performances/results without a much higher calibre of player/squad. It as if he is trying to make us play a system only very few top teams in World football can play and more importantly, make consistently effective.

 

I feel like he is failing to recognise that he doesn't have the players capable of this and I don't believe will ever get either, as we would need top, top players to be able to unlock stubborn defences with such a slow, indirect approach. People will say that he talks about playing quicker but again, he doesn't have the players for that and likely never will at our level. His mentor was Arsene Wenger and I think that reveals a lot about the way he wants his teams to play. The difference is, Arsene had decades of having World Class players at his disposal. Once Arsenal tightened the belt and he didn't, he also failed to make his style consistently effective at the top.

 

I see so little flexibility from him and that concerns me for the future and why I am doubtful that he just needs another season or more. For me, the best managers out there are the ones who are willing to adapt and try new things, as well as recognising their squad and players' strengths AND weaknesses and attempting to get the most from them. I am not suggesting he tear up his whole philosophy, but just show some flexibility and aim to get the most from the players he has here. 

 

He simply isn't doing that IMO and I believe that is the reason we are seeing a handful of players regress under him and looking devoid of confidence. Being asked to play a way that you struggle with and always likely will, will do that to a player's confidence. 

 

On the other hand, I think he has done a decent job of bringing Chilwell through and putting faith in Choudhury as well as now Barnes. I also think he as well as Rudkin is doing a good job of slowly but surely clearing out the deadwood. It's a job that needed doing and no doubt most Manager's could oversee that, but he should certainly be credited for it still. 

 

Our league position is one of the least relevant things right now IMO. I don't necessarily mind that much if we finish 7th or 12th, because I recognise we are a team in transition and very much in the mindset of maintaining a mid-table finish, whilst building a solid foundation to hopefully reap benefits from in 2-3 seasons time. 

 

I just don't buy into the arguments that if Puel goes we will: a) Undo all of the good work in terms of building a solid foundation with youth development/transitioning style OR b) Be on a Manager-Merry-Go-Round again OR c) Suddenly become a relegation threatened team again.

 

I firmly believe that 99% of fans want stability and a Manager who we can have for 10+ years if possible, but that doesn't mean we should stick with someone no matter what. The owner and the majority of fans have to buy into the Manager and what he is trying to achieve. Again, 99% of fans accept we are a 7th-12th Premier League team (which is bloody great btw!), so we aren't expecting miracles or 7th place finishes every season.

 

We just want a Manager we can connect with and believe in who isn't afraid to be flexible and adapt, whilst also playing a brand of football that we can (mostly) enjoy and get on board with, that also on the whole, gets the most from the players we have and will look to bring in. 

 

PUEL IN until the Summer! - but he has to show some flexibility over the next 15 games and cut-out some of the truly baffling decisions he makes or I'll be calling for a change and looking to bring someone in who can continue on the few positives he has brought such as youth development, but also bring their own key strengths to the role which hopefully includes man management and flexibility in playing styles. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said:

I cant see how we can blame him for this.  We have loads of CMDs, we could not possibly buy any more without selling.

Sorry Ric but there is just no way you can blame him for that

 

Same with the striker situation.  We have spent, what, about 60 million on 2 strikers that are nowhere near the 1st team atm and still on the books?   How is Puel to blame for that seeing as he signed neither of them?

 

These 2 issues are 2 of the core issues to our attacking problems and Puel is not to blame in any way for either of them

Are you serious?

 

He's systematically opted to phase out the only two players who are comfortable on the ball in Iborra and Silva. Granted, he came to the club and we had 6 central midfielders and obviously some of them needed to go but don't tell me his hands have been tied because as I've mentioned he's seemingly had no regard for the only two midfielders who are even remotely creative. He's been more than happy to collect centre halves without moving any on first and he's been more than happy to move on all fringe strikers bar Okazaki without bringing any in either. The squad is unbalanced and the way he's gone about it is massively inconsistent. He's shot himself in the foot by having very little creativity from central midfield or any differing options in attack. He has to shoulder the blame for that as he's had 3 transfer windows now and hasn't brought any CM's or strikers, there's very little argument to be had.

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

1 minute ago, Ric Flair said:

Are you serious?

