Toxic malaise of ageing pros and players not arsed or happy to ride out big contracts

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

I was thinking about this last night and not sure it’s been widely discussed on here, or it may have been mentioned in passing in other threads. But how much is the squad dynamic impacting on our passive style of play at the moment - code for a lack of drive and situations where players aren’t bothered anymore.

 

Brendan as good as said this about Soyuncu, and then you’ve got the likes of Soumare, Praet and Castagne who are linked to move back abroad. And let’s not mention Fofana and Tielemans. That’s 6 players who would either start or at least be in the match day squad.

 

The likes of Perez, Vestergaard, Bertrand and a few others are clearly on wages that no one else will match.

 

Evans and Vardy are among the first names on the team sheet, but they are pensioners in footballing terms now.

 

We then have others who you could argue aren’t getting a fair look in - Iheanacho et al.

 

In the first team 11 I can only pick out 4 players who would be motivated to an optimum level - Justin, KDH, Barnes, Maddison. Possibly Ward or Iversen if he comes in to the side. 

 

We’ve lost sight of what Pearson always used to do - recruit players with a hunger and drive. I’m not doubting the professionalism of any of the current lot (apart from Fofana!), but success is often the result of marginal gains - like the 1-5% (or whatever) that’s added by being incentivised in an optimum way. It could be the difference between closing a shot down and not for example. I really fear this summer was a cross roads, and we haven’t managed to change course.

[blue blood]

Agree.  Since claudio I don’t think we have had a manager that wears his heart on his sleeve and that has fed down into the playing staff.  

[taupe]

There's a broad discussion in that question. Does attitude impact on performance? I think we can yes to that. What impacts attitude? Team environment? Coaching? Etc etc etc

 

We all (or at least many of us) turn up day-after-day to do our jobs with no real passion for what we do. We enjoy the interaction with colleagues etc, sure, but the job itself? Not so much. That's about the money. And if the work place itself is joyless? Much of this is, sadly, sign of the times.

 

I can wonder equally if pros are loosing/have lost their love for the game. The love for the game that once drove them, that gave them that 'marginal gain', has gone.

 

 

Edited 30 August 2022 by taupe

[Claudio Fannieri]

I think this stems from the manager, the tactics set the tone and at the moment we are setting up to play a passive, turgid style of play, we saw it in the last days under Ranieri and Puel where the players looked out of sorts and were often accused of looking disinterested. I honestly believe a change in Manager and we will see an upturn in energy, performances and results. 
 

There are a lot of players who have contracts expiring, World Cup ambitions etc so there is still plenty of hunger within the squad to have good seasons, albeit for differing reasons. 

[South Shire Fox]

100% agree. Been saying for ages now that Rodgers buys players just for their technical ability and completely disregards how important a players personality is to making a strong team. He constantly goes on about the team needing to show character, leadership and aggression but i cant think of a single player hes bought since being at the club that has any of those traits. Especially leadership, infact in all the clubs hes ever managed im struggling to  think of a leader hes bought their either.

He just signs nice technical players thinking hes in charge of Barcelona. But then what do you expect when he says he’ll be signing players with a winning mentality but then signs two ageing Southampton players. He talks a good game but the bloke is a complete and utter moron.

Edited 30 August 2022 by South Shire Fox

[murphy]

And to think it was not that long ago that our players used to regularly describe the club as family.  How quickly that seems to have evaporated.  When a malaise comes over a club it is very hard to shift.  I have seen it before and at other clubs and it seems to me that it becomes unstoppable.  A club will have to reach a nadir and a complete rebuild before the clouds dissipate, usually in a division or two below where they started.

 

Rodgers has been on record as saying that he likes what he calls silver medallist players.  Players that have lost their way at clubs.  The implication being that he can be the one to get their careers back on course and get the most out of them.  Well we have several such players within our squad already.  Earn your 200k per week Brendan and get these players back on course, reintegrate Cags and light a fire beneath him.  This is your speciality, or so you keep telling us.

[taupe]

I know it suits the current climate but this thread needn't be specifically about Rodgers. There are other Rodgers bashing threads so it'd be really cool to keep that conversation there.

