Shinji Okazaki

[cityfanlee23]

To answer a few people, Yes I agree bringing him on obviously made a difference, but it was not the sole reason we improved, our best play has come in the 2nd half in the vast majority of our games, 

Ulloa has come on a couple of times as sub and has changed the game, and he's our slowest striker.

[Steve_Walsh5]

When was the last time Okazaki had a shot? I genuinely can only remember West Ham away the last time he had a shot.

[cityfanlee23]

True. That stat works in his favour too for when people say we looked better second half after Okazaki got dragged off. Can't ignore one and accept the other

I don't know

Guessing he means it was cagey and neither team fully commited to leaving space in behind

No, I'm just a pervert....

[CosbehFox]

Not speaking for Lee but the stats this season prove that we like to exploit teams in the second half when their legs have gone. Our fitness levels and high pressing game allow us to do this very well

We weren't really pressing up front until Okazaki came on. Watson and Capoue kept coming way deep to pick the ball up. Okazaki stopped that out ball which was evidenced by some absolute wayward clearances, Watford's back four were not comfortable at all when pressed.

He's very similar to Nugent at the moment. I personally think that work rate will be the key to getting a result against the bigger sides. The wheels fell off against Arsenal once their midfield could settle more without a no.10

[The Doctor]

You can call it a basic argument, but this is a player that came from the bundesliga on the back of scoring 30 goals in 2 seasons... now he's not doing that, the fans that like him are throwing him a lifeline and saying scoring goals is not his role all of a sudden, and it's okay if he does not because he's not on the pitch to score... Sounds like an excuse to me.

 

On that basis he does exactly the same job as vardy, yet vardy is scoring and Shinji is not... 

 

I've said it before and you conveniently ignored it, Okazaki statistically is a worse link up player than Ulloa is per 90 minutes.

 

He's not doing that because he's not playing the role of a goalscorer, he's playing the same role Nugent played in the championship winning season - his role is to move and hassle to create room for Vardy. If he scores, great, but anyone watching can see that he's not in the side to score goals at the moment.

 

He's not doing the same job as Vardy at all... Vardy is played as the main striker, off the backs of defenders with all the onus on scoring, Shinji is playing as a number 10, in front of the defence to help feed the system for Vardy.

 

Going to post these statistics?

[foxfanazer]

He's not doing that because he's not playing the role of a goalscorer, he's playing the same role Nugent played in the championship winning season - his role is to move and hassle to create room for Vardy. If he scores, great, but anyone watching can see that he's not in the side to score goals at the moment.

He's not doing the same job as Vardy at all... Vardy is played as the main striker, off the backs of defenders with all the onus on scoring, Shinji is playing as a number 10, in front of the defence to help feed the system for Vardy.

Going to post these statistics?

Agree with a lot of this but if he's playing the role Nugent played for us he needs to chip in with the odd goal here and there like Nuge did else we've not really got value for money from him.

I think he'll come good but I do think some are being a bit too strong in their defence of him. Not sure he should be automatically keeping Ulloa out of the side

[crisp packet]

Agree with a lot of this but if he's playing the role Nugent played for us he needs to chip in with the odd goal here and there like Nuge did else we've not really got value for money from him.

I think he'll come good but I do think some are being a bit too strong in their defence of him. Not sure he should be automatically keeping Ulloa out of the side

Nugget scored loads?

(In the prem)

[foxfanazer]

Nugget scored loads?

(In the prem)

He said in the championship winning season. The extra money spent on Okazaki should mean he's capable of doing the same in the prem

[The Doctor]

He said in the championship winning season. The extra money spent on Okazaki should mean he's capable of doing the same in the prem

 

In fairness most of nugents championship goals came from the penalty spot - Okazaki isn't our designated penalty taker, unlike Nugent.

[foxfanazer]

In fairness most of nugents championship goals came from the penalty spot - Okazaki isn't our designated penalty taker, unlike Nugent.

