Gary Rowett

[Manwell Pablo]

4 hours ago, LCFCnotKPFC said:

 

There's a guy who sits two rows behind me who constantly slags off Vestegaard and I know it's a popular opinion to hate guy bloke, but it doesn't seem to be performance related to me. He seems to be the scapegoat for our initial relegation, despite never playing a single League game for us that Season. 

 

In his defence, we know his flaws, yet people never discuss his strengths. He ALWAYS gets on the ball and is the player who always tries to get us playing and progressing forward. It's bizarre to me how much criticism he gets, as a centre half, when we've regularly seen Choudhury play in the last few years, a central midfielder, who always avoids responsibility and just passes sideways and backwards.

 

I feel the same with Winks, who by the way, is night and day the best footballer we have in our squad and is still the best central midfielder in this League. The fact he has played for King and now Rowett proves to me he wasn't just flat out refusing to play....Because he's now playing. Seems like we trusted an incompetent manager to toss aside players like Winks and Faes, who no matter what personal vendetta you have against them, are miles better than the guys who have replaced them.

 

Winks, Vestergaard and Faes walked this league a couple of years back. Suggesting Nelson should be playing just because he "Did ok at Oxford", is also part of the reason we're in this mess. We've overrated our young players massively and backed the wrong players, and now we're paying the price. 

Janick is the best we’ve got there I agree, clearly flawed but every defender in the squad is that’s why we let in goals every game regardless of who is playing. 

[Craig]

I saw enough today to see that we have a chance.

 

Obviously very predictable that Stoke scored after they should have been finished off, but the thing that impressed me today was that we didn't fold when they equalised.

 

Probably the first time I've walked away from a game this season where I've felt we got less than we deserved. 

[volpeazzurro]

3 hours ago, inckley fox said:

Winks, Vestergard and Faes benefited from Vardy, Hermansen, Dewsbury-Hall and Ndidi, plus a younger Pereira. They've been largely awful ever since. And I don't doubt that Winks has talent, but a decent half of football after two years of being mostly below par, during which time he was photographed disrespecting one manager, before being cast out by the next two, is hardly redemption. Not yet.

 

Awful recruitment and awful player application, including by Winks, has been a far greater problem than any individual manager. Your surmising, based on pretty much today alone (because statistically our results are a good deal worse when Winks starts), that he isn't indicative of the problems at the club, but Cifuentes and his predecessors have been, is just chopped logic. And it's dismissive of the cultural issues which have been at the heart of our decline.

 

I hope Winks redeems himself. If he does, we'll stay up and Rowett will get a whole load of deserved credit. But we shouldn't kid ourselves - these players have let multiple managers and coaches down, and shown an unacceptable lack of effort for a long, long time. We can't lose sight of that if there's to be any chance of making things better in the future.

Thank you, a bit of reality.

[LCFCnotKPFC]

Just now, murphy said:

Vestergaard has played 24 times this season and Faes 15 times.  Often together.  Nelson 18 times.  Faes has been in and out of the team due to poor form and dumb mistakes.  

 

You have seen us.  We have been terrible with Faes and vestergaard.  We don't have the second worst defensive record by accident.  Any combination we have tried has been poor. 

 

Can you explain why Mavididi was effective under Enzo and hopeless now?  Winks and Ricardo too.  Even Daka got the odd goal under Enzo.  One this season. 

 

 

I'm confused with your post.

 

Because you seem to come to the conclusion that a good manager/head coach is important, but only when it suits you (E.g. Winks, Ricardo, Daka, Mavididi)...But that Faes and Vestergaard are just bad.

 

 

I could write a hell of a lot about this, I speak often to the two guys next to me at the game about how under Enzo we were basically able to give the ball to Fatawu and Mavididi on the touchline every game, often, despite other teams knowing we were going to do it, this is because we were well coached and had good patterns of play.

 

But I disagree that Mavididi was particularly effective, I thought Fatawu was, he would take his man on for fun game after game. But I was constantly disappointed with Mavididi, especially because he had KDH to combine with that side. Mavididi was given far more freedom by the fact Fatawu/KDH/Vardy were such threats. Mavidi fools a lot of fans by looking like he's a threat, but all he does when he gets the ball to feet is a couple of stepovers, drops his shoulder as though he's looking to be direct....Then pass it backwards. His decision making is poor. 

 

Winks is a terrific footballer, still the best central midfielder in this league imo. 

Ricardo's legs went years ago, Maresca helped him a lot with the different role and he had KDH/Ndidi doing his running, which is true for Winks too.

