Ruud van Nistelrooy - New Manager - Official

[Realist Guy In The Room]

It wasn't great against Wolves but lets be honest, if Mads plays we dont lose that game.

 

Cooper wasn't the right fit to begin with and the speed at which he changed us into a steaming pile of turd was ridiculously alarming so he quite rightly was shown the door.

 

Has RVN done enough in his career so far to get a management job at a relegation threatened premier league team?  Yes.  Let's stop thinking we're something we're not.  It is odd that he hasn't brought in any backroom staff of his own yet so i'm expecting that to change.  Because he's a 'name', he'll get more slack than Cooper but that won't last forever.  I think he's genuinely surprised at just how bad the squad is and how much work it needs.  Quite a few of our players are underperforming and I think the introduction of a fresh face or two will shoot them into life, however we need to face facts.

 

The squad is terrible and with the exception of playing Buonanotte (I might be guilty of cutting him too much slack here but I can see the reason for not playing him, especially if he's going to be sent back in January.  He and Bilal are very similar so if you only want to play one, it should be the player we actually own.  On the rare occasion they've been on the pitch at the same time, it really doesn't work.), there really wasn't a whole lot different he could have done on Sunday (and whilst the 'played well' line doesn't wash, Vards had 3 decent chances on Sunday that if one had gone in, especially the first one on one he tried to lift over the keeper, the game is completely different).

 

With any new manager that comes in mid season, I do think before anyone spills their flange juice they need to be given a transfer window.  It's really only then you get a true idea of what a manager is capable of brining to the table.  Thankfully we don't have to wait that long.

 

This isn't to say I don't have my reservations.  I was hoping to see more of a reaction from the players but quite a few of them are really struggling for any kind of form.  Skipp and Justin in particular really look clueless.  Is that down to the manager?  Not completely but he needs to find a way of getting more out of the players we have as we know from how the January window works, we're not likely to be adding any more than 3 players max.

[funkyrobot]

11 hours ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

He's shown no more tactical sense than Cooper to date. Indeed, I reckon Cooper understood the limitations of the squad better arguably. 

In the first two games, RVN made key tactical changes with early subs and formation changes that earned us 4 points. Cooper just went for a like for like late substitutes to try and effect a game. The last two games have been ruined early by awful defending and a catastrophic goalkeeper. RVN though can rightly be criticised for the selection of Ward, JJ and Ayew as a winger ahead of anyone but specifically ahead of Buonanotte. The club were right to get rid of Cooper, RVN needs a transfer window to assess his ability. 

[Claudio Fannieri]

10 hours ago, CosbehFox said:

He’s being careful not to bad mouth existing players as it stands is my take on it. 

Absolutely spot on the reality is at best we will probably bring in 2/3 players so he can ill afford to go wading in on a group of players publicly and run the risk of alienating himself from the squad. 
 

That doesn’t necessarily mean behind closed doors he is not having honest and frank conversations about expectations and what he wants from the players but perhaps in a more constructive approach. 

[Paninistickers]

10 hours ago, Wasyls Pec Deck said:

People on here need to hold their nerve, perhaps more so than they hold their beer!

Ordinarily I'm pretty patient with managers. 

 

But sometimes you just gotta call it when you see it. He's a surgeon without ever being a doctor. He's way way under qualified for this job. 

 

I'll ignore the bizarre Ward and Buonnotte decisions, instead highlight his other red flags;

 

His decision to replace the winks/wilf (our best players)  like for like with inferior players (Skipp, Hamza) at Newcastle and expect the same performance levels defies all logic. That was the first major red flag. He surrendered the game by hanging Hamza and Skipp out to dry. 

 

To admit he'd done no homework on Ward (and presumably therefore no other player too) is excruciating in its ineptness and disrespects the job he's taken. 

 

The arrogance in being in Holland for his announcement appalls me. Get on a fcking 45 min flight you arrogant cvnt. What dreadful disrespect. 

 

I admit personally I didn't fancy him from the off. I'm not easily persuaded by a cashmere sweater. So yup, I've been dying to get rid since he's been appointed. This man is all wrong for us and it'll end up like Frank de Boer at Palace. Two more absolute whuppings and he'll be gone

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Chelmofox]

26 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

It wasn't great against Wolves but lets be honest, if Mads plays we dont lose that game.

