Leeds H Post Match Thread

[Col city fan]

4 hours ago, StanSP said:

Come on Col. You're not this stupid. Missing Wilf and Vardy is quite a clear reason. 

Cmon Stan, you’re not stupid either...

I’m not only talking about this particular game. Of course not having Vardy or Ndidi wouldn’t help at all, but I’m referring to Rodgers tenure at the club in general. 
I think he’s great to have around but this inconsistency of performance under Rodgers has been pretty dramatic. Last term it was ridiculous. World beaters up till Christmas, pretty appalling afterwards. 
And this season... losses at home to the so called ‘lesser clubs’ whilst realising some marvellous wins away.

There seems little middle ground under Brendan. We are either really naff or really good. 
It does seem however that an awful lot of this stems from whether Ndidi plays or not. He’s the shield for Tielemans and this seems to be crucial. That said, it shows a lack of depth in our squad to be honest 

Edited 1 February 2021 by Col city fan

[jmono84]

7 hours ago, KingKoala said:

Defensive errors coupled with tinkering from Brendan costed the game yesterday.

I knew the team would struggle with scoring goals without Jamie's presence.

Scoring wasn’t the problem, is was foolishness by our players giving the ball away so cheaply and then Leeds being extremely clinical.

 

But yea if Vardy was playing we may have scored another but for me the problem was our players making ridiculous decisions which led to all 3 of their goals.

[jmono84]

1 hour ago, Col city fan said:

Cmon Stan, you’re not stupid either...

I’m not only talking about this particular game. Of course not having Vardy or Ndidi wouldn’t help at all, but I’m referring to Rodgers tenure at the club in general. 
I think he’s great to have around but this inconsistency of performance under Rodgers has been pretty dramatic. Last term it was ridiculous. World beaters up till Christmas, pretty appalling afterwards. 
And this season... losses at home to the so called ‘lesser clubs’ whilst realising some marvellous wins away.

There seems little middle ground under Brendan. We are either really naff or really good. 
It does seem however that an awful lot of this stems from whether Ndidi plays or not. He’s the shield for Tielemans and this seems to be crucial. That said, it shows a lack of depth in our squad to be honest 

I still think we were decent and looked like the team that was going to win at 1-1 playing with 3 at the back. We were very much in control and if it weren’t for another mistake from our players I think we might have nicked it.

[Clever Fox]

6 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Woke up this morning again feeling really perplexed at LCFC

How can we play so well for a few weeks, to again play so badly at home? 
It doesn’t make sense. This team is the biggest Jekyll and Hyde team we’ve possibly ever had?

We have to be honest. Last season we absolutely chucked away a pretty nailed-on Champions League spot due to becoming very very crap after Christmas. 
That’s made me so apprehensive I guess, that this team can again go from hero to zero very quickly.

Strange times to be a City fan. We can go from sublime to pretty awful within a few days. And what was clear yesterday was that when Bamford scored his wonder goal to put them in the lead, we were clueless as to how to respond.

We have to now bounce back and win the next game.

I understand your frustration because I feel somewhat the same. There's no doubt last years failings were all down to Brendan.

But there's a common thread that runs thru our defeats and it's a lack of a physical presence and pace in the team. Clearly exposed yesterday by the absence of  NDiddi and Vardy.

 

While we have very good players in most positions unless we can dominate the opposition we struggle. To do that we need to be better in possession and swifter in our passing to grind Teams down. 

 

With the games coming quick and fast on top of each other, This hasn't helped us as standards drop not intentionally but by fatigue.

 

While you can't blame Brendan for yesterdays errors by the players, He has to take responsibility for the poor Corners both ends and Free kicks etc. That have been a constant problem all season.

Leeds didn't beat us yesterday, We beat ourselves by making basic mistakes from normally good players. They also wanted it a bit more as they were more physical in the challenges.

Something we're not very good at aside from Wilf who was sorely missed yesterday.