 

He's systematically opted to phase out the only two players who are comfortable on the ball in Iborra and Silva. Granted, he came to the club and we had 6 central midfielders and obviously some of them needed to go but don't tell me his hands have been tied because as I've mentioned he's seemingly had no regard for the only two midfielders who are even remotely creative. He's been more than happy to collect centre halves without moving any on first and he's been more than happy to move on all fringe strikers bar Okazaki without bringing any in either. The squad is unbalanced and the way he's gone about it is massively inconsistent. He's shot himself in the foot by having very little creativity from central midfield or any differing options in attack. He has to shoulder the blame for that as he's had 3 transfer windows now and hasn't brought any CM's or strikers, there's very little argument to be had.

1 summer window and we have a few players we cant get rid of.   Far from Carte Blanche to sign whoever

 

Iborra is hardly the answer to creativity in midfield.  Not a bad player, but had his chances and I didnt see a wealth of creativity there

 

Silva hasnt had a lot of chances but I can remember about 1 nice through ball and a lot of misplaced passes. To be fair, with the issue signing for him and then not having a run in the team maybe he would have been a lot better than we saw.  I dont know.  Many on here reckoned he is crap.  So there is argument to be head and its not obvious that Silva and Iborra were the answer at all.  There is evidence to the contrary if anything

 

I think our centre half policy is looking pretty clever.  We've brought in promising youngsters and Evans and if we sell Maguire we look to have some basis moving forward in that dept.

 

We had 3 strikers at the start of the season with Nacho expected to do a lot better than he has.  And come summer Slimani will be back here and we still need to find a buyer for him.

 

If we dont buy another striker now I am sure we will look to get a solid option in the summer

[Ric Flair]

Just now, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said:

1 summer window and we have a few players we cant get rid of.   Far from Carte Blanche to sign whoever

 

Iborra is hardly the answer to creativity in midfield.  Not a bad player, but had his chances and I didnt see a wealth of creativity there

 

Silva hasnt had a lot of chances but I can remember about 1 nice through ball and a lot of misplaced passes. To be fair, with the issue signing for him and then not having a run in the team maybe he would have been a lot better than we saw.  I dont know.  Many on here reckoned he is crap.  So there is argument to be head and its not obvious that Silva and Iborra were the answer at all.  There is evidence to the contrary if anything

 

I think our centre half policy is looking pretty clever.  We've brought in promising youngsters and Evans and if we sell Maguire we look to have some basis moving forward in that dept.

 

We had 3 strikers at the start of the season with Nacho expected to do a lot better than he has.  And come summer Slimani will be back here and we still need to find a buyer for him.

 

If we dont buy another striker now I am sure we will look to get a solid option in the summer

You are being very lenient here with Puel, which is entirely you're own prerogative but he has to shoulder the blame for the key issues which is an appalling lack of balance in central midfield, under resourced in the wide areas and attack. He's remedied this slightly with the recall of Barnes and I hope in the summer if he's still here that we'll see the recruitment of an upgrade on Ghezzal for the right wing. He's made a real pigs ear of the striker department, whether he thought Iheanacho would kick on or not he was taking a huge leap of faith going in to the season with Vardy and him and Okazaki, with the pair of them having only scored about 2 league goals in the 2nd half of last season. It's been an awful decision and he's been extremely stubborn not trying to rectify this in January. Okazaki wants out and yet he still won't go and sign another striker. Slimani will be offered around in the summer for under £10m in the hope there's a taker, apparently the 2 loan fees we've received from Newcastle and Fenerbache have collectively been around that amount so we are frantically trying to recoup as much of that grotesque transfer fee we paid for him.

 

Our recruitment of 3 new centre halves in time maybe shrewd, but if he's done it to the detriment of central midfield and attack due to a balancing act in funds available then it wasn't the correct decision.

