What grinds my gears...

[leicsmac]

6 hours ago, MattP said:

You have got to be a special kind of cnut to wear a white poppy mind.

 

The ultimate act of virtue signalling, jump into another campaign and hijack it saying "I'm better than you" - you show your respect whilst I show everyone I'm completely anti-war and only want peace.

 

Different to all those red poppy wearers who are just gagging for more war of course.

As Finn says, not sure why folks get so bent out of shape about people emphasising peace at a war memorial, seeing as you'd think most of the point of remembering those who gave their lives was so that future generations wouldn't have to get involved in something so terrible again.

 

But as time passes, the "Never Again" sentiment does seem to be getting lost, like it or not, and that is problematic.

[Guest MattP]

7 hours ago, leicsmac said:

As Finn says, not sure why folks get so bent out of shape about people emphasising peace at a war memorial, seeing as you'd think most of the point of remembering those who gave their lives was so that future generations wouldn't have to get involved in something so terrible again.

 

But as time passes, the "Never Again" sentiment does seem to be getting lost, like it or not, and that is problematic.

I've not got "bent out of shape" or what Finners described either, you can think someone else is an attention seeking twat without being triggered

 

The problem is they aren't "emphasising peace" they are virtue signalling and trying to flash to the World they are morally superior than the others. It's no coincidence it's always green party types who go around wearing them.

[Countryfox]

31 minutes ago, MattP said:

I've not got "bent out of shape" or what Finners described either, you can think someone else is an attention seeking twat without being triggered

 

The problem is they aren't "emphasising peace" they are virtue signalling and trying to flash to the World they are morally superior than the others. It's no coincidence it's always green party types who go around wearing them.

I know what you are saying Matt but at least they are showing something and have put their hands in their pocket ..  unlike others who just couldn’t give a toss.  

[Countryfox]

14 hours ago, Milo said:

Yeah - like trying to get a builder/roofer to replace a skylight...

2 have said they’ll come and quote, but have now disappeared. One came round two weeks ago, said he’d get back to us and has now also disappeared and one said he’d come round at 4 yesterday afternoon. I’m still waiting. 
 

I assume that dicking people about is part of their qualification criteria. 

Do you want a new skylight made and putting in Milo ...  and does it have to be exactly the same or perhaps slightly different and off the peg ?

[Guest MattP]

4 minutes ago, Countryfox said:

I know what you are saying Matt but at least they are showing something and have put their hands in their pocket ..  unlike others who just couldn’t give a toss.  

The problem with this is funding from the white poppy goes to the Peace Pledge Union - an organisation that supported appeasement of the Nazis and even openly campaigned for them to be given parts of Europe as a negotiation to try and stop WW2 - it's pretty insulting to the memories of those who fought against that.

 

So not only does it take money out of the pockets of genuine remembrance day charities, it funds some pretty dangerous and naive fringe groups.

[Strokes]

14 hours ago, Finnegan said:

You have to be a special kind of snowflake to feel insecure and inferior about someone wearing a symbol of peace on a war memorial day. 

It’s unnecessary one-upmanship on a day when really it’s about togetherness. I’m not going to get prissy about it but it’s just the wrong time to make that point in my opinion.

Edited 7 November 2019 by Strokes

[Finnegan]

9 minutes ago, Strokes said:

It’s unnecessary one-upmanship on a day when really it’s about togetherness. I’m not going to get prissy about it but it’s just the wrong time to make that point in my opinion.

 

But that's my point, it isn't. If you perceive it that way that is literally your insecurity. That's you being sensitive. 

 

It's unnecessary one-upmanship if the person wearing the white poppy then openly flexes some views of actual superiority, otherwise its just in your head. 

 

I'm pretty sure there's a vast amount of people that wear a red poppy, see someone wearing a white, purple or black one and either don't think anything at all or do think "we're all together in remembering, whatever the colour." 

 

If you're turning your nose up at other people's tributes, you're the one making it about division not togetherness, whether you're being smug about your white poppy or easily triggered about their black/purple/white one. 

 

TLDR: get over yourself and do you, let them do them. 