Leeds had the players with real pace in their Team who took full advantage of our sloppiness. But we've also lost to Palace, West Ham and others not because we weren't good enough but because we couldn't keep up with the pace and physical challenges applied by them.

At this level these type of small margins make a big difference. Going forward we really need to address these short comings in our team by signing players who can not only play but cannot be out muscled off the Ball. Not an easy task I know but that is the next level we need to get too.

In the meantime Brendan needs to sort out the glaring obvious mistakes constantly being repeated game after game.

 

[judy]

On 31/01/2021 at 15:54, Paddy. said:

Not the reason we lost but the officiating was atrocious. Does aid your team's cause when you have the option to throw yourself to the floor everytime you lose possession and get a free kick every time. That's cheating. Plain and simple.

 

There was a moment in the second half that summed it up for me; Cooper receives the ball on the touchline, seeing nothing is on ahead of him, he turns back towards his own goal but stumbles slightly. He sees that Perez (who is about a metre away) is about to win back possession- what does he do? Throws himself to the floor. Kavanagh gives them a free kick. Perez literally didn't even touch him.

 

Madders and set pieces btw - it's embarrassing.

I’m a Leeds fan and I don’t agree with your post at all.  How come the ref gave us 3 yellow cards but not one for Leicester, who actually made more fouls?  Your players were throwing themselves down as well - it is a trait I hate in Premier League football.  It is cheating, I agree.  Our players are mostly honest players so I’m surprised if what you say about Cooper is correct.

[Pub breath]

5 hours ago, judy said:

I’m a Leeds fan and I don’t agree with your post at all.  How come the ref gave us 3 yellow cards but not one for Leicester, who actually made more fouls?  Your players were throwing themselves down as well - it is a trait I hate in Premier League football.  It is cheating, I agree.  Our players are mostly honest players so I’m surprised if what you say about Cooper is correct.

I've never seen Cooper take a dive once.  Ever.  Alioski, aye.  Ayling, aye.  Cooper, nah.  Not in his mentality at all.

[HighPeakFox]

3 minutes ago, Pub breath said:

I've never seen Cooper take a dive once.  Ever.  Alioski, aye.  Ayling, aye.  Cooper, nah.  Not in his mentality at all.

There's a difference between diving and just falling over at the slightest contact. We should know, we've seen it enough.

[fuchsntf]

I reckon Sky & other Media wombats, are trying to make out Leeds into their new Leicester story...

[waylander]

13 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Cmon Stan, you’re not stupid either...

I’m not only talking about this particular game. Of course not having Vardy or Ndidi wouldn’t help at all, but I’m referring to Rodgers tenure at the club in general. 
I think he’s great to have around but this inconsistency of performance under Rodgers has been pretty dramatic. Last term it was ridiculous. World beaters up till Christmas, pretty appalling afterwards. 
And this season... losses at home to the so called ‘lesser clubs’ whilst realising some marvellous wins away.

There seems little middle ground under Brendan. We are either really naff or really good. 
It does seem however that an awful lot of this stems from whether Ndidi plays or not. He’s the shield for Tielemans and this seems to be crucial. That said, it shows a lack of depth in our squad to be honest 

Probably in all honesty the most all round complete manager we have had . His consistency this season has been incredible. We can’t win every game . We played well mistakes cost us . Felt we were the better team but they played well too. 

[LCFCCHRIS]

5 hours ago, fuchsntf said:

I reckon Sky & other Media wombats, are trying to make out Leeds into their new Leicester story...

They can try but real football fans will know the truth, and that is that it's unlikely our story can ever be replicated. The little amount spent on transfers, Jamie Vardy's rise from non league and almost giving up on his first season at Leicester, great escape to title winners, the list goes on. There may be new things to tell, inspiring stories and triumphs against the established teams, but ours will go down as the greatest premier League underdog's tale ever told.

[deanolegend1989]

20 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Woke up this morning again feeling really perplexed at LCFC

How can we play so well for a few weeks, to again play so badly at home? 
It doesn’t make sense. This team is the biggest Jekyll and Hyde team we’ve possibly ever had?

