Thoughts on Dyche?

[norwichfox]

1 minute ago, STUHILL said:

Bit unfair. He has only ever been tasked with that for one club: Burnley. 

 

He is not yet a Sam Allardyce figure who is known for playing dull football no matter the club or budget. 

 

Dyche with genuine Premier League players and ambitious owners, might become a lot more than a survival specialist. 

I just hope that it isn't with our club that he finds out that he isn't more than or even a survival specialist. We don't need a survival specialist, we want a manager capable of lifting us into the "European Slots". We are only 8 games into the season.

[Babylon]

15 minutes ago, pmcla26 said:

It worked pretty well for us when Ranieri was here.....

Didn't say it didn't and I don't particularly have an issue doing it when it's needed.

 

This is completely digressing from the original point, I have no issue with Dyche, he's been someone I've championed on here before.

 

The point was about those who called us negative but bummed Burnleys results.

[STUHILL]

Just now, norwichfox said:

I just hope that it isn't with our club that he finds out that he isn't more than or even a survival specialist. We don't need a survival specialist, we want a manager capable of lifting us into the "European Slots". We are only 8 games into the season.

True, I'm just conscious of which Managers are available and would actually want to join us.. It really does seem to be slim pickings. Of course as fans, we see this club behind blue tinted specs and think we could attract someone like Blanc if only we pay them enough... Reality, as it always has been, is probably quite different. 

 

Dyche is favourite (ignoring Coleman fave odds on some!) and I think a positive is that he is young in manager terms and still evolving and has had a successful spell at a club that really is made up of Championship players. That is not something to be sniffed at. He has also probably achieved that by the only way possible, and that is stifling the opposition and being incredibly well organised. 

 

At Leicester, he has a step up in term of players, and we just don't know what that could mean. I'm trying to sway to optimism here! 

[STUHILL]

9 minutes ago, norwichfox said:

I just hope that it isn't with our club that he finds out that he isn't more than or even a survival specialist. We don't need a survival specialist, we want a manager capable of lifting us into the "European Slots". We are only 8 games into the season.

Name a manager you are confident of lifting us to the "European slots" who a) is available b) would genuinely consider joining us*

 

*blue tinted specs need to be removed for this. 

[norwichfox]

3 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

Name a manager you are confident of lifting us to the "European slots" who a) is available b) would genuinely consider joining us*

 

*blue tinted specs need to be removed for this. 

I'll need a great deal of money to impart that information.....have a word with my agent 

[MPH]

20 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

Bit unfair. He has only ever been tasked with that for one club: Burnley. 

 

He is not yet a Sam Allardyce figure who is known for playing dull football no matter the club or budget. 

 

Dyche with genuine Premier League players and ambitious owners, might become a lot more than a survival specialist. 

 

 

 

He might also be found out  for being a one trick pony....

[STUHILL]

1 minute ago, pmcla26 said:

If you look at it I don't really see why Dyche would stay at Burnley if we came in for him... 

 

• Bigger Wages 

• Closer to his family 

• Step up in facilities 

• Better players to work with 

• Better Sports Science team 

• Bigger Budget which he has spoken about many times how he would like it

I do think if the owners go for him, which I think they may have to once they realise that managers like Ancelotti/Blanc have 0 interest in joining us, then Dyche will very likely join us. It really does tick so many boxes for him and I still think even with our current positions, he would still feel Leicester would finish above Burnley and of course our future seems a lot brighter with our resources etc. 

[Clever Fox]

11 minutes ago, orangecity23 said:

We've got 3 fit central midfielders, of which King is one. You can complain about King starting, or not having a 3, but complaining about both simultaneously is just daft. There is literally no one else who could play there, unless you start playing people out of position.

Firstly as a Manager, you have to make the best use of the Players available. That doesn't me you will get the result you want. Sometimes you have to think outside the Box or use Players in different positions, even playing some of the under 23s.

I'm sorry but Kings bottle has gone, He offers us absolutely nothing, and shouldn't be picked,  No matter how much anyone likes him. I don't believe we only have 3 players for midfield. He could have moved Maguire into Midfield or played Chilwell there. Both are decent on the Ball and will put in a tackle. Or we could have given someone a chance from the 23s. There are always alternatives but Shaky didn't seem to do anything. Just picking pretty much the same team and expecting a different result. He neither set us up to defend or attack. The other thing I've noticed also is that our fitness levels seemed to have dropped or maybe it was just the players losing interest. even Albrighton has looked sluggish this season. While he's not altogether to blame for our demise he was the Manager and as is tradition has to carry the can for the performances.

