Shakespeare future decided next week - Percy

[volpeazzurro]

2 hours ago, Thracian said:

 

 

Haha I don't know about Leicester's problems but it's clear that I was altogether too kind, reasonable and understanding as a coach and manager.

A bit soft really. You make me wish I'd had a mentor to put me straight on the issue. 

 

That said I don't remember claiming Spurs were the best team in the League and the fact that Spurs had three players out ignores another fact that they have far better depth in their squad than we do and better replacements.

 

The team they fielded was far superior to ours on the night because we had no worthwhile replacements for several key men as was apparent to me and many others from way back to our last close season at least. I've given it consideration and can't see that was Shakespeare's fault in any way. 

 

Yes, I believe our owners gave him some incentive to save our season but there was no changing the squad. He had to work with what he had and as far as I'm aware he's not actually a member of the Magic Circle.  

 

As a coach I did come up with one or two ways we might at least have salvaged a point against Spurs but then you did make a point about taking pride in what we do - and I have to admit my ways were unjustly illegal and would have resulted in the football authorities' equivalent of corporal punishment (which I'd already fallen foul of in my own career, easy going as I was).          

 

I'm not sure we raised our barrier last year. Yes, we won the Premiership title but then seemed blinded by the light of it because we couldn't seem to see beyond the end of our own pre-season publicity.

 

First our normally solidly sensible pre-season was entirely forgotten and replaced by a promotional circus that focused more on weather Mahrez was joining Arsenal as much as any football.           

 

Secondly we announced several new signings who had no proper opportunity to integrate into our team at all. It was like a pre-season own goal or two own goals when we discovered the contribution the combined force of those players would make to our abyssmal attempt to wear the crown of Premiership champions. 

 

Soft as you think me, I actually made a veiled hint that Ranieri should be sacked last September when someone asked what player I'd most like us to sign and I said, forget about a player, I'd like Klopp.

 

I suppose I was thinking - as you mentioned - about being at the right end of the table but, not being you, I didn't want to shout too loudly about the fact we were getting beaten and I didn't feel too good about it.

 

I  knew about being beaten as a football manager. There was an earlier draw but the defeat came in my third season - and about 80-odd matches into my career. Very quickly I decided team sports weren't for me - too many things I couldn't control - and headed for the squash court instead, enjoying countless storybook adventures and eventually getting proprietorship of my own club.

 

We won numerous titles and honours and probably lost fewer than 30 games in eight seasons which was not too bad seeing that related to all the 30-odd  teams we ran at what was only a village club when all said and done. The defeats still rankled as inexplicable but they served to offer a lesson in humility.   

 .    

In the end a court decided i shouldn't have sacked a thief on the spot so I closed the club because someone else impressed their authority on my fortress.

 

The legals were right of course. But what I should have done would have cost all the pride I had and left me villified on the front pages of every newspaper in the land.

 

So the club - among the top 25 in Britain by then - was demolished. Pride again I guess. Refusing to accept what was unacceptable to me.

 

Much the same as you really - and equally wrong in retrospect.

 

Cos when we refuse to accept reality we only hurt ourselves. I don't think that way anymore. I know (as someone else said on the subject) that shit happens sometimes. And when the Spurs game ended I clapped my team off and headed off home to await the Bournemouth game. Some of those players won a Premiership title and flew our flag higher than ever before in the Champions League. I'll owe em for a lifetime. 

        

    

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, we have to accept reality but...I still think that we shouldn't accept what is unacceptable to ourselves. When everyone else goes home or their separate ways,  ourself is all we have to live with and look in the mirror at. Heavy.

[Thracian]

25 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Yes, we have to accept reality but...I still think that we shouldn't accept what is unacceptable to ourselves. When everyone else goes home or their separate ways,  ourself is all we have to live with and look in the mirror at. Heavy.

Haha, wait til you get to my age - you can't find a decent mirror anywhere!      

[WigstonWanderer]

I'd still like Shakey to get the gig, but I do wonder, from his point of view whether he really wants to learn the finer points of football management in the glare of the Premier League. Perhaps he would be better off to go to a less high profile Championship club for now. I'm sure he wouldn't have any problem finding one.

[volpeazzurro]

8 hours ago, Thracian said:

Haha, wait til you get to my age - you can't find a decent mirror anywhere!      

I  too am fast approaching the wrinkly stage! Which team was it you managed? 

[Tielemans63]

I've got to be honest, I don't think he's the right man for the job and I thought that before the 1-6. I've praised him because I think he's done a magnificent job and whilst that sounds massively contradictory I've just got this nagging feeling that he isn't going to be a long term solution. I still feel that we're in that post-sacking bounce.

 

Admittedly, I'm going purely on gut feeling here but I just don't think he's a number one or the man to oversee what is going to be a critical summer transfer window (bigger than last year's IMHO). I can see a scenario where he gets a 1 or 2 year deal but he's gone by this time next year. 