 

Cooper wasn't the right fit to begin with and the speed at which he changed us into a steaming pile of turd was ridiculously alarming so he quite rightly was shown the door.

 

Has RVN done enough in his career so far to get a management job at a relegation threatened premier league team?  Yes.  Let's stop thinking we're something we're not.  It is odd that he hasn't brought in any backroom staff of his own yet so i'm expecting that to change.  Because he's a 'name', he'll get more slack than Cooper but that won't last forever.  I think he's genuinely surprised at just how bad the squad is and how much work it needs.  Quite a few of our players are underperforming and I think the introduction of a fresh face or two will shoot them into life, however we need to face facts.

 

The squad is terrible and with the exception of playing Buonanotte (I might be guilty of cutting him too much slack here but I can see the reason for not playing him, especially if he's going to be sent back in January.  He and Bilal are very similar so if you only want to play one, it should be the player we actually own.  On the rare occasion they've been on the pitch at the same time, it really doesn't work.), there really wasn't a whole lot different he could have done on Sunday (and whilst the 'played well' line doesn't wash, Vards had 3 decent chances on Sunday that if one had gone in, especially the first one on one he tried to lift over the keeper, the game is completely different).

 

With any new manager that comes in mid season, I do think before anyone spills their flange juice they need to be given a transfer window.  It's really only then you get a true idea of what a manager is capable of brining to the table.  Thankfully we don't have to wait that long.

 

This isn't to say I don't have my reservations.  I was hoping to see more of a reaction from the players but quite a few of them are really struggling for any kind of form.  Skipp and Justin in particular really look clueless.  Is that down to the manager?  Not completely but he needs to find a way of getting more out of the players we have as we know from how the January window works, we're not likely to be adding any more than 3 players max.

I had my reservations when the team came out Sunday afternoon. But, having to pick our 3rd keeper I can understand why he may have opted for a more defensive setup especially after the pounding from Newcastle. I love Buonanotte, but he gives the ball away a lot. Not just a few time - a lot. One of the first things Buonanotte did when he came on was stepping over the ball when passed too - immediate Wolves attack. I think Buonanotte blows hot and cold more than most of us are willing to admit. When he has been brilliant though he is a joy to watch.

 

Ruud has been dealt a sh1tty hand with Injuries. The Mads one is a killer. If Ruud is trying to get this lot organised in a certain way, i can understand why going for Iversen (himself not great anyway) might feel counterproductive if it meant changing the whole defensive shape. Ward did play the same way with his feet as Mads, and before the first calamitous goal we were looking ok. But once the Ward yips appeared it was game over.

 

Both us and Wolves were as bad as each other. The difference was the goalkeeper.  Mads is the difference. Need him back.

 

Jan window will be interesting, but history is a good indicator to what Ruud will get.

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

6 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

Ordinarily I'm pretty patient with managers. 

 

But sometimes you just gotta call it when you see it. He's a surgeon without ever being a doctor. He's way way under qualified for this job. 

 

I'll ignore the bizarre Ward and Buonnotte decisions, instead highlight his other red flags;

 

His decision to replace the winks/wilf (our best players)  like for like with inferior players (Skipp, Hamza) at Newcastle and expect the same performance levels defies all logic. That was the first major red flag. He surrendered the game by hanging Hamza and Skipp out to dry. 

 

To admit he'd done no homework on Ward (and presumably therefore no other player too) is excruciating in its ineptness and disrespects the job he's taken. 

 

The arrogance in being in Holland for his announcement appalls me. Get on a fcking 45 min flight you arrogant cvnt. What dreadful disrespect. 

 

I admit personally I didn't fancy him from the off. I'm not easily persuaded by a cashmere sweater. So yup, I've been dying to get rid since he's been appointed. This man is all wrong for us and it'll end up like Frank de Boer at Palace. Two more absolute whuppings and he'll be gone

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well we’re certainly going to find out what he’s made of. He may well be inexperienced for this situation, but let’s see.