[polarbear]

5 minutes ago, Clever Fox said:

Firstly as a Manager, you have to make the best use of the Players available. That doesn't me you will get the result you want. Sometimes you have to think outside the Box or use Players in different positions, even playing some of the under 23s.

I'm sorry but Kings bottle has gone, He offers us absolutely nothing, and shouldn't be picked,  No matter how much anyone likes him. I don't believe we only have 3 players for midfield. He could have moved Maguire into Midfield or played Chilwell there. Both are decent on the Ball and will put in a tackle. Or we could have given someone a chance from the 23s. There are always alternatives but Shaky didn't seem to do anything. Just picking pretty much the same team and expecting a different result. He neither set us up to defend or attack. The other thing I've noticed also is that our fitness levels seemed to have dropped or maybe it was just the players losing interest. even Albrighton has looked sluggish this season. While he's not altogether to blame for our demise he was the Manager and as is tradition has to carry the can for the performances.

or Daniel amarteys having a party?

[STUHILL]

9 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

 

 

He might also be found out  for being a one trick pony....

True. So at worst we get a Sam Allardyce MKII who keeps us up. If he can keep that dross Burnley up, then he can damn well keep us up. 

 

Just to be clear.. Dyche is not my first choice! He is just emerging as one of the best candidates out of those being linked and would actually consider us.

 

I really would like to hear people's suggestions for better alternatives??

 

Rafa - Won't leave Newcastle for us.

Ancelotti - Ha!

Blanc - USA bound and probably another Ha!

Silva - Why would he leave Watford riding high and after only 5 months in.

O'Neil - Never coming back here and tied up with ROI.

Pearson - Already ruled out.

Tuchel - Ruled himself out.

Mancini - Ruled himself out.

 

That leaves us with Pardew, Coleman and Dyche who have actually been linked...  Howe maybe?  

 

PLEASE suggest a TOP manager who is available and would want to come here? Really not as easy as throwing money at them and don't we want someone who genuinely wants to be here too and is excited to get stuck in! 

[kingfox]

Right now I'd put him top of my preferred list.

 

He's got the best out of a very average looking side, last season they were all about their home form, he made Turf Moor a fortress and that's what kept Burnley up. This season when I'm sure many listed them as relegation candidates, so far they've started extremely well, their away form speaks for itself.

 

What I'm sure he'll bring is solidity, he doesn't play an eye catching brand of football; however you can bet this team would work far harder than they have been doing recently.

 

Like him or not he's a manager who gets results, the only problem I'd have is that would he be too similar to what we've already had, would that be a good thing?

 

 

[Monsell1976]

Doesn’t excite me, but knows the league, but whoever comes in has to be a strong character, as whispers in the press and elsewhere appears to suggest the players have to much influence.

Whilst not an exciting prospect, he knows the league, done well on a budget, but will he be a Pearson mark 2, some will love that on here, other won’t, I’m mean that in the sense, he will have limitations, can he take us forward etc.

 Don’t really care what he’s like, as long as he gets these players organised, and gets results, if he gets the job.

[Mendi]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/10/18/leicester-consider-sean-dyche-approach-carlo-ancelotti-remains/

[Ricey]

1 hour ago, Clever Fox said:

Who have you been watching this season? I've seen very little of the things you mentioned, Togetherness, No.DD quitting and Mahrez want out. Organisation, No. Vardy left to fend for himself. Mahrez kept in the Team when he clearly wasn't interested. Playing 2 in midfield against 3 or even 4. Playing King in midfield when he wouldn't win a tackle in a pub team. Didn't know our best team which is a sacrilege for any Manager.

We never at any time looked balanced anywhere on the pitch. You can't win Matches that way.

 

I'd say he was sacked for all of the above but also because we didn't seem to be showing any improvement. The performances were telling a different story to the perception.

It doesn't have to be a disciplinarian but it does have to be a leader and someone who knows what he doing and gets players to buy into his philosophy. It's more of an art form than a skill. some of the best never had a Coaching lesson in their life.

 

Work rate and togetherness have been fine. I saw a team giving their all on Monday night. Compare it to the performances under Ranieri towards the end and they are polls apart.

 

Some of the criticism you mention have nothing to do with what I was talking about. They are tactical mistakes from Shakespeare. Despite poor performances and poor results, we have still shown resilience, character and fight towards the end.

 

A lot of what Dyche prides himself on are not real issues for us currently. I don't see how things would change enough for there to be a real improvement.

