Coronavirus Thread

[Parafox]

14 hours ago, String fellow said:

According to the government's website, the UK had 1578 cases on 15th May and today it has 6238. So in the last 3 weeks, the daily case rate has risen by a factor of almost four. Admittedly, these are both relatively small numbers, but nevertheless the current upward trend suggests to me that the removal of all remaining restrictions later this month may be a step too far. Having said that, what do I know, being a largely-ignorant member of the public.

FFS. Clearly your a well informed and thoughtful, intelligent person. I highly doubt you'll see a sensationalist headline in the red-tops and react  without thinking. There are plenty that do, though.

[String fellow]

Anyone with an interest in the use of dogs' noses as a rapid method of detecting cases of Covid-19 might like to have a look at this research paper. Last year, when I mentioned this topic, it didn't get a very good reception.

https://www.lshtm.ac.uk/media/49791

[VLC86]

3 minutes ago, String fellow said:

Anyone with an interest in the use of dogs' noses as a rapid method of detecting cases of Covid-19 might like to have a look at this research paper. Last year, when I mentioned this topic, it didn't get a very good reception.

https://www.lshtm.ac.uk/media/49791

Sounds like you are looking for praise, who is a good boy.

[Leicester_Loyal]

6 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

Sounds like you are looking for praise, who is a good boy.

Can we get you @Izzy and @urban.spaceman doing some form of weekly podcast? It's what the people want. Forget Joe Rogan. We want 90 minutes of terrible jokes every week.

[VLC86]

1 minute ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Can we get you @Izzy and @urban.spaceman doing some form of weekly podcast? It's what the people want. Forget Joe Rogan. We want 90 minutes of terrible jokes every week.

Hmmm do we want that? Lol 

[Matt]

On 04/06/2021 at 15:46, Costock_Fox said:

I know someone who  ‘never wants it to end’. Not sure he ever leaves Leicester.

I know a couple of people like this.

 

Whilst they've not actually said they 'never want it to end' per se, its basically their dream.

 

They were a nightmare to actually get out before this, this has been perfect for them, no need for excuses not to go out, do things, no saying yes to things only to let people/plans down at the last minute (You could set your watch by it), which is actually nice, just say no from the start and don't waste anyones time - not that i've had anything to arrange anyway, just before the pandemic I'd stopped inviting them out or suggesting things to do to them to stop these situations anyway and doubt I will again in the future - What's the point? For their sake and mine/others.

 

They've not even had to leave their houses for work - I'd genuinely be surprised if they left their house even for a walk in the past year. Literally.

 

It's genuinely almost like they were scared to go out long before all of this, I think this will give them even more reason to avoid going out even when we're 'back to normal', they'll continue to live in fear. I'm not even mocking it or taking the piss because whether they have mental heath issues or holdups that this is the case who am I to say - I don't think they do, I think they are just very much an introvert.

 

Each to their own and if that's how they wanna live their life who am I to judge but there are people who as was being debated are quite happy for this to continue for as long as possible, 'selfishly'. As a opposed to the 'selfish people' who want the restrictions to end. As always there is middle ground on everything and there is no wrong or right.

 

Prime example, group message, someone said "What are the restrictions now? When can we drink and get together again?", someone replied "Now. Pub?", Most us said yes and it got arranged, the person who wanted us to drink together and a couple of others didn't go. He wanted us to go to his garden.

 

I've had some people asking me to round theirs for BBQ's and stuff which is great, I appreciate mixing again, the company but i'd rather actually go out, I've been stuck in my own house staring at 4 walls for the last year, not to sound ungrateful but i'm not really sure I wanna sit round someone elses house staring at 4 walls or sat in their garden. I understand it's quite an effort to go out at the moment, booking, track and trace and it ultimately not being the same or having the same freedoms as going out as before but regardless of that the bottom line is they'd simply rather not go out. At all.

 

Edited 5 June 2021 by Matt

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, Matt said:

I know a couple of people like this.

 

Whilst they've not actually said they 'never want it to end' per se, its basically their wet dream.

