Inler

[dibbdroid]

Inler is a great player, top quality. Unfortunately he has not had enough starts to gain his 'legs' in the Premier League maelstrom. He was obviously brought in on Tuesday to sit in between the two banks of four and nullify Silva and any other runners, he did a pretty good job of that. Taking the ball off the defense didn't work so much in his favour as the game was very compressed around him when he received the ball, as we invited pressure rather than trying to stroke the ball around from the back

 

Inler did get caught in possession at times but he was often looking for non-existent runs to pass to.

 

Inler needs more game time and patience, 3 starts and 2 as sub is hardly enough to judge.

[Guest Col city fan]

Inler is a great player, top quality. Unfortunately he has not had enough starts to gain his 'legs' in the Premier League maelstrom. He was obviously brought in on Tuesday to sit in between the two banks of four and nullify Silva and any other runners, he did a pretty good job of that. Taking the ball off the defense didn't work so much in his favour as the game was very compressed around him when he received the ball, as we invited pressure rather than trying to stroke the ball around from the back

Inler did get caught in possession at times but he was often looking for non-existent runs to pass to.

Inler needs more game time and patience, 3 starts and 2 as sub is hardly enough to judge.

No offence...and you could be right.

But how long does the 'need time to adapt', 'get up to speed', 'get his legs' type argument last for?

Inler is only 31 I think? (Not that old). He's been training with the squad and (presumably) been going through the same fitness regime as everyone else. He's lean and not carrying weight (fair play to him).

But for me...a 'great player' is a great player. Inler could just as easily come into this side and immediately looked 'great'. He could have been composed, assured, looked to have time on the ball etc etc.. just as easily as looking 'shaky'.

But he's not done. In the few games he's had, let's have it right, he's looked poor to average. Far from 'great'.

And it's a bloody good job the ref chose not to blow for the penalty. If he had done, and we lost one-nil, this forum would not have been as understanding re. Inler. I'm convinced of that.

Fine lines....

I'm still yet to be convinced. It will be interesting to see the side Ranieri picks v Bournemouth.

[Thracian]

My previous post got lost in the transition to the new forum update, so I'll try again:

 

I've gathered the stats on lost possession by our players against Manchester City up until Inler got subbed in the 67th minute:

 

Kanté 7 (5 in the first half, 2 in the second)

Mahrez 5 (3 in the first half, 2 in the second)

Inler 14 (6 in the first half, 8 in the second)

Drinkwater 11 (7 in the first half, 4 in the second)

Fuchs 10 (8 in the first half, 2 in the second)

Albrighton 10 (5 in each half)

Simpson 2 (both in the first half)

Schmeichel 1 (goal kick)

Vardy 3 (all in the first half)

Huth 2 (both in the second half)

 

The total amount includes astray ground passes (short & long), long balls, lost aerial duels (mishit headers) and getting bullied off the ball.

 

In the first half, pretty much all our midfielders were guilty of giving the ball away numerous times, yet where was the criticism aimed at Fuchs, Drinkwater, Albrighton or even Kanté?

Drinkwater and Fuchs were even worse than Inler in the first 45 minutes.

 

Also note that the two players with the highest total amount of in that department are two proper central midfielders of which one has just returned from injury and the other not featured in a league game for roughly two months.

 

 

I like what you've done although the game time's not irrelevent given that Drinkwater was returning from an injury and I don't recall anyone making the same excuse for King who's been a fringe player most of the season and had to cope in a two-man central midfield instead of our usual three.

Basically everyone should be ready for every game. They've got the facilities available and are having lots of football most every day.

Inler's 14 times losing possession confirms that he was "well involved" which was always accepted but an alarming vulnerability as well. And it wasn't just his losing possession under immediate pressure which I might accept and understand in the circumstances.

It was he decision-making in doing certain things at certain times and in certain places that he should never be doing as a professional footballer and yet has done in every game or cameo I've watched him.

