Babylon Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 Not sure if you're referring to me there because I haven't done anything of the sort. Not exactly shied away from perpetuating the myth though. http://www.foxestalk.co.uk/forums/topic/101324-pearson-sacked/page-32#entry3463335 You can't tell 100%, that's what I was getting at. Others have claimed that you've 'proved' that Birch was saying that Cambiasso had written down something along the lines of where we could pick up points and nothing at all to do with tactics. But the quote doesn't prove that. It still leaves open the possibility that he was predicting how different tactics might work. I would say it gives a very strong indication of what he meant. Plotting out tactics, taking it to the manager etc would rarely be classed as a prediction. You know that I think, but won't admit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I don't, for one moment, think that Cambiasso was managing the team, or calling the shots, or whatever. As I've said before, I'm a big Pearson fan. Birchenall's comments are unclear, especially now people from both sides of the argument are trying to analyse them. The terms 'mapped out' and 'predicted' only came from Birchenall. Is he the greatest living exponent of the English language? Mapped out in his words could mean scribbled 'wwwwwlwdw' on the back of an envelope for all I know. I wasn't trying to upset the apple cart. Read my comments at the top of the page, don't take it personally. You were merely the tip of the iceburg and just happened to be the person I replied to. My frustration has been more towards a large number of people repeating it as fact that it was down to Cambiasso. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank to be Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I would say it gives a very strong indication of what he meant. Plotting out tactics, taking it to the manager etc would rarely be classed as a prediction. You know that I think, but won't admit it. I concede that it gives an indication and perhaps even a 'fairly strong' indication that Cambiasso was writing about where points could come from. When I first read the quote, that was my initial reaction. But if that was the case then why was was Birch so cryptic about it, why did he even bring it up? Players predicting results on a piece of paper in the canteen is hardly newsworthy. Maybe Birch was trying to tell us something without actually saying it, or maybe he was just being mischievous, I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpe's Fox Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I concede that it gives an indication and perhaps even a 'fairly strong' indication that Cambiasso was writing about where points could come from. When I first read the quote, that was my initial reaction. But if that was the case then why was was Birch so cryptic about it, why did he even bring it up? Players predicting results on a piece of paper in the canteen is hardly newsworthy. Maybe Birch was trying to tell us something without actually saying it, or maybe he was just being mischievous, I don't know. Being a bit of a tinfoil now, mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 But if that was the case then why was was Birch so cryptic about it, why did he even bring it up? Players predicting results on a piece of paper in the canteen is hardly newsworthy. Maybe Birch was trying to tell us something without actually saying it, or maybe he was just being mischievous, I don't know. I'm not sure he was cryptic, he just told a story. A story that's mildly interesting due to the nature of our survival and how unlikely it looked at that point in time. As I said, it's Birch. He's not exactly great with words. Having actually worked with him for a short period, his days are spent mostly telling stories ranging from shit to naff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Nige Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I concede that it gives an indication and perhaps even a 'fairly strong' indication that Cambiasso was writing about where points could come from. When I first read the quote, that was my initial reaction. But if that was the case then why was was Birch so cryptic about it, why did he even bring it up? Players predicting results on a piece of paper in the canteen is hardly newsworthy. Maybe Birch was trying to tell us something without actually saying it, or maybe he was just being mischievous, I don't know. The way I interpreted The Birch's comments was that he was implying the players had never given up. It could have been easy after the Spurs game to just peter out and except relegation but on the contrary there was still the belief there. Hence Cambiasso saying what in essence the most optimistic of fans were saying. "Come on lads, we've got 9 games left, 6 at home and 5 of those home games are very winnable, we can still do this" All this cryptic mumbo jumbo and conspiracy theories are bordering on the insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merchant_Banker Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 The way I interpreted The Birch's comments was that he was implying the players had never given up. It could have been easy after the Spurs game to just peter out and except relegation but on the contrary there was still the belief there. Hence Cambiasso saying what in essence the most optimistic of fans were saying. "Come on lads, we've got 9 games left, 6 at home and 5 of those home games are very winnable, we can still do this" All this