 

They were a nightmare to actually get out before this, this has been perfect for them, no need for excuses not to go out, do things, no saying yes to things only to let people/plans down at the last minute (You could set your watch by it). They've not even had to leave their houses for work - I'd genuinely be surprised if they left their house even for a walk in the past year. Literally.

 

It's genuinely almost like they were scared to go out long before all of this, I think this will give them even more reason to avoid going out even when we're 'back to normal', they'll continue to live in fear. I'm not even mocking it or taking the piss because whether they have mental heath issues or holdups that this is the case who am I to say - I don't think they do, I think they are just very much an introvert.

 

Each to their own and if that's how they wanna live their life who am I to judge but there are people who as was being debated are quite happy for this to continue for as long as possible, 'selfishly'. As a opposed to the 'selfish people' who want the restrictions to end. As always there is middle ground on everything and there is no wrong or right.

 

I've had some people asking me to round theirs for BBQ's and stuff which is great, I appreciate mixing again, the company but i'd rather actually go out, I've been stuck in my own house staring at 4 walls for the last year, not to sound ungrateful but i'm not really sure I wanna sit round someone elses house staring at 4 walls or sat in their garden. I understand it's quite an effort to go ou at the moment, booking, track and trace and it ultimately not being the same or having the same freedoms as going out as before but regardless of that the bottom line is they'd simply rather not go out. At all.

TBH I think that this, and by extension, this whole crisis, leads into an interesting conversation about introverts, extroverts...and who the world favours/is designed for.

 

Without a doubt, the last eighteen months (give or take) have favoured the introverts and the extroverts have had it pretty damn hard. However, I have heard an argument from introverts saying that is simply the same difficulty introverts had to face every day before this all hit - a world based around and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts. I don't think it's inaccurate to say that socially awkward people have at least had it difficult in terms of their lives for quite some time now.

 

My own personal take is that it is indeed somewhere in the middle that things need to meet in the future, where both social types can have equal ease of life and derive pleasure from it in their own ways.

[VLC86]

16 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

TBH I think that this, and by extension, this whole crisis, leads into an interesting conversation about introverts, extroverts...and who the world favours/is designed for.

 

Without a doubt, the last eighteen months (give or take) have favoured the introverts and the extroverts have had it pretty damn hard. However, I have heard an argument from introverts saying that is simply the same difficulty introverts had to face every day before this all hit - a world based around and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts. I don't think it's inaccurate to say that socially awkward people have at least had it difficult in terms of their lives for quite some time now.

 

My own personal take is that it is indeed somewhere in the middle that things need to meet in the future, where both social types can have equal ease of life and derive pleasure from it in their own ways.

So basically.... the world back to normal so people can make their own choices?

[leicsmac]

14 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

So basically.... the world back to normal so people can make their own choices?

Perhaps I wasn't clear in the last post, but an introvert might argue that the world as "back to normal", e.g. how it was before this began, was tilted against them anyway.

 

If that is true (and I think it's down to perception and I'm not totally convinced), then there are things that can be learned from all of this that might be of help going forward. Increased options for working from home is something that immediately springs to mind.

[String fellow]

19 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

TBH I think that this, and by extension, this whole crisis, leads into an interesting conversation about introverts, extroverts...and who the world favours/is designed for.

 

Without a doubt, the last eighteen months (give or take) have favoured the introverts and the extroverts have had it pretty damn hard. However, I have heard an argument from introverts saying that is simply the same difficulty introverts had to face every day before this all hit - a world based around and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts. I don't think it's inaccurate to say that socially awkward people have at least had it difficult in terms of their lives for quite some time now.

 

My own personal take is that it is indeed somewhere in the middle that things need to meet in the future, where both social types can have equal ease of life and derive pleasure from it in their own ways.

I agree - it's an interesting subject, and one which will perhaps provide material for future books written by social scientists.

Personally, lock-down has taught me that much of the stuff involving leaving the house is either unnecessary or can be drastically reduced, for example, by shopping in bulk. Even when the current situation has ended, much of that siege-mentality approach will undoubtedly continue, as it will bring big savings on transport costs and minimise the stress of socialising with others.     

[leicsmac]

6 minutes ago, String fellow said:

I agree - it's an interesting subject, and one which will perhaps provide material for future books written by social scientists.