 

I think there's a good discussion to be had on player motivation, how it impacts performance and how it is itself influenced. 

 

We see relative unease in our club at the moment, a good portion of which will be settled once the transfer window is gently closed. This unease will probably be reflected in the feeling around the place, in turn impacting motivation and hence performance.

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

21 minutes ago, taupe said:

I know it suits the current climate but this thread needn't be specifically about Rodgers. There are other Rodgers bashing threads so it'd be really cool to keep that conversation there.

 

I think there's a good discussion to be had on player motivation, how it impacts performance and how it is itself influenced. 

 

We see relative unease in our club at the moment, a good portion of which will be settled once the transfer window is gently closed. This unease will probably be reflected in the feeling around the place, in turn impacting motivation and hence performance.

I agree. Particularly because on the recruitment side Rodgers is part of a collective team who makes decisions.

 

I know from my own job and career that when I’ve not been arsed my productivity drops through the floor. For many reasons I think that is happening at our club. 

[Babylon]

Yes, mentioned this numerous times myself. People here too long, people wanting out, aging players and players Rodgers has just cast aside and then expects to step in and make a difference (they won't play for you now knob head). 

 

He was right about a rebuild, but with hindsight it needed to start last summer and we needed top quality starters, not more squad filler. We've wasted so much money on unused and unwanted squad filler, would could have bought 3 or 4 top quality starters instead. 

Edited 30 August 2022 by Babylon

[Captain...]

The problem with buying hungry players is if you then feed them they are no longer hungry, this squad tasted success, but also realised it is not sustainable at Leicester. How do you keep a world class player happy at Leicester? We can offer the potential of Europe and trophies, but we can't guarantee either. When someone comes in who can it will always be tough to keep.

 

Tielemans is an interesting case study as he is clearly very talented, but there is something there that lead to Monaco not playing him anf happy to sell. We saw it last season a drop off in focus that lead to so many mistakes. Soyuncu is another odd one, he had one great season alongside Evans then Fofana came along and I don't know if that unsettled him (maybe he always knew he was a snake) but his form has dropped off a cliff.

[Oldblueyes]

Listen, If your boss gave you a new 2 year contract including a substantial pay rise and then told you that on your workday you are not required to come in, would you be keen to leave?

[Shane]

Brendan Rodgers has the last say on transfers, he has said so himself. If the recruitment team came to him with someone like Craig Dawson for example, thinking we need a bit of experience as cover for Evans, would he take him?
 

Like you say he always bangs on about leadership and character blah blah blah, so why not actually sign players with those traits!

 

 

 

Edited 30 August 2022 by Shane

[RoboFox]

I'm starting to believe that Kasper could see what was happening and wanted out before it all goes south. 

[nnfox]

3 hours ago, Babylon said:

Yes, mentioned this numerous times myself. People here too long, people wanting out, aging players and players Rodgers has just cast aside and then expects to step in and make a difference (they won't play for you now knob head). 

 

He was right about a rebuild, but with hindsight it needed to start last summer and we needed top quality starters, not more squad filler. We've wasted so much money on unused and unwanted squad filler, would could have bought 3 or 4 top quality starters instead. 

This is exactly the problem.  We very rarely buy players who expect to be regularly starting, I can't remember the last one who came here and improved the starting line up.  Fofana? Tielemans?

 

Brendan has always had his favourites and seems reluctant to give anyone else a serious look in.  The trouble is that his favourites are getting old and those waiting in line have probably fallen from peak form due to lack of game time.

 

There is a serious lack of competition for starting places and that's not always through lack of quality.  I can't blame some of the players getting disheartened.

[Guest Col city fan]

Just what I’ve been saying for ages. The ‘squad’ didn’t need filling with yet more ‘squad players’. We needed to sign first teamers. Players who were clearly ready to challenge for a first team spot. 
Daka, Soumare, Bertrand, Vestergaard…

None of them clearly ready to get straight into the first team and to stay there.

Our recruitment, apart from Fofana has been bloody awful really. And we are now suffering because of it.