He did chip in with a half decent amount of goals though. I'm not saying Okazaki needs to bagging 20 goals a season but he should be getting around 10 imo to really justify his place in the team. Don't think he does enough else to justify his place without the odd goal here and there

[crisp packet]

If we play to his strengths ie ball on the floor? I feel we get more out of him. To be fair he does need to shoot a lot more ? Cannot have had many shots this season at all?

But we are third ....

[cityfanlee23]

He's not doing that because he's not playing the role of a goalscorer, he's playing the same role Nugent played in the championship winning season - his role is to move and hassle to create room for Vardy. If he scores, great, but anyone watching can see that he's not in the side to score goals at the moment.

He's not doing the same job as Vardy at all... Vardy is played as the main striker, off the backs of defenders with all the onus on scoring, Shinji is playing as a number 10, in front of the defence to help feed the system for Vardy.

Going to post these statistics?

It's all good and well saying that... Ulloa got how many last year? He played deep all season.

People just keep throwing him a life line, the fact is right now he's no better than ulloa, and no better than nugent,

As I said I want him to prove me wrong, but it's pretty obviously and a statistical fact that he's playing the link up job worse than both nugent and ulloa.

So he is either a goal scorer or a link up player either way he's not adding much apart from ruthlessly running around like a headless chicken.

Hope he does well but I'm not convinced.

[Guest ttfn]

It's all good and well saying that... Ulloa got how many last year? He played deep all season.

People just keep throwing him a life line, the fact is right now he's no better than ulloa, and no better than nugent,

As I said I want him to prove me wrong, but it's pretty obviously and a statistical fact that he's playing the link up job worse than both nugent and ulloa.

So he is either a goal scorer or a link up player either way he's not adding much apart from ruthlessly running around like a headless chicken.

Hope he does well but I'm not convinced.

Literally no idea where you're getting this crap about Ulloa "playing deep all season" from. He was the focal point of our attack for most of last season and whenever he dropped off the front he looked like a total donkey.

On Saturday whoever played in that "number 10" role was on a hiding to nothing. Capoue and Watson both sat very deep and denied whoever was playing there any space or time on the ball. Mahrez had an absolute shocker in the first half and couldn't get into the game for this reason. As Mahrez' role as a number 10 is all about the offensive side of his game, the two Watford holding players had all the time they needed to recycle the ball out of defence and start Watford moves.

So in the first half there was no space for the number 10 too effect the game in an attacking sense and we were struggling to stop their ball players playing.

Half time we bring on Okazaki in the knowledge that there is no space in that part of the pitch. We've tried our best and most creative player there and he's not managed a constructive moment in 45 minutes and just let Capoue and Watson have the ball.

All of a sudden there's no time for the Watford central midfield on the ball and they give the ball away more regularly. This allows our more dangerous players to get on the ball more quickly.

Somebody (it might have been you trying to be facetious) suggested that we may as well put Kante there. Well, you're right. We don't need a "second striker" or "number 10" who unpicks stubborn defences - our style of play is predicated on turning the ball over high up the pitch and moving it quickly to Vardy and Mahrez and Okazaki is crucial to that game plan.

Sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn't. But on Saturday okazaki's role in the win was absolutely critical and he's the only one of our forwards intelligent and energetic enough to have done that job.

[The Doctor]

It's all good and well saying that... Ulloa got how many last year? He played deep all season.

People just keep throwing him a life line, the fact is right now he's no better than ulloa, and no better than nugent,

As I said I want him to prove me wrong, but it's pretty obviously and a statistical fact that he's playing the link up job worse than both nugent and ulloa.

So he is either a goal scorer or a link up player either way he's not adding much apart from ruthlessly running around like a headless chicken.

Hope he does well but I'm not convinced.

 

 

He really didn't, Ulloa was the main striker whenever he played.

 

Also, still waiting on these statistics that show Ulloa is a better linkup player.

[cityfanlee23]

 

He really didn't, Ulloa was the main striker whenever he played.

 

Also, still waiting on these statistics that show Ulloa is a better linkup player.

 

 

Already posted them 3x now on other posts... 

[cityfanlee23]

Literally no idea where you're getting this crap about Ulloa "playing deep all season" from. He was the focal point of our attack for most of last season and whenever he dropped off the front he looked like a total donkey.