Personally, lock-down has taught me that much of the stuff involving leaving the house is either unnecessary or can be drastically reduced, for example, by shopping in bulk. Even when the current situation has ended, much of that siege-mentality approach will undoubtedly continue, as it will bring big savings on transport costs and minimise the stress of socialising with others.     

Less reliance on personal transportation (as it is now) might not be bad for the environment, either.

[Finnaldo]

31 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

TBH I think that this, and by extension, this whole crisis, leads into an interesting conversation about introverts, extroverts...and who the world favours/is designed for.

 

Without a doubt, the last eighteen months (give or take) have favoured the introverts and the extroverts have had it pretty damn hard. However, I have heard an argument from introverts saying that is simply the same difficulty introverts had to face every day before this all hit - a world based around and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts. I don't think it's inaccurate to say that socially awkward people have at least had it difficult in terms of their lives for quite some time now.

 

My own personal take is that it is indeed somewhere in the middle that things need to meet in the future, where both social types can have equal ease of life and derive pleasure from it in their own ways.

To be fair, the world before Covid had Netflix, Uber Eats/Deliveroo, Amazon Prime and next day delivery and supermarket deliveries etc. An introvert could live their lives just as inwards as now (probably easier as the demands for these services have gone up), the only real difference is the emergence of WFH which I don’t think is an introvert/extrovert issue, plenty of extroverts enjoy it due to the lack of commutes/micromanaging/office culture that comes part and parcel. 
 

The only thing that’s really changed is that introverts have been able to live relatively normal whereas extroverts have had their natural lifestyles heavily mandated, and a small minority (I do want to stress its a minority) of introverts used the opportunity to get up on their high horse over people legitimately struggling. 
 

Don’t get me wrong, there’s plenty of bellend anti-lockdowners/anti-vaxxers, but I’ve noticed more and more people simply fatigued and struggling with a lot of the things (live football, festivals, summer holidays etc.) that have been stripped from them for 18 months. And yeah whilst it’s quite a privileged position to have those things in the first place, mentally these things can all affect us differently. I know personally it feels like live isn’t moving forward after a year and a half on halt and it’s getting galling. 
 

People can’t align their emotions and mental state by scientific theory. I’m in no way anti-science, anti-vaccine (had both jabs) or anti-lockdown (I fully understood the need for the previous three) but any more and I’d struggle massively. I’m sure a couple here would like to smugly remind us ‘viruses don’t get tired’ but the fact is people do, and it’s getting to the point where people will begin to turn against science if they’re not given a break, and that’s infinitely more dangerous than a virus we’re beginning under control. 
 

Once again I think social media has a lot to answer for. The worst on both sides who have been asking for restrictions dropped at some of the worst points or demanding we don’t open up at all until there’s zero cases and it gets massively amplified despite being the minority, and the majority just want to get through it, even if their opinions are slightly differing.  I just hope 21st can go ahead as usual with limited consequence and the boring bastards on both sides can be silenced once and for all. 

[VLC86]

18 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Perhaps I wasn't clear in the last post, but an introvert might argue that the world as "back to normal", e.g. how it was before this began, was tilted against them anyway.

 

If that is true (and I think it's down to perception and I'm not totally convinced), then there are things that can be learned from all of this that might be of help going forward. Increased options for working from home is something that immediately springs to mind.

I honestly have no idea what you are getting at sorry. If you want to go out, go out, if you don’t want to go out, don’t go out. 
 

I’m not sure anyone is dragging introverts out of the house, if they are then they need telling to **** off. Nothing more nothing less.

[Super_horns]

I doubt there is anyone who hasn’t been out meeting people even inside pubs and cafes.

 

Bet social distancing is petty non existence and masks only worn inside .

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, Finnaldo said:

To be fair, the world before Covid had Netflix, Uber Eats/Deliveroo, Amazon Prime and next day delivery and supermarket deliveries etc. An introvert could live their lives just as inwards as now (probably easier as the demands for these services have gone up), the only real difference is the emergence of WFH which I don’t think is an introvert/extrovert issue, plenty of extroverts enjoy it due to the lack of commutes/micromanaging/office culture that comes part and parcel. 
 

