US Presidential Election 2020

[Kopfkino]

14 minutes ago, MattP said:

The state of US politics at the minute

 

A president so hopelessly out of his depth he can't go ten minutes without embarrassing himself and now needs to basically go full UBI bribery and jingoistic on the Chinese to have a hope of winning later this year.

 

On the other side a candidate now accused of sexual assault who the "Kavanagh must go, women MUST be believed" mob will now have to vote for and pretend it's morally OK to do so on the basis of the opponent.

 

Whatever anyone thinks of Boris I really hope this is the end of the comparisons with him and Trump - I mean just watch the two when conducting a press conference on this.

 

Tbh it is quite incredible that the Democrats had 4 years to find a candidate and they managed to get to a final two of the bloke that lost to the woman that lost last time and the geriatric groper that is the definition of Washington insider. 

 

As for comparisons between Boris and Trump, of course it won't stop. It's in vogue to describe anything as Trumpian, it doesn't help that Boris has floppy blonde hair but I don't think its an affliction only he will suffer. Basically if you're slightly to the left and don't like something just compare it to Trump and you've smashed it out of the park in those circles.

[leicsmac]

49 minutes ago, MattP said:

The state of US politics at the minute

 

A president so hopelessly out of his depth he can't go ten minutes without embarrassing himself and now needs to basically go full UBI bribery and jingoistic on the Chinese to have a hope of winning later this year.

 

On the other side a candidate now accused of sexual assault who the "Kavanagh must go, women MUST be believed" mob will now have to vote for and pretend it's morally OK to do so on the basis of the opponent.

 

Whatever anyone thinks of Boris I really hope this is the end of the comparisons with him and Trump - I mean just watch the two when conducting a press conference on this.

It really is a shitshow, isn't it? Goodness only knows how it has come to this.

 

Biden probably isn't a better person than Trump but Dem policy is ahead of Repub in many critical areas (even scientific policy alone would be enough to make a critical difference IMO but there are other areas too) so that should play a part for me: it likely won't, though - US politics has gone much too reality TV for that.

 

You're right on the last part and I've said it before too - the viewpoints of a great deal of those who are behind Trump in government and those who support him would make even the most hardened UK Tories blanch.

Edited 1 May 2020 by leicsmac

[urban.spaceman]

 

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

 

Apparently, she "has Jewish friends and they said it was ok".

 

Apparently.

[urban.spaceman]

23 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Apparently, she "has Jewish friends and they said it was ok".

 

Apparently.

But I bet her Polish friends just thought she was a cvnt. 

[Lionator]

I’d be worried if I was a Chinese citizen in the States right now. Trump and Pompeo stoking up some real anti Chinese sentiment in order to absolve themselves of their shambolic handling of the situation. 

[leicsmac]

5 hours ago, Lionator said:

I’d be worried if I was a Chinese citizen in the States right now. Trump and Pompeo stoking up some real anti Chinese sentiment in order to absolve themselves of their shambolic handling of the situation. 

TBH though depending on where you are such sentiment is going to be just another day for the Asian-American community.

 

"Model minority" when it suits the narrative, not when it doesn't.

[Jattdogg]

43 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

TBH though depending on where you are such sentiment is going to be just another day for the Asian-American community.

 

"Model minority" when it suits the narrative, not when it doesn't.

Can i get some fried rice, kung pao chicken and some sweet and sour spare  ribs?

 

That kind of model?  Greatest country my arse. 

[leicsmac]

2 hours ago, Jattdogg said:

Can i get some fried rice, kung pao chicken and some sweet and sour spare  ribs?

 

That kind of model?  Greatest country my arse. 

Well, yeah - that's one example. Others include "look at them all keeping their heads down and not rocking the boat" (read: not challenging the established status quo by seeking to get positions of any real political power) and "their women are always so meek and submissive. Why can't more women be like that?" (which shows a real abject lack of knowledge on the matter at hand, tbh).

[knitro]

[never mind, don't want to get involved here]

Edited 4 May 2020 by knitro

[Guest MattP]

Think I've done my money here.

Even if the press are prepared to cover this up Trump is surely going to bring it up at some point.

[Beechey]

On 02/05/2020 at 14:11, urban.spaceman said:

 

Christ alive. I'd say I'm not sure that means what she thinks it means - but she probably understands it entirely.