On Saturday whoever played in that "number 10" role was on a hiding to nothing. Capoue and Watson both sat very deep and denied whoever was playing there any space or time on the ball. Mahrez had an absolute shocker in the first half and couldn't get into the game for this reason. As Mahrez' role as a number 10 is all about the offensive side of his game, the two Watford holding players had all the time they needed to recycle the ball out of defence and start Watford moves.

So in the first half there was no space for the number 10 too effect the game in an attacking sense and we were struggling to stop their ball players playing.

Half time we bring on Okazaki in the knowledge that there is no space in that part of the pitch. We've tried our best and most creative player there and he's not managed a constructive moment in 45 minutes and just let Capoue and Watson have the ball.

All of a sudden there's no time for the Watford central midfield on the ball and they give the ball away more regularly. This allows our more dangerous players to get on the ball more quickly.

Somebody (it might have been you trying to be facetious) suggested that we may as well put Kante there. Well, you're right. We don't need a "second striker" or "number 10" who unpicks stubborn defences - our style of play is predicated on turning the ball over high up the pitch and moving it quickly to Vardy and Mahrez and Okazaki is crucial to that game plan.

Sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn't. But on Saturday okazaki's role in the win was absolutely critical and he's the only one of our forwards intelligent and energetic enough to have done that job.

 

 

You can argue it all you like, The fact you think Ulloa played more upfront than dropping deep makes these stats even worse for Okazaki.

 

 

Per 90 mins

 

Average forward passes 

Ulloa 12.22  (Passing forward to who if he was allegedly the main striker? Clearly he was deep if he was having to pass FORWARD 12 times a game)

Okazaki 6.17

 

Average backward passes

Ulloa 11.95

Okazaki 6

 

Total passes

Ulloa 24.30

Okazaki 12.25

 

Successful passes

Ulloa 17.68

Okazaki 9.75

 

Pass completion 

Ulloa 73%

Okazaki 80%

 

Key passes 

Ulloa 0.89

Okazaki 0.50

 

Chances created

Ulloa 0.97

Okazaki 0.50

 

Average Pass Length

Ulloa 13.70

Okazaki 10.36

 

Goal Ratio

Ulloa 1 in 3

Okazaki 1 in 12

 

Tackles won 

Ulloa 1.11

Okazaki 0.92

 

Tackles Lost

Ulloa 1.59

Okazaki 1.25

 

Take ons 

Ulloa 0.38

Okazaki 0.28

 

Arial Duels won

Ulloa 3.30

Okazaki 1.33

 

@@The Doctor

For a player that apparantely was the main striker and not a link up player, He scored 14 and done a better link up job. Happy now? Anything else?

[ImBlue]

I literally cannot wait for the responses to that..

[Guest ttfn]

If you genuinely watched us play last season and are trying to say Ulloa was playing as anything other than the furthest forward player in our team then you need to get a new set of eyes because your current ones aren't doing the job they're supposed to.

There are several reasons your stats are misleading. It's worth noting that other "target men" have a very similar number of "forward passes" to Ulloa. Rudy Gestede has made an average of 17 this season which presumably means he must be playing in goal or something. Likewise Crouch 14 this season and 17 last season, Carroll 19 last season, Bony 15, Ashley Barnes 16, Fletcher 15 both seasons, Lukaku 14 this season, Giroud 19 last season, Lambert 22 this season and 14 last, Pelle 17 last and 18 this. I could go on.

Target men make more forward passes because they're flicking the ball on and turning it into wide players.

You're not making a reasonable comparison because they're not doing the same job. Comparig Ulloa to Okazaki is like comparing Cambiasso and Kante, they're totally different players with different strengths playing different roles for the team in nominally similar areas of the pitch.

Your stats also show that Okazaki has a higher pass completion (why is it good to attempt more passes if you're just giving it away more?).

Also your "tackles won" stay is wrong, Okazaki is marginally ahead (1.56 to 1.54) and you've also omitted interceptions, which is a critical part of the role in breaking up attacks before they start and turning the ball over high up the pitch (0.85 to 0.56).