We have to be honest. Last season we absolutely chucked away a pretty nailed-on Champions League spot due to becoming very very crap after Christmas. 
That’s made me so apprehensive I guess, that this team can again go from hero to zero very quickly.

Strange times to be a City fan. We can go from sublime to pretty awful within a few days. And what was clear yesterday was that when Bamford scored his wonder goal to put them in the lead, we were clueless as to how to respond.

We have to now bounce back and win the next game.

Home form:
West Ham (H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Villa(H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Wolves (H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Fulham (H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Brighton(H) played fantastically - Wilf in Mendy out.

Everton(H) played badly - Mendy back in, Wilf at CB.

Man Utd(H) played fantastically - Wilf back in, Mendy back out.

Southampton(H) played fantastically - Wilf in, Mendy out.

Chelsea(H) played fantastically - Wilf in, Mendy out.

Leeds(H) - Mendy back in, Wilf out = ? 
 

I think it makes perfect sense and very easy to understand and an obvious pattern that can be followed each game if you watch clearly.

 

I agree with you on being apprehensive though. It’s very much the most I’ve ever felt like it’ll be a shame if we don’t fulfill our potential because when we have our best team we WOULD finish top 4, every day of the week and twice on Sunday, so it’s very upsetting that we might miss our best chance ever to do so because of something so obvious to see.

Makes me very apprehensive to watch us play to our potential every week and show what we can achieve, to then know it’s going to all go to waste.

 

When Mendy plays, we will continue to lose and get run over in the same way as West Ham, Leeds, Fulham, Everton, Villa and Liverpool all did and at best knick the odd sh*thouse lucky win vs Wolves or Arsenal occasionally.

The key is to keep our best 11 fit as much as possible and we’ll get top 4. The problem is the more Vardy, Tielemens and especially Wilf don’t play the more we will be thinking:

 

’How can we play so well for a few weeks, to again play so badly at home? 
It doesn’t make sense.

 

It makes clear sense and we just need to hope to sh*thouse as many points as possible until we have our best team.

Problem is we have Fulham and Wolves before we get our team back so that’s 2 easier games on paper that we’ll probably waste and then Wilf and Vards are back for a 3 game run of:

Liverpool, Villa and Arsenal 🤦‍♂️. That’s the problem.

We’ll probably continue to play sh*te then have to play 3 good teams that would be harder as it is! I’d rather of had Wilf for these 3 and got 9 points then ‘wasted’ the harder games that we might not win anyway...

 

We could quite easily be without a win in the next 5 games.

If Wilf and Vards are back for Liverpool, I’d be more confident beating a world class team in Liverpool than beating a tinpot Fulham team with Mendy instead.

[deanolegend1989]

15 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Cmon Stan, you’re not stupid either...

I’m not only talking about this particular game. Of course not having Vardy or Ndidi wouldn’t help at all, but I’m referring to Rodgers tenure at the club in general. 
I think he’s great to have around but this inconsistency of performance under Rodgers has been pretty dramatic. Last term it was ridiculous. World beaters up till Christmas, pretty appalling afterwards. 
And this season... losses at home to the so called ‘lesser clubs’ whilst realising some marvellous wins away.

There seems little middle ground under Brendan. We are either really naff or really good. 
It does seem however that an awful lot of this stems from whether Ndidi plays or not. He’s the shield for Tielemans and this seems to be crucial. That said, it shows a lack of depth in our squad to be honest 

👏👏👏. Yes, that’s the clearest thing ever seen in a football team.

 

You mention the Rodgers polarisation of form. Last season before Xmas we won 8 straight?

the starting line up for 7 of them was exactly the same, and guess what ? Ndidi and Tielemens with Madders in front was the situation then too 😮😮.

 

Then as you said after Xmas we struggled. Wilf was out, Vardy was out. We then played without Tielemens vs Brighton and Mendy back in and through more away by the same reason 🥱.

Bennet came in and was awful. Thomas and Justin thrown into the deep end, and ultimately injuries killed us.

