Boubakary Soumare

[hackneyfox]

28 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

He was signed to play as the left sided CM in a 433, the position he featured in multiple times at the start of the season. He was given a run of over 10 games as a starter to bed into the team and make an impact, which he did not make. He had one brilliant game away to Spartak Moscow, but that was about it.

 

Away to Southampton (a game he started), he was replaced by Kiernan Dewsbury-Hall at half time who took his place and kept it, because he did make an impact not only in that game but game after game, time and time again. We are selling Soumare because KDH beat him to that place in the team, which is why he was rewarded with a 5 year contract.

 

With regards to the statement: "we have a very poor manager incapable of coaching players to improvement." Here are some facts:

- James Justin signed from Luton Town, subsequently capped for England. One of the best full backs in the league before getting injured. Looked out of his depth prior to Rodgers coaching him.

- Wesley Fofana considered one of the best defenders under 23 in Europe. Clearly rates Rodgers as a coach as seen by his reaction after being supported by him after 6 months out after a horrendous injury.

- James Maddison turned from an out of form, out of confidence player into player of the season with the best G+A numbers of any English player in the league.

- Luke Thomas promoted to the first team, played in the FA Cup final, which we won.

- KDH loaned out to the Championship, challenged by Rodgers to prove himself first team worthy, which he did.

- Harvey Barnes had 11 goals and 12 assists in all competitions last season.

- Etc, etc.

 

Rodgers has many flaws, but saying he is incapable of coaching players to improvement is factually wrong. 

 

 

 

How very dare you come on here with your common sense approach and posts, we're in the middle of a meltdown and you're just trying to spoil it.

[murphy]

41 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

He was signed to play as the left sided CM in a 433, the position he featured in multiple times at the start of the season. He was given a run of over 10 games as a starter to bed into the team and make an impact, which he did not make. He had one brilliant game away to Spartak Moscow, but that was about it.

 

Away to Southampton (a game he started), he was replaced by Kiernan Dewsbury-Hall at half time who took his place and kept it, because he did make an impact not only in that game but game after game, time and time again. We are selling Soumare because KDH beat him to that place in the team, which is why he was rewarded with a 5 year contract.

 

With regards to the statement: "we have a very poor manager incapable of coaching players to improvement." Here are some facts:

- James Justin signed from Luton Town, subsequently capped for England. One of the best full backs in the league before getting injured. Looked out of his depth prior to Rodgers coaching him.

- Wesley Fofana considered one of the best defenders under 23 in Europe. Clearly rates Rodgers as a coach as seen by his reaction after being supported by him after 6 months out after a horrendous injury.

- James Maddison turned from an out of form, out of confidence player into player of the season with the best G+A numbers of any English player in the league.

- Luke Thomas promoted to the first team, played in the FA Cup final, which we won.

- KDH loaned out to the Championship, challenged by Rodgers to prove himself first team worthy, which he did.

- Harvey Barnes had 11 goals and 12 assists in all competitions last season.

- Etc, etc.

 

Rodgers has many flaws, but saying he is incapable of coaching players to improvement is factually wrong. 

 

 

 

Everything that you say might well be true but you cannot claim them as facts.

 

The emergence of Justin, Thomas and KDH might be fact but to say that is because of Rodgers is not a fact, just an opinion.  Any young player will sink or swim given the greater challenges they face when they step up into the first team.  Their improvement might be less about coaching and more about the talent of the individual and their natural progression.

[Dan]

Vestergaard and Bertrand will both be on quite good money. They're both at the prime age to get a good deal. I couldn't say for sure it's £80k a week but it wouldn't surprise me one bit, as obviously ridiculous as it is.

[hackneyfox]

12 minutes ago, murphy said:

Everything that you say might well be true but you cannot claim them as facts.

 

The emergence of Justin, Thomas and KDH might be fact but to say that is because of Rodgers is not a fact, just an opinion.  Any young player will sink or swim given the greater challenges they face when they step up into the first team.  Their improvement might be less about coaching and more about the talent of the individual and their natural progression.

Similarly those claiming that Rodgers is a liar and incapable of coaching players to improvement (see FoxyLeon above) are also expressing an opinion and cannot claim that as facts. If we only dealt with facts then you may as well close this place down (certainly during the close season).

[hackneyfox]

3 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

Vestergaard and Bertrand will both be on quite good money. They're both at the prime age to get a good deal. I couldn't say for sure it's £80k a week but it wouldn't surprise me one bit, as obviously ridiculous as it is.