 

I realise that that is harsh and pretty disloyal but I just think it's a bigger gamble to give him the top job than some seem to think it is. I just feel he's an excellent number 2 and not a manager. I genuinely mean it when I say I hope he proves me completely wrong and makes me look a right tit. I'll happily eat humble pie if he does.

[Moksky]

16 hours ago, HighPeakFox said:

Is it you that's embarrassed, or the team that should be embarrassed?

Both , not saying that most fans care any less the myself, but how can anyone not be embarrassed by getting smashed 6-1 at home. We will get over it, but that type of thing should not be happening. If the team are not embarrassed and show a response today, then they are not worthy of their huge salaries that we all contribute towards. I demand better from our Champions. I expect better. I don't mind losing, but it's the manner of defeat. 

 

Lets not get too hung on the word embarrassed, from my perspective I could use a number of words, disappointed, hurt.

 

from the team perspective, ashamed, amateur, pathetic, weak 

 

todays another day, we go again

 

on the matter of Shakespeare, today will be quite pivotal in his chances of getting the job, some may disagree that he should get the job regardless of today's result, however are they honestly thinking that due to the upheaval of Ranieris dismissal and what we have been through, it better to stick to what we've got? We were all banging on about his first 6 games, look at the last 6 results, and more importantly some of the performances in those games. The blueprint of our counter attacking style is the question , whether another upheaval , a potential risk of change of style in another manager is the question. 

 

Lets face facts, Mahrez, love him or loathe him, Schmiechel are both off. That 3 out of the spine of the title winning side gone. 2 have been successive Prem players of the season. We have to replace them with quality. Not potential future players, but players who can hit the ground running. Can Shakespeare attract those? Will players come to play for him? 

 

Repeat, I am not against him getting the job, but just because players responded when he took over, that honeymoon period is truly well and over. I wil point out that if players can't get themselves up for CL games in between his first 6 league fixtures, then there is something wrong. Levels have dipped since. 

 

 

[Wymsey]

Just now, Moksky said:

Both , not saying that most fans care any less the myself, but how can anyone not be embarrassed by getting smashed 6-1 at home. We will get over it, but that type of thing should not be happening. If the team are not embarrassed and show a response today, then they are not worthy of their huge salaries that we all contribute towards. I demand better from our Champions. I expect better. I don't mind losing, but it's the manner of defeat. 

 

Lets not get too hung on the word embarrassed, from my perspective I could use a number of words, disappointed, hurt.

 

from the team perspective, ashamed, amateur, pathetic, weak 

 

todays another day, we go again

 

on the matter of Shakespeare, today will be quite pivotal in his chances of getting the job, some may disagree that he should get the job regardless of today's result, however are they honestly thinking that due to the upheaval of Ranieris dismissal and what we have been through, it better to stick to what we've got? We were all banging on about his first 6 games, look at the last 6 results, and more importantly some of the performances in those games. The blueprint of our counter attacking style is the question , whether another upheaval , a potential risk of change of style in another manager is the question. 

 

Lets face facts, Mahrez, love him or loathe him, Schmiechel are both off. That 3 out of the spine of the title winning side gone. 2 have been successive Prem players of the season. We have to replace them with quality. Not potential future players, but players who can hit the ground running. Can Shakespeare attract those? Will players come to play for him? 

 

Repeat, I am not against him getting the job, but just because players responded when he took over, that honeymoon period is truly well and over. I wil point out that if players can't get themselves up for CL games in between his first 6 league fixtures, then there is something wrong. Levels have dipped since. 

 

 

Is that based on what your club sources are telling you, or just your gut instinct?

[Moksky]

4 minutes ago, Wymeswold fox said:

Is that based on what your club sources are telling you, or just your gut instinct?

Not club sources, Mahrez has not hidden the fact that he would give 1 more season, his wife was very persuasive over this last summer. His agent is in full flow. 

 

Schmiechel , Idont know whether this has been posted on FT , but he got rid of agent and recently employed another. Tells you everything. Why would you do that after agreeing a new lucrative contract . They both want CL football again. 

[HybridFox]

Huge game for him today I feel. Gotta end the season on a high and in the top half

[Tuna]

7 minutes ago, Moksky said:

Not club sources, Mahrez has not hidden the fact that he would give 1 more season, his wife was very persuasive over this last summer. His agent is in full flow. 

 

Schmiechel , Idont know whether this has been posted on FT , but he got rid of agent and recently employed another. Tells you everything. Why would you do that after agreeing a new lucrative contract . They both want CL football again. 

As much as I hate to see them go, Vardy is the one I'd be devastated at losing. He's our talisman and goalscorer.

 

Kasper is an excellent keeper but Begovic is going from Chelsea in the summer and would be an able replacement, Gray can take Mahrez's place.

