Wigan Post Match Thread 2 - 2

[Kitchandro]

I am making no assumptions, Vardy injury aside, how would you have handled these last few weeks if you were a manager of a team with a very talented squad? Would you have earmakrked 1 game to make a host of changes? Played the same 11 every game until they were knackered and you were forced to make changes? or would you have rotated the squad during those few weeks to maintain fitness?

 

 

No denying the need for rest or the quality in the squad, but I ask you the same question, how would you have handled it?

 

The issue is not the players he picked, all good players in their own right, and in Moore, Konch and Dyer, players who have significantly contributed to this unbeaten run the issue is that after not changing the side for weeks, he made 6 changes, and did so for one of our toughest games of the season.

 

It is also that 2 of those changes meant a complete new midfield, King has played 59 minutes, since he last started a league game, Millwall on 1st Jan 3 months ago, Hammond 75 minutes.

 

The fact Nigel did the same over the Christmas period makes me think that it is his tactic, making 6 changes in one game, then back to the 'first team', over Christmas he rested over 2 games, Millwall and the Stoke, maybe he will do the same against Wednesday, then back to the 'first team' for QPR and Reading.

 

On a final point, just because we are top and on a 20 match unbeaten run, it doesn't mean everything Nigel does is perfect, and cannot be criticised if you feel it was an error, had we won last night it would not have changed my opinion, I said the same over Christmas, he should use the squad better. In the last 14 games, 1260 minutes of league football our midfielders have played the following number of minutes:

 

Drinkwater: 1245

James: 1222

Hammond: 75

King: 59

 

Considering everyone is agreed that King and Hammond are good enough to start games, do you think that is good management of the squad?

 

Nobody really thinks that. I'm sure they don't. Even if they claim to.

[Woollett's Wellies]

We've not been good at defending set pieces for years in my opinion.

 

Similarly we don't make anything of corners either. How I long for the regular Scoring input of Elliott, Taggart, Walsh etc..Sorry! Old man moment there.

[Freeman's Wharfer]

One thing a lot of people seem to be missing is that it's not just about keeping players physically fit, it's also about keeping a squad happy.

 

Over the last few weeks the likes of Hammond, King, Dyer, Moore and Konchesky will have been itching to get in the side. Whilst you'd hope that they can see why they've not been playing with the good form of others, you'd also expect that as professional footballers they'd have been knocking on Pearson's door and asking when they're going to get a chance. I'd imagine that Pearson has probably been very clear for a good few weeks that he was thinking about the run of fixtures up to Burnley and that until that point he wouldn't be making any major changes unless forced to through disastrous form or someone forcing their way in from the bench.

 

Through that he's managed to keep a seemingly happy squad but if you're one of those players that is told that and you then don't get a chance with 3 games in 6 days how happy are you going to be then?!

 

That clearly wasn't our strongest team tonight but Wood and Hammond aside it was pretty much the team that got us to the top of the table early in the season. It was clearly good enough to go to Wigan and compete for something. All in all, we've seen some fantastic management from Pearson tonight. Key players rested, fringe players with minutes under their belts, squad kept happy and an additional point from the game in hand (another one along the way to the overall goal). At full-time Pearson was clearly delighted with the result, fist pumping as if it were a win and rightly so.

[goose2010]

Scrolled through 8 pages of bitching and moaning to see the goals from last night and nothing?! what's going on people!! 

[Kitchandro]

Yeah i didnt say he made loads of tackles did i. I'm talking about his positional sense, link up play, and ability to read the game. Whereas you just expect him to fly into tackles and spend half the game on his arse. No. The art of Defensive Midfield play has moved on since the 1970s. Get with it.

Exposed at the back? Numerous break aways? Missed that too. It was an end to end game, and overall we just about deserved a draw. No?

Same game, different planet.

 

Yeh and I'm telling you he's shite at it.

 

'Reading the game' is just code for 'is really slow and sits in the middle doing nothing'. It's not actual ability or impact on the match, it's just a meaningless phrase for players who you can't actually do anything of note.

 

It's like that old chestnut 'he's got experience'. That just means he's old, it's got no worth unless he's actually got some ability or asset of some sort to go with it.

[kingcarr21]

Great result for us. Would of took a point before kick off. Bit surprised of all the negativity around the team selection. Maybe it would of been the right choice to rest players against yeovil for the burnley and wigan game but at the end of the day we have still got a good points return from the last few games. Lets just keep getting behind the team and hope for a win vs wednesday and one step closer to the promised land. In Pearson we trust.

[Captain...]

Nobody really thinks that. I'm sure they don't. Even if they claim to.

 

Disagree, I think King is good enough to start, not necessarily better than either James or Drinkwater, but good enough to start, Hammond, I've yet to be convinced by, but I would have had no problem if he had started ahead of one of James or Drinkwater in any game, but to start them both as part of 6 changes, after months of keeping a settled team I can't describe it as good management of the squad.