[orangecity23]

15 minutes ago, Clever Fox said:

Firstly as a Manager, you have to make the best use of the Players available. That doesn't me you will get the result you want. Sometimes you have to think outside the Box or use Players in different positions, even playing some of the under 23s.

I'm sorry but Kings bottle has gone, He offers us absolutely nothing, and shouldn't be picked,  No matter how much anyone likes him. I don't believe we only have 3 players for midfield. He could have moved Maguire into Midfield or played Chilwell there. Both are decent on the Ball and will put in a tackle. Or we could have given someone a chance from the 23s. There are always alternatives but Shaky didn't seem to do anything. Just picking pretty much the same team and expecting a different result. He neither set us up to defend or attack. The other thing I've noticed also is that our fitness levels seemed to have dropped or maybe it was just the players losing interest. even Albrighton has looked sluggish this season. While he's not altogether to blame for our demise he was the Manager and as is tradition has to carry the can for the performances.

It's easy to sit round being captain hindsight and claiming King is the worst thing ever, but we were in a crap situation in central midfield, and all of your proposed solutions could easily have worked out worse than King. Amartey has been complained about loads on here, Choudury failed in the Championship last year, Thomas has only got experience in League 2. After that, as I said, it's players out of position, and as Fuchs at centre back last year showed, it doesn't always work as well on the pitch as it does on paper. And if it didn't work, would you give Shakespeare credit for trying it? Nah, just would have replaced the King stuff in the list of charges against him with "plays players out of position, totally wasting them".

[crisp packet]

My worries regarding dyche are his preferred formation 

4411 442?

 

We all know we cannot play that formation well anymore.

 

Best of a bad bunch granted? 

 

Rather have chris wilder if we are going English? But think a clean slate would be better? 

 

Knowlage of English game ?  English speaking foreign coach.

 

Our whole club as gone stale..

 

i do do not believe we have a bad squad, just wrong setup .

 

 

 

[Basildon Fox]

2 minutes ago, Ricey said:

Work rate and togetherness have been fine. I saw a team giving their all on Monday night. Compare it to the performances under Ranieri towards the end and they are polls apart.

 

Some of the criticism you mention have nothing to do with what I was talking about. They are tactical mistakes from Shakespeare. Despite poor performances and poor results, we have still shown resilience, character and fight towards the end.

 

A lot of what Dyche prides himself on are not real issues for us currently. I don't see how things would change enough for there to be a real improvement.

Work rate was walking pace and they looked like they had never met before on a football pitch.  They looked confused as to what their roles were and the heads were down.  Have no idea what game you watched but it certainly wasn't Leicesters...

[STUHILL]

2 minutes ago, orangecity23 said:

It's easy to sit round being captain hindsight and claiming King is the worst thing ever, but we were in a crap situation in central midfield, and all of your proposed solutions could easily have worked out worse than King. Amartey has been complained about loads on here, Choudury failed in the Championship last year, Thomas has only got experience in League 2. After that, as I said, it's players out of position, and as Fuchs at centre back last year showed, it doesn't always work as well on the pitch as it does on paper. And if it didn't work, would you give Shakespeare credit for trying it? Nah, just would have replaced the King stuff in the list of charges against him with "plays players out of position, totally wasting them".

It's also easy to dismiss at least trying other ideas when things clearly aren't working.

[STUHILL]

35 minutes ago, norwichfox said:

I'll need a great deal of money to impart that information.....have a word with my agent 

That's the reality of the situation facing our owners though.

 

I don't particular want Dyche. I want bloody Ancelotti or Blanc!! 

 

Not going to happen. The best we can hope for, is someone joining us who evolves in to a top manager and everything just clicks and those type appointments are impossible to predict. There's no set science, it's also attached with high risk. Look at De Boer for example, on paper an exciting, forward thinking manager - Disaster! 

 

Dyche for me hasn't been given the opportunity yet to see what he can do with better players and a bigger budget. He may not be able to shake the negative and defensive style that has brought him success at Burnley with their resources, but that for me isn't necessary the worst thing ever.

 

If his default and minimum, is survival but there is a chance there is more in his locker (i.e yet to be given the chance to show it)... then I'll take that.

In simple terms - At worst - Not great football but organised and survival. At best - we get a young talented manager evolving his style with better players/resources. 

 

Again - Still waiting on all these TOP manager suggestions from those turning their nose up at Dyche... ??

 

[MPH]

36 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

True. So at worst we get a Sam Allardyce MKII who keeps us up. If he can keep that dross Burnley up, then he can damn well keep us up. 

 

Just to be clear.. Dyche is not my first choice! He is just emerging as one of the best candidates out of those being linked and would actually consider us.

