Leicester city 1-4 Crystal palace post-Match thread

[elvisfmcfly]

28 minutes ago, Matt said:

I'm sure some could.

 

They'll be some stat that will be pulled up from somewhere.

The nether regions of Babylon I’d Eden Hazard to guess!

[The Doctor]

7 minutes ago, inckley fox said:

I think you'll struggle to find anyone in the world who seriously blames Puel for how clinical Vardy is or isn't. The whole point is that Vardy's form in front of goal wasn't a principal cause of our loss today, or our recent poor form, nor has it got Puel into the situation he's in now. If you want to blame him for missing a penalty against Spurs, or the xG stats, you have to credit him for his match-winning goals which kept Puel in a job over Xmas, or the incredibly clinical 2017/18 Vardy who got the goals to save Puel's bacon. Over time, he hasn't been one of the main reasons for Puel's predicament, and it's highly misleading for you to keep suggesting that it is. 

 

So I don't think anyone is going to argue that Vardy is on fire right now, or that he's still at his peak, or that Puel is responsible when he misses a chance. They might point out that we're not playing to Vardy's strengths. That the types of chances he has aren't necessarily the type he thrives off. That whoever plays up front for whichever of Puel's English top flight sides (Vardy last season excepted) always struggles for form. And they might point out that there are other more obvious problems in the side right now - the lack of creativity for anyone, Vardy or otherwise, up front. The form of Maddison, Ghezzal, Mendy, Maguire. Some of Puel's questionable decision-making.

You're talking about last season, and yes last season he was spectacular. But, there's no arguing this season for what ever reason he's been on a steep decline. People refuse to see that though and talk about not playing to his strengths, which may be the case, but a good striker buries good chances. There's not a "not the right sort of chance" for a top striker, there's a goalscoring chance or a half chance. Much as I think we all hate spurs, look at Kane: https://understat.com/team/Tottenham/2018 should be on 12-13, is on 15. He's not hiding behind missing clear cut chances because "oh, it wasn't a quick ball". Vardy this season doesn't justify a shirt, and is reliant on Okazaki (never a goalscorer for us) and Iheanacho (doing his best to prove every overweight 40 year old plumbers insistence that even he could score in a team like man city) not doing enough to displace him rather than having the shirt on his own merits - looking elsewhere and talking about the form of the midfielders and the tactics, as if that explains his profligacy, is excuse making. If he weren't getting the service fine, but he is, and he's wasting it.

 

2 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

He missed a pen at Wembley when ‘cold’ .......that apart, what big chances has he missed in the past month ???

 

Are we pretending he's not joint second on big chances missed this season? That he's not, by any statistical measure, underperforming?

[NotTheMarketLeader]

2 hours ago, UPinCarolina said:

Yeah, I post plenty. Have a look at my post history, if you won’t take my word for it. 

 

I think his position is now untenable and he has to go for the sake of the club, but the circumstances that have led us to this point are strange and I have even felt as if we were somewhat cursed at times. I don’t put all of this at Puel’s feet and I think those who do so are in error. 

So given the time has had - a season and a half - with his players being drafted in giving him what he wants - who else is responsible? 

 

When answering please consider Puel is responsible for motivating the players, the tactics

utilised and getting results.

[Parafox]

3 minutes ago, Kalacs_Orthopedic_Shoe said:

Supporting Leicester must be what it's like to bipolar...

I have a daughter who suffers terribly from Bi-polar disorder, type 3. Trust me, watching Leicester is infinitely less stressful and upsetting.

[st albans fox]

1 minute ago, The Doctor said:

 

Are we pretending he's not joint second on big chances missed this season? That he's not, by any statistical measure, underperforming?

What a nonsense stat - he’s a lone striker ......who else is going to miss our ‘big chances’?  Look  at the other names on that list and tell me you wouldn’t want them playing for us? 

 

5 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

I hear what your saying but the owners should choose the manager, not players picking and choosing which manager they want to play for.

 It’s obvious vardy isn’t playing for puel, and they are not getting on, Peter Schmeichel has made it obvious kasper doesn’t want to play for puel.

 To many spoilt players wanting their own way is the impression I’m getting 

It’s about motivation and this manger has lost the ability to motivate the players (if he ever had it) - experienced and inexperienced...... that did for shakey and it will do for Claude.  

[inckley fox]

7 minutes ago, Hammo said:

Those who have supported Puel on here have generally been as stubborn and as intransigent as the man himself.

 

How many of you have the guts now to admit that your backing of him was deluded, your loyalty misplaced and that, well, basically you were just wrong?

 

The truth is that he has taken this team backwards. He is clueless, dull, unpopular, uninspiring and incapable - or more pertinently- unwilling to learn from his mistakes.

 

I want him gone before Tuesday.

Did you never, at any point support him then? Assuming you did, you must also have changed your mind at some point! I don't think you can call people wanting to give someone a chance 'deluded'. All of us were, at one moment in time, willing to give Taylor, Bassett, Levein, Kelly, Allen, Holloway, Sousa a chance. Yes, we were wrong to in those cases, but we'd be lousy fans if we didn't give people a fair shot.

