Will Alves

[Lionator]

To be fair Hamza used to put in some horrific challenges when he was in the academy. It happens, hopefully he felt terrible about what happened and won’t do it again. 

[Tommy Fresh]

Just now, Lionator said:

To be fair Hamza used to put in some horrific challenges when he was in the academy. It happens, hopefully he felt terrible about what happened and won’t do it again. 

It wasn't really a challenge though was it?

[An Away Move]

6 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Good to know, but completely irrelevant. People don't go to war at 15 in 2023. And just because you went to work at 16 doesn't make you a wise old owl who never made a ridiculous decision.

 

Point is,  the Wolves player was what, 16 or 17? You're still at an early stage of your life learning about the world. If you don't like him being called a child, you can at least acknowledge that he's still learning what is right and wrong in life, and I would expect (and seriously hope) the last few months have been a very steep learning curve for him.  

That lad knew at the time what he was doing. It was malicious. At 17 he was old enough to know. I just don’t want to accept that because it’s 2023 young people no longer know the difference between right and wrong so we should cut them some slack for decisions that potentially make life altering consequences for others via their actions. So we should stop using it as a defence for the unjustifiable. Just my take. 

Edited 1 September 2023 by An Away Move

[Ric Flair]

Alves is the one player I cannot wait to see under Maresca, I really hope it happens and he recovers from his ACL. Could be devastating at this level.

[foxpleasure]

8 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Good to know, but completely irrelevant. People don't go to war at 15 in 2023. And just because you went to work at 16 doesn't make you a wise old owl who never made a ridiculous decision.

 

Point is,  the Wolves player was what, 16 or 17? You're still at an early stage of your life learning about the world. If you don't like him being called a child, you can at least acknowledge that he's still learning what is right and wrong in life, and I would expect (and seriously hope) the last few months have been a very steep learning curve for him.  

Assuming he's actually learned anything

[JJD_LCFC]

5 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Good to know, but completely irrelevant. People don't go to war at 15 in 2023. And just because you went to work at 16 doesn't make you a wise old owl who never made a ridiculous decision.

 

Point is,  the Wolves player was what, 16 or 17? You're still at an early stage of your life learning about the world. If you don't like him being called a child, you can at least acknowledge that he's still learning what is right and wrong in life, and I would expect (and seriously hope) the last few months have been a very steep learning curve for him.  

I do understand your point that he is young and learning.

 

I would say though look at the tackle again. He had clear intent to hit Alves and take him down, shouted at his teammates after for not taking Alves down earlier. And the outcome was he has massively hindered a career of a promising young player. These injuries are so hard to come back from,

 

Alves will always in the back of his mind have the impact of the tackle and it will change his game. My personal opinion is if you cause injury to another player via a horrible tackle, you are out for the same amount of time. 

 

Toney got banned from betting for months, yet his own club Shirt endorses betting. These kind of tackles are supposed to be stamped out of the game, yet the Wolves player gets a 3 game ban and England called up. Yet the player he intended to make contact with is out for 9 months. 

[Finnegan]

4 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Alves is the one player I cannot wait to see under Maresca, I really hope it happens and he recovers from his ACL. Could be devastating at this level.

 

He must be fairly close? 

 

It's been about 8 months and a week? 

[An Away Move]

1 minute ago, Finnegan said:

 

He must be fairly close? 

 

It's been about 8 months and a week? 

Hopefully October. 

[Foxdiamond]

16 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Good to know, but completely irrelevant. People don't go to war at 15 in 2023. And just because you went to work at 16 doesn't make you a wise old owl who never made a ridiculous decision.

 

Point is,  the Wolves player was what, 16 or 17? You're still at an early stage of your life learning about the world. If you don't like him being called a child, you can at least acknowledge that he's still learning what is right and wrong in life, and I would expect (and seriously hope) the last few months have been a very steep learning curve for him.  

You should know right and wrong well before 16. What he did was verging on ABH

[coolhandfox]

I bet some of the fans hating on Voice, idolise Steve Walsh 

[Tommy G]

39 minutes ago, An Away Move said:

He is not a child. I really detest it when people keep saying this. I’d been at work 2 years by the time I was 18. My grandad had served in WW1 for 3 by that age. 

Didn't think I'd ever see WW1 connected to Alves in a thread. Foxestalk

Edited 1 September 2023 by Tommy G

[smudger63]

27 minutes ago, Lionator said:

To be fair Hamza used to put in some horrific challenges when he was in the academy. It happens, hopefully he felt terrible about what happened and won’t do it again. 

There are horrific challenges, and then there is premeditated ABH, and that's what that was.

I don't care how young he was, and "we all make mistakes" blardy blah!

If that had been a City kid who was playing for us, and done what that Wolves thug done, I would want our club to bomb him out of the club the next day.  

[An Away Move]

10 minutes ago, Tommy G said:

Didn't think I'd ever see WW1 connected to Alves in a thread. Foxestalk

Here to serve. 

[Gamble92]

27 minutes ago, JJD_LCFC said:

I do understand your point that he is young and learning.

 

I would say though look at the tackle again. He had clear intent to hit Alves and take him down, shouted at his teammates after for not taking Alves down earlier. And the outcome was he has massively hindered a career of a promising young player. These injuries are so hard to come back from,

 

Alves will always in the back of his mind have the impact of the tackle and it will change his game. My personal opinion is if you cause injury to another player via a horrible tackle, you are out for the same amount of time. 