Okazaki comes out on top more in "duels" (43 to 35%), wins significantly more free kicks and concedes many, many fewer fouls.

I think your fundamental problem with Okazaki is that you don't understand that his role is to be the first line of defence, something he is very good at and its integral to our play when he's at his most effective. In time his confidence will come back and he'll prove himself an effective goalscorer too, just as he did in Germany. And if he doesn't, he still has many good attributes to bring to the team, much like Ulloa.

[cityfanlee23]

If you genuinely watched us play last season and are trying to say Ulloa was playing as anything other than the furthest forward player in our team then you need to get a new set of eyes because your current ones aren't doing the job they're supposed to.

There are several reasons your stats are misleading. It's worth noting that other "target men" have a very similar number of "forward passes" to Ulloa. Rudy Gestede has made an average of 17 this season which presumably means he must be playing in goal or something. Likewise Crouch 14 this season and 17 last season, Carroll 19 last season, Bony 15, Ashley Barnes 16, Fletcher 15 both seasons, Lukaku 14 this season, Giroud 19 last season, Lambert 22 this season and 14 last, Pelle 17 last and 18 this. I could go on.

Target men make more forward passes because they're flicking the ball on and turning it into wide players.

You're not making a reasonable comparison because they're not doing the same job. Comparig Ulloa to Okazaki is like comparing Cambiasso and Kante, they're totally different players with different strengths playing different roles for the team in nominally similar areas of the pitch.

Your stats also show that Okazaki has a higher pass completion (why is it good to attempt more passes if you're just giving it away more?).

Also your "tackles won" stay is wrong, Okazaki is marginally ahead (1.56 to 1.54) and you've also omitted interceptions, which is a critical part of the role in breaking up attacks before they start and turning the ball over high up the pitch (0.85 to 0.56).

Okazaki comes out on top more in "duels" (43 to 35%), wins significantly more free kicks and concedes many, many fewer fouls.

I think your fundamental problem with Okazaki is that you don't understand that his role is to be the first line of defence, something he is very good at and its integral to our play when he's at his most effective. In time his confidence will come back and he'll prove himself an effective goalscorer too, just as he did in Germany. And if he doesn't, he still has many good attributes to bring to the team, much like Ulloa.

 

 

With regard to stats being wrong, my mistake I clicked "Per match" rather than "Per 90 metrics"

 

The fact is he passes much more than Okazaki who is supposedly a link up player...

Okazaki winning 0.02 more tackles per 90 metrics is not really an argument to be fair.

 

We can go in circles, but my point is although I do recognise his game and his "role" 

His stats are no better than a player that according to you was not even playing that role, so what does that say about Okazaki?

[NewEnglandFox]

Cannot have had many shots this season at all?

 

 

Last shot and on target was Southampton. Almost ironically in the air. Only hit the target 3 times all season. The other 2 were in the goal play at West Ham.

 

https://streamable.com/6r42

 

I have no confidence in playing to his attacking strengths. I think we need to diversify our attack and the easiest way to do that is to play to Albrighton, Mahrez and Fuchs' by putting a target man in for their sweet crosses.

[MC Prussian]

With regard to stats being wrong, my mistake I clicked "Per match" rather than "Per 90 metrics"

 

The fact is he passes much more than Okazaki who is supposedly a link up player...

Okazaki winning 0.02 more tackles per 90 metrics is not really an argument to be fair.

 

We can go in circles, but my point is although I do recognise his game and his "role" 

His stats are no better than a player that according to you was not even playing that role, so what does that say about Okazaki?

Thanks for the stats, Lee.

 

Now if you could be so kind and provide a link to the site you've used and the number of games you've based your calculations upon, as well as which season/games we're talking about, etc.

[FireFox]

Thanks for the stats, Lee.

 

Now if you could be so kind and provide a link to the site you've used and the number of games you've based your calculations upon, as well as which season/games we're talking about, etc.