 

The only thing that's changed for me is that I now think there is a strong enough argument now for us to fire him, whereas it was previously quite a flimsy argument based on misinformation, gut feelings and unrealistic expectations. I've always had doubts about him, but I could see progress here and there, and in that regard I'm consistent. In the here and now, of course, there's a very strong argument not to wait and see in the summer, but to act immediately.

[Monsell1976]

Just now, st albans fox said:

What a nonsense stat - he’s a lone striker ......who else is going to miss our ‘big chances’?  Look  at the other names on that list and tell me you wouldn’t want them playing for us? 

 

It’s about motivation and this manger has lost the ability to motivate the players (if he ever had it) - experienced and inexperienced...... that did for shakey and it will do for Claude.  

Think there is more to it than that, I heard puel is a task master, and a few are not taking it well.

[st albans fox]

Just now, Monsell1976 said:

Think there is more to it than that, I heard puel is a task master, and a few are not taking it well.

There are ways that it should/could be done ..... players on a small fortune need to be ‘managed’ and clearly Claude isn’t able to do that 

 

nothing personal against the bloke but it’s time .........

[Monsell1976]

Just now, st albans fox said:

There are ways that it should/could be done ..... players on a small fortune need to be ‘managed’ and clearly Claude isn’t able to do that 

 

nothing personal against the bloke but it’s time .........

Agree it’s time, but it’s time to break up the click in the playing staff, a few commentators have stated there is to much player power at the club, time to cull for me

[Corky]

24 minutes ago, Hammo said:

Those who have supported Puel on here have generally been as stubborn and as intransigent as the man himself.

 

How many of you have the guts now to admit that your backing of him was deluded, your loyalty misplaced and that, well, basically you were just wrong?

 

The truth is that he has taken this team backwards. He is clueless, dull, unpopular, uninspiring and incapable - or more pertinently- unwilling to learn from his mistakes.

 

I want him gone before Tuesday.

Some of the people who want him out have been ok with or encouraging us to lose games before you start preaching about opinions.

[st albans fox]

2 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

Agree it’s time, but it’s time to break up the click in the playing staff, a few commentators have stated there is to much player power at the club, time to cull for me

That job is pretty well done - Wes will probably leave in the summer, as will a few of the other old guard out of contract. look around the squad .......not many of the strong characters will be left. Top trusts Kasper and vards and won’t pick anyone ahead of them given the choice. 

 

A new manager will thrive here if he is a good man manager 

Edited 23 February 2019 by st albans fox

[Hammo]

4 minutes ago, inckley fox said:

Did you never, at any point support him then? Assuming you did, you must also have changed your mind at some point! I don't think you can call people wanting to give someone a chance 'deluded'. All of us were, at one moment in time, willing to give Taylor, Bassett, Levein, Kelly, Allen, Holloway, Sousa a chance. Yes, we were wrong to in those cases, but we'd be lousy fans if we didn't give people a fair shot.

 

The only thing that's changed for me is that I now think there is a strong enough argument now for us to fire him, whereas it was previously quite a flimsy argument based on misinformation, gut feelings and unrealistic expectations. I've always had doubts about him, but I could see progress here and there, and in that regard I'm consistent. In the here and now, of course, there's a very strong argument not to wait and see in the summer, but to act immediately.

I have always supported THE TEAM. Managers and players have to earn support by doing their job well and delivering the goods. I always want them to succeed, but, unlike many on here, I see absolutely no virtue in having blind faith and misplaced loyalty in someone who does not deserve it.

[inckley fox]

6 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

You're talking about last season, and yes last season he was spectacular. But, there's no arguing this season for what ever reason he's been on a steep decline. People refuse to see that though and talk about not playing to his strengths, which may be the case, but a good striker buries good chances. There's not a "not the right sort of chance" for a top striker, there's a goalscoring chance or a half chance. Much as I think we all hate spurs, look at Kane: https://understat.com/team/Tottenham/2018 should be on 12-13, is on 15. He's not hiding behind missing clear cut chances because "oh, it wasn't a quick ball". Vardy this season doesn't justify a shirt, and is reliant on Okazaki (never a goalscorer for us) and Iheanacho (doing his best to prove every overweight 40 year old plumbers insistence that even he could score in a team like man city) not doing enough to displace him rather than having the shirt on his own merits - looking elsewhere and talking about the form of the midfielders and the tactics, as if that explains his profligacy, is excuse making. If he weren't getting the service fine, but he is, and he's wasting it.

 

Are we pretending he's not joint second on big chances missed this season? That he's not, by any statistical measure, underperforming?