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

20 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

You are being very lenient here with Puel, which is entirely you're own prerogative but he has to shoulder the blame for the key issues which is an appalling lack of balance in central midfield, under resourced in the wide areas and attack. He's remedied this slightly with the recall of Barnes and I hope in the summer if he's still here that we'll see the recruitment of an upgrade on Ghezzal for the right wing. He's made a real pigs ear of the striker department, whether he thought Iheanacho would kick on or not he was taking a huge leap of faith going in to the season with Vardy and him and Okazaki, with the pair of them having only scored about 2 league goals in the 2nd half of last season. It's been an awful decision and he's been extremely stubborn not trying to rectify this in January. Okazaki wants out and yet he still won't go and sign another striker. Slimani will be offered around in the summer for under £10m in the hope there's a taker, apparently the 2 loan fees we've received from Newcastle and Fenerbache have collectively been around that amount so we are frantically trying to recoup as much of that grotesque transfer fee we paid for him.

 

Our recruitment of 3 new centre halves in time maybe shrewd, but if he's done it to the detriment of central midfield and attack due to a balancing act in funds available then it wasn't the correct decision.

He may have made a pigs ear of the striker dept., but the next striker we buy I really want to be a proper striker who comes in, is a long term prospect who makes a difference to the squad soon after arrival.  I dont know if the club were willing to buy such a striker in the summer or not, well, obviously not.  Transfers are not solely down to Puel.  Winter isnt a good time to get such a player, but we had better get one in the summer

 

Yes the midfield is often a pointless mess, no argument here.  Sometimes the lack of movement is criminal and that coupled with the fact that we play Ndidi and Mendy neither of home are exactly slick passers makes us poor at breaking teams down.  We all agree on that no matter what we think about Puel.  It might be a new manager could come in and improve this.  Its the one area that I feel we really struggle in that the manager might have a real impact on...

 

Puel's job is to improve this part of our game and its on him.  I won't know if he can do it or not until we have another summer transfer window

 

Last summer was all about defense.  This summer is all about attack.  And thats how it is for me.  We improved the defence this season.

If come September we have not improved our attack then something is very wrong and Puel will be to blame or the recruitment or both...

 

Although as many have said the feeling and noise around the club is so grim atm that we may never find out what Puel would have done with one more summer window

Edited 21 January 2019 by AlloverthefloorYesNdidi

[lcfcsnow]

24 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said:

Last summer was all about defense.  This summer is all about attack.  And thats how it is for me.  We improved the defence this season.

Did we? We've signed the defenders but we've not played them. Morgan and Simpson are still starting games, we're more conservative and protecting them more with two, sometimes three defensive midfielders, so of course they'll be less goals conceded, and less goals scored.

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

1 minute ago, lcfcsnow said:

Did we? We've signed the defenders but we've not played them. Morgan and Simpson are still starting games, we're just more conservative and protecting them more with two defensive midfielders, so of course they'll be less goals conceded, and less goals scored.

So we've improved the defence short term with managerial tactics and bolstered it long term

 

Simpson has started about 3 games.  One of them in which we conceded 4

[Fosse93]

22 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said:

He may have made a pigs ear of the striker dept., but the next striker we buy I really want to be a proper striker who comes in, is a long term prospect who makes a difference to the squad soon after arrival.  I dont know if the club were willing to buy such a striker in the summer or not, well, obviously not.  Transfers are not solely down to Puel.  Winter isnt a good time to get such a player, but we had better get one in the summer

 

Yes the midfield is often a pointless mess, no argument here.  Sometimes the lack of movement is criminal and that coupled with the fact that we play Ndidi and Mendy neither of home are exactly slick passers makes us poor at breaking teams down.  We all agree on that no matter what we think about Puel.  It might be a new manager could come in and improve this.  Its the one area that I feel we really struggle in that the manager might have a real impact on...

 

Puel's job is to improve this part of our game and its on him.  I won't know if he can do it or not until we have another summer transfer window

 

Last summer was all about defense.  This summer is all about attack.  And thats how it is for me.  We improved the defence this season.

If come September we have not improved our attack then something is very wrong and Puel will be to blame or the recruitment or both...

 

Although as many have said the feeling and noise around the club is so grim atm that we may never find out what Puel would have done with one more summer window

Are you seriously suggesting that we give him the first 5/6 games of next season and then sack him if no improvement?

 

What a waste of a summer that would be! And no doubt you'd be on here telling us all he needs more time to implement his ideas.

 

Crazy talk.

[That_Dude]

3 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Are you serious?

