Is Tyson Fury one of the greatest heavyweights of all time?

[MPH]

34 minutes ago, indierich06 said:

The most impressive bobbing and weaving Fury does is when a difficult fight comes his way.

 

 

id say a fat and clearly out of shape Tyson taking on a Prime Wilder was a difficult fight…

[STEVIE B]

4 hours ago, Greg2607 said:

the problem with modern heavyweight boxing, is that there is too much money involved.  They would all fight each other more often if they were only getting £100,000 for a fight rather than £50m.   a £50m fight needs hyping up more, to get more commercial deals in place to underwrite the prize money and there is too much to lose, by losing the fight. 

 

I suspect that the legends of the past were having to fight, to keep putting food on the table and to provide for themselves in retirement. 

 

I also think it's hard to compare fighters over different eras. Muhammed Ali was 6ft 3 and 16 stone....  Mike Tyson was 5ft 10 and 15 stone.....   Tyson fury is 6ft 9 and 19 stone.....  he'd be a giant against those two.... who's to say they would get close enough, regularly enough to take him out.... 

 

I think Fury is the most skillful boxer of his generation, he can win in multiple different ways, but his legacy would be cemented by beating Fury and Usyk. Both of which I think he would. 

 

 

Joshua ? 

[MPH]

38 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

Oh unbunch your knickers, you know that was funny

 

you’ve come in here like you are taking on the top ten heavyweights yourself

 

take two tramadol, pop them under your tongue  and go sit in a dark room. You’ll feel better in the morning.

[Greg2607]

24 minutes ago, STEVIE B said:

Joshua ? 

correct. apologies!!  

[Greg2607]

although of all the current heavyweights, Fury IS the one I could see fighting himself. he's as mad as a box of frogs. 

[indierich06]

2 hours ago, MPH said:

 

 

id say a fat and clearly out of shape Tyson taking on a Prime Wilder was a difficult fight…

He was lucky to get such a high profile fight, given the state he was in and the state of his career. It was no-lose for him - big payday, if he wins then great, if he loses it's because 'oh I'm out of shape'. Since his comeback and return to fitness, he has ducked out of any decent fights - why hasn't he fought Usyk for undisputed? Why hasn't he fought Joshua? He's a master of spin, it's always someone else's fault - but at the end of the day, if he wanted these fights, they would happen.

[Samilktray]

He’s a big weird idiot and I personally couldn’t allow myself to openly be a fan of his tbqh 

[MPH]

51 minutes ago, indierich06 said:

He was lucky to get such a high profile fight, given the state he was in and the state of his career. It was no-lose for him - big payday, if he wins then great, if he loses it's because 'oh I'm out of shape'. Since his comeback and return to fitness, he has ducked out of any decent fights - why hasn't he fought Usyk for undisputed? Why hasn't he fought Joshua? He's a master of spin, it's always someone else's fault - but at the end of the day, if he wanted these fights, they would happen.

 

I don’t disagree with what you’re saying about him being lucky to get that fight,  but you can’t deny that it was a difficult fight for him.

 

Edited 27 July 2023 by MPH

[Raj]

15 hours ago, indierich06 said:

He was lucky to get such a high profile fight, given the state he was in and the state of his career. It was no-lose for him - big payday, if he wins then great, if he loses it's because 'oh I'm out of shape'. Since his comeback and return to fitness, he has ducked out of any decent fights - why hasn't he fought Usyk for undisputed? Why hasn't he fought Joshua? He's a master of spin, it's always someone else's fault - but at the end of the day, if he wanted these fights, they would happen.

Must be a scouser!

[STEVIE B]

15 hours ago, indierich06 said:

He was lucky to get such a high profile fight, given the state he was in and the state of his career. It was no-lose for him - big payday, if he wins then great, if he loses it's because 'oh I'm out of shape'. Since his comeback and return to fitness, he has ducked out of any decent fights - why hasn't he fought Usyk for undisputed? Why hasn't he fought Joshua? He's a master of spin, it's always someone else's fault - but at the end of the day, if he wanted these fights, they would happen.