We also through away 2 points vs Watford and 3 vs Bournemouth from absolute brain farts.

 

But ultimately as you said, and I agree, about with Rodgers we are either unbelievably good or unbelievably awful. I totally agree but it obvious why and it boils down to 1 thing that I’ll continue to say but it’s because we have a handful of players who could play ‘right at the very top’ so when they all start, 90% of the time we reach high levels.

However when they are replaced by players who are so far out their depth it’s scary, then ultimately we carry them and it makes every game a struggle that more often than not we won’t win.

 

As you said on the last sentence, it shows a lack of depth in the squad but also that we make wrong choices.

Stick to something that proves doesn’t work or maybe try something else..Fofana in there? Big Dan Amarty as a DM would be better. Hamza with Tielemens would be an upgrade Praet getting injured hasn’t helped either.

 

Ultimately, every single time we persist with Mendy in there will consistently ‘not be a suprise’ when we struggle time and time again.

[Pub breath]

7 hours ago, HighPeakFox said:

There's a difference between diving and just falling over at the slightest contact. We should know, we've seen it enough.

True enough but still not him.  He's a big, tough as nails Yorkshire lad, it's really not in his psyche.  Ayling, very much different.  We even have a name for it, the "Ayling flop".

 

Nowt unique to Leeds mind, every team has one or two foppers.  

[Foxhateram]

1 hour ago, deanolegend1989 said:

Home form:
West Ham (H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Villa(H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Wolves (H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Fulham (H) played badly - Mendy in Wilf out.

Brighton(H) played fantastically - Wilf in Mendy out.

Everton(H) played badly - Mendy back in, Wilf at CB.

Man Utd(H) played fantastically - Wilf back in, Mendy back out.

Southampton(H) played fantastically - Wilf in, Mendy out.

Chelsea(H) played fantastically - Wilf in, Mendy out.

Leeds(H) - Mendy back in, Wilf out = ? 
 

I think it makes perfect sense and very easy to understand and an obvious pattern that can be followed each game if you watch clearly.

 

I agree with you on being apprehensive though. It’s very much the most I’ve ever felt like it’ll be a shame if we don’t fulfill our potential because when we have our best team we WOULD finish top 4, every day of the week and twice on Sunday, so it’s very upsetting that we might miss our best chance ever to do so because of something so obvious to see.

Makes me very apprehensive to watch us play to our potential every week and show what we can achieve, to then know it’s going to all go to waste.

 

When Mendy plays, we will continue to lose and get run over in the same way as West Ham, Leeds, Fulham, Everton, Villa and Liverpool all did and at best knick the odd sh*thouse lucky win vs Wolves or Arsenal occasionally.

The key is to keep our best 11 fit as much as possible and we’ll get top 4. The problem is the more Vardy, Tielemens and especially Wilf don’t play the more we will be thinking:

 

’How can we play so well for a few weeks, to again play so badly at home? 
It doesn’t make sense.

 

It makes clear sense and we just need to hope to sh*thouse as many points as possible until we have our best team.

Problem is we have Fulham and Wolves before we get our team back so that’s 2 easier games on paper that we’ll probably waste and then Wilf and Vards are back for a 3 game run of:

Liverpool, Villa and Arsenal 🤦‍♂️. That’s the problem.

We’ll probably continue to play sh*te then have to play 3 good teams that would be harder as it is! I’d rather of had Wilf for these 3 and got 9 points then ‘wasted’ the harder games that we might not win anyway...

 

We could quite easily be without a win in the next 5 games.

If Wilf and Vards are back for Liverpool, I’d be more confident beating a world class team in Liverpool than beating a tinpot Fulham team with Mendy instead.

Mendy had a string of games where I thought he might prove me wrong. But I am going to stand by what I said at the end of last season. He is far too lightweight, needs to get in the gym. The way he was cast aside by the Leeds player for their third the other day was shambolic, you should not be losing 50:50s like that, in this league you'll get punished for it. 

