Facundo Buonanotte joins on loan - Official

[JimJams]

8 minutes ago, It'sblueupnorth said:

Yet has scored only the one winner against Bournemouth, compared to ayew who scored the winner against soton and the equaliser against Ipswich 

Erm, you're aware Buonanotte also scored against Saints in that game too though yeah?

[Paninistickers]

5 minutes ago, ronnup said:

 

He's young, and been horribly mismanaged 

Gets on my pip that this Buonnotte isn't as good as we think had become like a hipster badge. No doubt the same punters talk passionately about Dukla Prague's away kit too..

 

Idgaf what the stats say, it what formation we play or even how often he gives the ball away (which is a myth anyway,  come about from Fulham where the lad desperately tried any trick to spark some life into a dead game) .....he is absolutely miles and miles better than Bob Reid mincing about doing zilch and Ayew holding the ball up, slowing the game down, looking for a foul and - at best - passing the ball back to the centre half

 

 

[Dahnsouff]

1 minute ago, Paninistickers said:

Gets on my pip that this Buonnotte isn't as good as we think had become like a hipster badge. No doubt the same punters talk passionately about Dukla Prague's away kit too..

 

Idgaf what the stats say, it what formation we play or even how often he gives the ball away (which is a myth anyway,  come about from Fulham where the lad desperately tried any trick to spark some life into a dead game) .....he is absolutely miles and miles better than Bob Reid mincing about doing zilch and Ayew holding the ball up, slowing the game down, looking for a foul and - at best - passing the ball back to the centre half

 

 

There is a reason stats exist, it’s to stop this prehistoric eye test bullshit. Stats say he is not better. I trust stats.

[JimJams]

1 minute ago, Dahnsouff said:

There is a reason stats exist, it’s to stop this prehistoric eye test bullshit. Stats say he is not better. I trust stats.

It's not really though is it?  It's to aid the prehistoric eye test bullshit.  Otherwise there'd be no point scouting, you could just use a stat sheet.

[Paninistickers]

2 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

There is a reason stats exist, it’s to stop this prehistoric eye test bullshit. Stats say he is not better. I trust stats.

Fair play to you pal. You enjoy your stays based Dutch football watching us being bummed alive every week (except for spurs youth team,)....I don't find it as entertaining meself

[Dahnsouff]

2 minutes ago, JimJams said:

It's not really though is it?  It's to aid the prehistoric eye test bullshit.  Otherwise there'd be no point scouting, you could just use a stat sheet.

Fair, but I get just tired of seeing the defence of Facundo when he has been very poor of late and not warranting of a start.

[Dahnsouff]

2 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

Fair play to you pal. You enjoy your stays based Dutch football watching us being bummed alive every week (except for spurs youth team,)....I don't find it as entertaining meself

If it’s all about entertainment, why are you watching and expecting? We have been pretty dire from that perspective for quite some time, but suppose that’s why the Championship season was a brief sojourn back into excitement, as winning is inherently exciting.

[davieG]

Ruud seems to want him to play in a deeper role probably to support our none existence midfield defence. But it doesn't look like his natural game and tempts him into dribbling the ball forward when he should probably pass he needs to be played further forward so he can get in the box more as he did in his early appearances.

[ts_1010]

I feel like he's liable to try and force situations and chances at the moment. I feel like he's trying to do something that stands out so that he can get back in the starting line up. That's probably leading to taking risks and losing possession.

 

I feel like Ayew offers JJ more protection so I can see why he's playing ahead of Facundo

[dmayne7]

12 minutes ago, ts_1010 said:

I feel like he's liable to try and force situations and chances at the moment. I feel like he's trying to do something that stands out so that he can get back in the starting line up. That's probably leading to taking risks and losing possession.

 

I feel like Ayew offers JJ more protection so I can see why he's playing ahead of Facundo

You're right but even though Ayew offers more protection, the protection he offers is laughable. Genuinely think we had more cover when Riyad was playing because at least he was out wide. Ayew drifts into no mans land in the middle of the pitch way too much.

[Old Fox]

26 minutes ago, ts_1010 said:

I feel like he's liable to try and force situations and chances at the moment. I feel like he's trying to do something that stands out so that he can get back in the starting line up. That's probably leading to taking risks and losing possession.

 

I feel like Ayew offers JJ more protection so I can see why he's playing ahead of Facundo

He bloody well didn’t at Goodison last week - he was a disgrace like Faes, Winks and VK - never bother me if we didn’t see any of them again in a blue shirt …..wishful thinking but how Buanonotte does not get in this pile of rubbish i will never know 

[It'sblueupnorth]

1 hour ago, JimJams said:

Erm, you're aware Buonanotte also scored against Saints in that game too though yeah?

Right? And that makes him more of a ‘match winner’ than the bloke who scored the actual winner? 

[Analysethis]

Im not sure what the issue is with him. He looks at times a bit Iheanacho heavy but that could be puppy fat lol.

 

I like him playing from the right but maybe he doesnt run back enough? Im not sure why Ruud has omitted him but something aint right.

[ian__marshall]

The lad's incredibly talented, has the technical ability to go on and be a superstar.

 

His biggest shortcoming at the moment is he tries too hard and doesn't always release the ball when he should.