The Wilder fight wasn’t Fury’s choice. It was a cherry pick by Wilder that went badly wrong. 

Fury’s father begged him to turn it down due to his shape & inactivity. 
Wilder just wanted a decent name on his very poor record. 
I’m not a fan of Fury, for the reasons you mention. 
I’m becoming less of a fan of HW boxing as a whole, it’s boring, they are too inactive. 

Edited 28 July 2023 by STEVIE B

[ealingfox]

He should have been doing everything he could to get the Joshua fight on since Joshua got found out. It was baffling that he ducked it for so long anyway given that I don't think there's any point in their respective careers where Fury wouldn't have at least beat him on points. But the pay day would still be insane these days for what would basically be a guaranteed win.

[STEVIE B]

14 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

He should have been doing everything he could to get the Joshua fight on since Joshua got found out. It was baffling that he ducked it for so long anyway given that I don't think there's any point in their respective careers where Fury wouldn't have at least beat him on points. But the pay day would still be insane these days for what would basically be a guaranteed win.

Exactly. The problem is, the so called top HW (Fury,Joshua,Usyk & Wilder), are all waiting for the Saudi money.
In between, if they can be bothered, they take on much lesser fighters, or in Fury’s case a virtual exhibition ! 
Usyk, who possibly has a viable excuse to be inactive (his country is at war) is taking on Dubois, but should still win comfortably. 

Edited 28 July 2023 by STEVIE B

[Izzy]

8 minutes ago, STEVIE B said:

Exactly. The problem is, the so called top HW (Fury,Joshua,Usyk & Wilder), are all waiting for the Saudi money.
 

With all the talk of LIV golf and the Saudi football league, I’d almost forgotten about them buying boxing too. 
Slightly off topic I know but notice how all this Saudi money is actually diluting the quality of sport rather than making it better.

[STEVIE B]

4 minutes ago, Izzy said:

With all the talk of LIV golf and the Saudi football league, I’d almost forgotten about them buying boxing too. 
Slightly off topic I know but notice how all this Saudi money is actually diluting the quality of sport rather than making it better.

The worrying thing is the money probably will never run out. 

Edited 28 July 2023 by STEVIE B

[MPH]

9 hours ago, Izzy said:

With all the talk of LIV golf and the Saudi football league, I’d almost forgotten about them buying boxing too. 
Slightly off topic I know but notice how all this Saudi money is actually diluting the quality of sport rather than making it better.

 

9 hours ago, STEVIE B said:

The worrying thing is the money probably will never run out. 

 

im more disappointed with Jordan Henderson to be honest.  Campaigned for the rights of so many yet soon changed his mind at the sight of a fat pay Cheque . but that’s for another thread..

[fuchsntf]

On 27/07/2023 at 16:08, Greg2607 said:

although of all the current heavyweights, Fury IS the one I could see fighting himself. he's as mad as a box of frogs. 

My box of frogs,we quite tame..

only croaker George,on the left had some issues,always complaining,all through the wet season,then again in the dry season,got really mardy when some frogs from the same box went out on tour,and flirted with the Vesta lot.

[fuchsntf]

On 27/07/2023 at 15:37, MPH said:

 

you’ve come in here like you are taking on the top ten heavyweights yourself

 

take two tramadol, pop them under your tongue  and go sit in a dark room. You’ll feel better in the morning.

I tried that,but found out some foxtalk membersdidnt like it when I went on one ofmy rants, but I am frightened of the dark so I sat in an elightened room..singing

livingdol ,not tramadol..

[Spiritwalker]

Definitely.

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

Not the best of opponents knocking around nowadays, Fury can’t help that, however I feel Liston, Ali, Frazier, Foreman would of beaten him Norton and Holmes would of been close and a prime Mike Tyson would of knocked him out.

Always difficult to judge different eras and it’s all opinions. 