Okay, so at one point Vardy bailed Puel out, at another he added to his problems. It's still totally wrong to imply that Vardy has been the great thorn in Puel's side, or that his finishing was a relevant factor in today's debacle. He remains the only striker to have enjoyed any kind of success in the EPL under Puel's management. And of course there are 'right sort of chances' for a striker. A floated cross into the box would have been fantastic for Ulloa, Iwan Roberts, Steve Walsh, less so for Tony Cottee or Vardy. There are strikers, like Cottee, who are 'quick around the box', react well in tight situations. Others thrive in the air. And we could go on. So when Vardy misses a decent aerial opportunity, the chance isn't as tailored to his skills as when he's one on one. Now I know he's not buried all of his one-on-ones, and I know he used to have a good record in the air, but it's another sweeping, misleading statement to say 'chances are chances are chances.' I simply don't understand your determination to focus this argument on Vardy, even on a day like today when he clearly wasn't one of our principal problems. It's beginning to look more like an aggressive agenda rather than balanced, sober criticism of a still-decent striker who isn't enjoying his best form, and may be showing the first signs of decline. And I find that very peculiar from a Leicester fan, especially when it's largely driven by a determination to defend Claude Puel, and do so by pointing the finger at established favourites.

[Bert]

The problems. 

 

The players dont like the manager. 

We are too easy to play against. 

We have no plan b. 

We don’t create enough goalscoring chances. 

 

[Hammo]

3 minutes ago, Corky said:

Some of the people who want him out have been ok with or encouraging us to lose games before you start preaching about opinions.

Do you want to try again and rephrase that so that it actually makes sense?

[Monsell1976]

Just now, st albans fox said:

That job is pretty well done - Wes will probably leave in the summer, as will a few of the other old guard out of contract. look around the squad .......not many of the strong characters will be left. Top trusts Kasper and vards and won’t pick anyone ahead of them given the choice. 

 

A new manager will thrive here if he is a good man manager 

There lies the problem, players to close to owners, to much power given to them.

 I don’t know this but it wouldn’t surprise me if vardy and Schmeichel are the arse holes, and are making it hard for puel 

[Corky]

Just now, Hammo said:

Do you want to try again and rephrase that so that it actually makes sense?

It has been seen on here that fans are happy for us to lose games if it means the manager goes. Everton away being an example.

 

 

[MC Prussian]

[st albans fox]

Just now, Monsell1976 said:

There lies the problem, players to close to owners, to much power given to them.

 I don’t know this but it wouldn’t surprise me if vardy and Schmeichel are the arse holes, and are making it hard for puel 

it’s not about a couple of individuals.......

 

 it’s about the payers in general not putting in the effort that the opposition are.......

 they do care but you need  to get that extra half a percent out of them and this guy isn’t able to do it ....... look at the ability we have out wide .....

banres and gray are rapid ...... imagine how many times pep would work the ball and get them in behind ...... we can’t manage it ...... imo, that’s down to the coaching and the game plan  

[Hammo]

Just now, Corky said:

It has been seen on here that fans are happy for us to lose games if it means the manager goes. Everton away being an example.

 

 

Well I don't understand that attitude at all, never have, but if it gets to that point then there is clearly something seriously wrong.

[Lesta2014]

8 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

There lies the problem, players to close to owners, to much power given to them.

 I don’t know this but it wouldn’t surprise me if vardy and Schmeichel are the arse holes, and are making it hard for puel 

 

Maddison by all accounts isn’t very happy either! 

[inckley fox]

1 minute ago, Hammo said:

I have always supported THE TEAM. Managers and players have to earn support by doing their job well and delivering the goods. I always want them to succeed, but, unlike many on here, I see absolutely no virtue in having blind faith and misplaced loyalty in someone who does not deserve it.

I know, but blind faith and misplaced loyalty aren't the same as simply giving a manager a fair chance, and not wishing for him to be fired. I always had doubts about Puel, I've been consistent in my criticism and praise of him, but until now I've not felt the argument is strong enough for us to fire him. I don't think that is blind faith, I think it's the process any fan goes through when they decide their manager is no longer the right person for the club. There had to be some moment in time when we were willing to give them their fair crack of the whip.

 

And yes, I support the team too, of course. There's a distinction between the way you support the club you love - which is by buying tickets, singing songs, wearing their shirts and so on - and the way you support the manager, which is basically by not shouting for him to be fired, and being willing to tolerate his continuation. For me, it sounds like you're talking about supporters who support the manager at the expense of the team; expressing greater support for them than for the players, blaming players in order to paper over a manager's flaws, deciding that they like a manager and then simply refusing to change their opinion regardless of what happens. That's definitely not me, and it's probably not the most accurate description of most others who were/are defending the manager.

[BKLFox]

54 minutes ago, smudger63 said:

The manager doesn`t play to Vardys strengths. I don`t know if hes out of form or not, because he is rarely given the same opportunities that he usually thrives on, in the style in which this manager wants us to play.

If the manager wants to play in the way that he sets us up, then he has had 3 transfer windows to bring  a striker in that can play that way, but he has failed to do so, and would rather try and convert Gray into that striker, who is not football intelligent enough, it`s bizarre.

 

1 summer and 2 January windows so if you know anything about transfer windows it’s 1 yes and in that time he didn’t know what he had in the summer, and what does he buy January just gone and for how much?

[Stoopid]

I remember going to Wolves years ago. We got stuffed 3-0, i got me bleedin head kicked in, and I missed the bus back home,

It was still more fun than today, though...

[Master Fox]

Maguire was the worst player on the pitch today. Awful