[Finnegan]

1 hour ago, MattP said:

The problem is they aren't "emphasising peace" they are virtue signalling and trying to flash to the World they are morally superior than the others. It's no coincidence it's always green party types who go around wearing them.

 

I don't know if it's comforting or extremely sad to know that, however cynical and jaded I get in life, there'll always be people worse. 

 

Smh. 

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, MattP said:

I've not got "bent out of shape" or what Finners described either, you can think someone else is an attention seeking twat without being triggered

 

The problem is they aren't "emphasising peace" they are virtue signalling and trying to flash to the World they are morally superior than the others. It's no coincidence it's always green party types who go around wearing them.

You can certainly express the opinion without being angry, yeah, it just didn't seem that way from the tone - but text isn't really good for reading tone anyway.

 

Anyhow, Finn in his reply to Strokes has pretty much said what I wanted to say.

[Strokes]

39 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

But that's my point, it isn't. If you perceive it that way that is literally your insecurity. That's you being sensitive. 

 

It's unnecessary one-upmanship if the person wearing the white poppy then openly flexes some views of actual superiority, otherwise its just in your head. 

 

I'm pretty sure there's a vast amount of people that wear a red poppy, see someone wearing a white, purple or black one and either don't think anything at all or do think "we're all together in remembering, whatever the colour." 

 

If you're turning your nose up at other people's tributes, you're the one making it about division not togetherness, whether you're being smug about your white poppy or easily triggered about their black/purple/white one. 

 

TLDR: get over yourself and do you, let them do them. 

I still disagree, I think they are making a personal statement at the wrong time.

[Finnegan]

lol

 

 

[Guest MattP]

26 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

I don't know if it's comforting or extremely sad to know that, however cynical and jaded I get in life, there'll always be people worse. 

 

Smh. 

It can be either or, it's totally upto you. I don't know why you always seem to assume people are so outraged or upset whenever they express an opinion on something.

 

Just he content in yourself though, then you'll be happy. Believe it or not I am.

[David Guiza]

1 minute ago, Finnegan said:

 

 

 

 

[Countryfox]

1 hour ago, MattP said:

The problem with this is funding from the white poppy goes to the Peace Pledge Union - an organisation that supported appeasement of the Nazis and even openly campaigned for them to be given parts of Europe as a negotiation to try and stop WW2 - it's pretty insulting to the memories of those who fought against that.

 

So not only does it take money out of the pockets of genuine remembrance day charities, it funds some pretty dangerous and naive fringe groups.

 

Didn't realise that ...

[leicsmac]

3 hours ago, MattP said:

The problem with this is funding from the white poppy goes to the Peace Pledge Union - an organisation that supported appeasement of the Nazis and even openly campaigned for them to be given parts of Europe as a negotiation to try and stop WW2 - it's pretty insulting to the memories of those who fought against that.

 

So not only does it take money out of the pockets of genuine remembrance day charities, it funds some pretty dangerous and naive fringe groups.

 

2 hours ago, Countryfox said:

 

Didn't realise that ...

The PPU were indeed advocates for appeasement in the 1930's...as were a lot of other various groups that considered what Nazi Germany was doing at the time a lesser evil to a war where millions would likely die.

 

The Holocaust and the extent of Nazi depravity found rather later of course proved that course of action to be horribly misguided...but hindsight is always 20/20.

 

(Oh, and before anyone pops up with a reference to Mosley and his band of merry blackshirts being fans of appeasement too, there's a rather important distinction: the PPU were willing to tolerate Nazi Germany as a lesser evil, the BUF wanted to imitate Nazi Germany in the UK.)

[leicsmac]

NB. I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing to think of the real enemy being war itself and those that seek to engage in it (they don't just start on their own, after all) - whatever side of whatever border they're currently on. 

[Guest MattP]

17 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

NB. I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing to think of the real enemy being war itself and those that seek to engage in it (they don't just start on their own, after all) - whatever side of whatever border they're currently on. 

It's an absolutely terrible thing if it leads to the sort of appeasement we have seen over the last 100 years in many parts of the World.

 

Like anything, try and look at the situation without any preconceptions  at all is the ideal starting point.

