Ruud van Nistelrooy - New Manager - Official

[Realist Guy In The Room]

4 minutes ago, Tom12345 said:

It seems afterall we are not in a position to impose an identity. We just need some points. Now we are getting none.

 

I think part of the problem was that we had Maresca who was very stubborn with imposing his style and identity, and the players was stuck with that and did not trust Cooper from the start culminating in that weekend away with Winks holding on to that ‘Enzo we miss you’ sign. Who knows if Enzo stayed though - it is very different playing in the EPL compared to the Championship. In any event, given that, Cooper was doomed from the start without that trust from the beginning. But if not for individual players - Faes and Justin in particular making all sorts of defensive mistakes, we would have gotten more points under Cooper even though he has kept us above the relegation zone much of the time. And also, we looked like scoring in each game - we just couldn’t keep a clean sheet.

If Enzo stayed, we’d be mid table and complaining about how boring it is to watch.

 

He would never have signed Skipp, Ayew, BDCR or Okoli.

[Dan]

I think we were better under Cooper because he actually didn't try and put in any structure as strange as it sounds. I think we were acting more on instinct and just chancing it on the randomness of games. It's never a long term plan but maybe in the long run that would've yielded the odd result a bit more often.

 

My sympathy for him is massively suspended because his recruitment was appalling and totally irresponsible given the financial constraints we've found ourselves under. How it was allowed is beyond me.

 

Van Nistelrooy has managed the worst of both worlds - he's kept us just as disorganised at the back while totally stifling our ability to score goals. I think he's been completely stitched up but as I feared when he was appointed, the entire thing has been one massive false start and it's never going to recover. He came close to matching our alltime losing run last time with 7. I think he goes one better this time. Not a chance this side gets a point until Wolves, probably Southampton. Other teams may as well rest players.

[Leeds Fox]

8 hours ago, grth2004 said:

I don’t actually think Cooper is crap I just think he was a bad fit for us and was probably never going to work. 
RVN again is a bad fit for us and what we need right now. 

 

Whoever made the last two decisions needs to be kicked out. 
 

I don’t think he’s necessarily a bad manager, but he wasn’t good here. That was my point. 

 

Exactly, if you’re sacking managers at the rate we are, they’re either not good enough, the squad isn’t good enough or both. Whoever’s in charge of the two needs to go also. But we already know this, unfortunately I think the Championship season and the Enzo appointment probably banked the Teflon individuals enough credit. 

[grth2004]

8 hours ago, volpeazzurro said:

Nobody I knew gave a toss that he'd managed Forest in the past. Why would they, it's not as if O'Neil or Morgan got vilified for their previous connections. 

O’Neill or Morgan had never managed Forest before plus O’Neil was actually given a hard time at the start of his career and admitted he nearly quit due to the crowd getting on him. 
It’s a pointless argument because some fans didn't like the Forest connection just not your mates. 

[Feed The Yak!!]

5 hours ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

If Enzo stayed, we’d be mid table and complaining about how boring it is to watch.

 

He would never have signed Skipp, Ayew, BDCR or Okoli.

Yep, we looked good against Bournemouth last year in the cup.

 

Enzo would probably always have left us in the summer due to the size of the Chelsea opportunity and our board misleading him. That said, if there was a fraction of a chance of him doing a McKenna and staying on due to the relationship with the fans, our lot sure as shit snuffed that out. 

[CrazyKopCorner]

I thought Cooper was a terrible manager and clueless but Ruud absolutely trumps him. 

 

I think with Cooper we'd at least still be in with a chance and possibly just in or outside of the relegation zone. 

 

Ruud is borderline insane. A complete and utter fruitcake. 

[hejammy]

6 minutes ago, Feed The Yak!! said:

Yep, we looked good against Bournemouth last year in the cup.

 

Enzo would probably always have left us in the summer due to the size of the Chelsea opportunity and our board misleading him. That said, if there was a fraction of a chance of him doing a McKenna and staying on due to the relationship with the fans, our lot sure as shit snuffed that out. 

But really, since Ranieri, has there been a manager with a real connection to the fans? Who interacts with the fans in a positive way during games / press conferences etc? 

[CrazyKopCorner]

1 minute ago, hejammy said:

But really, since Ranieri, has there been a manager with a real connection to the fans? Who interacts with the fans in a positive way during games / press conferences etc? 

No 

 

Shakespeare was very likable but not a manager 

[Qwerty]

7 hours ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

If Enzo stayed, we’d be mid table and complaining about how boring it is to watch.

 

He would never have signed Skipp, Ayew, BDCR or Okoli.

I'm really not sure we'd have been much better than we are to be honest.  Enzo was stubborn, slow to make subs, and had zero Plan B.  We nearly bottled the championship as a result, and it was seemingly the talk by Vardy and Albrighton that rallied the troops at the end.  We were the best team in the  league and it still looked shaky at times.  So I'm not convinced he'd have been successful with our mediocre team in the Premier League.  You only have the read the Chelsea forum to see they've got the same frustrations we had, and have lost games they should be winning.  He's had hundreds of millions to spend and they're still only 7th.  

[RonnieTodger]

It’s mental that we try and take teams on. We don’t acknowledge our inferiority enough.

 

Matt Piper was right in that Burnley/Stoke were clearly inferior teams but they made it ugly for opposition and tried to win that way. 

[Qwerty]

8 minutes ago, RonnieTodger said:

It’s mental that we try and take teams on. We don’t acknowledge our inferiority enough.

 

Matt Piper was right in that Burnley/Stoke were clearly inferior teams but they made it ugly for opposition and tried to win that way. 

Dyche managed it for years with Burnley didn't he.  That's why many of us wanted that sort of manager.