The only thing that’s really changed is that introverts have been able to live relatively normal whereas extroverts have had their natural lifestyles heavily mandated, and a small minority (I do want to stress its a minority) of introverts used the opportunity to get up on their high horse over people legitimately struggling. 
 

Don’t get me wrong, there’s plenty of bellend anti-lockdowners/anti-vaxxers, but I’ve noticed more and more people simply fatigued and struggling with a lot of the things (live football, festivals, summer holidays etc.) that have been stripped from them for 18 months. And yeah whilst it’s quite a privileged position to have those things in the first place, mentally these things can all affect us differently. I know personally it feels like live isn’t moving forward after a year and a half on halt and it’s getting galling. 
 

People can’t align their emotions and mental state by scientific theory. I’m in no way anti-science, anti-vaccine (had both jabs) or anti-lockdown (I fully understood the need for the previous three) but any more and I’d struggle massively. I’m sure a couple here would like to smugly remind us ‘viruses don’t get tired’ but the fact is people do, and it’s getting to the point where people will begin to turn against science if they’re not given a break, and that’s infinitely more dangerous than a virus we’re beginning under control. 
 

Once again I think social media has a lot to answer for. The worst on both sides who have been asking for restrictions dropped at some of the worst points or demanding we don’t open up at all until there’s zero cases and it gets massively amplified despite being the minority, and the majority just want to get through it, even if their opinions are slightly differing.  I just hope 21st can go ahead as usual with limited consequence and the boring bastards on both sides can be silenced once and for all. 

Starting with the bolded here, I actually have a foot in both camps - I know that I've said that viruses don't get tired (and that's not smugness, that's a simple statement of fact about how it might beat us) but also this thing has worn on me and I really want to see something other than my workplace, my food shop and my apartment. It's not so bad in terms of restrictions over here but my workplace get damned ornery about people taking trips to places where they might get sick from interactions with other people. So yes, and I think I made this point a little while back too, people certainly will stop regarding the science if they don't get a break. I'm just hoping that the vaccine performs as intended and as such it means those restrictions in the UK and elsewhere are lifted soon enough.

 

WRT the rest of the post, I totally agree with social media acting as an amplifier, but I'm not convinced that introverts had it as easy as extroverts pre-Covid even with the benefits of "Netflix, Uber Eats and Amazon Prime". That being said, as I said before, I'm not convinced that they're right either.

 

1 minute ago, Costock_Fox said:

I honestly have no idea what you are getting at sorry. If you want to go out, go out, if you don’t want to go out, don’t go out. 
 

I’m not sure anyone is dragging introverts out of the house, if they are then they need telling to **** off. Nothing more nothing less.

My point is that the folks who choose "don't go out" say that they had a more difficult life because the world was more designed for those who choose "go out" before lockdown, and therefore that choice is unfair and it should be more equitable. (Again, I'm not 100% convinced of that viewpoint but it is more complex than just the choice itself.

[Izzy]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

TBH I think that this, and by extension, this whole crisis, leads into an interesting conversation about introverts, extroverts...and who the world favours/is designed for.

 

Without a doubt, the last eighteen months (give or take) have favoured the introverts and the extroverts have had it pretty damn hard. However, I have heard an argument from introverts saying that is simply the same difficulty introverts had to face every day before this all hit - a world based around and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts. I don't think it's inaccurate to say that socially awkward people have at least had it difficult in terms of their lives for quite some time now.

 

My own personal take is that it is indeed somewhere in the middle that things need to meet in the future, where both social types can have equal ease of life and derive pleasure from it in their own ways.

I think it depends what your definition of introvert and extrovert is. Many people have the misconception that introvert = quiet, loner, socially awkward, and extrovert = loud, out there, brash, life and soul of the party etc.

 

My understanding of the difference between the two is where they get their 'energy' from. Introverts get their energy from within, whereas extroverts get their energy from others around them.

 

Obviously extroverts in this sense have struggled more in lockdown, but I'm not sure I agree that the 'world is based and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts'.

 

Some of the happiest people I know (pre and post COVID) are introverts, and I've never heard any of them say the world was 'difficult' for them or weighted towards those with extrovert tendencies.