 

That said I don't think it's any coincidence that this has become more prevalent since Ruud came in and suddenly just benched him despite being our best player at the time. That would have rocked his confidence massively. 

 

He's at that age where he wants to prove himself, and most players at his stage of development who suddenly find game time limited instinctively will default to trying a risky flick, taking on one man too many, or looking for the killer pass that has a 5% chance of success to try and impress the coach, even though the reality is that when it doesn't come off it only reinforces the reasons for not playing them. 

 

It'll be exacerbated by the fact that he'll know Brighton will be tracking him closely too, so will also be keen to impress them and stake a claim for 1st team football. 

 

Whilst I understand the need to sometimes take a hard line stance with flair players and reign in their tendency to over play in-order to instill the mindset that you also have to be less reckless, there is a fine line, and if you're not careful you can coach the creativity out of them to the point where they end up looking like a shadow of the player they're capable of being. 

 

I think he needs to play more personally. I just think Ruud needs to coach him better on the situations and areas of the pitch where you can and can't take risks. 

[funkyrobot]

2 hours ago, Dahnsouff said:

There is a reason stats exist, it’s to stop this prehistoric eye test bullshit. Stats say he is not better. I trust stats.

The best modern scouts base their assessments 50% eye test and 50% stats. Heard it on a football podcast last year (not involving Coady fyi.) 

[HankMarvin]

2 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

Gets on my pip that this Buonnotte isn't as good as we think had become like a hipster badge. No doubt the same punters talk passionately about Dukla Prague's away kit too..

 

Idgaf what the stats say, it what formation we play or even how often he gives the ball away (which is a myth anyway,  come about from Fulham where the lad desperately tried any trick to spark some life into a dead game) .....he is absolutely miles and miles better than Bob Reid mincing about doing zilch and Ayew holding the ball up, slowing the game down, looking for a foul and - at best - passing the ball back to the centre half

 

 

Well if people are going to harp on about losing the ball, Ayew has actually been dispossessed more times and they both have played similar minutes 

[Paninistickers]

3 minutes ago, HankMarvin said:

Well if people are going to harp on about losing the ball, Ayew has actually been dispossessed more times and they both have played similar minutes 

Yeah, but you lose the cool credentials by admitting the blindingly obvious. Some red pill blue pill garbage at a guess. 

 

I'm all for metrics in football. That players have certain kois to hit....distance covered, recovery runs, progressive passes or whatever....but to base your opinion of a player on stats alone is lunacy - particularly when the stats show us being collectively  destroyed week in, week out

 

 

[FLAN]

2 hours ago, funkyrobot said:

The best modern scouts base their assessments 50% eye test and 50% stats. Heard it on a football podcast last year (not involving Coady fyi.) 

BS. Coady is on every podcast 

[Jobyfox]

I’d like to get excited about him but, as he won’t be here next season, I just can’t 

 

But if the alternative is Jordan Ayew … then just play the lad! 

[ceebeefox]

13 hours ago, Dahnsouff said:

Fair, but I get just tired of seeing the defence of Facundo when he has been very poor of late and not warranting of a start.

If he’s the best you’ve got you play him, we’ve scarce few players who can create. I’ve got no problem with a player trying something and losing the ball in the opponents half. Beats the sterile crap of keeping the ball, which in our “stats” gives Vesty and Faes 65% possession!

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, ceebeefox said:

If he’s the best you’ve got you play him, we’ve scarce few players who can create. I’ve got no problem with a player trying something and losing the ball in the opponents half. Beats the sterile crap of keeping the ball, which in our “stats” gives Vesty and Faes 65% possession!

Bilal is the best player we have currently, and he is ours. 

 

I can see the argument for playing Facundo in a midfield role or on the wing, but he is very prone to losing the ball and is quite weak (Maybe direct swap for Winks then   ) but yes, at his best he is creative, I just don`t feel we see his best much recently.

[Sol thewall Bamba]

Reckon he plays a blinder tonight. Couldn't hope for a bigger shop window. 

[Grebfromgrebland]

We need our best players on the pitch. The manager needs to figure this out

[Fox92]

26 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Bilal is the best player we have currently, and he is ours. 

 

I can see the argument for playing Facundo in a midfield role or on the wing, but he is very prone to losing the ball and is quite weak (Maybe direct swap for Winks then   ) but yes, at his best he is creative, I just don`t feel we see his best much recently.

Probably because we're already 2 down by the time he's coming on. Everybody wants him to create something for us. He loses the ball. Players who do more, try to do more, are bound to lose the ball more.

 

I'd rather that than watch Winks pass it back and sideways all game and "achieve" 90% passing accuracy, which brings me onto your next point...

 

14 hours ago, Dahnsouff said:

There is a reason stats exist, it’s to stop this prehistoric eye test bullshit. Stats say he is not better. I trust stats.

Stats probably say players such as Winks are so good on the ball yet they do fvck all with it.

[volpeazzurro]

14 hours ago, JimJams said:

It's not really though is it?  It's to aid the prehistoric eye test bullshit.  Otherwise there'd be no point scouting, you could just use a stat sheet.

One set of stats could suggest a player is good because he has a 100% successful pass, the reality being that he hid all game and merely passed sideways and backwards to a teammate 4 feet away. The same stats could make another player look bad because he was only 80%, however, that player had been far more adventurous and more likely to win a game for you. Some stats tell half the story.