 

I don’t think it’s quite as bad as that. For example, the Newcastle selections were driven by the alternatives we have. I don’t think he had any better options in midfield on that day? Did he expect the same level of performance? Again I’m not sure we can assume that.

 

I agree with you on the Ward issue though, but not sure about him being in a the Netherlands reflects bad on him. What if he had a family commitment or something like that?

[Lionator]

8 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

Ordinarily I'm pretty patient with managers. 

 

But sometimes you just gotta call it when you see it. He's a surgeon without ever being a doctor. He's way way under qualified for this job. 

 

I'll ignore the bizarre Ward and Buonnotte decisions, instead highlight his other red flags;

 

His decision to replace the winks/wilf (our best players)  like for like with inferior players (Skipp, Hamza) at Newcastle and expect the same performance levels defies all logic. That was the first major red flag. He surrendered the game by hanging Hamza and Skipp out to dry. 

 

To admit he'd done no homework on Ward (and presumably therefore no other player too) is excruciating in its ineptness and disrespects the job he's taken. 

 

The arrogance in being in Holland for his announcement appalls me. Get on a fcking 45 min flight you arrogant cvnt. What dreadful disrespect. 

 

I admit personally I didn't fancy him from the off. I'm not easily persuaded by a cashmere sweater. So yup, I've been dying to get rid since he's been appointed. This man is all wrong for us and it'll end up like Frank de Boer at Palace. Two more absolute whuppings and he'll be gone

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is a weird one, what else is he meant to do, play no midfielders at all? 

[Paninistickers]

1 minute ago, Lionator said:

This is a weird one, what else is he meant to do, play no midfielders at all? 

You have to play the hand you are dealt. We had two fit midfielders. He NEEDED to add a third body in there as they were ALWAYS going to get mullered.

 

But he does no research on his players, so maybe he didn't know. 

 

  

 

 

[Tommy G]

1 hour ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

It wasn't great against Wolves but lets be honest, if Mads plays we dont lose that game.

 

Cooper wasn't the right fit to begin with and the speed at which he changed us into a steaming pile of turd was ridiculously alarming so he quite rightly was shown the door.

 

Has RVN done enough in his career so far to get a management job at a relegation threatened premier league team?  Yes.  Let's stop thinking we're something we're not.  It is odd that he hasn't brought in any backroom staff of his own yet so i'm expecting that to change.  Because he's a 'name', he'll get more slack than Cooper but that won't last forever.  I think he's genuinely surprised at just how bad the squad is and how much work it needs.  Quite a few of our players are underperforming and I think the introduction of a fresh face or two will shoot them into life, however we need to face facts.

 

The squad is terrible and with the exception of playing Buonanotte (I might be guilty of cutting him too much slack here but I can see the reason for not playing him, especially if he's going to be sent back in January.  He and Bilal are very similar so if you only want to play one, it should be the player we actually own.  On the rare occasion they've been on the pitch at the same time, it really doesn't work.), there really wasn't a whole lot different he could have done on Sunday (and whilst the 'played well' line doesn't wash, Vards had 3 decent chances on Sunday that if one had gone in, especially the first one on one he tried to lift over the keeper, the game is completely different).

 

With any new manager that comes in mid season, I do think before anyone spills their flange juice they need to be given a transfer window.  It's really only then you get a true idea of what a manager is capable of brining to the table.  Thankfully we don't have to wait that long.

 

This isn't to say I don't have my reservations.  I was hoping to see more of a reaction from the players but quite a few of them are really struggling for any kind of form.  Skipp and Justin in particular really look clueless.  Is that down to the manager?  Not completely but he needs to find a way of getting more out of the players we have as we know from how the January window works, we're not likely to be adding any more than 3 players max.

I don’t think Mads is a save all card as he’s got 4 donuts in front of him particularly full backs.

 

What about not playing our best midfielder either?

 

something very off about his team selections 

[Lionator]

9 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

You have to play the hand you are dealt. We had two fit midfielders. He NEEDED to add a third body in there as they were ALWAYS going to get mullered.

 

But he does no research on his players, so maybe he didn't know. 

 

  

 

 

Who could we have played there? Faes?

[Realist Guy In The Room]

3 minutes ago, Tommy G said:

I don’t think Mads is a save all card as he’s got 4 donuts in front of him particularly full backs.