 

[Finnaldo]

7 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Starting with the bolded here, I actually have a foot in both camps - I know that I've said that viruses don't get tired (and that's not smugness, that's a simple statement of fact about how it might beat us) but also this thing has worn on me and I really want to see something other than my workplace, my food shop and my apartment. It's not so bad in terms of restrictions over here but my workplace get damned ornery about people taking trips to places where they might get sick from interactions with other people. So yes, and I think I made this point a little while back too, people certainly will stop regarding the science if they don't get a break. I'm just hoping that the vaccine performs as intended and as such it means those restrictions in the UK and elsewhere are lifted soon enough.

 

WRT the rest of the post, I totally agree with social media acting as an amplifier, but I'm not convinced that introverts had it as easy as extroverts pre-Covid even with the benefits of "Netflix, Uber Eats and Amazon Prime". That being said, as I said before, I'm not convinced that they're right either.

Sorry Mac, my point wasn’t that you in particular have been smug about it and I do get the point of it, I know you’ve occasionally rubbed people the wrong way but I don’t tend to find your posts particularly smug. I have seen people on here and elsewhere make that point much more combatively however. 
 

And whilst I didn’t greatly expand on that initial points re: introverts, my point was that these services have greatly expanded the options for introverts, and if anything even pre-pandemic the sort of innovations and services we saw were geared towards that: you can get restaurant-quality food delivered to you, fresh ingredients shipped to your door, groceries or retail shopping delivered next day and even more commonly now same day, even the hard part of dating or meeting others can be done over dating apps. I don’t think you can argue this is all benefitting those who prefer to keep to themselves or a small group of friends. There’s even the trialling of those Amazon supermarkets where you walk in and out and are billed on your phone, without speaking to anyone. It may not be purposeful, but markets, services and modes of socialising have all shifted towards the introverted. For years pubs, cinemas and ‘in-person’ entertainment have been struggling or receding somewhat. I’d genuinely like to hear your opinion on it but I can’t see how for the decade, things haven’t been suited towards those who are introverted.

[leicsmac]

5 minutes ago, Izzy said:

I think it depends what your definition of introvert and extrovert is. Many people have the misconception that introvert = quiet, loner, socially awkward, and extrovert = loud, out there, brash, life and soul of the party etc.

 

My understanding of the difference between the two is where they get their 'energy' from. Introverts get their energy from within, whereas extroverts get their energy from others around them.

 

Obviously extroverts in this sense have struggled more in lockdown, but I'm not sure I agree that the 'world is based and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts'.

 

Some of the happiest people I know (pre and post COVID) are introverts, and I've never heard any of them say the world was 'difficult' for them or weighted towards those with extrovert tendencies.

 

 

3 minutes ago, Finnaldo said:

Sorry Mac, my point wasn’t that you in particular have been smug about it and I do get the point of it, I know you’ve occasionally rubbed people the wrong way but I don’t tend to find your posts particularly smug. I have seen people on here and elsewhere make that point much more combatively however. 
 

And whilst I didn’t greatly expand on that initial points re: introverts, my point was that these services have greatly expanded the options for introverts, and if anything even pre-pandemic the sort of innovations and services we saw were geared towards that: you can get restaurant-quality food delivered to you, fresh ingredients shipped to your door, groceries or retail shopping delivered next day and even more commonly now same day, even the hard part of dating or meeting others can be done over dating apps. I don’t think you can argue this is all benefitting those who prefer to keep to themselves or a small group of friends. There’s even the trialling of those Amazon supermarkets where you walk in and out and are billed on your phone, without speaking to anyone. It may not be purposeful, but markets, services and modes of socialising have all shifted towards the introverted. For years pubs, cinemas and ‘in-person’ entertainment have been struggling or receding somewhat. I’d genuinely like to hear your opinion on it but I can’t see how for the decade, things haven’t been suited towards those who are introverted.

You both make absolutely fair points, and I'll hasten to comment again that I am very much unsure of the reading of the situation from the introverts I've heard from, I'm merely presenting the argument as they have framed it.

 

This is going to sound like a cop-out, but I'm not picking a poison either way because I think it's so subjective. But it does make for an interesting discussion precisely because of that, and that's why I brought it up.