 

I really would like to hear people's suggestions for better alternatives??

 

Rafa - Won't leave Newcastle for us.

Ancelotti - Ha!

Blanc - USA bound and probably another Ha!

Silva - Why would he leave Watford riding high and after only 5 months in.

O'Neil - Never coming back here and tied up with ROI.

Pearson - Already ruled out.

Tuchel - Ruled himself out.

Mancini - Ruled himself out.

 

That leaves us with Pardew, Coleman and Dyche who have actually been linked...  Howe maybe?  

 

PLEASE suggest a TOP manager who is available and would want to come here? Really not as easy as throwing money at them and don't we want someone who genuinely wants to be here too and is excited to get stuck in! 

 

 

Yeah ah he's not my first choice I'd take him, but all I am saying is that it could be a risk.

 

and by one trick pony, I didn't mean Hed necessarily keep us up, but that his mind set is all geared to the small club and players on small wages fighting for the right to stay in the prem. Grafters. How would he cope with a Mahrez, or a Vardy? Or Silva. What works for them, telling them they need to fight to stay in the prem could run them up completely he wrong way. Who knows.

[norwichfox]

11 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

Again - Still waiting on all these TOP manager suggestions from those turning their nose up at Dyche... ??

 

The main point to consider is that no matter who we want or suggest will have absolutely no bearing on who the Srivaddhanaprabha's and their accompanying assassins employ. Categorically, I don't want eff'ing Dyche, Pardew, Coleman, Allardyce, Dyche, Howe, Dyche or Dyche....edit, I'm still undecided about Bob Weasel Fox

[ROKERITE]

17 hours ago, blueharmie said:

Cheers Sean. 

Well there's a new one on my list. I've been Brendan Rodgers, Lee Sinnott, Graham Westley, Craig Harrison and many others over the years, according to various teams' fans. But Sean Dyche is a new one; and I hadn't even begun to plead his case.

You fellows will be very lucky if you get him. We, according to various sources, had him in Summer, 2015 but Short performed the second worst manoeuvre of his disastrous time with us; persuading Dick Advocat to stay a little (and it was a little) longer. We'd still be in The Premier League if we'd got Dyche.

Mind, if you get the new favourite worry. I'd be pleased for Burnley supporters but Chris Coleman over Sean Dyche would be terrible for you. 

 

[STUHILL]

1 minute ago, MPH said:

 

 

Yeah ah he's not my first choice I'd take him, but all I am saying is that it could be a risk.

 

and by one trick pony, I didn't mean Hed necessarily keep us up, but that his mind set is all geared to the small club and players on small wages fighting for the right to stay in the prem. Grafters. How would he cope with a Mahrez, or a Vardy? Or Silva. What works for them, telling them they need to fight to stay in the prem could run them up completely he wrong way. Who knows.

Agreed it is a risk but as he has never experienced that, we really don't know. It could be the making of him as a manager as equally the downfall of him. 

 

Like I said in a previous post. With Dyche, I see his default as being able to keep us up. That is purely based on him achieving that with a very poor Burnley side (on paper)

 

I know we don't want to simply survive and the owners don't want that, but it's kind of nice to know that with Dyche, that we are in safe-ish hands in terms of grinding out results if needed. Obviously there are no guarantees but you certainly know the players will be organised and working hard. 

 

The question then becomes whether he is able to match our ambitions of pushing for a regular top 8 finish. No one knows what he is capable of yet as he has never been given the players or resources, so that fills me with some hope that he can evolve. He's certainly young enough to and certainly would be unfair to brand him a certain style of manager i.e Big Sam, after only managing 1 ("poor") club in the Premier League so far. 

[STUHILL]

4 minutes ago, norwichfox said:

The main point to consider is that no matter who we want or suggest will have absolutely no bearing on who the Srivaddhanaprabha's and their accompanying assassins employ. Categorically, I don't want eff'ing Dyche, Pardew, Coleman, Allardyce, Dyche, Howe, Dyche or Dyche....edit, I'm still undecided about Bob Weasel Fox

I don't think anyone believes any of us have any bearing on who they will hire. The point of the forum is to discuss exactly things like this though.

 

The same with me suggesting a formation change.. I don't actually believe that me writing that has any bearing on a manager's decision.. 

 

What the hell would we talk about on here if not what Managers we are linked to 

 

We may be a sad bunch.. but not quite that deluded 

[Manwell Pablo]

He's a belled but I guess I'd have to try and look past it if he were appointed. He's proved himself to be a very good manager.

 

Whether he'd leave Burnley is another matter though.