 

 

[deanolegend1989]

18 minutes ago, Foxhateram said:

Mendy had a string of games where I thought he might prove me wrong. But I am going to stand by what I said at the end of last season. He is far too lightweight, needs to get in the gym. The way he was cast aside by the Leeds player for their third the other day was shambolic, you should not be losing 50:50s like that, in this league you'll get punished for it. 

 

 

Exactly this 100%. He hasn’t got the strength , physicality, can’t win aerial battles and offers us absolutely nothing in terms of moving the ball quick. He’s static, stands off people and we’re easy to play against.

3rd goal he was embarrassing and the 1st goal he was trotting around like bambi in ice. Wilf closes Ayling down but Mendy does absolutely nothing.

The stats tell a horrible story. It’s time we played anyone over Mendy before it’s too late.

[Nick]

16 minutes ago, deanolegend1989 said:

Exactly this 100%. He hasn’t got the strength , physicality, can’t win aerial battles and offers us absolutely nothing in terms of moving the ball quick. He’s static, stands off people and we’re easy to play against.

3rd goal he was embarrassing and the 1st goal he was trotting around like bambi in ice. Wilf closes Ayling down but Mendy does absolutely nothing.

The stats tell a horrible story. It’s time we played anyone over Mendy before it’s too late.

Another truth, stats and fact update here.

 

Just with strong opinion passed off as truth, stats and facts.

 

Blaming Mendy for the first goal is hilarious. On that basis we should get rid of all the players who led to Leeds chances - Madders, Evans, Soyunco ...

 

Wanna talk about leightweight - let’s talk Perez. Mendy can’t and doesn’t tackle like Wilf - you are swapping one of the best DCM’s in the league, a Bentley of players and replacing it with Focus RS - Mendy isn’t perfect and yes isn’t a top four DCM but he’s what we have and has played well but by no means exceptionally. To keep up this tirade of singling him out for blame and abuse is just over the top and ****ing boring now - give it a rest. He’s second choice for a reason but let’s be honest here, as far as second choice goes, let’s talk about Nacho and Perez because they surely are the ones that need replacing as reserve players before Mendy.

[FOXSE]

6 minutes ago, Nick said:

Another truth, stats and fact update here.

 

Just with strong opinion passed off as truth, stats and facts.

 

Blaming Mendy for the first goal is hilarious. On that basis we should get rid of all the players who led to Leeds chances - Madders, Evans, Soyunco ...

 

Wanna talk about leightweight - let’s talk Perez. Mendy can’t and doesn’t tackle like Wilf - you are swapping one of the best DCM’s in the league, a Bentley of players and replacing it with Focus RS - Mendy isn’t perfect and yes isn’t a top four DCM but he’s what we have and has played well but by no means exceptionally. To keep up this tirade of singling him out for blame and abuse is just over the top and ****ing boring now - give it a rest. He’s second choice for a reason but let’s be honest here, as far as second choice goes, let’s talk about Nacho and Perez because they surely are the ones that need replacing as reserve players before Mendy.

I agree with the point about the form, and it not being a mystery because when you look, we have had our worst games when wilf isn't in as CDM. However,  we have had good performances with mendy,  its just that wilf gives the team the ability to really play. Mendy isn't as good as wilf: but who is??

[deanolegend1989]

13 minutes ago, Nick said:

Another truth, stats and fact update here.

 

Just with strong opinion passed off as truth, stats and facts.

 

Blaming Mendy for the first goal is hilarious. On that basis we should get rid of all the players who led to Leeds chances - Madders, Evans, Soyunco ...

 

Wanna talk about leightweight - let’s talk Perez. Mendy can’t and doesn’t tackle like Wilf - you are swapping one of the best DCM’s in the league, a Bentley of players and replacing it with Focus RS - Mendy isn’t perfect and yes isn’t a top four DCM but he’s what we have and has played well but by no means exceptionally. To keep up this tirade of singling him out for blame and abuse is just over the top and ****ing boring now - give it a rest. He’s second choice for a reason but let’s be honest here, as far as second choice goes, let’s talk about Nacho and Perez because they surely are the ones that need replacing as reserve players before Mendy.