 

We've all known these fixtures were coming, it is not just about them starting games, why not make changes at half time against Yeovil, when we were looking tired bring on King at half time, give Drinkwater a rest as he was looking off the boil?

[Babylon]

One question, one statement.

What would you have done over the last few weeks knowing the fixture list and the stresses and strains on a footballer and the likely need for changes, earmarked one game to make a lot of changes, or rotated the squad throughout the whole period so the team was never significantly weakened?

The fact promotion is a certainty is irrelevant I still want us to finish top of the league and I still want us to win every game.

Vardy had to be replaced, and was replaced by Chris Wood.

 

Up until Moore got injured he was playing regularly in the team that got us clear at the top.

Up until Dyer got injured he was playing regularly in the team that got us clear at the top.

Up until Konchesky got suspended he was playing regularly in the team that got us clear at the top.

 

People seem to forget Andy King started the season in midfield over James, and has started many games himself in a team that got to the top of the league.

 

The team last night, was the same starting 11 that beat Wigan 2-0 at our place earlier in the season, other than Vardy being injured and Drinkwater making way for Hammond. With that in mind, it's hardly a shock the management thought that team might get something out of it (and they did).

 

People are acting like the team was full of duds, where as other than Hammond and Wood it was virtually our starting line up for a huge chunk of the season.

[Captain...]

Vardy had to be replaced, and was replaced by Chris Wood.

 

Up until Moore got injured he was playing regularly in the team that got us clear at the top.

Up until Dyer got injured he was playing regularly in the team that got us clear at the top.

Up until Konchesky got injured he was playing regularly in the team that got us clear at the top.

 

People seem to forget Andy King started the season in midfield over James, and has started many games himself in a team that got to the top of the league.

 

The team last night, was the same starting 11 that beat Wigan 2-0 at our place earlier in the season, other than Vardy being injured and Drinkwater making way for Hammond. With that in mind, it's hardly a shock the management thought that team might get something out of it (and they did).

 

Again, another person not answering my question, what would you have done Babylon?

 

I have stated repeatedly this is no criticism of the players in the squad, it is frustration that they are not used more often so we can keep a largely settled team but rotate, for example, one position a match during a tough run, and make more changes at half time or around the 60 minute mark to keep everyone fit and fresh, and not have to make 6 changes for an away trip to the form team in the Championship, current FA Cup holders, and FA Cup semi finalists, who until recently had been an established prem side.

[cambridgefox]

The belief in the squad is class. We just don't know when we are beat. Were nowhere near our best whatsoever but didn't give up. Two poor goals to concede. We must get better at defending set pieces.

Agreed,in seasons past if we had gone behind twice,I really don't think we would have battled back,we would have rolled over.We were poor at Brighton admittedly ,and I didn't go to the other away defeats so I can't comment but these days are few and far between,even at Brighton when we pulled a goal back we were pushing for a while and I had belief( albeit a short while )This has been a fantastic season for everyone connected with the club and these days don't happen very often,so why some are moaning .if Wigan away would have been the 1st game of the season,you would have been over the moon for a point.

[Babylon]

Again, another person not answering my question, what would you have done Babylon?

 

I have stated repeatedly this is no criticism of the players in the squad, it is frustration that they are not used more often so we can keep a largely settled team but rotate one position a match during a tough run, and make more changes at half time to keep everyone fit and fresh, and not have to make 6 changes for an away trip to the form team in the Championship, current FA Cup holders, and FA Cup semi finalists, who until recently had been an established prem side.

How can anyone possibly answer with any certainty when they have no idea of their physical state? Whether it's tiredness, knocks, sniffles, the shits or something else.

 

Quite frankly as well, I don't presume to know more than the person who has got us clear top, breaking records left right and centre, who works with the players all the time and has the data in front of him to make the decisions.

 

If they decide that they would rather do it this way, then I'm pretty sure it's all been thought through rather thoroughly.  At the end of the day, it's been done twice this season and we have walked away with 4 points from two fairly tough away games.

 

I have no problem with you saying "this is what I would have done", what I and I guess others find annoying is it comes across from many more a case of "Pearson was wrong, he should have done this".

[Mythyaar]

We were lucky to get a point last night. Wigan were the better team by a long way and should walk the play offs. Won't dwell on the negatives.

 

The positives: great game to watch, invaluable point gained, and the performance of RDL who was absolutely superb throughout.

[LanguedocFox]

I was out last night so didn't catch the game or any of the action here. Not even going to bother looking in the match thread, I can already imagine the comments. March on lads, decent point away to Wigan, all things considered.