 

He's systematically opted to phase out the only two players who are comfortable on the ball in Iborra and Silva. Granted, he came to the club and we had 6 central midfielders and obviously some of them needed to go but don't tell me his hands have been tied because as I've mentioned he's seemingly had no regard for the only two midfielders who are even remotely creative. He's been more than happy to collect centre halves without moving any on first and he's been more than happy to move on all fringe strikers bar Okazaki without bringing any in either. The squad is unbalanced and the way he's gone about it is massively inconsistent. He's shot himself in the foot by having very little creativity from central midfield or any differing options in attack. He has to shoulder the blame for that as he's had 3 transfer windows now and hasn't brought any CM's or strikers, there's very little argument to be had.

He's given Iborra more than a chance and I can remember him being an integral part of the squad from Puel's appointment to the end of 2017. Then Iborra went on a poor run and never really deserved a place in the starting XI after that. We were conceding goals for fun and Puel made stopping the leak a priority hence Mendy playing a major role in the next season. It came at the cost of the creativity there's no denying that.

 

I also recall he said many times that they were doing everything they could to make Silva match fit as fast as possible. Sadly for all his qualities, he proved to be way to lightweight for the PL and shrugged off the ball too easily and I can't possibly think that Puel deliberately dropped him just for fun. 6 months in the freezer might have ruined his career and I feel for the guy.

 

You're a bit unfair because firstly you don't know if he wasn't searching for a CM and secondly a good one who would come here isn't easy to find at all. Just like signing Ghezzal when we lost Mahrez reeks of panic buy. As for the striker problem, it was a gamble on Nacho who had a good pre-season which massively back-fired. Letting Slim go was another mistake because his actual system would greatly benefit from a target man. But it is said that Vardy and some of the players couldn't stand him so...

 

We did the best signings we could last summer and it's good to see the back four sorted out for a while, although we might need a back-up for Chilwell. Now the problem in the middle of the park and forward is a real albeit being mitigated by the emergence of Barnes and Choudhury. We still absolutely need a striker and a CM but we realistically need to wait for the summer and there's not much Puel can do about that.

Edited 21 January 2019 by That_Dude

[Countryfox]

1 hour ago, Fosse93 said:

Are you seriously suggesting that we give him the first 5/6 games of next season and then sack him if no improvement?

 

What a waste of a summer that would be! And no doubt you'd be on here telling us all he needs more time to implement his ideas.

 

Crazy talk.

 

6 minutes ago, That_Dude said:

He's given Iborra more than a chance and I can remember him being an integral part of the squad from Puel's appointment to the end of 2017. Then Iborra went on a poor run and never really deserved a place in the starting XI after that. We were conceding goals for fun and Puel made stopping the leak a priority hence Mendy playing a major role in the next season. It came at the cost of the creativity there's no denying that.

 

I also recall he said many times that they were doing everything they could to make Silva match fit as fast as possible. Sadly for all his qualities, he proved to be way to lightweight for the PL and shrugged off the ball too easily and I can't possibly think that Puel deliberately dropped him just for fun. 6 months in the freezer might have ruined his career and I feel for the guy.

 

You're a bit unfair because firstly you don't know if he wasn't searching for a CM and secondly a good one who would come here isn't easy to find at all. Just like signing Ghezzal when we lost Mahrez reeks of panic buy. As for the striker problem, it was a gamble on Nacho who had a good pre-season which massively back-fired. Letting Slim go was another mistake because his actual system would greatly benefit from a target man. But it is said that Vardy and some of the players couldn't stand him so...

 

We did the best signings we could last summer and it's good to see the back four sorted out for a while, although we might need a back-up for Chilwell. Now the problem in the middle of the park and forward is a real albeit mitigated by the emergence of Barnes and Choudhury. We still absolutely need a striker and a CM but we realistically need to wait for the summer and there's not much Puel can do about that.

 

I read today that we let Iborra go on compassionate grounds ...  not sure exactly what that means but the impression is it was nothing to do with CP wanting rid of him.

 

Edit ...  sorry meant to quote Ric Flair not Fosse93 ...

Edited 21 January 2019 by Countryfox

[That_Dude]

1 minute ago, Countryfox said:

 

 

I read today that we let Iborra go on compassionate grounds ...  not sure exactly what that means but the impression is it was nothing to do with CP wanting rid of him.

