Ozan Kabak

[Ric Flair]

10 minutes ago, Father Ted said:

I’d rather play Amartey. Not impressed at all, this man stinks. Couldn’t even get into a Liverpool side that had Henderson and Nat Phillips at centre half. We need an experienced centre half, not a youth that’s looked awful in a short stint at Liverpool and is a big gamble. 

Was one of the best young defenders in the Bundesliga in 2019/20, there's enough ability there. 

[STUHILL]

 

Some good stuff in there 

[An Sionnach]

13 minutes ago, Father Ted said:

I’d rather play Amartey. Not impressed at all, this man stinks. Couldn’t even get into a Liverpool side that had Henderson and Nat Phillips at centre half. We need an experienced centre half, not a youth that’s looked awful in a short stint at Liverpool and is a big gamble. 

A couple of injuries or positive tests and its Fofana and Kabak at the back. Doesn't fill me with confidence . If its six million more for Tarks, do that.

[moore_94]

1 minute ago, An Sionnach said:

A couple of injuries or positive tests and its Fofana and Kabak at the back. Doesn't fill me with confidence . If its six million more for Tarks, do that.

Probably double what we would pay for Kabak to get Tarkowski

[An Sionnach]

2 minutes ago, moore_94 said:

Probably double what we would pay for Kabak to get Tarkowski

Word on the street is 20 million, a good investment I reckon . Five years of solid, no nonsense defending.

[kingfox]

15 minutes ago, gurru991 said:

All three of those players have huge potential & will continue to improve with coaching & game time. It's solid business to buy young players with a strong upside who will double or triple in value.

And that’s the way we usually go; however on this occasion I don’t think it’s the right move.

 

Wes Morgan is gone, apart from Jonny Evans our other centre back options lack experience and leadership, Evans is the glue that holds the defence together, take him out then you’re left with an inexperienced partnership.

 

If Tarkowski isn’t reachable this summer, then you need a stop gap until he becomes available. 
 

If the idea is to get in someone long term now, then the only answer for me is Joachim Andersen. 
 

1. He’s available 

2. He has the leadership skills that we desperately need.

[moore_94]

3 minutes ago, An Sionnach said:

Word on the street is 20 million, a good investment I reckon . Five years of solid, no nonsense defending.

I reckon probably looking at closer to £25m for him, Burnley will try and get every penny out of whoever they sell to because Brentford have a decent sized sell on clause as well

[jeffschlupp]

4 minutes ago, kingfox said:

inexperienced partnership

Cags is 25 now and has 113 games in the Bundesliga or PL + 38 caps for Turkey.

 

Andersen has 91 games across PL/Serie A/La Liga + 8 national caps, although I will bear in mind another 49 Eredivisie games. Even Tarkowski has not played 160 top flight games, and in terms of leadership plays alongside his captain Ben Mee at all times for Burnley.

 

What about those two make them more experienced and better leaders?

Edited 12 July 2021 by jeffschlupp

[jruizc_]

1. Kabak had the issue of the language, not here with Soyuncu

2. Kabak is better with a good defender on his side (Evans, Soyuncu and Fofana are, Phillips and Williams are good but nowhere near our CBs level)

3. 12 million is a steal

4. Only 21 years plenty of time for him to develop

5. Really high ceilling and potential

[majaco]

If people keep arguing about whether or not he was ahead of Phillips and Williams in the Liverpool pecking order and about whether he was injured, this could get to 100 pages.

 

We do need experience.  Evans is an asset.  Soyuncu has played for enough seasons now that he should be developing leadership.   Bertrand, if he ever does sign, will provide experience .

 

If our recruitment team decide Kabak is a good option, there is a strong chance they are right.

[kingfox]

23 minutes ago, jeffschlupp said:

I do think Soyuncu and Fofana both take a lot of unnecessary flak, just because they are young does not mean they can't read the game or use their heads.

 

You've got the captain behind them and they'll be protected by one of the best tacklers in the division.  They'll never prove they are capable of leading a back line if they are always having to be babysat by Evans

Really?

 

All you need to do is look at the 4-2 defeats to Newcastle & Spurs last season.

 

They got exposed, because the key to our defence in Jonny Evans couldn’t play.

 

That’s why they need to be babysat for a reason, because as I said, Evans is the glue that holds them together.

[jeffschlupp]

Just now, kingfox said:

All you need to do is look at the 4-2 defeats to Newcastle & Spurs last season.

Both of these were psychological capitulations if nothing else. Against Spurs we looked absolutely fine going backwards until we conceded the equaliser and the entire team collectively soiled themselves just like Bournemouth away the year before, as they worked out they were now outside the top 4 again.

 

Newcastle we lost Evans half an hour before kick-off and you're shuffling along Fofana into the middle of a 3 where he's never played before, and Castagne to CB out of nowhere.

 

It's unfair to make sweeping judgements on those two moments

[TMELcfc]

Saw the guy at Schalke, he was immense in a really poor side. What I saw at Liverpool was mixed. Sometimes really good, sometimes really s***

[Attywolf]

9 minutes ago, kingfox said:

Really?

 

All you need to do is look at the 4-2 defeats to Newcastle & Spurs last season.

 

They got exposed, because the key to our defence in Jonny Evans couldn’t play.

