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Countryfox

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By Countryfox, in General Chat

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Innovindil

Innovindil

Posted
Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, hejammy said:

On the first point - if the person being bullied cannot stick up for themselves then other people should get involved and help them right? The person being bullied cannot and should not accept a "peace deal" where by the bully still takes their money and is allowed to beat them up once a day? 

 

Second point is that yes ofcourse you would not attempt to fight the person with the gun if you didn't not have a gun. But you'd come back to try and take your house (which is rightfully and legally yours) by other means or with help from external sources right? So what's the difference? 

There isn't a difference, which is the point. I'd go back with the police, or if it was beyond them, the army. But if they were unwilling/unable to help? I wouldn't go back. I wouldn't charge the house with a rock in my hand and expect anyone to give a shit. 

 

You're stuck on this notion of right and wrong. Let me make this clear, what Israel is doing isn't right. It isn't fair and it shouldn't be happening. But it is. Israel have a million reasons in their favour, from their economic size, military force, the tactical advantages they offer to other countries, the history of their people, the actions of hamas/Palestinians, the rhetoric that flows from neighbouring counties etc etc it's all just enough that anyone who could make a difference will go for the peace route. See Murica for details, the world's battering ram who love killing for the sake of killing more than anyone else have come out and said... Errr, pls stop. 

 

Even the majority Muslim countries nearby who fully support the creation of a state of Palestine only get involved in the most mundane ways. Not because they don't think what Israel is doing is wrong, but because they aren't stupid enough to take a rock to a gunfight. 

 

So yep, I'd accept the peace deal, I'd stop shooting rockets and suck it up. Not because it's the best options or even the right option, because it's the only option. And ironically, if they signed a peace deal and stuck to it themselves and then Israel were still being bellends, then they might actually get some international support. Right now you can't shoot a thousand rockets at someone then play the victims, no matter how true that may be. 

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hejammy

hejammy

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

There isn't a difference, which is the point. I'd go back with the police, or if it was beyond them, the army. But if they were unwilling/unable to help? I wouldn't go back. I wouldn't charge the house with a rock in my hand and expect anyone to give a shit. 

 

You're stuck on this notion of right and wrong. Let me make this clear, what Israel is doing isn't right. It isn't fair and it shouldn't be happening. But it is. Israel have a million reasons in their favour, from their economic size, military force, the tactical advantages they offer to other countries, the history of their people, the actions of hamas/Palestinians, the rhetoric that flows from neighbouring counties etc etc it's all just enough that anyone who could make a difference will go for the peace route. See Murica for details, the world's battering ram who love killing for the sake of killing more than anyone else have come out and said... Errr, pls stop. 

 

Even the majority Muslim countries nearby who fully support the creation of a state of Palestine only get involved in the most mundane ways. Not because they don't think what Israel is doing is wrong, but because they aren't stupid enough to take a rock to a gunfight. 

 

So yep, I'd accept the peace deal, I'd stop shooting rockets and suck it up. Not because it's the best options or even the right option, because it's the only option. And ironically, if they signed a peace deal and stuck to it themselves and then Israel were still being bellends, then they might actually get some international support. Right now you can't shoot a thousand rockets at someone then play the victims, no matter how true that may be. 

The fact that this has been going on for over 50 years is proof enough that a peace deal will not work as Israel has complete disregard to internationally recognised law and deals. This is the problem that we don't need the smaller counties trying to "chip in" we need the super powers that be get involved and prevent injustice. This is the problem with the world, economy comes before human life and injustice. Similar to the black lives matter movement when enough is enough and if no one else is to help then they'll take the cause themselves to try and create the wave. 

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Innovindil

Innovindil

Posted
Posted
57 minutes ago, hejammy said:

The fact that this has been going on for over 50 years is proof enough that a peace deal will not work as Israel has complete disregard to internationally recognised law and deals. This is the problem that we don't need the smaller counties trying to "chip in" we need the super powers that be get involved and prevent injustice. This is the problem with the world, economy comes before human life and injustice. Similar to the black lives matter movement when enough is enough and if no one else is to help then they'll take the cause themselves to try and create the wave. 