Mendy is far far far worse than Perez. Just because people love Mendy on here but love to scapegoat Gray, Perez, Nacho, Albrighton amongst others is just hypocritical at the highest order.

Mendys influence changes everything, we are a much poorer team and every single bit of detail shows this.

Perez is very average and doesn’t offer a great deal, but it’s not as damning to the team.

 

Being a midfield general, is the most crucial position. It’s the biggest impact and when a player is so far below the required standard in that role, it shows up more.

 

Kante leaving us = polarisation of form from league winners to almost relegated(other 10 players exactly the same) .

He then turned a mid table Chelsea team into winners by a mile.

 

Xabi Alonso in Liverpool dictated everything, nearly won Liverpool a PL , leaves in the summer 08/09. the exact same team next season aside from him(Aqulani in next to Mascherano and Gerrard instead) Liverpool finished 7th and Benetez was sacked.

 

Viera at Arsenal another one I could go into how invincibility and then a 2nd place finish in 03/04 and 04/05, suddenly turned to a huge drop off and a scramble for a top 4 finish on the last day in 05/06.

 

Can even go to 97/98 and Roy Keane getting an ACL injury, Utd dropped and Arsenal knicked it. Keane back in 98/99 treble.

 

Makalele at Chelsea turned them into dominance 04/05-05/06.

 

You can even go to Spain and see Xavi/Iniesta influence. Yeah they still had Messi afterwards and still won leagues but Barca wernt quite as good or dominant as when they were controlling the middle. Probably the best club team ever.

 

My overall point being that this is where you see the biggest drop offs/upward curves depending if you have a good centre.

A good lb over an average one or a good winger over an average one might win you a few more points over a few seasons but the difference between a top middle and a poor one can be the difference to how the whole thing works. It’s as simple as that.

We might get top 10 with Mendy, but if we want to progress as a club and get into CL riches, we can’t be playing players the standard of Mendy in that quest. It’s harsh but true I’m afraid.

[teblin]

3 minutes ago, deanolegend1989 said:

Mendy is far far far worse than Perez. Just because people love Mendy on here but love to scapegoat Gray, Perez, Nacho, Albrighton amongst others is just hypocritical at the highest order.

Mendys influence changes everything, we are a much poorer team and every single bit of detail shows this.

Perez is very average and doesn’t offer a great deal, but it’s not as damning to the team.

 

Being a midfield general, is the most crucial position. It’s the biggest impact and when a player is so far below the required standard in that role, it shows up more.

 

Kante leaving us = polarisation of form from league winners to almost relegated(other 10 players exactly the same) .

He then turned a mid table Chelsea team into winners by a mile.

 

Xabi Alonso in Liverpool dictated everything, nearly won Liverpool a PL , leaves in the summer 08/09. the exact same team next season aside from him(Aqulani in next to Mascherano and Gerrard instead) Liverpool finished 7th and Benetez was sacked.

 

Viera at Arsenal another one I could go into how invincibility and then a 2nd place finish in 03/04 and 04/05, suddenly turned to a huge drop off and a scramble for a top 4 finish on the last day in 05/06.

 

Can even go to 97/98 and Roy Keane getting an ACL injury, Utd dropped and Arsenal knicked it. Keane back in 98/99 treble.

 

Makalele at Chelsea turned them into dominance 04/05-05/06.

 

You can even go to Spain and see Xavi/Iniesta influence. Yeah they still had Messi afterwards and still won leagues but Barca wernt quite as good or dominant as when they were controlling the middle. Probably the best club team ever.

 

My overall point being that this is where you see the biggest drop offs/upward curves depending if you have a good centre.

A good lb over an average one or a good winger over an average one might win you a few more points over a few seasons but the difference between a top middle and a poor one can be the difference to how the whole thing works. It’s as simple as that.