 

Toney got banned from betting for months, yet his own club Shirt endorses betting. These kind of tackles are supposed to be stamped out of the game, yet the Wolves player gets a 3 game ban and England called up. Yet the player he intended to make contact with is out for 9 months. 

Spot on. It was so calculated too. Could see that in the way he went in. At least others can be genuinely remorseful because of a heat of the moment lunge. This wasn't that. It was evil.

[Foxdiamond]

10 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

I bet some of the fans hating on Voice, idolise Steve Walsh 

Walsh was banned 11 matches for breaking David Geddes jaw. How long did Voice get?

[walkerleeds]

20 minutes ago, JJD_LCFC said:

I do understand your point that he is young and learning.

 

I would say though look at the tackle again. He had clear intent to hit Alves and take him down, shouted at his teammates after for not taking Alves down earlier. And the outcome was he has massively hindered a career of a promising young player. These injuries are so hard to come back from,

 

Alves will always in the back of his mind have the impact of the tackle and it will change his game. My personal opinion is if you cause injury to another player via a horrible tackle, you are out for the same amount of time. 

 

Toney got banned from betting for months, yet his own club Shirt endorses betting. These kind of tackles are supposed to be stamped out of the game, yet the Wolves player gets a 3 game ban and England called up. Yet the player he intended to make contact with is out for 9 months. 

 

Absolutely it was intentional to hurt him, but I do not believe for a second he intended to put Alves out for X months and potentially ruin his career. I've played football my whole life and been "hit" plenty of times, aside from the odd psychopath I generally think they don't want to snap me in half.

 

Does until the player is fit mean back in training, back in the first team, back on the bench? Alves' definition of being fit may be different to other players etc. It's a really difficult precedent to set. The England call up has come 8 months after the event, it isn't like he got a 3 match ban and was immediately called up. 

 

I just think we need to put it into context a little.

[An Away Move]

1 minute ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Absolutely it was intentional to hurt him, but I do not believe for a second he intended to put Alves out for X months and potentially ruin his career. I've played football my whole life and been "hit" plenty of times, aside from the odd psychopath I generally think they don't want to snap me in half.

 

Does until the player is fit mean back in training, back in the first team, back on the bench? Alves' definition of being fit may be different to other players etc. It's a really difficult precedent to set. The England call up has come 8 months after the event, it isn't like he got a 3 match ban and was immediately called up. 

 

I just think we need to put it into context a little.

And what if he had intended to snap his leg, which is what it very much looked like?

[Noahfence]

Didn’t realise he got injured last December thought it was early this year. Should be getting close to him returning soon? Next month maybe? 

[sacreblueits442]

16 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Good to know, but completely irrelevant. People don't go to war at 15 in 2023. And just because you went to work at 16 doesn't make you a wise old owl who never made a ridiculous decision.

 

Point is,  the Wolves player was what, 16 or 17? You're still at an early stage of your life learning about the world. If you don't like him being called a child, you can at least acknowledge that he's still learning what is right and wrong in life, and I would expect (and seriously hope) the last few months have been a very steep learning curve for him.  

...true,  but his take on the incident was that Alves was showboating and it was why he did what he did!!!

  So even after the heat of the moment, with time to consider his actions, he was still attempting to justify what he did?

[ealingfox]

52 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Good to know, but completely irrelevant. People don't go to war at 15 in 2023. And just because you went to work at 16 doesn't make you a wise old owl who never made a ridiculous decision.

 

Point is,  the Wolves player was what, 16 or 17? You're still at an early stage of your life learning about the world. If you don't like him being called a child, you can at least acknowledge that he's still learning what is right and wrong in life, and I would expect (and seriously hope) the last few months have been a very steep learning curve for him.  

 

Why would there have been any learning? Did he receive any punishment beyond that automatically triggered by the straight red card? It's clearly not cost him anything.

[Tommy Fresh]

11 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

 

Absolutely it was intentional to hurt him, but I do not believe for a second he intended to put Alves out for X months and potentially ruin his career. I've played football my whole life and been "hit" plenty of times, aside from the odd psychopath I generally think they don't want to snap me in half.

 

Does until the player is fit mean back in training, back in the first team, back on the bench? Alves' definition of being fit may be different to other players etc. It's a really difficult precedent to set. The England call up has come 8 months after the event, it isn't like he got a 3 match ban and was immediately called up. 

 

I just think we need to put it into context a little.

If someone intentionally did that to you in Sunday league, you'd be looking at pressing charges mate

[st albans fox]

1 minute ago, ealingfox said:

 

Why would there have been any learning? Did he receive any punishment beyond that automatically triggered by the straight red card? It's clearly not cost him anything.

i think that wolves dropped him for a month or two 

[sacreblueits442]

3 hours ago, Lionator said:

To be fair Hamza used to put in some horrific challenges when he was in the academy. It happens, hopefully he felt terrible about what happened and won’t do it again. 

...can't recall seeing him do that, it was never part of his game, he just sat infront of the defence "wall passing!!!"

  It is only since he got into the first team we are seeing this.

Edited 1 September 2023 by sacreblueits442
Spelling error.

[AKCJ]

Anyone else open this thread thinking there'd been news that Will is back in training or something?

[filbertway]

More salt than the dead Sea here. No wonder people are so miserable of theyre holding onto grudges this long

 

Let it go fellas. Alves is on the come back trail now.

 

Also fighting in a war as a child doesn't make you any more experienced in life.