Goal kick routine and the ghost of Cooper.

[Collymore]

What the hell is going on with these absolutely abysmal goal kicks we've been taking this season? 

 

Yesterday we percevered with putting 2 men on the corner of the 6 yd box, only for Mads to fire the ball over to the wing for us to lose possession time and time again. What's worse, Newcastle were set ready with an attacking shape, pushed up, as our defenders were still stood on the 6yd box ready for attack after attack. 

 

We saw against Chelsea (Faes horror show goal) how this is so dangerous unless you're sure you're going to keep possession. 

 

Surely if I'm Ruud, I'd be like "you know what, I've got no midfield, the defence is like a siv, let's try and win the ball higher up the pitch and go back to basics" 

 

I do worry that Cooper's team is still having a say with Ruud.  I've seen some identical stuff that I only saw when Cooper came in still being implemented with Ruud - it's like the ghost of Cooper is still haunting the dugout. Sometimes it's little things such as ball back to GK on KO or ridiculous goal kicks, but it worries me that Ruud might have said "go with what he said for now"

 

I'm hoping over time he changes things and bring his own team in but we seem so fundamentally bad at times.

 

We're unable to do the basics at all. 

 

 

[phoneticerror]

Are you certain this is a Cooper thing? Didn’t we do it under both Enzo and BR? Or am I daydreaming?

[Collymore]

11 minutes ago, phoneticerror said:

Are you certain this is a Cooper thing? Didn’t we do it under both Enzo and BR? Or am I daydreaming?

Enzo played more risky stuff in the Championship with say Winks often coming deep and playing tippy tappy stuff. Most of the time it worked, but there were a few times (Blackburn away) where we were caught out. You could see it was far more a benefit though. 

 

Under Cooper we started to set up to play the same but Mads would either just suddenly quickly boot it with everyone back set up on the 6yd box  or sometimes Faes or the other CB would kick it to Mads for him to then boot it. I never saw this being implemented so much under Maresca. 

 

Yes, the idea of it is to entice the opposition up and bypass them and hopefully then have a better chance of attacking with them not set in midfield properly but yesterday we didn't even try and disguise we were going to do it. It was kick after kick after kick over the the wing where Newcastle were like "What, you really going to keep on doing this, the exact same thing over and over again for us to set up and easily win it back? - thanks!" 

 

 

Edited 15 December 2024 by Collymore

[Tuna]

Get it up the field

[MS0204]

I have to agree with the original poster.. this tippy tappy routine outside from a goal kick ain’t working.. being so high up it was much clearer and frustrating to see. But after the 5th time out of 50 attempts and the opposition will know the plan.. trouble is if you ain’t that good at it then don’t do it, and in Leicesters case they ain’t. Losing possession time and time again they need to realise that. 
maybe shake it up now and again but yesterday was painful..  no way I’m blaming cooper for that, sadly it’s just engrained in teams now. I remember in the fa cup a few seasons ago, didn’t Swindon try it against Man City? Big

miatake 

[coolhandfox]

50 minutes ago, Tuna said:

Get it up the field

Issue we have is no one holds it up.

[Collymore]

5 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Issue we have is no one holds it up.

Yeah this is the problem. You need a Chris Wood type player. I always think it's good to have that type of player in the squad, a huge unit you can pull out from time to time. We saw Manchester Utd buy Weghorst for this a few seasons a go. I mean he never scored a goal for them and Utd have been ran worse than us but it gave them an option. 

 

I'd love us to scour Europe for a 6ft 8 Eastern European brick laying monster who'd be happy to sit on the bench and be wheeled out for times like yesterday to give us options. 

 

The fans would love it, I'm sure! 

 

 

[Number 6]

Playing it out from the back is fine, setting up to play it out from the back and punting it is an issue. One or the other.

 

We'll have to decide as and when we want to use either option, and we've mostly got right this season. If Mads is out then it will be long kicks.

[Muzzy_no7]

1 hour ago, Tuna said:

Get it up the field

Hit the channels for Scowcroft and Deane 

[Lesterlad]

Never mind the goal kicks. What about when we kicked of from them scoring. Every time who ever kicked off past it straight back to the goalie. What is that all about. Why not just attack straight from the kick offs. It was awful to watch. 

[AKCJ]

I find it incredible that people devote their lives to following a sport they don't actually understand.

[Collymore]

47 minutes ago, AKCJ said:

I find it incredible that people devote their lives to following a sport they don't actually understand.

You would hope and expect for each and every decision made on that pitch there is a reason for it backed up by statistical analysis beforehand and they'd know thousands times more than the average fan. 

 

I think fans are pretty good at seeing something not working though, not perhaps why but they can see it's not working. 

 

I do wonder sometimes if things are so data driven that then the basics become ignored.

 

"Forget the fact we're getting overrun everywhere over the pitch, we're conceding goals right left and centre, we've got an 8% better chance of getting into the upper left quadrant where we can start phase D if we kick the ball there..." 

 

 

[Collymore]

Also the bloke I was sat next to who said he was going to sign up to Foxestalk... Register and say hello!