cryptic mumbo jumbo and conspiracy theories are bordering on the insane. I suspect it was more than just 'Come on lads we can still do this'. Before the arrival of Cambiasso and Huth we had very little top flight experience in the club as a whole. He may have just repeated what Pearson was saying in the media, i.e. we had competed well, been close in many matches, not been hammered by anyone, but coming from someone who had been there and done it may have carried more weight. Surely this is what the two of them were brought in for though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan LCFC Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 A simple question: Is there any reliable information that NP was sacked for non-footballing reasons (erratic conduct during the season, arguing over the Bang-Cock 3 or whatever)? There has been speculation: that he was sacked due to erratic behaviour over the season and/or the "racist sex scandal", or that the owners wanted a big name or to splash the cash. But speculation is all that it was - on all sides of the argument. Many now seem to be assuming that he was sacked for non-footballing reasons. Could anyone quote a reliable or official source for this assumption? The official club statement just cited "fundamental differences of perspective", which could mean anything. In the absence of any official/reliable information, I'll continue to assume that I don't know why he was sacked or whether it was justified, a massive source of frustration in itself given his successful trajectory. As far as I'm aware, what we know is: - Despite imperfections and uncertainties about his potential, he had been a highly successful manager who was continuing to progress and who had ended the season on a high - He had been involved in 1 or 2 slightly odd bits of behaviour, which some seem to see as very important, but that I viewed as trivial and amusing - His son and 2 others were sacked (rightly, in my opinion) after a scandal - We can only speculate as to why NP himself was sacked as the club statement re. "fundamental differences of perspective" told us nothing about the source of the disagreement - We don't know whose fault (if anybody's) that disagreement was A question for those who think it reasonable for him to be sacked due to his "erratic" conduct: Would you also have sacked Clough, Ferguson and Mourinho for their well-documented erratic conduct? Or Cantona and Gascoigne? Would you have called for that argumentative, drunken depressive Churchill to be replaced by that nice, polite Neville Chamberlain? Would you have dismissed outrageous musicians from Mozart via Leadbelly, Elvis, Little Richard, the Stones, the Sex Pistols, the Libertines and Amy Winehouse....and replaced them with polite, family-friendly types like Donny Osmond and, er, Cliff Richard? I wonder if any of those taking a hard line are fans of Boris Johnson? If so, they should Google his name with "Petronella"...this is someone who might be PM in a couple of years time, and yet Pearson is unworthy to manage a football team because he makes 1 or 2 odd comments, behaves slightly oddly and has disagreed with his bosses about something unspecified? We have a winner. It's taken so far out of context it's unreal. You lot have fell for the media again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellend Sebastian Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I'm not sure he was cryptic, he just told a story. A story that's mildly interesting due to the nature of our survival and how unlikely it looked at that point in time. As I said, it's Birch. He's not exactly great with words. Having actually worked with him for a short period, his days are spent mostly telling stories ranging from shit to naff. Well he's not great at reading them. Made his pub quiz particularly difficult, as you had to translate the question before you tried to answer it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wymsey Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I genuinely believe Pearson managed the side, considering that we played the same style of play we did in the Championship under him last season. But, I can imagine that he asked advice from Cambiasso's perspective, such as how games are played at top-level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webbo Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I neither know nor care whether Cambiasso decided how to play in the last few games. I seriously doubt it though. Why does it matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueSi13 Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 So in other words, Cambiasso became the club captain in all but name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wymsey Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I neither know nor care whether Cambiasso decided how to play in the last few games. I seriously doubt it though. Why does it matter? Probably because there was a disagreement with how Pearson wanted the team to play and what certain players thought about his tactical ideas. And Cambiasso became the 'middle man' and led the team by example - unity and hunger to win. Why does it matter? This rumour might outline that Pearson's relationship/trust with others, before Cambiasso apparently 'managed' the team, had deteriorated in a sensitive part of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inckley fox Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 First of all I apologise for calling you a fool...I can understand where you are coming from a