 

Very sensible, Haydos. I listened to the match on Foxes Player while occasionally coming to the match thread. With one or two notable exceptions - Babylon and MC Prussian for example - there was a constant stream of whinging and moaning, about the team selection and the players. The maddest thing was that the players who came in for most stick were King and Hammond, which shows that an awful lot of posters here know fvck all about football.

 

 

Embarrassing match thread and post match thread of the season goes to......Wigan away!

I really do shudder at the thought of the premier league for some of you. A draw is a great result and keeps the unbeaten run going whilst giving our top performers a WELL EARNED rest!

 

I couldn't agree more. Next season we'll be losing 1-0 to someone like Stoke and we'll have the whingers out in force. I just wish they would sod off, but that's not going to happen. Sadly.

 

I would rather see the mods be more heavy handed in banning trolls and clowns. that's not to say no criticism, but obvious, over the top complaining should be terminated. nothing wrong with a bit of censorship.

 

Don't see the point in this, Shade. Unfortunately, everyone has the right to be a pr!ck: just that some people on FT seem to enjoy abusing the priviledge. Banning them is not the answer: keep them here where we can keep an eye on the fvckwits.

 

Scrolled through 8 pages of bitching and moaning to see the goals from last night and nothing?! what's going on people!! 

 

There weren't any goals last night, at least not for City. Didn't you see the team? We sent out six useless replacements with a midfield that included King and Hammond (yeah - I'm not joking) who, as we all know, couldn't hit a cow's ar$e with a banjo.

[Captain...]

How can anyone possibly answer with any certainty when they have no idea of their physical state? Whether it's tiredness, knocks, sniffles, the shits or something else.

 

Quite frankly as well, I don't presume to know more than the person who has got us clear top, breaking records left right and centre, who works with the players all the time and has the data in front of him to make the decisions.

 

If they decide that they would rather do it this way, then I'm pretty sure it's all been thought through rather thoroughly.  At the end of the day, it's been done twice this season and we have walked away with 4 points from two fairly tough away games.

 

I have no problem with you saying "this is what I would have done", what I and I guess others find annoying is it comes across from many more a case of "Pearson was wrong, he should have done this".

 

There are no certainties in life, so I'll rephrase the question, what is the better approach, in your opinion:

 

A) Utilising the squad and making small changes to the first team, rotating players in the starting line-up and at half time over the season

B) Playing the best 11 players in every match then making lots of changes for one or two matches then go back to the best 11 players.

 

Both have their pros and cons, option A) Aims to ensure the squad remains fresh, fit and match sharp, but will rarely have the best 11 players on the pitch at the same time, but can be managed to ensure that for important games all key players are 100% and raring to go. Option B) means we have the best 11 playing together more often, a settled side and in the best 11 the players know each other's games inside out, but in these "rest" games there is a risk, that making so many changes would significantly weaken the team and players coming in haven't been playing much with rest of the team, then even if playing well players get dropped to the bench in favour of the first 11 again.

 

So you're the manager, what approach would you take?

[MrSpaM]

Good point last night, but we really need to stop giving away stupid set pieces and conceding from them. If we do that in the premiership we are going to get annihilated every week.

 

Well done to the lads for getting us one step closer to the promised land though!

[Dickov22]

One thing a lot of people seem to be missing is that it's not just about keeping players physically fit, it's also about keeping a squad happy.

Over the last few weeks the likes of Hammond, King, Dyer, Moore and Konchesky will have been itching to get in the side. Whilst you'd hope that they can see why they've not been playing with the good form of others, you'd also expect that as professional footballers they'd have been knocking on Pearson's door and asking when they're going to get a chance. I'd imagine that Pearson has probably been very clear for a good few weeks that he was thinking about the run of fixtures up to Burnley and that until that point he wouldn't be making any major changes unless forced to through disastrous form or someone forcing their way in from the bench.

Through that he's managed to keep a seemingly happy squad but if you're one of those players that is told that and you then don't get a chance with 3 games in 6 days how happy are you going to be then?!

That clearly wasn't our strongest team tonight but Wood and Hammond aside it was pretty much the team that got us to the top of the table early in the season. It was clearly good enough to go to Wigan and compete for something. All in all, we've seen some fantastic management from Pearson tonight. Key players rested, fringe players with minutes under their belts, squad kept happy and an additional point from the game in hand (another one along the way to the overall goal). At full-time Pearson was clearly delighted with the result, fist pumping as if it were a win and rightly so.

Best post in this thread ðŸ‘

[cambridgefox]

I'm sure some on here would make bloody good union reps at work,always moaning.

[Dickov22]

We were lucky to get a point last night. Wigan were the better team by a long way and should walk the play offs. Won't dwell on the negatives.

The positives: great game to watch, invaluable point gained, and the performance of RDL who was absolutely superb throughout.

And yet there's someone in the man of the match thread suggesting De Laet was poor!