There's a big difference in someone misplacing a forward pass under pressure (whether Inler or anyone else) and someone slow dribbling on the edge of the penalty box or making a square pass in the same place without looking and they're the sorts of mistakes Inler was making - mistakes that could easily have cost goals.

It's clear the bloke has a certain presence and the ability to break up play, to deliver a longish pass and even to shoot from distance. But it's the flaws in his game that are so alarming for such an experienced player. They smack of someone who simply doesn't recognise his limitations.....that he's slow in attacking mode, that he's not quick enough or clever enough to take people on in dangerous places (because the risks will always outweigh the gains). Nor does he seem to recognise that the intensity of English football requires vision fast, accurate passing above all things, otherwise he'll be sussed and have his pocket pinched.           

[suffolk fox]

I must be in the minority I thought he did a good job in the middle of the park breaking up Man City's play. Put in some crucial tackles and interceptions. He did get caught in possession a couple of times but the positive play he contributed outweighed the negative. Question is did he play to put him in the shop window for a January sale? We will need more squad players as the second half of the season takes its toll, so I hope he stays as his experience could prove pivotal.

[Thracian]

Inler is a great player, top quality. Unfortunately he has not had enough starts to gain his 'legs' in the Premier League maelstrom. He was obviously brought in on Tuesday to sit in between the two banks of four and nullify Silva and any other runners, he did a pretty good job of that. Taking the ball off the defense didn't work so much in his favour as the game was very compressed around him when he received the ball, as we invited pressure rather than trying to stroke the ball around from the back

 

Inler did get caught in possession at times but he was often looking for non-existent runs to pass to.

 

Inler needs more game time and patience, 3 starts and 2 as sub is hardly enough to judge.

 

Whatever the merits or otherwise of the Inler argument he's in no way a "great" player or even close. The very suggestion belittles the word and insults genuine greats like Ronaldo, Messi and so many other genuine legends down the years.

 

I was serious in saying I wouldn't want Inler in my non-league team  and, if acting as an opposing coach I'd be earmarking him as someone we might well pressure into giving us a goal.

 

The only crumb of hope is the "time" you refer to in your last sentence and whether the guy is humble enough, intelligent enough and committed enough to change at such a late stage of his career and actually improve his failings.

 

I can't answer those questions. He seems to have been motivated enough to get himself fit and he seems to have a positive attitude so perhaps it's possible.

 

My worry is that you don't make a fast player (physically or mentally) out of a slowish one and everything I've seen of Inler suggests he's too laid back for English football. There's just not enough urgency in the way he thinks, the way he reacts, his close control or his athleticism.

 

Give him time and space and he'd be fine, perhaps even constructive. But in the cauldron of action in front of his own penalty area he looks far too vulnerable to me.          

[MC Prussian]

I like what you've done although the game time's not irrelevent given that Drinkwater was returning from an injury and I don't recall anyone making the same excuse for King who's been a fringe player most of the season and had to cope in a two-man central midfield instead of our usual three.

Basically everyone should be ready for every game. They've got the facilities available and are having lots of football most every day.

Inler's 14 times losing possession confirms that he was "well involved" which was always accepted but an alarming vulnerability as well. And it wasn't just his losing possession under immediate pressure which I might accept and understand in the circumstances.

It was he decision-making in doing certain things at certain times and in certain places that he should never be doing as a professional footballer and yet has done in every game or cameo I've watched him.

There's a big difference in someone misplacing a forward pass under pressure (whether Inler or anyone else) and someone slow dribbling on the edge of the penalty box or making a square pass in the same place without looking and they're the sorts of mistakes Inler was making - mistakes that could easily have cost goals.

It's clear the bloke has a certain presence and the ability to break up play, to deliver a longish pass and even to shoot from distance. But it's the flaws in his game that are so alarming for such an experienced player. They smack of someone who simply doesn't recognise his limitations.....that he's slow in attacking mode, that he's not quick enough or clever enough to take people on in dangerous places (because the risks will always outweigh the gains). Nor does he seem to recognise that the intensity of English football requires vision fast, accurate passing above all things, otherwise he'll be sussed and have his pocket pinched.           