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, MattP said:

Think I've done my money here.

Even if the press are prepared to cover this up Trump is surely going to bring it up at some point.

Agreed that Trump can bring it up, but then Biden can simply reference Trump's own comments and endorsement of Kauvanagh to say that he's no better. I don't actually think this matter alone will make much difference overall.

[Finnaldo]

34 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Agreed that Trump can bring it up, but then Biden can simply reference Trump's own comments and endorsement of Kauvanagh to say that he's no better. I don't actually think this matter alone will make much difference overall.

You can argue Biden has less dirt than Trump, but I think what you’re overlooking is that Trump’s rhetoric annihilated Clinton who could at least argue back, Biden looks less and less with it every day. I could see the debates devolving into Trump just pummelling Biden whilst he defencelessly stumbles over his words and gets lost in his own sentences. At least with Clinton it was kind of funny, watching some senile old man get obliterated is just sad. 
 

It’s becoming more and more obvious the Democrats picked the weaker of their final two, but the fact is it was a pretty weak final two in the first place. It’s clear the left wing of the party needs to reign themselves in a bit (Bernie or bust isn’t really going to help their cause with swaying moderate Democrats) and similarly the establishment Democrats need to make some actual concessions to the left wing to find a candidate they can both get behind, rather than dogpiling outsider candidates and trying to suppress them. Currently they have such a focus on bitter entrenched Primary campaigns that by the time campaigning for the Presidential election comes around they’re polarised, and at that point they’re just running a loser campaign 

 

 

Edited 4 May 2020 by Finnaldo

[Guest MattP]

34 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Agreed that Trump can bring it up, but then Biden can simply reference Trump's own comments and endorsement of Kauvanagh to say that he's no better. I don't actually think this matter alone will make much difference overall.

That's the problem, it's expected of Trump, it's already factored in 

 

Vote for me as I'm the better sex pest of the two isn't going to be any sort of argument.

[Jattdogg]

I'd be more shocked if Biden wins then when Trump won almost 4 years ago.

[SMX11]

Jesse Ventura potentially running on the Green ticket. I would pay to see him cut a promo on Biden and Trump in a debate. Shame it won't happen. 

[Carl the Llama]

Still time to give Bernie the nomination, just saying...

[Guest MattP]

11 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

Still time to give Bernie the nomination, just saying...

If they decide Biden can't do it because he's so awful they aren't going then select the guy that managed to get battered at the polls by Biden

 

If it got to that point you would assume they just have to go to Hillary again unless Cuomo wants the gig. 

 

A lot of the Sanders economic policy was considered a joke before global economic paralysis, let alone now.

[leicsmac]

2 hours ago, Finnaldo said:

You can argue Biden has less dirt than Trump, but I think what you’re overlooking is that Trump’s rhetoric annihilated Clinton who could at least argue back, Biden looks less and less with it every day. I could see the debates devolving into Trump just pummelling Biden whilst he defencelessly stumbles over his words and gets lost in his own sentences. At least with Clinton it was kind of funny, watching some senile old man get obliterated is just sad. 
 

It’s becoming more and more obvious the Democrats picked the weaker of their final two, but the fact is it was a pretty weak final two in the first place. It’s clear the left wing of the party needs to reign themselves in a bit (Bernie or bust isn’t really going to help their cause with swaying moderate Democrats) and similarly the establishment Democrats need to make some actual concessions to the left wing to find a candidate they can both get behind, rather than dogpiling outsider candidates and trying to suppress them. Currently they have such a focus on bitter entrenched Primary campaigns that by the time campaigning for the Presidential election comes around they’re polarised, and at that point they’re just running a loser campaign 

 

 

Yeah, perhaps I'm expecting too much when I think that this contest might be decided by policy rather than by debate soundbites.

 

You'll get no disagreement with me on the second paragraph.

 

 

2 hours ago, MattP said:

That's the problem, it's expected of Trump, it's already factored in 

 

Vote for me as I'm the better sex pest of the two isn't going to be any sort of argument.