 

They've earned moves for all they've done for the club, yes Mahrez has had a crap season but lets look at his record over the last 3 years and all the special moments he delivered for us.

 

Lets give them a great send off today. If I'm selfish though I'd like to see Riyad go abroad - it would be heartbreaking seeing him play against us !

[Moksky]

14 hours ago, Thracian said:

 

 

Haha I don't know about Leicester's problems but it's clear that I was altogether too kind, reasonable and understanding as a coach and manager.

A bit soft really. You make me wish I'd had a mentor to put me straight on the issue. 

 

That said I don't remember claiming Spurs were the best team in the League and the fact that Spurs had three players out ignores another fact that they have far better depth in their squad than we do and better replacements.

 

The team they fielded was far superior to ours on the night because we had no worthwhile replacements for several key men as was apparent to me and many others from way back to our last close season at least. I've given it consideration and can't see that was Shakespeare's fault in any way. 

 

Yes, I believe our owners gave him some incentive to save our season but there was no changing the squad. He had to work with what he had and as far as I'm aware he's not actually a member of the Magic Circle.  

 

As a coach I did come up with one or two ways we might at least have salvaged a point against Spurs but then you did make a point about taking pride in what we do - and I have to admit my ways were unjustly illegal and would have resulted in the football authorities' equivalent of corporal punishment (which I'd already fallen foul of in my own career, easy going as I was).          

 

I'm not sure we raised our barrier last year. Yes, we won the Premiership title but then seemed blinded by the light of it because we couldn't seem to see beyond the end of our own pre-season publicity.

 

First our normally solidly sensible pre-season was entirely forgotten and replaced by a promotional circus that focused more on whether Mahrez was joining Arsenal as much as any football.           

 

Secondly we announced several new signings who had no proper opportunity to integrate into our team at all. It was like a pre-season own goal or two own goals when we discovered the contribution the combined force of those players would make to our abyssmal attempt to wear the crown of Premiership champions. 

 

Soft as you think me, I actually made a veiled hint that Ranieri should be sacked last September when someone asked what player I'd most like us to sign and I said, forget about a player, I'd like Klopp.

 

I suppose I was thinking - as you mentioned - about being at the right end of the table but, not being you, I didn't want to shout too loudly about the fact we were getting beaten and I didn't feel too good about it.

 

I  knew about being beaten as a football manager. There was an earlier draw but the first defeat came in my third season - and about 80-odd matches into my career. Very quickly I decided team sports weren't for me - too many things I couldn't control - and headed for the squash court instead, enjoying countless storybook adventures and eventually getting proprietorship of my own club.

 

We won numerous titles and honours and probably lost fewer than 30 games in eight seasons which was not too bad seeing that related to all the 30-odd  teams we ran at what was only a village club when all said and done. The defeats still rankled as inexplicable but they served to offer a lesson in humility.   

 .    

In the end a court decided i shouldn't have sacked a thief on the spot so I closed the club because someone else impressed their authority on my fortress.

 

The legals were right of course. But what I should have done would have cost all the pride I had and left me villified on the front pages of every newspaper in the land.

 

So the club - among the top 25 in Britain by then - was demolished. Pride again I guess. Refusing to accept what was unacceptable to me.

 

Much the same as you really - and equally wrong in retrospect.

 

Cos when we refuse to accept reality we only hurt ourselves. I don't think that way anymore. I know (as someone else said on the subject) that shit happens sometimes. And when the Spurs game ended I clapped my team off and headed off home to await the Bournemouth game. Some of those players won a Premiership title and flew our flag higher than ever before in the Champions League. I'll owe em for a lifetime. 

        

    

 

 

 

 

 

I acknowledge that we got beat 6-1 , but I am not accepting it . Never. Yes shit happens, but 6-1 was avoidable and the manner of it totally avoidable. The signs are there that the decline is in full swing if we continue in the same it will be a rapid one. 

 

The management and and team have standards, the fans expect and have standards, accept defeat , yes, smashed 6-1 at home no . I guess by reading your posts, you are older then myself, and perhaps don't get too wound up it all really. 

For me that's the difference between winners and losers, the reason why Germans win penalty shoot outs and England don't, people accept defeat too easily,  it's the mentality. 

[Wymsey]

@Moksky, do you feel Shakespeare will stay as manager or go back as number two?

I personally think it's still 50-50 and could go either way.

[Dr The Singh]

Just now, Wymeswold fox said:

@Moksky, do you feel Shakespeare will stay as manager or go back to number two?

I personally think it's still 50-50 and go either way.

He won't go for a number 2

[RODNEY FERNIO]

I think they need to make a statement on way or the other pretty quickly .. this a big summer ahead.

If the worse situation transpires and there is a significant player exodus that money needs to be reinvested wisely

and before the end of August transfer deadline.