Okay then, I wasn't aware of that and stand corrected. Could it correlate with his dip in form? We still sure as hell took our time to let him go and why not in the summer? I'd imagine there wasn't a good offer at that time.

[Hanan96]

It's interesting to see some people here forgot that last summer we have 2 unregistered player while already have 5 new player who need to get integrated to the team. The squad is too huge, we can't buy 11 first teamers in single time.

 

What more interesting is how Simpson start just 3 or 4 times until now, and that's only because Amartey Injury, yet it treated like we sign right back and never play him for the sake of simpson. 

[Ric Flair]

27 minutes ago, That_Dude said:

He's given Iborra more than a chance and I can remember him being an integral part of the squad from Puel's appointment to the end of 2017. Then Iborra went on a poor run and never really deserved a place in the starting XI after that. We were conceding goals for fun and Puel made stopping the leak a priority hence Mendy playing a major role in the next season. It came at the cost of the creativity there's no denying that.

 

I also recall he said many times that they were doing everything they could to make Silva match fit as fast as possible. Sadly for all his qualities, he proved to be way to lightweight for the PL and shrugged off the ball too easily and I can't possibly think that Puel deliberately dropped him just for fun. 6 months in the freezer might have ruined his career and I feel for the guy.

 

You're a bit unfair because firstly you don't know if he wasn't searching for a CM and secondly a good one who would come here isn't easy to find at all. Just like signing Ghezzal when we lost Mahrez reeks of panic buy. As for the striker problem, it was a gamble on Nacho who had a good pre-season which massively back-fired. Letting Slim go was another mistake because his actual system would greatly benefit from a target man. But it is said that Vardy and some of the players couldn't stand him so...

 

We did the best signings we could last summer and it's good to see the back four sorted out for a while, although we might need a back-up for Chilwell. Now the problem in the middle of the park and forward is a real albeit being mitigated by the emergence of Barnes and Choudhury. We still absolutely need a striker and a CM but we realistically need to wait for the summer and there's not much Puel can do about that.

I always thought he dropped Iborra after we'd had a superb run of performances and results up until that Palace home game. Then he played vs Man Utd which we did well in and then when we suffered over Xmas he was out and didn't return properly for several weeks as Matty James was flavour of the month. It was around the turn of the year that we suddenly started struggling to break teams down at home and although it wasn't apparent at the time I think it stemmed a lot from the lack of forward momentum in central midfield. When Puel first came in, Iborra seemed revitalised and Shakespeare must have been frustrated how stop start Iborra had been with injuries. But we played some incredible football in the first few months, football we have struggled to get close to again.

 

I'd be willing to give him the time to rectify central midfield but I've suspicions he actually likes two defensive midfielders playing in a 4-2-3-1 and that is a real problem unless one of them is extremely capable at forward passing and supporting attacks, otherwise the same issues will persist against teams who sit back.

 

I think for fans who have had enough of Puel it is now easy to point the finger at the central midfield and striker problems, the fact is he hasn't made a single signing in either department and there will be many reasons that may have prevented him from doing so, but the facts still remain.

[Ric Flair]

33 minutes ago, Countryfox said:

 

 

I read today that we let Iborra go on compassionate grounds ...  not sure exactly what that means but the impression is it was nothing to do with CP wanting rid of him.

 

Edit ...  sorry meant to quote Ric Flair not Fosse93 …

I don't dispute that at all, but one of the reasons Iborra will have wanted to go back to Spain was the little football he played for us since the latter part of 2017. Puel may well have wanted to keep him in the squad but that doesn't mean he was handling him appropriately. Iborra started about 2 PL games all season, he was always going to be unhappy.

[STUHILL]

5 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I always thought he dropped Iborra after we'd had a superb run of performances and results up until that Palace home game. Then he played vs Man Utd which we did well in and then when we suffered over Xmas he was out and didn't return properly for several weeks as Matty James was flavour of the month. It was around the turn of the year that we suddenly started struggling to break teams down at home and although it wasn't apparent at the time I think it stemmed a lot from the lack of forward momentum in central midfield. When Puel first came in, Iborra seemed revitalised and Shakespeare must have been frustrated how stop start Iborra had been with injuries. But we played some incredible football in the first few months, football we have struggled to get close to again.