[BKLFox]

59 minutes ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

Not the best of opponents knocking around nowadays, Fury can’t help that, however I feel Liston, Ali, Frazier, Foreman would of beaten him Norton and Holmes would of been close and a prime Mike Tyson would of knocked him out.

Always difficult to judge different eras and it’s all opinions. 

With you on this, The heavyweight division stopped being the best boxing division at the turn of this century.

From the turn of this century only Lennox (dips in this side) and Wladimir would get anywhere near a greatest top 20 heavyweight list of all time. 

 

Edited 29 July 2023 by BKLFox

[turlo]

Not even close going by his record alone, which is a shame because he has all the attributes to potentially be up there.
 

• Only fought 2 top 10 ranked fighters since he became WBC champion in 2015
• Only made 2 defences of his WBC title since he beat Klitschko (1 of those was Chisora 3 after the WBC didn't order him a mandetory defence last year)
• Avoided Usyk and Joshua for the chance to become undisputed heavyweight champion (last person to achieve this was Lenox Lewis over 20 years ago) .

Even in a weak era in the heavyweight division he's only fought 2 out of 4 of the toughest opponents/biggest fights and padded his record with warm up fights or had long periods of inactivity. 

[Silebyfox_89]

No.

[Sly]

I’d struggle to put him in the top 10 of heavyweight boxing, purely because I don’t think we have enough evidence on how good he actually is. 
 

He’s the best of this era, however he’s fully dislikable and a bit of a ****. Like others have stated, this era of boxing isn’t exactly blessed with an abundance of stars.  

He beat Wilder, however a large proportion of people have question marks on how good he actually is. Devastating power, however so did the likes of Shaver, Tua and Lyle and in a potentially better “era”, Wilder wouldn’t have held a world title for so long, if he’d have actually boxed elite fighters. He spent too long padding his record and took the Fury fight, to try and stop people questioning that record. Fury can be given credit for at least acknowledging he’d beat him and he ended up exposing him for what he is really. 
 

In fairness, AJ isn’t that much different to Wilder. Slightly better technically but again, Ruiz showed that a better technical fighter exposed him. Ruiz learnt the hard way in the rematch as he was clearly out of shape.
 

Wins against Chisora and Whyte in a way, do him more harm. Chisora is an enhancement fighter at this stage. Whyte is okay, he suffered from Wilder ducking him to be honest. I mean, how did Chisora even get a fight with Fury? He’s nowhere in the rankings to be in contention. 

 

Fury is basically now a glorified prize fighter isn’t he, taking the highest purse possible? 
 

He could have fought Uysk, AJ, Zang, Ruiz, Ortiz or Hrgovik, however he’s fighting someone in the desert. 
 

How the WBC have allowed it to happen is a joke. 
 

 

Edited 30 July 2023 by Sly

[The Horse's Mouth]

He’s too 3 at least I think, nobody that size has moved like that before. He’s a complete phenomenon. I don’t buy the idea he has to fight Joshua, the only reason for fighting Joshua is for the money and the spectacle for British boxing, Joshua ain’t the goose he was since he got slapped up by an obese Mexican. He ended one of the most dominant spells at the top of heavyweight boxing in decades, in Wlads own backyard. Took on and beat twice the fiercest knockout artist in history, he only needs Usyk to complete his legacy now really. It whether he wants it, his legacy speaks for itself now, but I’m not sure he’s hungry enough to fight Usyk.

[Raj]

1 hour ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

He’s too 3 at least I think, nobody that size has moved like that before. He’s a complete phenomenon. I don’t buy the idea he has to fight Joshua, the only reason for fighting Joshua is for the money and the spectacle for British boxing, Joshua ain’t the goose he was since he got slapped up by an obese Mexican. He ended one of the most dominant spells at the top of heavyweight boxing in decades, in Wlads own backyard. Took on and beat twice the fiercest knockout artist in history, he only needs Usyk to complete his legacy now really. It whether he wants it, his legacy speaks for itself now, but I’m not sure he’s hungry enough to fight Usyk.

What?

And what?

Have you only followed boxing in the last few years!!!