 

Except for the fact that the majority of his passes were actually accurate (as posted by somebody else earlier in this thread) and he was usually looking at the pass receiver. I can't see how you can classify that as a mistake if the options in front of you are limited or non-existing. Let's not forget that Manchester City were pressing hard all the way to the edge of our penalty box, crowding it.

 

At the end, he was a valuable asset locking Sterling, Silva, Agüero and even Yaya Touré out of our box which in itself is a tough ask. Maybe a bit rusty going forward and not reacting quickly enough when he was being closed down by the opposition, but that was never why he was put in that CDM role behind the four-man central midfield with Mahrez, Kanté, Drinkwater and Albrighton in the first place. He was our sweeper before our four-man backline and he completed that task rather well.

[filbertway]

No offence...and you could be right.

But how long does the 'need time to adapt', 'get up to speed', 'get his legs' type argument last for?

Inler is only 31 I think? (Not that old). He's been training with the squad and (presumably) been going through the same fitness regime as everyone else. He's lean and not carrying weight (fair play to him).

 

Probably by playing some games. You can't adapt to premier league football by not playing premier league football. I'd say if by the end of the season he's started 10-15 games and still looks no better then you can probably write him off.

 

It hasn't helped him with the fact the Kanté has come in and looked an absolute boss within about 15 seconds. He's a very decent squad player to have. I suppose with the fact we actually paid money for him people have fairly high expectations which he obviously hasn't met so far. I still think he can do a job for the squad though. He can only improve on what he has done so far as well.

MC v Thracian in an Inler v King debate. See you all on page 90.

[Thracian]

Except for the fact that the majority of his passes were actually accurate (as posted by somebody else earlier in this thread) and he was usually looking at the pass receiver. I can't see how you can classify that as a mistake if the options in front of you are limited or non-existing. Let's not forget that Manchester City were pressing hard all the way to the edge of our penalty box, crowding it.

 

At the end, he was a valuable asset locking Sterling, Silva, Agüero and even Yaya Touré out of our box which in itself is a tough ask. Maybe a bit rusty going forward and not reacting quickly enough when he was being closed down by the opposition, but that was never why he was put in that CDM role behind the four-man central midfield with Mahrez, Kanté, Drinkwater and Albrighton in the first place. He was our sweeper before our four-man backline and he completed that task rather well.

 

 

I thought the main thrust of Manchester's attacks was down the outside - and particularly their left - and was uneasy about them always having an extra man in that area and the freedom to deliver so many crosses or to work the ball in by the near post.

 

That unease only disappeared when I realised how majestically our back line was dealing with those challenges....to the point where they hardly allowed anyone a free touch. 

 

So, in truth, the back line was only partially protected. I'd actually be interested to know how often the ball got crossed or fed into our box because I thought it was a lot, both from general play and set-pieces.Enough to make Morgan a 10-rated MoM and the rest of the back line "honourable mentions" on a day when they were collectively outstanding.      

 

As for Inler's dribbling and decision-making in more central areas, there are times when "away" is the right reaction and delay, indecision or the wrong decision is asking for disaster.     

[Guest Col city fan]

Probably by playing some games. You can't adapt to premier league football by not playing premier league football. I'd say if by the end of the season he's started 10-15 games and still looks no better then you can probably write him off.

 

It hasn't helped him with the fact the Kanté has come in and looked an absolute boss within about 15 seconds. He's a very decent squad player to have. I suppose with the fact we actually paid money for him people have fairly high expectations which he obviously hasn't met so far. I still think he can do a job for the squad though. He can only improve on what he has done so far as well.

MC v Thracian in an Inler v King debate. See you all on page 90.

 

Make no  mistake. MC will find some way to make Inler 'world class'

And Thrac will get King into the debate at some point.

:xmastongue:

[MC Prussian]

Make no  mistake. MC will find some way to make Inler 'world class'

And Thrac will get King into the debate at some point.

:xmastongue:

 

And you will find a way of spoiling it for everyone, buddy.

