Could you do it?

[Finnegan]

One of those serious threads, time for some genuine honesty and a reflective debate.

 

The Ian Watkins story (specifically, people's reactions to it) have gotten me thinking somewhat. You're all alone with not a witness in the world, it's you, Watkins (or other, relevant, bogeyman of choice) and a blunt instrument. Would you and - if yes - COULD you? Would you only want to inflict pain, or death?

 

And if you could, on reflection, is that weird? What does it say about you and us as a society? And what does it achieve? Is it only eliminating all possibility of re-offending or is it something else?

 

Before any of the obvious, select few jump - I'm not trying to make some preachy point about the death penalty, I'm not suggesting it's wrong or that it makes you a bad person to wish harm on someone who's done something so undeniably, so utterly terrible. It just genuinely interests me what people's views are.

 

A lot of standard reactions to news stories like this (the Rigby killers will be another) involve cries for torture, the death penalty, physical maiming, etc. I'm just curious to see who people think should actually carry out these actions? Are people serious, do they really mean it or is it just an emotional statement?

 

I've always felt that life imprisonment - proper life imprisonment, the sort of South American / East Asian, life (that means life) in a small hole imprisonment would be my preferred punishment for anyone who had hurt my family or loved ones, as a non-believer in the "afterlife" it seems far more punishing than any execution.

 

Thoughts?

[Dan]

It's hard to implement it for the reasons stated which are quite obvious - it technically makes whoever does it, a murderer.

 

Could I flick the switch on an electric chair which Ian Watkins is sat in? Honestly? I could.

 

EDIT; I do see what you're saying at the end about what you'd do, Finners, and I can see exactly why - I'm just not convinced that that actually happens in prison. Does it seriously cost a decent amount of money each year to keep someone in there? For what?

 

I'd be more for prisons if it's being stuck in a whole like that, with rats for your meals.

[Guest ttfn]

Nope.

Maybe had it been a case directly affecting me I could get worked up enough. But it isn't, so no.

I mean I could but I wouldn't want to.

[Stadt]

Chemical castration and a broken nose.

[cambridgefox]

Don't think I could ,unless it involved my immediate family.

Regarding imprisonment,yeah I think your right some Thai style justice would be ideal.

[Soar Fox]

Don't think I could stand there and beat someone to death. I could defiently give them a couple of slaps though.

Would rather see them rot in some South American prison though and let god knows what happen to them in there.

[Fox92]

Although what he did was vile, I don't think I could as it isn't in me.

[DennisNedry]

I think only if the victim was a family member or close friend of mine.

 

I can't imagine being Lee Rigby's father I'd have any trouble hacking at a cuffed Adobolajo with a meat cleaver. Or hacking Watkins genitals off if it were my baby daughter that got raped.

 

That's if there were no consequences of course! The satisfaction wouldn't be worth years in prison!

[RobHawk]

I'm going to concentrate on the Watkins scenario as I think if it involved a loved one that is a very different question.

So I've re re-read the report, feel sick and disgusted with all 3 human beings (lets not exclude the 2 mothers in this) and I've got my chance to hurt them, would I? Honestly don't think I would. I'd probably be calling them every name under the sun but I don't really think I would do much having just read what sick bastards they are.

However, had i walked in on the 3 of them in the act it would probably be a different story. Seeing is believing and that amount of realism may well push me to far, I don't know if I could or would want to kill them, but I would like to do some permanent damage. Something so they could never forget what they had done. Genital mutilation followed by removing their eyes sounds like a good start. Then they can rot like they deserve!

[Captain...]

If I caught him in the act then yes.

 

If it was now after he has been arrested and convicted and I was left alone with him handcuffed, then no, I couldn't just attack a defenceless person and kill them, I think it is a greater punishment to let him live with what he has done, and psychologically break him until he realises exactly what he has done.

 

If he had been let out on a technicality and there was nothing stopping him doing it again, and I found myself alone with him then I really don't know.

[ADK]

I wouldn't want to torture someone and I don't really see how that is making anything right.

 

As for the mothers, they are supposed to have shown remorse, I feel that eventually when the kids find out who their real mothers are it should be up to them to either forgive them or not.

 

I find it hard to feel genuine anger at people when they are clearly so removed from normal society. I feel intense anger when someone has conned a vulnerable person out of money or caused a serious injury through deliberate bad behaviour yet find it hard to get worked up about a baby rapist even though that is worse because it just seems like abnormal behaviour. What possible gain could a person get from committing such a crime? 

[pSinatra]

I couldn't do it.  I very rarely lose my rag & it has only ever been when it involves loved ones that a sort of red mist takes over, but even then I have never had to resort to violence.  But Watkins is a different matter altogether.  I suspect I may well find myself doing something I wouldn't normally do under those circumstances.