We might get top 10 with Mendy, but if we want to progress as a club and get into CL riches, we can’t be playing players the standard of Mendy in that quest. It’s harsh but true I’m afraid.

We all know wilf is so important I don’t think anyone argues with that. But mendy isn’t as bad as you are making out.

 

maddison was at fault for the 1st goal as well castagne(who was injured).

 

also Maddison was so bad against Leeds mendy and youri were in a 2.

[messerschmitt]

1 hour ago, Foxhateram said:

Mendy had a string of games where I thought he might prove me wrong. But I am going to stand by what I said at the end of last season. He is far too lightweight, needs to get in the gym. The way he was cast aside by the Leeds player for their third the other day was shambolic, you should not be losing 50:50s like that, in this league you'll get punished for it. 

 

 

Unfortunatly the difference when we have Wilf and Mendy is really looking massive not just in results but performances, we look so much better with Wilf on front of a back four, I'm not sure five at the back works,we seem to leak even more goals, probably a case of too many cooks. Mendy is a fine footballer who moves the ball around well and links things but we lack physicallity in this team and Mendy and Perez were totally bullied by Leeds. These are two technically great footballers but will struggle against teams who know how to play us.

[messerschmitt]

7 minutes ago, deanolegend1989 said:

Mendy is far far far worse than Perez. Just because people love Mendy on here but love to scapegoat Gray, Perez, Nacho, Albrighton amongst others is just hypocritical at the highest order.

Mendys influence changes everything, we are a much poorer team and every single bit of detail shows this.

Perez is very average and doesn’t offer a great deal, but it’s not as damning to the team.

 

Being a midfield general, is the most crucial position. It’s the biggest impact and when a player is so far below the required standard in that role, it shows up more.

 

Kante leaving us = polarisation of form from league winners to almost relegated(other 10 players exactly the same) .

He then turned a mid table Chelsea team into winners by a mile.

 

Xabi Alonso in Liverpool dictated everything, nearly won Liverpool a PL , leaves in the summer 08/09. the exact same team next season aside from him(Aqulani in next to Mascherano and Gerrard instead) Liverpool finished 7th and Benetez was sacked.

 

Viera at Arsenal another one I could go into how invincibility and then a 2nd place finish in 03/04 and 04/05, suddenly turned to a huge drop off and a scramble for a top 4 finish on the last day in 05/06.

 

Can even go to 97/98 and Roy Keane getting an ACL injury, Utd dropped and Arsenal knicked it. Keane back in 98/99 treble.

 

Makalele at Chelsea turned them into dominance 04/05-05/06.

 

You can even go to Spain and see Xavi/Iniesta influence. Yeah they still had Messi afterwards and still won leagues but Barca wernt quite as good or dominant as when they were controlling the middle. Probably the best club team ever.

 

My overall point being that this is where you see the biggest drop offs/upward curves depending if you have a good centre.

A good lb over an average one or a good winger over an average one might win you a few more points over a few seasons but the difference between a top middle and a poor one can be the difference to how the whole thing works. It’s as simple as that.

We might get top 10 with Mendy, but if we want to progress as a club and get into CL riches, we can’t be playing players the standard of Mendy in that quest. It’s harsh but true I’m afraid.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying here, but I don't think Mendy is a bad player it's just that Wilf is so good and totally underestimated. Its easy to look at the Messi's and Mahrez's of this world as what they do stands out but players like Wilf make a huge difference to a team and enable others to play their game.

[Mike Oxlong]

12 minutes ago, deanolegend1989 said:

Mendy is far far far worse than Perez. Just because people love Mendy on here but love to scapegoat Gray, Perez, Nacho, Albrighton amongst others is just hypocritical at the highest order.

Mendys influence changes everything, we are a much poorer team and every single bit of detail shows this.

Perez is very average and doesn’t offer a great deal, but it’s not as damning to the team.

 

Being a midfield general, is the most crucial position. It’s the biggest impact and when a player is so far below the required standard in that role, it shows up more.

 

Kante leaving us = polarisation of form from league winners to almost relegated(other 10 players exactly the same) .