 

We were much better coached under Enzo. But even so, if you watch us play today, you can still see that Vestergaard has that progressive passing ability which is superior to anyone else in the squad. 

[LCFCnotKPFC]

9 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

Janick is the best we’ve got there I agree, clearly flawed but every defender in the squad is that’s why we let in goals every game regardless of who is playing. 

 

I want to make it clear that I'm not stating he's some incredible defender, but our fans appear to have a short memory.

 

Can people not remember how lost Wes Morgan was in 2014-15 before Huth came in? His levels were what our fans claim Vestergaard/Faes to be.

What really helped Morgan was the fact he had terrific physical attributes, he was rapid across the ground and completely underrated in this regard. Huth basically told him what to do every game and the rest is History. 

 

Vestergaard doesn't have any legs around him, and he needs it. Could you imagine Huth in this back 4? He'd look very similarly exposed too. Marti mishandled Aluko earlier this Season. After the two yellow cards, of which one comes about from a horrific pass from the supposed to be experienced Choudhury, Aluko should've been back in the team after his suspension. The idea you think a player is "Ready", but then you drop him after just one performance is terrible judgement from a terrible manager. 

[southfox66]

I take back what said about him before today I think he did well, first half we were terrible but it the first he had actually game with them, he clearly spoken to them at half time and we saw a much better Leicester team in the second half, now he has something to build on, but the club should have got him sooner they wasted three games to get him in, if got him sooner  today could have been three points. Tuesday is going to be a tough one we need to make an positive start, don't let them try to overwhelm us get an early goal, if he keeps us up and gets playing the way we can, no reason why he doesn't stay for next season. 

[Wymsey]

Reckon will stay for a while and he'll progress himself as a manager.

 

He knows this is an excellent opportunity for him to try to advance professionally.

Edited 22 February by Wymsey

[BrilliantFox]

30 minutes ago, Wymsey said:

Reckon will stay for a while and he'll progress himeelf as a manager.

 

Regardless of league position, he needs to leave in the summer.

He's a quick fix, not a long-term solution and definitely not the man you want to let rebuild this club.

 

Good news is we have an incoming Technical Director who will be deciding on our next manager in the summer.

[Chrysalis]

1 hour ago, LCFCnotKPFC said:

 

I want to make it clear that I'm not stating he's some incredible defender, but our fans appear to have a short memory.

 

Can people not remember how lost Wes Morgan was in 2014-15 before Huth came in? His levels were what our fans claim Vestergaard/Faes to be.

What really helped Morgan was the fact he had terrific physical attributes, he was rapid across the ground and completely underrated in this regard. Huth basically told him what to do every game and the rest is History. 

 

Vestergaard doesn't have any legs around him, and he needs it. Could you imagine Huth in this back 4? He'd look very similarly exposed too. Marti mishandled Aluko earlier this Season. After the two yellow cards, of which one comes about from a horrific pass from the supposed to be experienced Choudhury, Aluko should've been back in the team after his suspension. The idea you think a player is "Ready", but then you drop him after just one performance is terrible judgement from a terrible manager. 

 

I agree on Wes improving a lot with Huth.

 

But I want to make a point that has bothered me for a while.

 

It is fashionable on the community that when we concede a goal, to either blame the keeper, or usually to blame the last man that got beaten.  This is a very short sighted way of viewing the game, it is a team sport, lots of things happen before the ball gets to the final defender, but many dont seem to understand this, it might be excused that people are relying only on highlights which sadly dont show much else than a few seconds before the goal, but I would expect people watching live to see the bigger picture.

 

As an example lets say we have possession in final 3rd, a player over hits a pass (common with us), we lose the ball, then the other team runs through our midfield without getting challenged, often without even getting pressed (also common), then the ball gets in to a dangerous area our final 3rd, and only then we shift into gear to try and get it back, one defender stands like a statue, and another tries to intercept before the shot, but fails and the shot is in the back of the net.

Basically that defender that tried to save the situation right at the end is the one that gets blamed, not the defender not helping him, not the midfield, being cut through like butter, not the player who did an unenforced error with a over hit pass.  Not the lack of a full team press, or bad tactics from the manager, its all down to that final defender nearly every single time with foxes talk, its frustrating.  The problem with this, it can lead to specific defenders getting abuse from the crowd, affects confidence and motivation, and before you know it they in perpetual bad form.