 

I don't know about what punishment he deserves?  I quite like the idea of chemical castration (or even actual castration) for crimes against children & the rape of men & women.  If it works on cats & dogs, I don't see why it wouldn't work on humans.

 

Is there a reason for what he did?  Has he ever been a victim himself?  It's been discussed before, but is he just plain evil?  It's difficult for a simpleton like me to get my head around what he's done & make any sense of it.

 

Locking people up for the rest of their living days might be a more suitable punishment than what is currently available.  Maybe letting him out & seeing how he gets on might be more fitting?

[Guest Bilo]

A lifetime in solitary confinement so he can only reflect on his crimes for the rest of his days. He might feel no remorse now, but years of time alone will soon change that and the hope is that he will go out of his mind with guilt and self-loathing. 

 

I dislike the reactionary attitudes of reintroducing capital punishment when horrific crimes such as this come to light, a few years in prison followed by a procedure that has been made as scientific and lacking in cruelty as possible isn't an appropriate punishment. All it does is to make people like Watkins, Sutcliffe, Huntley and other scumbags causes celebres. 

 

[BoneDog]

Don't know much about this story and never heard of him before he was in the news, but read a bit the other day and I don't think I'd have a problem with disposing him (preferably with a gun - not really into blunt weapon combat). You've got to be strong when dealing with these people. Even if he could be helped (which I doubt) he doesn't deserve help. Absolute psycho of the worst type.

 

The women involved should be in prison for life aswell.

[pSinatra]

Compile a list of the top 30 offenders.  Stick them on the Isle of Man & have them fight it out Battle Royale style

[Soar Fox]

After watching a panorama special about Lee Rigby & his murderers I really do hope the prison officers turn a blind eye to whatever happens to them in prison.

[MC Prussian]

 

I couldn't. Part of me believes this could make me just as bad as the other.

 

But I would make sure they stay locked away for life.

I'd consider such a move a much bigger sentence than killing or dangerously injuring a (mentally ill) wrongdoer on the spot - I think you'd only give them what they're longing for that way, anyway.

[Bert]

Unless it was a relative of mine involved, I do my best to give him a kicking but I wouldn't be able to kill.

[Strokes]

I would love to say yes, but I'm not sure. If it was my immediates then without hesitation. I think I could pull a trigger or flip a switch, but not beat with a blunt instrument if that makes sense.

[Saxondale]

I'm actually impressed that people are being honest and saying they wouldn't. I was expecting the usual 'I'd kick 'is 'ead in' bravado.

 

Regardless, I think this is one of those situations where you can't say what you'd do unless you're actually faced with the scenario. 

 

If you ask somebody what they'd do if their trousers were on fire, they'd probably say that they'd take them off or roll on the floor. In reality they'd probably flail around like a clown.

[Webbo]

It's impossible to know unless you're in that situation but I don't think I could.

[Mark_w]

Depends on the situation. If I knew he was going to prison for life, then no I couldn't. If the alternative to doing it was someone like that walking back into society unpunished, then I think I probably could (Not sure I'd be able to live with myself afterwards though).

 

Probably with your views on Capital Punishment though Finnegan.

[BoneDog]

I would love to say yes, but I'm not sure. If it was my immediates then without hesitation. I think I could pull a trigger or flip a switch, but not beat with a blunt instrument if that makes sense.

 

Yes that makes sense. I think I could shoot him but don't think I could do a physical job with a blunt weapon. Could maybe manage one swing of a bat if I was wearing ear defenders, but it's not my cup of tea.

 

I'm actually impressed that people are being honest and saying they wouldn't. I was expecting the usual 'I'd kick 'is 'ead in' bravado.

 

Regardless, I think this is one of those situations where you can't say what you'd do unless you're actually faced with the scenario. 

 

If you ask somebody what they'd do if their trousers were on fire, they'd probably say that they'd take them off or roll on the floor. In reality they'd probably flail around like a clown.

 

It isn't always bravado when people say that, I know a few who'd enjoy it. Also known a few who go inside and they wouldn't hesitate to do it if they got near him. The number of people who would jump straight on him if they had the chance is likely very high.

[Rincewind]

No/ I do not think I am capable of killing another human being. But if the killers were to suffer an untimely death I  would not mourn for them.

[Guest MattP]

Impossible to say unless you are in the situation.

Not sure if I could torture someone at all, especially in some horrific way.

I'd have no problem putting a bullet in the back of Watkins or those two savages heads though, I've only shot animals and never a human and I regard those as lower than a pheasant or a fox.