He then turned a mid table Chelsea team into winners by a mile.

 

Xabi Alonso in Liverpool dictated everything, nearly won Liverpool a PL , leaves in the summer 08/09. the exact same team next season aside from him(Aqulani in next to Mascherano and Gerrard instead) Liverpool finished 7th and Benetez was sacked.

 

Viera at Arsenal another one I could go into how invincibility and then a 2nd place finish in 03/04 and 04/05, suddenly turned to a huge drop off and a scramble for a top 4 finish on the last day in 05/06.

 

Can even go to 97/98 and Roy Keane getting an ACL injury, Utd dropped and Arsenal knicked it. Keane back in 98/99 treble.

 

Makalele at Chelsea turned them into dominance 04/05-05/06.

 

You can even go to Spain and see Xavi/Iniesta influence. Yeah they still had Messi afterwards and still won leagues but Barca wernt quite as good or dominant as when they were controlling the middle. Probably the best club team ever.

 

My overall point being that this is where you see the biggest drop offs/upward curves depending if you have a good centre.

A good lb over an average one or a good winger over an average one might win you a few more points over a few seasons but the difference between a top middle and a poor one can be the difference to how the whole thing works. It’s as simple as that.

We might get top 10 with Mendy, but if we want to progress as a club and get into CL riches, we can’t be playing players the standard of Mendy in that quest. It’s harsh but true I’m afraid.

Yeah, but we’re not going to get a top 4 DM to come and happily sit on our bench when Wilf is playing. Mendy is perfectly suitable cover and on the whole does a decent job, recognising that he’s not at the same level as Wilf 

[HighPeakFox]

I was waiting for this to happen. Soon enough, someone will blame Mendy for other players having a dreadful game. It is very easy to create a fixed opinion, and then post-fit the evidence to rationalise any argument. It's a bit like going in to an election and repeatedly shouting 'vote tampering' in case you lose, so that when you lose, you can then keep saying 'see?', despite all the evidence to the contrary. Doesn't make it true or wholly correct, but it does poison the well.

[Sharpe's Fox]

Wilf is a world class DM being covered by a decent DM in Mendy who would get into plenty of starting elevens in the PL. No one in the league is starting Perez as a lone centre forward.

[deanolegend1989]

10 minutes ago, Mike Oxlong said:

Yeah, but we’re not going to get a top 4 DM to come and happily sit on our bench when Wilf is playing. Mendy is perfectly suitable cover and on the whole does a decent job, recognising that he’s not at the same level as Wilf 

I understand that and I agree I’m not expecting we can get a Wilf level back up. However for me he’s not ‘a perfectly suitable cover’ he’s a liability.

There is no way the stats should be that polarised due to 1 man, it’s incredible really.

Ndidi is fantastic, but if the difference is that huge it’s more than just 1 being better than the other.

Mendy is well off the pace. We can’t replace Ndidi, however if everyone was fully fit except Wilf we could have 5/6 options I’d have over Mendy.

1. Praet.

Praet and YT sitting with Madders in the front of the triangle would be perfectly fine as the cover(I’m aware Praet is out too but in general I mean).

2. Fofana. I believe a guy with this much physical attributes should be able to do a job there. He has everything.

3. Amarty. He’s big physical and although he isn’t the greatest, he’s far better than Mendy both physically and in the air.

4. Hamza. He’s not great but still better than Mendy imo. He breaks up play more and has a bit more presence.

 

We could do a lot better and that’s the sad thing.

 

1 minute ago, Sharpe's Fox said:

Wilf is a world class DM being covered by a decent DM in Mendy who would get into plenty of starting elevens in the PL. No one in the league is starting Perez as a lone centre forward.

Perez would get in:

Palace

Brighton

Newcastle

Fulham

Sheffield Utd

West Brom

Wolves

Burnley.

 

Name which Mendy would get in? A big fat 0. I doubt he’d get in a top Championship club.
 

Not many teams have as good of a CM in Tielemens to cover Mendys limitations.