 

I'd be willing to give him the time to rectify central midfield but I've suspicions he actually likes two defensive midfielders playing in a 4-2-3-1 and that is a real problem unless one of them is extremely capable at forward passing and supporting attacks, otherwise the same issues will persist against teams who sit back.

 

I think for fans who have had enough of Puel it is now easy to point the finger at the central midfield and striker problems, the fact is he hasn't made a single signing in either department and there will be many reasons that may have prevented him from doing so, but the facts still remain.

Iborra was voted our 2nd best player via the match ratings in the first 6 months here, second only to a very in form Maguire. He was then dropped in favour of James and when he came back, not as immediately impressive as before and was pretty much written off and struggled to get a consistent chance ever since. He is by no means without his faults, but it still seems strange that he has been pretty much sidelined ever since.

 

Silva is another strange one and find it very hard to understand how people have written him off after just 851 minutes play, which is the equivalent to just over 9 games! 

If we were stacked with creative CM's then I could understand it more, but the fact it's an area we are really struggling in and have been for a while, just makes the decision to not give either more game time, very odd IMO.

 

Too late for Iborra obviously but I'd personally like to see how Silva would perform under a different Manager and we may still get to see that if it's just a loan deal he gets. Not saying I think he will suddenly be one of our best players, but I do think he may still have something to offer if given similar patience that players like Mendy, Iheanacho and Gray have all been afforded. Let's see what happens in the Summer, in regards to Puel and Silva, although I wouldn't blame Silva for wanting to never come back here, after all the crap he has been through! 

[That_Dude]

54 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I always thought he dropped Iborra after we'd had a superb run of performances and results up until that Palace home game. Then he played vs Man Utd which we did well in and then when we suffered over Xmas he was out and didn't return properly for several weeks as Matty James was flavour of the month. It was around the turn of the year that we suddenly started struggling to break teams down at home and although it wasn't apparent at the time I think it stemmed a lot from the lack of forward momentum in central midfield. When Puel first came in, Iborra seemed revitalised and Shakespeare must have been frustrated how stop start Iborra had been with injuries. But we played some incredible football in the first few months, football we have struggled to get close to again.

 

I'd be willing to give him the time to rectify central midfield but I've suspicions he actually likes two defensive midfielders playing in a 4-2-3-1 and that is a real problem unless one of them is extremely capable at forward passing and supporting attacks, otherwise the same issues will persist against teams who sit back.

 

I think for fans who have had enough of Puel it is now easy to point the finger at the central midfield and striker problems, the fact is he hasn't made a single signing in either department and there will be many reasons that may have prevented him from doing so, but the facts still remain.

We had a great run mainly because Mahrez was on fire and close to his 2015/16 level. Things never were the same after Man City messed with him in January. I genuinely thought Iborra's form dipped after january but you're right when you said he favoured James over the former. I found it at the time a bit annoying but James did relatively well the first games especially against Chelsea away. Maybe Puel saw something in him and James being younger than Iborra, he was maybe thinking for the future. @Countryfox just wrote that Puel didn't want to get rid of Iborra and we let him go for "compassionate reasons". Either way it's true that everything went to shit after that and Puel has to take some of the responsibility here.

 

The 4-2-3-1 with 2 DM is momentarily the lesser evil, in my opinion. The 4-4-2 is out of question, for a 4-3-3 to effectively work against deep lying teams we need a creative CM and the 3-5-2 is a two edged sword that supposes very mobile CBs Morgan isn't, Evans isn't, Maguire isn't and it would leave us very vulnerable on the counter. There goes the formation so many people want to try. 

 

It's a fact but you still can't put the blame (solely) on the manager. 

Edited 21 January 2019 by That_Dude

[Countryfox]

16 minutes ago, That_Dude said:

We had a great run mainly because Mahrez was on fire and close to his 2015/16 level. Things never were the same after Man City messed with him in January. I genuinely thought Iborra's form dipped after january but you're right when you said he favoured James over the former. I found it at the time a bit annoying but James did relatively well the first games especially against Chelsea away. Maybe Puel saw something in him and James being younger than Iborra, he was maybe thinking for the future. @Countryfox just wrote that Puel didn't want to get rid of Iborra and we let him go for "compassionate reasons". Either way it's true that everything went to shit after that.