[Babylon]

My previous post got lost in the transition to the new forum update, so I'll try again:

I've gathered the stats on lost possession by our players against Manchester City up until Inler got subbed in the 67th minute:

Kanté 7 (5 in the first half, 2 in the second)

Mahrez 5 (3 in the first half, 2 in the second)

Inler 14 (6 in the first half, 8 in the second)

Drinkwater 11 (7 in the first half, 4 in the second)

Fuchs 10 (8 in the first half, 2 in the second)

Albrighton 10 (5 in each half)

Simpson 2 (both in the first half)

Schmeichel 1 (goal kick)

Vardy 3 (all in the first half)

Huth 2 (both in the second half)

The total amount includes astray ground passes (short & long), long balls, lost aerial duels (mishit headers) and getting bullied off the ball.

In the first half, pretty much all our midfielders were guilty of giving the ball away numerous times, yet where was the criticism aimed at Fuchs, Drinkwater, Albrighton or even Kanté?

Drinkwater and Fuchs were even worse than Inler in the first 45 minutes.

Also note that the two players with the highest total amount in that department are two proper central midfielders of which one has just returned from injury and the other not featured in a league game for roughly two months.

Backs up what I thought I saw, he was fine first half, Second half he lost the ball several times in succession and got subbed, rightly so, but that could have been fatigue as he's not played much football at all.

[Thracian]

Haha I apologise for warming to what has been a good debate with you lot - and not for the first time. Now I must about some work. If only to give you all some peace. Happy New Year everyone - and stay safe. :xmassmile:   

[The Guvnor]

Good without the ball last night. Not so good with the ball last night. Wasn't the worst performance I've ever seen he was certainly no worse than drinkwater. Cannot understand why he's getting slated so badly.

 

I am mustard without the ball, I have been told a mixture of Messi and Ronaldo, on the ball however I'm pretty sh^t, my Achilles heel I'm afraid. 

[Izzy]

Bottom line is, he's a good player (not great) but probably doesn't suit our formation or dynamic, fast paced style of play. I like his attitude and professionalism but maybe we should all hold our hands up and admit 'square peg in a round hole' on this signing. I'm sure he'll do well somewhere else and I was desperate for him to do well for us (same for Kram) but sometimes maybe we have to acknowledge that not every incoming transfer will pay off. Inler, Benny and Kram may not have worked (still might?) where as Kante, Fuchs and Huth for example have all paid off spectacularly.

You win some, you lose some I reckon.

[Medwayfox]

Go check out on Youtube how many of our chances originated from Cambiasso and years ago from Garry Parker in that central midfield role. You need a good touch, quick mind and accurate short and long passes. Not sure Inler possesses these qualities - but to be fair I won't write him off just yet as everyone deserves a fair chance (unless you're Kramaric when it seems you deserve next to no chance!)

  

[st albans fox]

Our tactic of playing Inler in front of the back 4 was to force citeh to attack down the flanks rather than breaking through the centre with their quick 1-2 's

I expect we will see this tactic employed at the Emirates and possibly against all the top teams in the second half of the season. Asking teams to cross the ball in from wide is the best way we have of defending against these sides. with Fuchs and Simpson at full back, we have more chance of stopping them getting in behind inside close enough to our box to pick out a man.

rainieri may convince GI not to go elsewhere on the basis he will get 10 starts between now and the end of the season. once he is more match fit, he will make a better sub to come on and help close out games when nec.

[Guest Col city fan]

And you will find a way of spoiling it for everyone, buddy.

 

Nope, I'll simply point out where you are showing clear bias...

Show some objectivity and I'll listen a little more

Buddy

[foxes21]

I thought Inlers positioning was good when their wingers got into the box and tried to cut it back a few times.

[theessexfox]

He's probably not suited to the games like Bournemouth, Villa, Everton, etc when we're pressing high and looking to be on the front foot. Against City he was picked as we were set up to sit in, soak up pressure, and cut off supply to Silva and De Bruyne dropping in between the lines, as Claudio said. He did very well in helping shut Silva, De Bruyne and Aguero out of the game, especially first half. Some of his distribution was poor, though its harder in his position when he usually gets the ball and has two CMs about 5 yards away from him and a small striker who is marked by two CBs. He wasn't outstanding but he did his job fairly well, though looked a bit of a liability on the ball in our own half as the second half went on, probably why Claudio pulled him off.