Bertrand is 32 so hardly a prime age to get a good deal.

[Dan]

Just now, hackneyfox said:

Bertrand is 32 so hardly a prime age to get a good deal.

Will he or won't he be on more than he was at Southampton?

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, Dan LCFC said:

Will he or won't he be on more than he was at Southampton?

When does any player move for less, or even to maintain the status quo?   

[Dan]

Just now, Dahnsouff said:

When does any player move for less, or even to maintain the status quo?   

Which is what I'm saying? He's come here because we've offered him a good last deal.

[Dahnsouff]

18 minutes ago, murphy said:

Everything that you say might well be true but you cannot claim them as facts.

 

The emergence of Justin, Thomas and KDH might be fact but to say that is because of Rodgers is not a fact, just an opinion.  Any young player will sink or swim given the greater challenges they face when they step up into the first team.  Their improvement might be less about coaching and more about the talent of the individual and their natural progression.

The only fact you can make is that it is in part down to both sides, the player and the manager (and his associated team)

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, Dan LCFC said:

Which is what I'm saying? He's come here because we've offered him a good last deal.

Was agreeing but disguised it as a question  

[StriderHiryu]

15 minutes ago, murphy said:

Everything that you say might well be true but you cannot claim them as facts.

 

The emergence of Justin, Thomas and KDH might be fact but to say that is because of Rodgers is not a fact, just an opinion.  Any young player will sink or swim given the greater challenges they face when they step up into the first team.  Their improvement might be less about coaching and more about the talent of the individual and their natural progression.

Disagree. If multiple players across multiple teams coached by the same person are improving over time, then said person has proven they can coach and improve players. Even players like Amartey and Ndidi have noticeably gotten better on the ball under Rodgers.

 

If we were talking about one or two players, then I would agree it would be an opinion. When a manager is lauded for being one of the best coaches for young players in the game and has proved to be able to coach and improve so many players across his career then it's no longer subjective, but objective to say that players improve under his coaching. 

[murphy]

Just now, Dahnsouff said:

The only fact you can make is that it is in part down to both sides, the player and the manager (and his associated team)

Not necessarily.  That is not fact.

 

It could be that these players improved despite Rodgers.  I'm not for a minute saying that is what I think, but just to pedantically demonstrate that it is not a fact that they improved in any part down to Rodgers, although it is highly likely imo.

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, murphy said:

Not necessarily.  That is not fact.

 

It could be that these players improved despite Rodgers.  I'm not for a minute saying that is what I think, but just to pedantically demonstrate that it is not a fact that they improved in any part down to Rodgers, although it is highly likely imo.

Pedantic correction is accepted, noted and responded to with the appropriate emoji 

[murphy]

2 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

Disagree. If multiple players across multiple teams coached by the same person are improving over time, then said person has proven they can coach and improve players. Even players like Amartey and Ndidi have noticeably gotten better on the ball under Rodgers.

 

If we were talking about one or two players, then I would agree it would be an opinion. When a manager is lauded for being one of the best coaches for young players in the game and has proved to be able to coach and improve so many players across his career then it's no longer subjective, but objective to say that players improve under his coaching. 

I think it is very likely true but then what about players that went backwards last year - Soyuncu, Wilf etc

 

I don't disagree with you in general I just disagree that you are stating facts.

[MarriedaLeicesterGirl]

12 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

Will he or won't he be on more than he was at Southampton?

 

11 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

When does any player move for less, or even to maintain the status quo?   

I mean, he was a free transfer. His "status quo" was technically "unemployed."

 

If I remember correctly, the sticking point on signing him was we only wanted a one-year deal, and he wanted two. In such situations, the previous salary at the club you no longer work for isn't actually your biggest bargaining chip. (I wouldn't be surprised if there were some unmet incentives in that deal, too.)

 

I very much doubt he is on as much as Vesty, who was a last minute panic buy.

[MPH]

7 hours ago, Micky said:

I wouldn't need one. I just make it all up, like most of the guff that I read on here. 

 

 

 

you might be right, and that’s. Fine if that’s the conclusion you want to come to, but you’d still be guessing- you have no way of knowing.

[hackneyfox]

8 minutes ago, MarriedaLeicesterGirl said:

 

I mean, he was a free transfer. His "status quo" was technically "unemployed."

 

If I remember correctly, the sticking point on signing him was we only wanted a one-year deal, and he wanted two. In such situations, the previous salary at the club you no longer work for isn't actually your biggest bargaining chip. (I wouldn't be surprised if there were some unmet incentives in that deal, too.)