Or a peace deal won't work because there's a part of a proposed Palestinian state controlled by hamas who have no intention of ever accepting a peace deal. 

 

Swings and roundabouts eh. 

 

Again, far more reasons than just economic for super powers not to get involved. Reducing this decades long conflict to Israel bad is nonsensical. 

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Mickyblueeyes

Mickyblueeyes

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Innovindil said:

Or a peace deal won't work because there's a part of a proposed Palestinian state controlled by hamas who have no intention of ever accepting a peace deal. 

 

Swings and roundabouts eh. 

 

Again, far more reasons than just economic for super powers not to get involved. Reducing this decades long conflict to Israel bad is nonsensical. 

The Palestinians can’t just accept any peace deal. Nor can the Israelies. Especially one where the two state solution effectively makes one side a suburb in land they truly believe is there’s. Or the makes the other side concede on land they’ve been told is worth fighting for. While there is a need for peace, associating Palestine with Hamas only is just wrong. As is associating Israel with Judaism - there are supporters of the other side in both factions.
 

Believe it or not, what has been suggested so far is not even supported by all Israelies.
 

Ive been lucky enough to spend sometime out there. I’ve met Palestinians who are Christians who feel they’ve been forgotten. I’ve met israelies who feel their Govt have acted poorly for years. 
 

It’s far too complexed to say, hey guys, chill out, accept what you’ve been given and get on with it. I mean, imagine if that attitude was adopted by Nelson in Robin Island. The video that was posted earlier on in this thread is the problem (I truly believe) the vast majority of Israelies and Palestinians want to move past. There are too sides who have emotional scares from previous treatments. However, based on what a lot of them have told me, they dislike each other but is there genuine hate and destruction of the other in their thoughts ? No, not from my experience. There are those who have never been there who’ll try and encourage the religious aspect and cowardly say “look what they did” to get a response. 
 

Whether the international community likes it or not, peace in the Middle East will only be when neutrally someone can sit across the table from each side and say right, let’s fix this. At the moment, you’ve got an American govt who can’t see past Israel. Some Arab Govts who can’t see past the religious argument. And a group of clueless fools who think they know what is going on but haven’t got a scooby. Everyone’s picked a side - it didn’t work when that approach was applied in Northern Ireland and it just won’t work here. 

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Facecloth

Facecloth

Posted
Posted
53 minutes ago, doverfox said:

Aah Religion one groups fictional book verses another. Dont see Trekkies and Dr Who fanboys shooting each other do you. 

Doctor Who never uses guns :ph34r:

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ozleicester

ozleicester

Posted
Posted

The hate and acceptance of it by the world at large is disgusting. The Israeli's are killing dozens of kids a day.. in the name of FVCKING religion.

You pricks all locked yourselves up for a year to stop catching a cold...meanwhile you accept people blowing each other up because of a fairy tale.

Fvck Covid, lets lockdown against religion.

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hejammy

hejammy

Posted
Posted

I'm not sure why people are getting their knickers in a twist about religious conflict on here, the Israeli - Palestine injustice is not about religion. It's greed and land occupation. It's the lack of human rights because one has a ridiculous backing, money and power vs another who has nothing. Like others have said, there are Christians, Muslims and Jews on both lands. Just because you see people talking in Arabic doesn't automatically mean its to do with religion. :rolleyes:

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Mickyblueeyes

Mickyblueeyes

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, hejammy said:

I'm not sure why people are getting their knickers in a twist about religious conflict on here, the Israeli - Palestine injustice is not about religion. It's greed and land occupation. It's the lack of human rights because one has a ridiculous backing, money and power vs another who has nothing. Like others have said, there are Christians, Muslims and Jews on both lands. Just because you see people talking in Arabic doesn't automatically mean its to do with religion. :rolleyes:

This exactly. Well said. 
 

The amount of people who have an opinion on the conflict without the knowledge is ridiculous. It’s like, if you want to give your two cents, speak to the people, get out there, learn what’s going on. Otherwise, keep it quiet. 
 