[Babylon]

17 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

Just what I’ve been saying for ages. The ‘squad’ didn’t need filling with yet more ‘squad players’. We needed to sign first teamers. Players who were clearly ready to challenge for a first team spot. 
Daka, Soumare, Bertrand, Vestergaard…

None of them clearly ready to get straight into the first team and to stay there.

Our recruitment, apart from Fofana has been bloody awful really. And we are now suffering because of it.

What I would say there is that Bertrand was nothing but a stop gap because of other injuries. Vestergaard, clearly was a last minute budget panic buy because of an injury, Daka was tardy replacement, hard to know when Vards is just going to stop performing. I have some understanding of those and the reasonings.  But Soumare 100%, what was the point. May as well have kept Praet and not bothered at all with him. 

[UHDrive]

The cancer started when we won the PL and we flooded the team with players. Some worked, some failed and moved on. Some stayed and stayed, and stayed even longer. 

 

The club has been a soft touch as far as im concerned with respect to players and their contracts and letting the scouting team do their job and relying on them as they should do.

 

We started getting some traction back under Puel with incoming players, but combined with his awful playing style the players that he had at his disposal in/out squad were never going to work. 

 

BR made subtle references as soon as he came about having a lean squad. What has changed? Nothing. The club have failed to move players on or exert pressure on them to do so and have consistently pandered down to players who never had what it took to play first team. 

Edited 30 August 2022 by UHDrive
Typo

[Lambert09]

In football, just like water, if it stays stagnant for too long it will go bad. 

 

I think everything has gone stale, from the football to the business side of things.  
 

in truth the easiest fix for most of our problems is a new manager. It’s a new hope to all the players and would remove some of the toxicity certain players have.

 

I don’t think we have a horrible group of players, the opposite actually, most of them are too bloody nice. But as you pointed out, there’s a clear lack of motivation for far too many in the squad and the fact that kasper requested to leave says a lot imo. 

[Fox92]

And add in a board that is completely happy to give these contracts and wages out.

[gazzaa2]

8 hours ago, South Shire Fox said:

100% agree. Been saying for ages now that Rodgers buys players just for their technical ability and completely disregards how important a players personality is to making a strong team. He constantly goes on about the team needing to show character, leadership and aggression but i cant think of a single player hes bought since being at the club that has any of those traits. Especially leadership, infact in all the clubs hes ever managed im struggling to  think of a leader hes bought their either.

He just signs nice technical players thinking hes in charge of Barcelona. But then what do you expect when he says he’ll be signing players with a winning mentality but then signs two ageing Southampton players. He talks a good game but the bloke is a complete and utter moron.

 

He was the same at Liverpool. He even wanted the players with leadership and character out the door because he was intimidated by them. Players like Reina, Agger and Carragher. Agger did a big interview last year around this btw. 

[Guest itude]

This another then ?

Leicester City are ready to make a move for West Ham defender Craig Dawson, according to reports.

Brendan Rodgers is in the market to replace Wesley Fofana with the 21-year-old's move to Chelsea close to a conclusion. City will look to bring in a new centre-back once Fofana's £70 million-plus move goes through and Dawson has been one of the latest players to be linked.

According to The Sun's Alan Nixon, the Foxes are "ready to rival" Aston Villa for the 32-year-old defender. Dawson is yet to feature for the Hammers this season following the arrivals of Thilo Kehrer and Nayef Aguerd.

[Area88]

Vardy is on 160k a week!

[Vestan Pance]

When Mendy ran his contract down and no one came in for him, so we re-signed him, that was the point we should have realised things were going wrong. I'm not getting at Mendy but clearly you don't progress by signing 'squad players'

[Dames]

10 minutes ago, Vestan Pance said:

When Mendy ran his contract down and no one came in for him, so we re-signed him, that was the point we should have realised things were going wrong. I'm not getting at Mendy but clearly you don't progress by signing 'squad players'

To be fair that was when covid was still relatively new and nobody knew about the long term impacts on clubs. It was a win win for both parties. 

[Raj]

Bloody long title thread