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-matrix#bundesliga/2014/2015/shinji_okazaki/129/129/2354/92/p|premier_league/2014/2015/leonardo_ulloa/165/126/10242/0/p|premier_league/2015/2016/shinji_okazaki/165/165/2354/0/p#goals_scored/total_shots/assists/total_forward_passes/pass_completion/key_passes/chances_created/avg_pass_length/clearances/blocks/interceptions/tackles_won/tackles_lost/successful_take_ons_%/aerial_duels_won_%/fouls_suffered/fouls_committed#90

 

or, with Ulloa's stats this season, which with only 174 minutes played is not a good indicator

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-matrix#bundesliga/2014/2015/shinji_okazaki/129/129/2354/92/p|premier_league/2014/2015/leonardo_ulloa/165/126/10242/0/p|premier_league/2015/2016/shinji_okazaki/165/165/2354/0/p|premier_league/2015/2016/leonardo_ulloa/165/165/10242/0/p#goals_scored/total_shots/assists/total_forward_passes/pass_completion/key_passes/chances_created/avg_pass_length/clearances/blocks/interceptions/tackles_won/tackles_lost/successful_take_ons_%/aerial_duels_won_%/fouls_suffered/fouls_committed#90

[Nick]

With regard to stats being wrong, my mistake I clicked "Per match" rather than "Per 90 metrics"

The fact is he passes much more than Okazaki who is supposedly a link up player...

Okazaki winning 0.02 more tackles per 90 metrics is not really an argument to be fair.

We can go in circles, but my point is although I do recognise his game and his "role"

His stats are no better than a player that according to you was not even playing that role, so what does that say about Okazaki?

I'm not sure but more importantly as I've always wondered, who is in your profile picture? Is it you or a girl? No offence meant I just can't tell if it's a bloke or a bird.

[ImBlue]

Last shot and on target was Southampton. Almost ironically in the air. Only hit the target 3 times all season. The other 2 were in the goal play at West Ham.

https://streamable.com/6r42

I have no confidence in playing to his attacking strengths. I think we need to diversify our attack and the easiest way to do that is to play to Albrighton, Mahrez and Fuchs' by putting a target man in for their sweet crosses.

That is damning. Didn't realise it was that bad.

[ImBlue]

If you genuinely watched us play last season and are trying to say Ulloa was playing as anything other than the furthest forward player in our team then you need to get a new set of eyes because your current ones aren't doing the job they're supposed to.

There are several reasons your stats are misleading. It's worth noting that other "target men" have a very similar number of "forward passes" to Ulloa. Rudy Gestede has made an average of 17 this season which presumably means he must be playing in goal or something. Likewise Crouch 14 this season and 17 last season, Carroll 19 last season, Bony 15, Ashley Barnes 16, Fletcher 15 both seasons, Lukaku 14 this season, Giroud 19 last season, Lambert 22 this season and 14 last, Pelle 17 last and 18 this. I could go on.

Target men make more forward passes because they're flicking the ball on and turning it into wide players.

You're not making a reasonable comparison because they're not doing the same job. Comparig Ulloa to Okazaki is like comparing Cambiasso and Kante, they're totally different players with different strengths playing different roles for the team in nominally similar areas of the pitch.

Your stats also show that Okazaki has a higher pass completion (why is it good to attempt more passes if you're just giving it away more?).

Also your "tackles won" stay is wrong, Okazaki is marginally ahead (1.56 to 1.54) and you've also omitted interceptions, which is a critical part of the role in breaking up attacks before they start and turning the ball over high up the pitch (0.85 to 0.56).

Okazaki comes out on top more in "duels" (43 to 35%), wins significantly more free kicks and concedes many, many fewer fouls.

I think your fundamental problem with Okazaki is that you don't understand that his role is to be the first line of defence, something he is very good at and its integral to our play when he's at his most effective. In time his confidence will come back and he'll prove himself an effective goalscorer too, just as he did in Germany. And if he doesn't, he still has many good attributes to bring to the team, much like Ulloa.

Duels is kinda skewed, every second touch of Okazaki is a duel. A duel in which there is only 2 outcomes. Either he loses the duel, or he wins a foul. Hence his low number of passes.