 

I very much doubt he is on as much as Vesty, who was a last minute panic buy.

Agree with this, if you're unemployed the your last salary, PL average or average at the team that may sign you doesn't/shouldn't really come into it.

We knew we had to reduce our overall salary so why would you put him on the 'average' when he's only being signed as a backup?

 

[MarriedaLeicesterGirl]

Just now, hackneyfox said:

Agree with this, if you're unemployed the your last salary, PL average or average at the team that may sign you doesn't/shouldn't really come into it.

We knew we had to reduce our overall salary so why would you put him on the 'average' when he's only being signed as a backup?

 

I mean, debating a 1 year vs 2 year contract isn't a sign the club is interested in "investing" in the player. It's the realisation on the player's part that everyone knows he is on a steep downhill trajectory and won't be getting a new deal.

 

In all honesty, I expect Bertrand to have a niggle all season and then retire in May.

 

But back to Soumare ... I think there are issues behind the scenes we know nothing about, because he is certainly the kind of player you give time to develop - which Rodgers has always done in the past and said he was going to do in this case. The kid might just really want out of England. If we can get a good deal from Monaco, I will thank the stars and wish him luck in his career!

[TommyK]

Oh god I'm so bored. Couldn't even be bothered to read the last pages. I presume it was nothing to do with actual transfers. 

[Vardinio'sCat]

1 minute ago, TommyK said:

Oh god I'm so bored. Couldn't even be bothered to read the last pages. I presume it was nothing to do with actual transfers. 

[hackneyfox]

55 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

Will he or won't he be on more than he was at Southampton?

Less I would hope as he's nearing the end of his career and was brought in as a backup.

[kingfox]

The Soumare situation feels very much like Ndombele at Spurs.

 

Soumare looked good early on for us, in Pre Season he had some good performances, in early Europa League games he had some good performances, in the Premier League however, he’s never really got going. If I recall Ndombele had a hot start at Spurs, his form dramatically dropped off and Jose then froze him out. He got another shot, then his form deteriorated again, then they loaned him back to France.

 

Whether we loan him out or sell him, it seems Soumare could easily follow suit like Ndombele has and end up back in France.

 

If we do give him a second chance then he simply has to stop being lazy, he is one of the laziest players I’ve seen in a Leicester shirt, I’ve often referred to him as a World Class jogger. If he gets another shot and keeps doing what he’s doing, Brendan will freeze him out again and eventually it will be goodbye.

 

 

[LFEFox23]

Difficult situation with Soumare, whilst i feel like the lad has tones of ability he also looks well off the pace and potentially has a attitude problem?! 

 

If rumours are true about Monaco, personally i think id accept any bids above the £20m mark and move on.

[majaco]

3 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

He was signed to play as the left sided CM in a 433, the position he featured in multiple times at the start of the season. He was given a run of over 10 games as a starter to bed into the team and make an impact, which he did not make. He had one brilliant game away to Spartak Moscow, but that was about it.

 

Away to Southampton (a game he started), he was replaced by Kiernan Dewsbury-Hall at half time who took his place and kept it, because he did make an impact not only in that game but game after game, time and time again. We are selling Soumare because KDH beat him to that place in the team, which is why he was rewarded with a 5 year contract.

 

With regards to the statement: "we have a very poor manager incapable of coaching players to improvement." Here are some facts:

- James Justin signed from Luton Town, subsequently capped for England. One of the best full backs in the league before getting injured. Looked out of his depth prior to Rodgers coaching him.

- Wesley Fofana considered one of the best defenders under 23 in Europe. Clearly rates Rodgers as a coach as seen by his reaction after being supported by him after 6 months out after a horrendous injury.

- James Maddison turned from an out of form, out of confidence player into player of the season with the best G+A numbers of any English player in the league.

- Luke Thomas promoted to the first team, played in the FA Cup final, which we won.

- KDH loaned out to the Championship, challenged by Rodgers to prove himself first team worthy, which he did.

- Harvey Barnes had 11 goals and 12 assists in all competitions last season.

- Etc, etc.

 

Rodgers has many flaws, but saying he is incapable of coaching players to improvement is factually wrong. 

 

 

 

Don't be so sensible.

 

Much easier to like your post than respond to the hogwash.

[Bluearmyfox28]

If the sale of Soumare can partly fund a transfer for a player like Sangare then for me I’m all for it.

 

I understand the argument of us selling him to soon and not giving the kid a chance, but I just can’t see him fitting into our system.