[simon789us]

Whatever the merits or otherwise of the Inler argument he's in no way a "great" player or even close. The very suggestion belittles the word and insults genuine greats like Ronaldo, Messi and so many other genuine legends down the years.

I was serious in saying I wouldn't want Inler in my non-league team and, if acting as an opposing coach I'd be earmarking him as someone we might well pressure into giving us a goal.

The only crumb of hope is the "time" you refer to in your last sentence and whether the guy is humble enough, intelligent enough and committed enough to change at such a late stage of his career and actually improve his failings.

I can't answer those questions. He seems to have been motivated enough to get himself fit and he seems to have a positive attitude so perhaps it's possible.

My worry is that you don't make a fast player (physically or mentally) out of a slowish one and everything I've seen of Inler suggests he's too laid back for English football. There's just not enough urgency in the way he thinks, the way he reacts, his close control or his athleticism.

Give him time and space and he'd be fine, perhaps even constructive. But in the cauldron of action in front of his own penalty area he looks far too vulnerable to me.

Agree with this however good a player he is he is not suited to the premier league maybe if he was a little more skillful so he could work space for himself but he ain't so it's a no from me

[bigbiff]

O my god every one that watched the same game as me will/should say the same thing about him. Good off the ball, goodish defending. Abit poo with the ball ie if he only passed simple balls the way he faced and didnt try to playmake, he would have looked good. But he didnt and lost the ball from his feet when he had time. End of

[MC Prussian]

Whatever the merits or otherwise of the Inler argument he's in no way a "great" player or even close. The very suggestion belittles the word and insults genuine greats like Ronaldo, Messi and so many other genuine legends down the years.

 

I was serious in saying I wouldn't want Inler in my non-league team  and, if acting as an opposing coach I'd be earmarking him as someone we might well pressure into giving us a goal.

 

The only crumb of hope is the "time" you refer to in your last sentence and whether the guy is humble enough, intelligent enough and committed enough to change at such a late stage of his career and actually improve his failings.

 

I can't answer those questions. He seems to have been motivated enough to get himself fit and he seems to have a positive attitude so perhaps it's possible.

 

My worry is that you don't make a fast player (physically or mentally) out of a slowish one and everything I've seen of Inler suggests he's too laid back for English football. There's just not enough urgency in the way he thinks, the way he reacts, his close control or his athleticism.

 

Give him time and space and he'd be fine, perhaps even constructive. But in the cauldron of action in front of his own penalty area he looks far too vulnerable to me.          

 

I don't know about you - but who's started to compare Gökhan Inler to great (forward) players like Ronaldo or Messi in two separate sentences? Tony, you're having a 'mare there! Just some more ludicrous fishing on your behalf and you should be exposed for that.

 

Bottom line is - even the greatest players needed time to adjust to a new club, a new surrounding and were at the mercy of their respective manager in order to get more minutes on the pitch.

We've got a tough January/February schedule ahead and I think Inler will get more time on the pitch as the season progresses, also keeping cup games in mind. We can't afford to send out the same starting XI all the time, it'll wear everyone down and could potentially endanger our push for a Top Four spot.

 

He may be slow, but keep in mind most players tend to lose speed as they grow older and (defensive) central midfielders don't necessarily need to be fast, anyway. Positioning and movement should make up for that.

As already mentioned in the Andy King thread, let's get back to this discussion once Kanté or Drinkwater have hit 31 years of age and amassed the same or a similar amount of games in total.

[Izzy]

probably why Claudio pulled him off.

An extra bonus on top of his £40k a week

[foxes21]

In time Claudio will perfect the formation we used against Man City and continue our counter attacking style against the big teams with this formation

[Guest Col city fan]

An extra bonus on top of his £40k a week