[teblin]

The Big thing with the great escape season, We changes formation for those last 12/13 games and we had the majority of the team that won the league in place.

 

We had 1 more point after 26 games that year.

 

We need to change what we do, we haven't got great wingers fit. We have fairly mobile Full backs in JJ, Woyo, Victor to a lesser extent. Lets go 3-5-2 or 3 4 2 1 change something up. Though I just can't see Ruud doing it.

Edited 25 February by teblin

[Haywood_6]

9 minutes ago, RonnieTodger said:

It’s mental that we try and take teams on. We don’t acknowledge our inferiority enough.

 

Matt Piper was right in that Burnley/Stoke were clearly inferior teams but they made it ugly for opposition and tried to win that way. 

I really don't think "winning ugly" is a thing anymore. The quality of the Prem has made it near on impossible to get away with that. Teams like Brentford, Fulham, Palace, and Bournemouth don’t play that way. You don’t see it much these days. Everton might be the closest example of a physical, direct team but I honestly think they’ve got way better players than us. How many of our players get in Everton's team now? If you have a shower of shite squad, you’ll get exposed. We got a few lucky points early on but the stats were already showing we weren’t at the level which has turned out to be true.

 

[inckley fox]

8 hours ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

If Enzo stayed, we’d be mid table and complaining about how boring it is to watch.

 

He would never have signed Skipp, Ayew, BDCR or Okoli.

I thought he probably left partly because he knew he'd be signing players like that. And it's not as if all of his signings came off either. Of those that did, only one has so far been able to make the step-up.

 

Of course that could be down to the sorts of recruitment problems that have plagued us for four or more years.

 

So Maybe it's harsh to have a go at Maresca for that, but then it'd be even harder to be critical of Cooper (given the greater restrictions, and the need to have PL-capable players). Some of the players who came in, including Okoli and Skipp, were hardly clear-cut first choices for him. The former was probably a product of long-term scouting.

 

Either way, I am a bit surprised that people feel that - playing Enzo's style of football, with largely the same set of players and a limited budget - we'd be mid-table. That seems very hopeful to me.

[dnewty]

Is it his press conference today ?

[fox_up_north]

I've said it before and I'll say it again - neither manager was the right choice. 

[suffolk fox]

9 hours ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

If Enzo stayed, we’d be mid table and complaining about how boring it is to watch.

 

He would never have signed Skipp, Ayew, BDCR or Okoli.

With the squad we have it's uncertain we would have been mid table if Enzo had stayed.  Way we played under him in the Championship playing out from the back and the consistent side to side passing at the back no way would we have been mid table.  It's impossible to predict.  PSR restrictions aside, it's impossible to know who we would have signed.

[Lesta Legend]

12 minutes ago, fox_up_north said:

I've said it before and I'll say it again - neither manager was the right choice. 

Yearning for Cooper is fcking weird isn’t it. 

[filbertway]

With this squad enzo would be achieving about the same, because her'd be doing what RVN is doing and trying to play his only way of playing against better teams.

 

I find it hard to believe the window would have been as much of a car crash under Enzo as it was under Cooper though. Facundo and BEK matches the type of player he was looking for last season. 

Can't see him getting a hard on over Skipp, BDCR and Ayew.

 

Can't shake the thought that he'd have been all over Casadei though

 

 

 

[Fox92]

1 hour ago, Haywood_6 said:

I really don't think "winning ugly" is a thing anymore. The quality of the Prem has made it near on impossible to get away with that. Teams like Brentford, Fulham, Palace, and Bournemouth don’t play that way. You don’t see it much these days. Everton might be the closest example of a physical, direct team but I honestly think they’ve got way better players than us. How many of our players get in Everton's team now? If you have a shower of shite squad, you’ll get exposed. We got a few lucky points early on but the stats were already showing we weren’t at the level which has turned out to be true.

 

Brentford are so direct. Most of their balls go long, they even still do long throws. Friday was probably the worse opposition performance I've seen from a team that put 4 past us (and should have had more, to be fair to them). Even Wolves had a bit more about them and their 3 goals were awful at our place.

[Happy Fox]

RVN wasn't first choice was he? It was definitely Potter and then probably Moyes as a backup.

[bovril]

I think we've done this discussion to death but I seriously doubt we'd be below Wolves with Maresca in charge. The continuity alone would be worth a few more points.

[Gamble92]

Cooper clearly put a lot of pressure on the club to make signings. This led to some appalling buys for the sake of Premier League experience that he kept banging on about.

 

Cooper himself was stuck between wanting to play a way he's always coached and appeasing Top and Rudkin's Enzo ball vision. 

 

It's all a ****ing mess 

[Claudio Fannieri]

Let’s get a few things straight, absolutely no way do we sign Ayew, BDCR, Skipp if Enzo had stayed I’m not sure Okoli would have been signed either, our recruitment would have been very different so who knows where we would be, it’s impossible to compare, however what we would be is in a lot better position in terms of at least having some sort of strategy and direction. 

[Fox92]

23 minutes ago, filbertway said:

With this squad enzo would be achieving about the same, because her'd be doing what RVN is doing and trying to play his only way of playing against better teams.

 

I find it hard to believe the window would have been as much of a car crash under Enzo as it was under Cooper though. Facundo and BEK matches the type of player he was looking for last season. 

Can't see him getting a hard on over Skipp, BDCR and Ayew.

 

Can't shake the thought that he'd have been all over Casadei though

 

 

 

Our transfer window under Enzo wasn't great though. We still spent 8m on Coady and while the players we bought we good enough for a Championship title challenge, we weren't looking into the future because these sort of players were never improving us for a Premier League season. Hermansen aside, of course.