Edited 22 February by Chrysalis
typos

[Deeg67]

The key for Rowett will be getting Jannik and Lascelles back and established as the CB pair. Will it happen, who knows - both old and injury-prone but they're the best we have. If he gets the pair of them healthy his track record shows he can patch together enough defensive improvement to survive.

 

Mukasa had a goal, an assist, and three more shoulda-assists in about 20 minutes. He's clearly a difference-maker at this level. With the likes of Mukasa, James, Ramsey and even Reid around him (eventually) we can clearly score enough goals to stay up with even modest improvement defensively.

[LCFCJohn]

1 hour ago, Deeg67 said:

The key for Rowett will be getting Jannik and Lascelles back and established as the CB pair. Will it happen, who knows - both old and injury-prone but they're the best we have. If he gets the pair of them healthy his track record shows he can patch together enough defensive improvement to survive.

 

Mukasa had a goal, an assist, and three more shoulda-assists in about 20 minutes. He's clearly a difference-maker at this level. With the likes of Mukasa, James, Ramsey and even Reid around him (eventually) we can clearly score enough goals to stay up with even modest improvement defensively.

One of them with Nelson. I don’t see Vestergaard and Lascelles working as a pair. I might be wrong as Wes and Huth mentioned above, we both on the senior side!

 

But I do think Nelson is looking shakey because of those around him and he is too young and experienced to take it all on by himself. Whereas even when he was alongside Vestergaard for a spell, they looked to be ok. 
 

Anyway, Rowett raved about Nelson when he coached him last season and made comments about him going to the top so I expect he’ll be first choice. 

[LCFCJohn]

4 hours ago, BrilliantFox said:

Regardless of league position, he needs to leave in the summer.

He's a quick fix, not a long-term solution and definitely not the man you want to let rebuild this club.

 

Good news is we have an incoming Technical Director who will be deciding on our next manager in the summer.

Not necessarily. Let’s be open minded at least. He spent a number of years at Millwall, progressing them and establishing them as a side pushing at the top end of the league not looking over their shoulders.

 

For me, we don’t need a really technical manager right now. I know you love Enzo but that’s not where we are right now. Even under Enzo, we lost an awful lot of games and conceded a lot (and often got away with it due to poor finishing). Obviously we scored an awful lot and won loads so went up and fair play.

 

We now need things such as years worth of decline defensively and mentally to be addressed. We need to go back to basics and be structured and defensively sound so we can focus on the other end. It must be soul destroying for the attacking players to score 2/3 and it not be enough. 
 

Even if we stay up, we aren’t challenging for promotion next season. Rowett would continue this work. With the recent history of managerial appointments, it’s more likely the club get it wrong. 

[Claudio Fannieri]

I was really impressed with how he turned things around at half time but wha the actually feck did he say as his pre match talk because we were as flat as we have been all season. 
 

You would hope that first 45 minutes would have been high intensity and high energy everyone up for it and positivity under the new manager. Which does make me worry once the novelty of Rowett has worn off does this rabble revert to type. 

[shen]

21 minutes ago, Claudio Fannieri said:

I was really impressed with how he turned things around at half time but wha the actually feck did he say as his pre match talk because we were as flat as we have been all season. 
 

You would hope that first 45 minutes would have been high intensity and high energy everyone up for it and positivity under the new manager. Which does make me worry once the novelty of Rowett has worn off does this rabble revert to type. 

A goal against after a couple of minutes could explain this. We're obviously fragile in our current state, so it would've been a miracle if they were unaffected by the goal.

We finished the first half stronger than we started it, so we were stabilizing already before halftime. Rowett capitalized on it at HT evidently, but he's no magician who can change the entire mentality in a few days.

[Deeg67]

2 hours ago, LCFCJohn said:

One of them with Nelson. I don’t see Vestergaard and Lascelles working as a pair. I might be wrong as Wes and Huth mentioned above, we both on the senior side!

 

But I do think Nelson is looking shakey because of those around him and he is too young and experienced to take it all on by himself. Whereas even when he was alongside Vestergaard for a spell, they looked to be ok. 
 

Anyway, Rowett raved about Nelson when he coached him last season and made comments about him going to the top so I expect he’ll be first choice. 

Vesty and Lascelles won't handle two matches a week for long even if they get healthy, so there'll be opportunities for Nelson either way.

Edited 22 February by Deeg67

[UniFox21]

7 hours ago, BrilliantFox said:

Regardless of league position, he needs to leave in the summer.

He's a quick fix, not a long-term solution and definitely not the man you want to let rebuild this club.