[Guest Kopfkino]

1 hour ago, Izzy said:

I think it depends what your definition of introvert and extrovert is. Many people have the misconception that introvert = quiet, loner, socially awkward, and extrovert = loud, out there, brash, life and soul of the party etc.

 

My understanding of the difference between the two is where they get their 'energy' from. Introverts get their energy from within, whereas extroverts get their energy from others around them.

 

Obviously extroverts in this sense have struggled more in lockdown, but I'm not sure I agree that the 'world is based and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts'.

 

Some of the happiest people I know (pre and post COVID) are introverts, and I've never heard any of them say the world was 'difficult' for them or weighted towards those with extrovert tendencies.

 

Aye it’s most frustrating that introvert is seen as a synonym for shy, socially awkward, loner etc, it might manifest itself that way but that’s not really what it is. That’s being shy, loner, socially awkward not an introvert, it’s not mutually exclusive.

 

Im fairly introvert and I’m more than keen to do things alone sometimes but I also enjoy big gatherings and talking to complete strangers, mainly because it provides huge observational material and the challenge of working people out.

 

I think the world is setup more for a particular subset of extroverts, if you’re an introvert and happy with the world, it’s probably because you’re easy-going asf and not an angry, think everyone’s a moron introvert like me 

[String fellow]

1 hour ago, Izzy said:

I think it depends what your definition of introvert and extrovert is. Many people have the misconception that introvert = quiet, loner, socially awkward, and extrovert = loud, out there, brash, life and soul of the party etc.

 

My understanding of the difference between the two is where they get their 'energy' from. Introverts get their energy from within, whereas extroverts get their energy from others around them.

 

Obviously extroverts in this sense have struggled more in lockdown, but I'm not sure I agree that the 'world is based and designed for happiness based on social interaction for extroverts'.

 

Some of the happiest people I know (pre and post COVID) are introverts, and I've never heard any of them say the world was 'difficult' for them or weighted towards those with extrovert tendencies.

 

There are, of course, websites where one can test oneself on the introvert-ambivert-extrovert continuum, such as the one below. It has 14 questions, including ones involving social situations which some introverts wouldn't ever get involved with in the first place! At the end, it provides an interesting summary of the inquirer's personality. 

https://www.psychologies.co.uk/self/are-you-an-introvert-or-an-extrovert.html

[filbertway]

Heres hoping we see cases level off at 5-8k for the whole of next week, that be pretty deliciois

[Parafox]

2 hours ago, String fellow said:

There are, of course, websites where one can test oneself on the introvert-ambivert-extrovert continuum, such as the one below. It has 14 questions, including ones involving social situations which some introverts wouldn't ever get involved with in the first place! At the end, it provides an interesting summary of the inquirer's personality. 

https://www.psychologies.co.uk/self/are-you-an-introvert-or-an-extrovert.html

I did the quiz. I found that I was somewhere in between the available responses but I answered as honestly as I could.

The result was nothing like me.

[String fellow]

1 hour ago, Parafox said:

I did the quiz. I found that I was somewhere in between the available responses but I answered as honestly as I could.

The result was nothing like me.

Mine seemed pretty accurate. It may be that people at the extreme ends of the range are easier to characterise. 

[Soup]

On 04/06/2021 at 11:36, StanSP said:

 

 

 

 

 

Israel have been trialing the Pfizer vaccine on children so this is interesting

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/93-doctors-sign-letter-urging-goverment-to-hold-off-on-vaccinating-children/

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, Soup said:

Israel have been trialing the Pfizer vaccine on children so this is interesting

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/93-doctors-sign-letter-urging-goverment-to-hold-off-on-vaccinating-children/

We are far from being anti vax in my household. 
 

we’ve had the virus amongst us both last spring and again around new year. On both occasions my thirteen y o showed absolutely no signs of illness whatsoever.  Hence my wife has decided that there is no need for him to be vaccinated if offered.  I sort of get where she is coming from but presume the idea of vaccinating the youth is to slow transmission in general rather than protect them specifically. 
 

I certainly understand the stance of the Israeli doctors who have signed that letter