 

The 4-2-3-1 with 2 DM is momentarily the lesser evil, in my opinion The 4-4-2 is out of question, for a 4-3-3 to effectively work against deep lying teams we need a creative CM and the 3-5-2 is a two edged sword that supposes very mobile CBs Morgan isn't, Evans isn't, Maguire isn't and it would leave us very vulnerable on the counter. There goes the formation so many people want to try. 

 

It's a fact but you still can't put the blame (solely) on the manager. 

 

Yes it was in today’s Merc ..   an article by Tanner ..   I’ve copied the relevant bit ...   thought it might help your discussion.

 

 

[Ric Flair]

1 minute ago, Countryfox said:

 

Yes it was in today’s Merc ..   an article by Tanner ..   I’ve copied the relevant bit ...   thought it might help your discussion.

 

 

It's all well and good having a ball playing midfielder in the squad (we had two) but if you don't ever play them, it's irrelevant. It would seem to me, he either doesn't place enough importance on that type of player in our current system or they are both that poor all round that he can't afford to give them game time. I would potentially accept the latter but he is under huge pressure with our home form over the last year and it baffles me how stubborn he's been. He will happily keep giving under performing players chances and with Chilwell it has paid dividends and hopefully will do eventually with Gray, Ghezzal and Ndidi but Iborra got piss all starts this season in the league and Silva appears to have been kidnapped.

[Countryfox]

3 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

It's all well and good having a ball playing midfielder in the squad (we had two) but if you don't ever play them, it's irrelevant. It would seem to me, he either doesn't place enough importance on that type of player in our current system or they are both that poor all round that he can't afford to give them game time. I would potentially accept the latter but he is under huge pressure with our home form over the last year and it baffles me how stubborn he's been. He will happily keep giving under performing players chances and with Chilwell it has paid dividends and hopefully will do eventually with Gray, Ghezzal and Ndidi but Iborra got piss all starts this season in the league and Silva appears to have been kidnapped.

I’m not arguing with you Ric ..  this just seemed relevant to what you two were discussing ...   the only thing it shows to me is that we, as fans, don’t know all the facts until they are nonchalanty slipped into an article ...   something similar may pop up about Silva ...  who knows.

 

Also, it’s alright for Tanner to say there is now a hole for a creative midfielder, but if CP has to trim the squad before he can get someone new in, what the fook is he expected to do !

[cc_star]

3 minutes ago, Countryfox said:

I’m not arguing with you Ric ..  this just seemed relevant to what you two were discussing ...   the only thing it shows to me is that we, as fans, don’t know all the facts until they are nonchalanty slipped into an article ...   something similar may pop up about Silva ...  who knows.

 

Also, it’s alright for Tanner to say there is now a hole for a creative midfielder, but if CP has to trim the squad before he can get someone new in, what the fook is he expected to do !

It's irrelevant Tanner saying there's a whole for a creative midfielder

 

a) Doesn't suit Puel or Puel's system (whatever that is)

b) He could play Maddison more dynamically either box-to-box which doesn't suit Puel... or further back & use him more like a quarterback, seeing Maddison distributing the ball from a ballwinner like Ndidi, or via being passed it from the defence

 

But he chooses not to

 

Still, when your face fits as well as Mendy's does we could sign prime Cambiasso, Gazza & Maradona... And they'd still play 2nd fiddle to Mendy

[That_Dude]

37 minutes ago, cc_star said:

It's irrelevant Tanner saying there's a whole for a creative midfielder

 

a) Doesn't suit Puel or Puel's system (whatever that is)

b) He could play Maddison more dynamically either box-to-box which doesn't suit Puel... or further back & use him more like a quarterback, seeing Maddison distributing the ball from a ballwinner like Ndidi, or via being passed it from the defence

 

But he chooses not to

 

Still, when your face fits as well as Mendy's does we could sign prime Cambiasso, Gazza & Maradona... And they'd still play 2nd fiddle to Mendy

Maddison as a box to box or as CM in a mifield three?

Thank God you're not the manager.

[The Doctor]

1 minute ago, That_Dude said:

Maddison as a box to box or as CM in a mifield three?

Thank God you're not the manager.

Not that daft a suggestion, when things aren't happening he drops deeper anyway and iirc played there for Norwich.