I dunno what people are on.

[Biggus]

We clearly need two simultaneous threads per game going forward.  One for positive people and one for moaners. 

[Babylon]

There are no certainties in life, so I'll rephrase the question, what is the better approach, in your opinion:

 

A) Utilising the squad and making small changes to the first team, rotating players in the starting line-up and at half time over the season

B) Playing the best 11 players in every match then making lots of changes for one or two matches then go back to the best 11 players.

 

Both have their pros and cons, option A) Aims to ensure the squad remains fresh, fit and match sharp, but will rarely have the best 11 players on the pitch at the same time, but can be managed to ensure that for important games all key players are 100% and raring to go. Option B) means we have the best 11 playing together more often, a settled side and in the best 11 the players know each other's games inside out, but in these "rest" games there is a risk, that making so many changes would significantly weaken the team and players coming in haven't been playing much with rest of the team, then even if playing well players get dropped to the bench in favour of the first 11 again.

 

So you're the manager, what approach would you take?

Well my decision would also be based on other factors also, such as games played, points ahead of other rivals etc.

 

Being clear top, with a game in hand, in a seemingly unassailable position, with our nearest rival for the title suffering an injury crisis, then I would have no problem with b).

 

If on the other hand, we were 3rd with a very good shout of catching the top two, and last night was a game in hand to chase them down, then I would have preferred a).

[suffolk fox]

Was that Wigan team tonight the best we have played against all season????... Manchester City may agree?

This....please wigan fluke a result against Man City and suddenly they are Barcelona/Bayern Munich rolled into one? With the team we played I will take a draw tonight however, let's not build Wigan up to a lavel they are not. Until Rosler came in they were in freefall and going nowhere. Freak results happen in football sometimes Wigan beating Man City was one of those.

[Dan]

We're still unbeaten, we've lowered the chances of going up on Saturday when we don't even play, and we've still been able to celebrate a late goal.

 

That, to me, is ideal - and feels as good as a win (not sure how many will agree with that).

 

I'll take a draw at a side who haven't lost at home under their current manager if we make six changes.

 

Our defending of set pieces however is still non-league standard. West Ham are going to kill us next year.

[AndWhat?]

We're still unbeaten, we've lowered the chances of going up on Saturday when we don't even play, and we've still been able to celebrate a late goal.

 

That, to me, is ideal - and feels as good as a win (not sure how many will agree with that).

 

I'll take a draw at a side who haven't lost at home under their current manager if we make six changes.

 

Our defending of set pieces however is still non-league standard. West Ham are going to kill us next year.

 

Exactly how I feel. 

[RobHawk]

There are no certainties in life, so I'll rephrase the question, what is the better approach, in your opinion:

 

A) Utilising the squad and making small changes to the first team, rotating players in the starting line-up and at half time over the season

B) Playing the best 11 players in every match then making lots of changes for one or two matches then go back to the best 11 players.

 

Both have their pros and cons, option A) Aims to ensure the squad remains fresh, fit and match sharp, but will rarely have the best 11 players on the pitch at the same time, but can be managed to ensure that for important games all key players are 100% and raring to go. Option B) means we have the best 11 playing together more often, a settled side and in the best 11 the players know each other's games inside out, but in these "rest" games there is a risk, that making so many changes would significantly weaken the team and players coming in haven't been playing much with rest of the team, then even if playing well players get dropped to the bench in favour of the first 11 again.

 

So you're the manager, what approach would you take?

 

Im going to wade into this debate and keep my response nice and simple.

 

Given that option B has our beloved club all but promoted at the beginning of April in one of the most competitive leagues in the world, on a 20 game unbeaten run i would go for that.

 

How anyone can even dream to question or criticise Nig's approach over the course of the season completely baffles me. 

[Captain...]

Im going to wade into this debate and keep my response nice and simple.

 

Given that option B has our beloved club all but promoted at the beginning of April in one of the most competitive leagues in the world, on a 20 game unbeaten run i would go for that.

 

How anyone can even dream to question or criticise Nig's approach over the course of the season completely baffles me. 

 

I don't care how good he has been over the course of a season, if I think he has made a mistake I will say, in the same way people can say the likes of Vardy and Drinkwater have played badly when they have. (I was being accused of being a happy clapper last season, now I'm being told I can't even dream of criticising NP, I love FT)

 

We are top and NP has done an excellent job, but we have dropped points over the last few games with tiredness and fatigue being cited as a factor and changes made as a result, I think better management over the last month could have prevented having to make 6 changes for one game. I also think it will give the wrong message to King, Moore, Dyer, Konch and Hammond if they are dropped again for Wednesday and we keep the same line up until the end of the season.

 

Now you can't argue with the results, but it is not an approach I agree with, and not one you see at many successful clubs.