So say Mahrez £35m, Kasper £35m, Musa £8m , Gray £10m, Slimani £25m, Ulluoa £7m, James £7m,

Mendy £8m, Lawrence £5m, Chilwell £10m .... plus say another £50m from the champions league adventure and retaining premier league

status ... this would give a transfer kitty of around £200 million  which should comfortably give us a good enough

squad to be competitive next season. 

[Moksky]

2 minutes ago, Wymeswold fox said:

@Moksky, do you feel Shakespeare will stay as manager or go back as number two?

I personally think it's still 50-50 and could go either way.

If I could give you a concrete fact I would, but on my personal hunch, I would say no. Saying that I will try to find out. 

[stevelcfc]

Give him the job asap after today's game, if it's not already done. My concerns are with Macia and the recruitment team not shakey. Let's not forget he's transformed us on his own with only Mike Stowell and Matty Reeves stepping up to support in any capacity. Get some good coaches in with him next season, build up the science and psychology departments again and we will fly.

[Moksky]

3 minutes ago, RODNEY FERNIO said:

I think they need to make a statement on way or the other pretty quickly .. this a big summer ahead.

If the worse situation transpires and there is a significant player exodus that money needs to be reinvested wisely

and before the end of August transfer deadline.

So say Mahrez £35m, Kasper £35m, Musa £8m , Gray £10m, Slimani £25m, Ulluoa £7m, James £7m,

Mendy £8m, Lawrence £5m, Chilwell £10m .... plus say another £50m from the champions league adventure and retaining premier league

status ... this would give a transfer kitty of around £200 million  which should comfortably give us a good enough

squad to be competitive next season. 

Blimey we will have no left. 

 

We earned £66 million from CL this season, plus what ever we earned on home match days. That is a fact. 

[Moksky]

1 minute ago, stevelcfc said:

Give him the job asap after today's game, if it's not already done. My concerns are with Macia and the recruitment team not shakey. Let's not forget he's transformed us on his own with only Mike Stowell and Matty Reeves stepping up to support in any capacity. Get some good coaches in with him next season, build up the science and psychology departments again and we will fly.

And if we get beat again with a poor display? 

[Babylon]

He'll do a fine job as manager in terms of league position for a couple of seasons, the issue we have is when the current crop of players come to the end of their time here.

 

The question marks are there over his team building (not just over his but the post Walsh recruitment team). Can see see us through that transitional period where slowly but surely the players he's known for years need transitioning out and others bringing in bit by bit.

 

He can get the lads playing and they will play for him, we've seen enough of that already.

 

There are no worries about bringing players in, they move for money and to bigger things, very seldom for managers.

[smudger63]

4 hours ago, Paddy. said:

I've got to be honest, I don't think he's the right man for the job and I thought that before the 1-6. I've praised him because I think he's done a magnificent job and whilst that sounds massively contradictory I've just got this nagging feeling that he isn't going to be a long term solution. I still feel that we're in that post-sacking bounce.

 

Admittedly, I'm going purely on gut feeling here but I just don't think he's a number one or the man to oversee what is going to be a critical summer transfer window (bigger than last year's IMHO). I can see a scenario where he gets a 1 or 2 year deal but he's gone by this time next year. 

 

I realise that that is harsh and pretty disloyal but I just think it's a bigger gamble to give him the top job than some seem to think it is. I just feel he's an excellent number 2 and not a manager. I genuinely mean it when I say I hope he proves me completely wrong and makes me look a right tit. I'll happily eat humble pie if he does.

You`ve just summed up my own feelings exactly.

 

[sishades]

On 5/18/2017 at 00:37, Jattdogg said:

Realistically we should be aiming for top 10 at the minimum (any less  is failure) with a real drive to finish 6th to 8th next season.

In the fourty years of being a city fan this has only ever happened once. What makes you think that his can happen twice in in three years?

[surrifox]

I'm a lot confident he will get the job now . I've thought all along the owners would want a name and that leaves CS out in the cold unless they go some sort of New Football Director route with CS just taking care of the training and team preparation 

[whetstonefox]

He may surprise everyone by saying he doesn't want to be a manager, unlikely given the rewards , but he be happy going back as Pearsons number 2 at Middlesbrough, if and when that happens.

 

i imagine we'll know the clubs plans within the next 24 hours, either officially or off the record

[midland_red]

22 hours ago, Wymeswold fox said:

It's rather unlikely he'll come back.

 

He's in his 60's and he mentioned one of the reasons he went to Everton was to be more closer to his family.

So he did. I never believed it though, I was convinced there was more to it than that

[Babylon]

Why do people keep going on about him spending money and over seeing the transfer window. He's a small cog in that machine, the targets are already chosen, the recruitment team have most of the say now. Whether it's him or someone else, they will have to fit into OUR system and not is fitting around them.