[leicsmac]

31 minutes ago, MattP said:

It's an absolutely terrible thing if it leads to the sort of appeasement we have seen over the last 100 years in many parts of the World.

 

Like anything, try and look at the situation without any preconceptions  at all is the ideal starting point.

....which has not an awful lot to do with my post where I rather clearly stated there was a clear problem with those who seek to engage in war because the urge to exert power over other people is too strong.

 

A logical view without preconceptions would equally view war as an asinine waste of human life given the reasons it is fought over (most of the time).

Edited 7 November 2019 by leicsmac

[LiberalFox]

The solution to war is the establishment of a stronger global community with shared liberal ideals. 

 

I don't really like how the poppy has become so etched into the establishment over recent years and only wear one if I feel obliged to. 

 

I don't see a great need any more for the poppy appeal considering the majority of the war generation have passed on now and the state should be more than capable of caring for veterans and service personnel.

[Nalis]

2 hours ago, LiberalFox said:

The solution to war is the establishment of a stronger global community with shared liberal ideals. 

 

I don't really like how the poppy has become so etched into the establishment over recent years and only wear one if I feel obliged to. 

 

I don't see a great need any more for the poppy appeal considering the majority of the war generation have passed on now and the state should be more than capable of caring for veterans and service personnel.

1  - In the nicest possible way, surely thats the worst thing to do, I like to think that the whole point of wearing a poppy because you want to and if you dont then thats fine too but I dont think you should feel like you have to wear one.

 

2 - You are rught - the state should be capable, but they arent. Sadly some of those who served in Afghanistan and Iraq arent getting as much post conflict support from the government that they should. Guess its like donating to food banks, the public shouldnt have to give anything as the government should support those in need, but it is what it unfortunately is. Thats regardless of anyone's thoughts on those conflicts in the first place.

[LiberalFox]

2 hours ago, Nalis said:

1  - In the nicest possible way, surely thats the worst thing to do, I like to think that the whole point of wearing a poppy because you want to and if you dont then thats fine too but I dont think you should feel like you have to wear one.

 

2 - You are rught - the state should be capable, but they arent. Sadly some of those who served in Afghanistan and Iraq arent getting as much post conflict support from the government that they should. Guess its like donating to food banks, the public shouldnt have to give anything as the government should support those in need, but it is what it unfortunately is. Thats regardless of anyone's thoughts on those conflicts in the first place.

Well it depends who I'm around. My Grandfather used to wear one and he served in WW2 (he died fairly recently though) also a few friends who are in the forces. Not like they're going to make a fuss about it if I didn't. Ultimately it's a small donation to a decent charity. Yeah you are right, like donating to foodbanks, or just charity in general. 

 

As a child I had a more naive view of Armistice day, I think growing up and in particular Iraq (and to a lesser extent Afghanistan) soured my opinion of the whole thing. You can watch politicians looking poe faced and the latest generation of young men to be scarred by war parading (or being paraded?) with great ceremony. It's not something I feel totally comfortable about. These soldiers at football matches, it feels like trying to advertise the military.  

[Guest MattP]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7664893/Pub-landlord-bans-non-poppy-wearers-pub.html

 

[bovril]

36 minutes ago, MattP said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7664893/Pub-landlord-bans-non-poppy-wearers-pub.html

 

Been there a few times. Excellent selection of craft beers available, and their wild garlic and mushroom risotto is to die for, honestly. The landlord is a smashing guy and even turned off the football last week because it was disturbing the board game enthusiasts who were having their monthly meeting in the lounge area. 

[Guest MattP]

5 minutes ago, bovril said:

Been there a few times. Excellent selection of craft beers available, and their wild garlic and mushroom risotto is to die for, honestly. The landlord is a smashing guy and even turned off the football last week because it was disturbing the board game enthusiasts who were having their monthly meeting in the lounge area. 

Didn't know you were from around there.

I used to stay in Bristol a lot before Cheltenham and there was cracking pub in the centre called the White Lion near the cenotaph - the landlord was the best pub host I've ever had the company of.

[StanSP]

FFS