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

5 hours ago, Fosse93 said:

Are you seriously suggesting that we give him the first 5/6 games of next season and then sack him if no improvement?

 

What a waste of a summer that would be! And no doubt you'd be on here telling us all he needs more time to implement his ideas.

 

Crazy talk.

Yeah that is crazy talk. But you're putting words in my mouth there, although I can see how you could interpret it as implied.

 

I dont think Puel is an inept fool so I dont think he deserves the sack.

 

If he gets the whole season my prediction is that we will be solidly mid table. Therefore he will have done well and in my view earned another season

 

Im just saying that in September then I think the criticism levelled at him now would be fair, if things stay the same, which they probably wont. But atm for me  a lot of the stick he gets is premature

 

But anyway, even if things go tits up in September under Puel, loads on here who want him gone say changing the manager wont effect the long term process. After all, the players arent the problem at all are they? Its the manager who is the issue right?

[reynard]

9 hours ago, MC Prussian said:

I have no problem with the manager going on television or giving interviews in the press.

It's the timing that doesn't feel right.

 

We've just lost the third game in a row, the fourth loss in five matches, out in both cups after showing little fight, seemingly letting 7th place slip away once more,  we've seen the new year start with turgid football (just like last year), performances have been mostly dire, the football on show is forgettable at times. The fear is that we'll end this season the way we did a year before.

Personally, I'd rather he didn't do media appearances right now, I wish he didn't come out with statements that go against his team's own fans or could be misinterpreted as such.

Part of it still boils down to his rather poor grasp of English, he can't express himself clearly enough. In these cases, he should follow Sarri's example and talk in his mother tongue, relying on a translator.

 

If he's talking about "expectations", I'm pretty sure it's got little to nothing to do with the fans' expectations, because they aren't high. He doesn't know what the fans think, he doesn't care (he's said as such). I can only presume he's alluding to what the owners have set as targets. But even then, it all remains pretty vague. He doesn't go in any further detail.

 

I share the notion that it comes across as desperate on the one hand, with him trying to save his face in times of crisis, and on the other hand, putting most of the blame, if not all of it, on others. I have yet to read an interview or see an interview on television where he takes responsibility for the team's failures. It would make him much more sympathetic if he could admit his own mistakes. It all adds to his public perception of the arrogant Frenchman, further cementing that image.

This is the key for me. Most fans have expectations and hopes that usually exceed their clubs abilities. However, what the owner's and board's expectations are for this season are unknown to all of us.

I am slightly concerned by his rather negative take on things in public. It is ok for us fans  to be negative but for the manager to take this appraoch isn't perhaps such a good idea. It won't adhere him to fans and the players may not be that inspired by it either. He's come out and said we can't compete with certain teams and now the expectations are difficult/perhaps impossible to meet.
I believe he has also come out and said it will be hard to keep our best players without European football. As this seems unlikely to happen it is all building up into a rather negative portrayal of the club at this exact moment.

Add to this the certain amount of financial uncertainty there seems to be regarding player investment right now we could well be heading for a period of struggle.

Whilst the gap to the bottom 4 or 5 looks healthy at the moment the difference between sides like us and sides like Newcastle is a lot closer than many on here would like to admit. I'd rather a manager who comes over in a more positive inspirational light than Puel has managed in his recent media blitz.

[Freeman's Wharfer]

23 hours ago, Babylon said:

I don't see how togetherness with fans won us the league. So I can only presume you meant players. Especially as that bond was long gone the second season under Ranieri looking like we were going down, so that's not all in Puel.

 

We were happy because we were winning, there as no mythical bond between us all. Not in my eyes anyway.

 

 

So you didn’t feel that collective togetherness in the stadium and you think that we’d have won the league playing in an empty stadium every week?

 

Nonsense.

 

The great atmosphere started during the great escape when we were bottom of the league. Sure, winning helps. But Pearson created a unity that ran throughout the club from the owners down to the fans.

 

It’s gone now. The manager cares not for the fans. The fans aren’t particularly taken with the manager. I wouldn’t be surprised if the likes of Vardy and whoever is talking to those in-the-know journalists who are breaking stories of an unhappy camp are also not so fond of Mr Puel.