 

Good news is we have an incoming Technical Director who will be deciding on our next manager in the summer.

I'm unsure. If he keeps us up, he's a coach that can create a sturdy base to build from.

 

Whilst we're having so much change off field, that might not be the worst thing. 

 

 

[Lesta2014]

Anyone know what nixons story on us is today? Is it around longer term manager appointment?

[Manwell Pablo]

7 hours ago, Chrysalis said:

 

I agree on Wes improving a lot with Huth.

 

But I want to make a point that has bothered me for a while.

 

It is fashionable on the community that when we concede a goal, to either blame the keeper, or usually to blame the last man that got beaten.  This is a very short sighted way of viewing the game, it is a team sport, lots of things happen before the ball gets to the final defender, but many dont seem to understand this, it might be excused that people are relying only on highlights which sadly dont show much else than a few seconds before the goal, but I would expect people watching live to see the bigger picture.

 

As an example lets say we have possession in final 3rd, a player over hits a pass (common with us), we lose the ball, then the other team runs through our midfield without getting challenged, often without even getting pressed (also common), then the ball gets in to a dangerous area our final 3rd, and only then we shift into gear to try and get it back, one defender stands like a statue, and another tries to intercept before the shot, but fails and the shot is in the back of the net.

Basically that defender that tried to save the situation right at the end is the one that gets blamed, not the defender not helping him, not the midfield, being cut through like butter, not the player who did an unenforced error with a over hit pass.  Not the lack of a full team press, or bad tactics from the manager, its all down to that final defender nearly every single time with foxes talk, its frustrating.  The problem with this, it can lead to specific defenders getting abuse from the crowd, affects confidence and motivation, and before you know it they in perpetual bad form.

There’s a team element to it that’s for sure, you don’t conceed every game through having a bad back line alone. 
 

but in the same breath it’s normally a heavy contributing factor 😂

[alanf0x]

Appointed 3 weeks to late unfortunately. Rudkin out 

[Happy Fox]

3 minutes ago, alanf0x said:

Appointed 3 weeks to late unfortunately. Rudkin out 

Because we f**ked around trying to get a higher profile manager..

[trooky]

Rowett, has to do something with the defence. 

 

The problem isn't just the back 4, the full backs get no help from Mavididi, Fatawu or Monga when he plays. 

 

Mukasa is a great attacking player but doesn't help in defense either. 

 

I would play 433, with Mukasa, Daka and Fatawu up top, and play Skipp, Aribo and JJ as first choice midfield 3.

 

The emphasis has to be on working hard without the ball, stopping crosses, it was said by the sky commentator countless times yesterday and throughout the season. 

Edited 22 February by trooky

[Chelmofox]

5 hours ago, Deeg67 said:

The key for Rowett will be getting Jannik and Lascelles back and established as the CB pair. Will it happen, who knows - both old and injury-prone but they're the best we have. If he gets the pair of them healthy his track record shows he can patch together enough defensive improvement to survive.

 

Mukasa had a goal, an assist, and three more shoulda-assists in about 20 minutes. He's clearly a difference-maker at this level. With the likes of Mukasa, James, Ramsey and even Reid around him (eventually) we can clearly score enough goals to stay up with even modest improvement defensively.

Lascelles yes, Jannik should be a bench option. Nelson + Lascelles should be the first choice. Vestergaard has been horrific this season and isn't a magical solution. He can't jump and gets caught out for pace. 

[alanf0x]

25 minutes ago, Happy Fox said:

Because we f**ked around trying to get a higher profile manager..

Yeah - let's chase Enzo and Potter. Whilst they are thinking about it, no drama throwing away 12 points to our rivals 

[coolhandfox]

41 minutes ago, Chelmofox said:

Lascelles yes, Jannik should be a bench option. Nelson + Lascelles should be the first choice. Vestergaard has been horrific this season and isn't a magical solution. He can't jump and gets caught out for pace. 

 

Disagree he's probably been out best defender.

 

PPG with JV playing 1.33 

 

PPG without JV playing 0.77 

 

We have taken 0.57 less points per game without him.

 

 

 

Edited 22 February by coolhandfox

[john ridley]

29 minutes ago, Happy Fox said:

Because we f**ked around trying to get a higher profile manager..

I don't get why they think we deserve  a higher calibre  manager ,them days  have gone .Rowett IS our level now ,whether  he keeps us up or not he should be given ago .You don't see many high profile  managers  in league 1,especially  in our state.