 

(You didn't pick my cap by any chance?) 

[oxford blue]

47 minutes ago, AKCJ said:

I find it incredible that people devote their lives to following a sport they don't actually understand.

Mr Expert - Could you please clarify the point you are trying to make in relation to this thread? Perhaps I don't understand football either, but I think there are some good points made. One extra point, and not speaking as an expert,  - playing short to a teammate centrally with opposition players is always fraught with danger, and we see this across many teams. I am not worried about opposition but I do wish we could stop this practice. 

[Chrysalis]

2 hours ago, Collymore said:

What the hell is going on with these absolutely abysmal goal kicks we've been taking this season? 

 

Yesterday we percevered with putting 2 men on the corner of the 6 yd box, only for Mads to fire the ball over to the wing for us to lose possession time and time again. What's worse, Newcastle were set ready with an attacking shape, pushed up, as our defenders were still stood on the 6yd box ready for attack after attack. 

 

We saw against Chelsea (Faes horror show goal) how this is so dangerous unless you're sure you're going to keep possession. 

 

Surely if I'm Ruud, I'd be like "you know what, I've got no midfield, the defence is like a siv, let's try and win the ball higher up the pitch and go back to basics" 

 

I do worry that Cooper's team is still having a say with Ruud.  I've seen some identical stuff that I only saw when Cooper came in still being implemented with Ruud - it's like the ghost of Cooper is still haunting the dugout. Sometimes it's little things such as ball back to GK on KO or ridiculous goal kicks, but it worries me that Ruud might have said "go with what he said for now"

 

I'm hoping over time he changes things and bring his own team in but we seem so fundamentally bad at times.

 

We're unable to do the basics at all. 

 

 

Rather we lose possession on the wing instead of directly in front of goal as Southampton have done.

 

Cooper isnt here anymore, we cant blame everything on him, Ruud has a lot of issues to deal with, including the poor state of the squad which is down to Top and Rudkin.

[RYM]

We have faced 73 (Seventy three) shots in our last 3 games.

 

Ipswich have faced 51

Wolves have faced 42

Saints have faced 66
 

wild that innit!

 

you’ll never sing that etc…:

 

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

13 minutes ago, Chrysalis said:

Cooper isnt here anymore, we cant blame everything on him, Ruud has a lot of issues to deal with, including the poor state of the squad which is down to Top and Rudkin.

Spot on

Edited 15 December 2024 by Cadno'r Cymoedd

[Fox92]

2 hours ago, Collymore said:

Yeah this is the problem. You need a Chris Wood type player. I always think it's good to have that type of player in the squad, a huge unit you can pull out from time to time. We saw Manchester Utd buy Weghorst for this a few seasons a go. I mean he never scored a goal for them and Utd have been ran worse than us but it gave them an option. 

 

I'd love us to scour Europe for a 6ft 8 Eastern European brick laying monster who'd be happy to sit on the bench and be wheeled out for times like yesterday to give us options. 

 

The fans would love it, I'm sure! 

 

 

Yes we do, I said it ages ago but got laughed off as "you want a target man a hoof football" which never was my idea. A player who can hold the ball doesn't mean they are an old style centre forward.

[New_Signing_Name Ole Ole]

6 hours ago, Collymore said:

Also the bloke I was sat next to who said he was going to sign up to Foxestalk... Register and say hello!

 

(You didn't pick my cap by any chance?) 

Hello!

I felt obliged to sign up so I could say, unfortunately, I didn't pick up your cap.

[Pliskin]

We didn’t under Rodgers….. it’s the modern thing to do. 
 

 

Our problem is we’ve got no midfield anchor at the moment to get on the ball, and build from the back…. This is where we need Winks, he’s the only one who can get on the ball in the half space. But we also can’t go long, because we just give it away, unless we try Ayew in that position to play off, but I don’t think he can do it. 

[Wolfox]

Name me a team who doesn’t try and play it out from the back?  Well there’s a reason for that…

 

Lump it up…. Their centre half gets it and you’ve a small chance on the second ball, but the play is compressed and it’s unlikely to lead to much

 

Play it out, stretch the play, get out of the press and you have a chance of getting a far more attacking a position…

 

it’s really not that tricky to work out…

Edited 15 December 2024 by Wolfox

[cropstonfox]

Any stats to prove playing out is that effective v previous methods.Chances created v chances given to the opposition

Any Stats available?? Or is it just a fanciful trend?

[Collymore]

1 hour ago, New_Signing_Name Ole Ole said:

Hello!

I felt obliged to sign up so I could say, unfortunately, I didn't pick up your cap.

Thanks for letting me know and welcome to Foxestalk!

[Gamble92]

8 hours ago, Collymore said:

Also the bloke I was sat next to who said he was going to sign up to Foxestalk... Register and say hello!

 

(You didn't pick my cap by any chance?) 

Hello mate, think I found it on Row B

[Trav Le Bleu]

10 hours ago, Tuna said:

Get it up the field

GET RID!