I'm sorry, I'm not getting how that's an argument that somehow benefits Trump - that he was discovered to be a sex pest first rather than the only one makes him somehow a more palatable candidate looking at that one quality alone? Is anyone really going to think "yeah, Trump is a misogynist creeper but now the other guy is too so I'll vote for him based on that only"?

 

If anything, as I said before, all it does is rob the Dems of any kind of advantage that can be used in that particular area and means they have to focus on others. Of course, how it comes across in the debates is going to be critical but that doesn't actually have much to do with the facts at hand - just how good the two candidates are at utilising them for their own ends.

 

As Covid cases and deaths continue to spiral upwards in the US and this administration continues to drop the ball on handling both it and the fringes of their own support who seem bound and determined to act as Typhoid Maries the more it seems like Dems need to stick to attacking based on policy and not get drawn into a personality/style clash; because Trump is indeed stronger there and that's exactly what he needs to win. It would be criminal to not use scientific policy, in particular, as a keystone argument given the events of this year.

 

 

[bovril]

1 hour ago, Jattdogg said:

I'd be more shocked if Biden wins then when Trump won almost 4 years ago.

If I were a betting man I would still go for Biden. As bad as he is, I don't think there are as many Biden haters as there were Clinton haters.

[Guest MattP]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

Im sorry, I'm not getting how that's an argument that somehow benefits Trump - that he was discovered to be a sex pest first rather than the only one makes him somehow a more palatable candidate looking at that one quality alone? Is anyone really going to think "yeah, Trump is a misogynist creeper but now the other guy is too so I'll vote for him based on that only"?

Because like I said, it's already factored in.

 

Will someone who voted for Trump last time not vote for him because he grabs pussy? Nope.

 

Will someone who potentially wants to vote Biden not vote for him when they see him being accused of sexual assault or touching up children? Possibly.

 

No win situation, can only lose votes on it.

 

This is starting to mirror 2016 already where the only moral choice for those who aren't already in one camp or the other is to vote third party or abstain.

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, MattP said:

Because like I said, it's already factored in.

 

Will someone who voted for Trump last time not vote for him because he grabs pussy? Nope.

 

Will someone who potentially wants to vote Biden not vote for him when they see him being accused of sexual assault or touching up children? Possibly.

 

No win situation, can only lose votes on it.

 

This is starting to mirror 2016 already where the only moral choice for those who aren't already in one camp or the other is to vote third party or abstain.

Ah, so you're talking about people not voting for Biden and abstaining rather than voting for Trump per se that makes more sense, as I said this costs Dems an advantage on this particular area. Perhaps (again as above) I'm expecting too much to think that voting decisions will be made based on policy rather than glorified reality TV, but what this does mean is that the Dems have to stay away from it and confront Trump on policy decisions as much as they can, because of course he'll use this.

[Bilo]

Has there ever been a less inspiring POTUS election than this one? Certainly not in my lifetime, and I remember Gore vs Bush. 

 

Trump has been even more hopeless than even his worst critics feared through this crisis and should be staring at a landslide, catastrophic defeat that leaves the GOP soul-searching over their electoral future.

 

Then along come the Dems to throw him a lifeline with a candidate even worse than Hilary, someone you'd only want to get the gig so Trump doesn't get a second term.

 

I honestly think AOC would have been a more inspiring candidate; at least she's young, Hispanic and has a history of something other than being groomed into wealth despite zero ****ing ability. It's honestly THAT bad.

 

The trouble is that it's tough to find rising stars in US politics. The GOP have gone full tinfoil and appealing primarily to imbeciles, and the Dems haven't a clue how to engage beyond ORANGE MAN BAD. 

 

It certainly puts a different perspective on our politics when we have two party leaders who, while unlikely to feature in anyone's list of greatest ever leaders when the history books are written, can actually articulate coherent political ideas. 

[st albans fox]

Just looking at the big gamble currently being undertaken by trump. 
 

if the lockdowns continue and a slow phased release occurred, there is little chance of the economy making any kind of recovery by the time the election campaign is in its vital stages ......

 

so he has gambled that an early reopening of states will encourage an earlier recovery of the economy but clearly, a second wave will be disastrous for him. I think the only chance he has is the warmth and humidity of a US late spring and summer will lower the transmission rate long enough for events regarding some kind of effective treatment to rescue him by the time autumn arrives and with it, an uptick In the R rate.