Palestinian Christians do not avoid the air raids just because they’re Christians nor are they exempt from the land raids. In turn, Israeli Arabs do not get missed out from the rocket attacks. 
 

There are some Jews holding up Palestinian flags and some Muslims who have spoken up against the current approach of the Palestinian leaders. The poor Palestinian Christians (and Christian Israelies) for some do not even matter.

 

Religion is one aspect. One of so many aspects that dictates this conflict. However, it’s easy to just refer to that and have an opinion. It’s sad that in a time where knowledge is so easy to gain, this conflict is still alien to so many. 

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Finnaldo

Finnaldo

Posted
Posted

You’ve got Israel’s right wing government committing religious/ethnic apartheid on on one side and Palestine’s Islamist government on the other. A two state solution party in Israel or Fatah in Palestine hasn’t been in power for years. They needed to be treated equally awful regimes, embargoed with Israel’s international recognition withdrawn until they come back committed to a two state solution. Neither authority will back down otherwise and only the populations of both suffer. As others have said as well, it requires actual co-ordination from international and regional powers however, and that’s unlikely to happen at present.

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Jon the Hat

Jon the Hat

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, ozleicester said:

The hate and acceptance of it by the world at large is disgusting. The Israeli's are killing dozens of kids a day.. in the name of FVCKING religion.

You pricks all locked yourselves up for a year to stop catching a cold...meanwhile you accept people blowing each other up because of a fairy tale.

Fvck Covid, lets lockdown against religion.

Is this were someone says "but HAMAS are firing more rockets, you cannot expect Israel not to retaliate?!!" and we go back down the rabbit hole?

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ozleicester

ozleicester

Posted
Posted
16 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

Is this were someone says "but HAMAS are firing more rockets, you cannot expect Israel not to retaliate?!!" and we go back down the rabbit hole?

May be a Twitter screenshot of 1 person and text that says "RD Hale @RD_Hale A kid threw a stone at me today (and missed) so I climbed into a fighter jet and blew up his entire street with an air-to-surface missile. I'm sure you will agree acted in self-defence. 9:41AM •May15 May 2021. Twitter Web 6,473 Retweets 186 Quote Tweets 24.8K Likes"

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Jattdogg

Jattdogg

Posted
Posted

https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/may/19/texas-abortion-ban-law-greg-abbott

 

What a bunch of cvnts. I can appreciate people not believing in abortion and also view points on not using it as a means of birth control etc. To each their own. 

 

But if your sister was raped by a sick bastard (family member or not) and was impregnated is it fair for her to have to be reminded of this for the rest of her life via a baby. Sure, she could give birth and put the child into the system (maybe those repubs would adopt....righhttttt).  Heck if she wanted to keep because she doesnt agree with abortion thats up to her.  But to say they have no right? What about her right not to be raped?

 

 

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Bellend Sebastian

Bellend Sebastian

Posted
Posted
20 hours ago, Brizzle Fox said:

Real life Line of Duty.... This is horrendous. Hopefully someone on the inquiry will leak the full,  unredacted report post haste. 

 

 

I do find it incredible that folk aren't more interested in stuff like this, but then again, it's not really drawn to your attention, is it?

 

More stink here:

 

https://bylinetimes.com/2021/05/19/the-daniel-morgan-independent-panel-and-press-misconduct-what-might-the-government-be-trying-to-hide/

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Wymsey

Wymsey

Posted
Posted

Imagine being the owner or a long-serving customer of the cafe being searched in the Fred West investigation, where a murdered teenager could be hidden..:blink:

 

Apparently the investigators have found some blue fragments in a hole underneath the toilet area, a coat colour which was worn by the young victim on the day she went missing.

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Brizzle Fox

Brizzle Fox

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

I do find it incredible that folk aren't more interested in stuff like this, but then again, it's not really drawn to your attention, is it?

 

More stink here:

 

https://bylinetimes.com/2021/05/19/the-daniel-morgan-independent-panel-and-press-misconduct-what-might-the-government-be-trying-to-hide/

You're right. People just don't seem to care though even if it is drawn to their attention. It's like shouting into an empty room and it's so important. 

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