 

What about not playing our best midfielder either?

 

something very off about his team selections 

Yeah I did address the Buonanotte selection :-

 

I might be guilty of cutting him too much slack here but I can see the reason for not playing him, especially if he's going to be sent back in January.  He and Bilal are very similar so if you only want to play one, it should be the player we actually own.  On the rare occasion they've been on the pitch at the same time, it really doesn't work

[Nolucklcfc]

11 hours ago, CosbehFox said:

He’s being careful not to bad mouth existing players as it stands is my take on it. 

I bloody hope so. 

[HankMarvin]

56 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

Yeah I did address the Buonanotte selection :-

 

I might be guilty of cutting him too much slack here but I can see the reason for not playing him, especially if he's going to be sent back in January.  He and Bilal are very similar so if you only want to play one, it should be the player we actually own.  On the rare occasion they've been on the pitch at the same time, it really doesn't work

Disagree, irrespective if he is going back he is a game changer. 10 starts 4 goals and 2 assists  from Midfield with 21 shots.
To put that in perspective Vardy started all 16 with 6 goals and 3 assists 24 shots.
If it wasn’t for fitness reasons it was poor management.

[cityfanlee23]

I just don't know where we are at the moment, some of the mistakes Ruud has made so far are unacceptable, if Cooper had played Hamza/Skipp at Newcastle, and picked Ward when mads picked up his knock, this place would be on fire. 
We are so early into his tenure it really is hard to judge but 4 games in Cooper was on the chopping block with most, and Ruud has done basically nothing to show he's an upgrade, tactically he's made some changes, but the performances have been just as bad if not worse than much of what Cooper offered up, our win against West Ham and draw against Brighton were 2 games where realistically we could have been dead and buried if they had their shooting boots on, and were somewhat fortunate to come away with 4 points from them both, is that the "new manager bounce"? 

We go into January needing at least 50m spent just on the back 4, we likely need a versatile winger who can play on both sides. Our recruitment under Glover has been relatively poor. Do we try to sign young defenders for 15-20m on lower wages and accept relegation? or do we go for some cheaper, experienced heads who will command a higher wage on a 3 year deal who we then get lumbered with? 

Sacking Cooper was inevitable, but it was absolutely mandatory that Ruud got us organised quickly and improved every position 10%, so far he hasn't even come close to that, very worrying indeed, he needs to turn this around because we now go into the Christmas games against Liverpool who are going to put 7 past us, and Man City/Villa are likely going to breeze past. 

So what do we do, gamble? or play it safe and accept our fate? Option 3 is Ruud can actually find a system that shores us up defensively, but I won't hold my breath with this circus of a back 4. 

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

2 hours ago, Lionator said:

This is a weird one, what else is he meant to do, play no midfielders at all? 

He should have gone full Martin Allen or Holloway and played 4 right backs. Oh wait, we don’t actually have more right backs…

[cruzFOX]

I think we’re in big trouble. At the min we need N’didi, mads, Ricky back asap.

[brownfox]

RUUD needs to bring in some coaches to assist as he looks a lonely figure. Don’t rate Dawson and the other one at all 

[Its11th heaven]

All this talk about RVN having no experience except he has more than Enzo had when joined. RVN has managed a whole successful season in Holland but Enzo had only had a short disastrous run of games.

 

Neither are very experienced of course but to describe RVN as a complete rookie is not correct.

[coolhandfox]

4 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

Ordinarily I'm pretty patient with managers. 

 

But sometimes you just gotta call it when you see it. He's a surgeon without ever being a doctor. He's way way under qualified for this job. 

Way more then Enzo was, where you anti him too? 

4 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

I'll ignore the bizarre Ward and Buonnotte decisions, instead highlight his other red flags;

 

His decision to replace the winks/wilf (our best players)  like for like with inferior players (Skipp, Hamza) at Newcastle and expect the same performance levels defies all logic.

Who else was he going to bring in to play DCM? 

4 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

That was the first major red flag. He surrendered the game by hanging Hamza and Skipp out to dry. 

Go on then give us your tactical genius.that would have got us though that game? 