bit more than I did last night. I most definitely do not think Cambiasso was in charge, as you think some people do. I fail to see where I was 'wrong' and 'misguided' when commenting on the quote which Babylon posted. There's no need to apologise! It's fun to debate these things and I certainly wouldn't take anything personally. You should have seen the things Richard was saying about me the night before, and I enjoyed those exchanges too. It's good that you've clarified your opinion - the more sane, rational people on here the better - but there's nothing wrong with a bit of heated discussion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inckley fox Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I neither know nor care whether Cambiasso decided how to play in the last few games. I seriously doubt it though. Why does it matter? For many reasons. If it's true then it's essential we get Cambiasso back for next season, for a start and to get him coaching or managing as soon as possible. It might also lead a few people to re-evaluate their opinion of Pearson. There's every chance that, a few years down the line, we'll have another set of owners and they'll try to curry favour with the fans by bringing back Pearson, much like some chairmen have toyed with bringing back O'Neill. If, in such a scenario, nobody especially wanted him back then it would be less likely to happen. But seeing as there's no sensible reason to believe the rumour, it's all irrelevant. Were there ever to be a reason to believe it then, yes, I think it would matter. Much like anything else in history, you have to figure out what went wrong or right in the past to make the right decisions in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DANGEROUS TIGER Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 Because people are stating it as fact, it's not fact. If you map out some tactics on a piece of paper it's not a prediction is it. It's an idea. Plotting where you might pick up points, is a prediction. So lets think about what is more likely for one moment. Especially when the same people are saying that Pearson is stubborn, pig headed etc etc. We're now meant to believe from a very unclear comment, that he was no longer managing the team and that Cambiasso was. I said a couple of weeks ago, that I would not be surprised, if Cambiasso or someone else was doing Pearson's job on our winning run. It is quite irrelevant really, as it can neither be proved, nor disproved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 I said a couple of weeks ago, that I would not be surprised, if Cambiasso or someone else was doing Pearson's job on our winning run. It is quite irrelevant really, as it can neither be proved, nor disproved. Were they doing it in previous seasons as well where we had good form? Or when we played well in a decent number of games before that run? United, Arsenal, Chelsea, Arsenal again and Liverpool, and Spurs. It's crap and you know it, just another attempt to discredit him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 17 July 2015 Share Posted 17 July 2015 Were they doing it in previous seasons as well where we had good form? Or when we played well in a decent number of games before that run? United, Arsenal, Chelsea, Arsenal again and Liverpool, and Spurs. It's crap and you know it, just another attempt to discredit him. WTF, Pearson does a good job or bad job or no job at all, who fooking knows the reasons behind it. The only thing we know is that Pearson was the manager and managed us to avoid defeat, although most of the season was miserable!! I don't like Pearson, but he did his job, he kept us up, and should have been allowed to continue to manage the the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langley Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Has anyone seen this disabled? https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=-7_MNssm1Gk&app=desktop If I was Nigel I would smashed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wymsey Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Happened around a month ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sly Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Okay, so if the "truth" comes out. People will generally feel that the owners were left with no option and made the right decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webbo Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Okay, so if the "truth" comes out. People will generally feel that the owners were left with no option and made the right decision. I seriously doubt that. If Nige turns out to be the regional organiser for ISIS there'll still be some blaming the owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eblair Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Okay, so if the "truth" comes out. People will generally feel that the owners were left with no option and made the right decision. #itk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxhateram Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Possible assistant managers role (With further future responsibilities garunteed) at a bigger club than us, is talk in the managerial world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank to be Posted 21 July 2015 Share Posted 21 July 2015 Possible assistant managers role (With further future responsibilities garunteed) at a bigger club than us, is talk in the managerial world. Whoop de woo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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