 

That’s why they need to be babysat for a reason, because as I said, Evans is the glue that holds them together.

You mean the 2 games that the defence had to be changed very early on so had no experience with eachother. Even then they didn't look exposed . Heck fofana looked like he could cover for Evans and without his injury we could of won that last game

 

[An Sionnach]

5 minutes ago, kingfox said:

Really?

 

All you need to do is look at the 4-2 defeats to Newcastle & Spurs last season.

 

They got exposed, because the key to our defence in Jonny Evans couldn’t play.

 

That’s why they need to be babysat for a reason, because as I said, Evans is the glue that holds them together.

We need to win games - now - we need points. We are not an experiment or finishing school. We are a top six side and we are going to have to fight tooth and nail to stay there. We need experience in the team and Rodgers has more or less admitted that. I have no reason to doubt that in five years Kabak won't be a top-class CB ,if we stay top six we can buy him then.

[matty98]

This could end up being a really good deal. He's got all the attributes and is only a year older than Fofana!

No idea how we're going to keep 4 very good CB's happy though.

[STUHILL]

14 minutes ago, kingfox said:

Really?

 

All you need to do is look at the 4-2 defeats to Newcastle & Spurs last season.

 

They got exposed, because the key to our defence in Jonny Evans couldn’t play.

 

That’s why they need to be babysat for a reason, because as I said, Evans is the glue that holds them together.

Bit harsh as Evans was injured in the warm-up and even experienced pros would have struggled with that last minute spanner. 

 

No doubt Evans is a great organiser and leader, but Soyuncu is 25 now and has Kasper and other seasoned pros around him. 

 

I think Fofana and Soyuncu will actually prove to be a top pairing, and Kabak has already played in the Premier League and is a Turkish International. Hardly, inexperienced at this level, even if all 3 are 25 and under. 

Edited 12 July 2021 by STUHILL

[Attywolf]

3 minutes ago, An Sionnach said:

We need to win games - now - we need points. We are not an experiment or finishing school. We are a top six side and we are going to have to fight tooth and nail to stay there. We need experience in the team and Rodgers has more or less admitted that. I have no reason to doubt that in five years Kabak won't be a top-class CB ,if we stay top six we can buy him then.

With that attitude we never would of signed fofana /Justin or any of the signings we have already made 

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

It’s difficult moving mid season to the Premier League. It’s even harder going straight into the defending champions back line during an injury crisis. Think he did ok, unless you expected him to be a cross between Franz Beckenbauer and Sergio Ramos.
 

I’d give the lad a go at £13m. That’s pocket change these days.

[Father Ted]

36 minutes ago, An Sionnach said:

A couple of injuries or positive tests and its Fofana and Kabak at the back. Doesn't fill me with confidence . If its six million more for Tarks, do that.

Soyuncu and Fofana is as bad. If Evans is out we are in trouble. As you’ve said, give us a Tarkowski over Kabak any day.

[gurru991]

21 minutes ago, jruizc_ said:

1. Kabak had the issue of the language, not here with Soyuncu

2. Kabak is better with a good defender on his side (Evans, Soyuncu and Fofana are, Phillips and Williams are good but nowhere near our CBs level)

3. 12 million is a steal

4. Only 21 years plenty of time for him to develop

5. Really high ceilling and potential

1. Yes

2.Yes

3. Yes. Yes & Yes

4.Yes

5. Yes & really fits City's master plan

[kingfox]

11 minutes ago, jeffschlupp said:

What about those two make them more experienced and better leaders?

That band around his arm

 

8 minutes ago, jeffschlupp said:

Both of these were psychological capitulations if nothing else. Against Spurs we looked absolutely fine going backwards until we conceded the equaliser and the entire team collectively soiled themselves just like Bournemouth away the year before, as they worked out they were now outside the top 4 again.

 

Newcastle we lost Evans half an hour before kick-off and you're shuffling along Fofana into the middle of a 3 where he's never played before, and Castagne to CB out of nowhere.

 

It's unfair to make sweeping judgements on those two moments

Excuses, plus these “psychological capitulations” have happened too many times.

 

Would those results have happened if Evans was fit? You could say probably not.

 

Fofana & Cags are terrific defenders, but they don’t possess the leadership skills that we require.

 

Our squad last season lacked depth, it lacked experienced, it lacked leadership. Rodgers said that himself when the season finished. 
 

We have lost Big Wes & Fuchs, we’re replacing Fuchs with an experienced player in Bertrand, we need to replace Big Wes with either someone who has leadership qualities, are experienced or ideally both.

 

We’ve seen how this defence is once you take Evans out of it, more often than not it doesn’t hold up.

 

Cags, Little Wes & Kabak are all well rated, but in terms of what we desperately need when Evans is out of the team, they don’t have it.

[gurru991]

Cags & Wes both show potential to be leaders & I believe they will both progress in this area as the season progresses. 

[VLC86]

51 minutes ago, gurru991 said:

The difference between the two is about 35-40 million pounds.

But if you get the choice of the two, you pay it.

[VLC86]

Cheap, sensible deal but I wasn’t impressed with him at Liverpool. As a back up, fine, but if we get violated with injuries as usual and we have to rely on him we might regret this one.