4 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

To admit he'd done no homework on Ward (and presumably therefore no other player too) is excruciating in its ineptness and disrespects the job he's taken. 

 

The arrogance in being in Holland for his announcement appalls me. Get on a fcking 45 min flight you arrogant cvnt. What dreadful disrespect. 

How do you know it was down to him? 

 

4 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

 

I admit personally I didn't fancy him from the off. I'm not easily persuaded by a cashmere sweater. So yup, I've been dying to get rid since he's been appointed. This man is all wrong for us and it'll end up like Frank de Boer at Palace. Two more absolute whuppings and he'll be gone

Who did you want? 

[Stevosevic]

10 minutes ago, Its11th heaven said:

All this talk about RVN having no experience except he has more than Enzo had when joined. RVN has managed a whole successful season in Holland but Enzo had only had a short disastrous run of games.

 

Neither are very experienced of course but to describe RVN as a complete rookie is not correct.

Yeh I think the whole experience argument in football and managers is a bit redundant.

 

So many managers do well from their first job at big clubs and some don’t. You’ve either got it or you haven’t. 

[Paninistickers]

27 minutes ago, Its11th heaven said:

All this talk about RVN having no experience except he has more than Enzo had when joined. RVN has managed a whole successful season in Holland but Enzo had only had a short disastrous run of games.

 

Neither are very experienced of course but to describe RVN as a complete rookie is not correct.

The situation is in no way comparable. 

 

Enzo was asked to work his football theories essentially in a level below the players' standard. He was handed the highest ever wage bill, the biggest ever transfer budget and an experienced PL squad ..then asked to compete against inferior teams. It's a situation where an up and coming manager could (if they could deal with the resulting pressure) test themselves and learn on the job. Everything was stacked in his favour. 

 

 

 

 

[filthyfox]

Shouldn't be anywhere near managing in the PLif he can't see Ward is about as useless as a chocolate fireguard

[RoboFox]

“But finding a defensively capable manager – David Moyes was and is available – or allowing Van Nistelrooy to bring in his own staff would have been the priority for a serious football club.”

 

Judging by what Shearer said to guest David Moyes on TRIF live podcast episode the other day (which Moyes tellingly didn’t react to), it was insinuated that Moyes turned us down.

 

The official line from the club that he and Potter weren’t in consideration is - and always was - bollocks.

[Filbert Fireworks]

6 hours ago, Chelmofox said:

I had my reservations when the team came out Sunday afternoon. But, having to pick our 3rd keeper I can understand why he may have opted for a more defensive setup especially after the pounding from Newcastle. I love Buonanotte, but he gives the ball away a lot. Not just a few time - a lot. One of the first things Buonanotte did when he came on was stepping over the ball when passed too - immediate Wolves attack. I think Buonanotte blows hot and cold more than most of us are willing to admit. When he has been brilliant though he is a joy to watch.

 

Ruud has been dealt a sh1tty hand with Injuries. The Mads one is a killer. If Ruud is trying to get this lot organised in a certain way, i can understand why going for Iversen (himself not great anyway) might feel counterproductive if it meant changing the whole defensive shape. Ward did play the same way with his feet as Mads, and before the first calamitous goal we were looking ok. But once the Ward yips appeared it was game over.

 

Both us and Wolves were as bad as each other. The difference was the goalkeeper.  Mads is the difference. Need him back.

 

Jan window will be interesting, but history is a good indicator to what Ruud will get.

All very valid points, why pick Ward again though after a drumming the week before and his previous record with us. Red flag that one. Appreciate your thoughts on not wanting to change the defensive shape but think he kind of did that with the team selection in a way. 

[Filbert Fireworks]

1 hour ago, Paninistickers said:

The situation is in no way comparable. 

 

Enzo was asked to work his football theories essentially in a level below the players' standard. He was handed the highest ever wage bill, the biggest ever transfer budget and an experienced PL squad ..then asked to compete against inferior teams. It's a situation where an up and coming manager could (if they could deal with the resulting pressure) test themselves and learn on the job. Everything was stacked in his favour. 

 

 

 

 

Enzo was also an assistant manager with a team that had just won a treble under possibly the best manager in world football.