DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Quite diverse on the sub panel for leave, remain seem a little hoity toity. Weird - Remain we're weak on the actual economy topic, but that was their strongest defense on immigration yet, coupled with more prominent economy jibes within that section and with Giesla and Angela starting to sound very much a one phrase ponies they've clawed back to put things pretty much level in my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Weird - Remain we're weak on the actual economy topic, but that was their strongest defense on immigration yet, coupled with more prominent economy jibes within that section and with Giesla and Angela starting to sound very much a one phrase ponies they've clawed back to put things pretty much level in my mind. Giesla made a huge mistake not iterating her point on numbers properly but apart from that I think she has been pretty sound. Who's the fat lesbian on remain, she's a right ball buster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raj Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Was undecided until Monday,then sent my postal vote off this morning to remain. Took along time to decide..still not sure if I'm 100% but hey ho!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Giesla made a huge mistake not iterating her point on numbers properly but apart from that I think she has been pretty sound. Who's the fat lesbian on remain, she's a right ball buster. She's the best one on the Remain side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Was undecided until Monday,then sent my postal vote off this morning to remain. Took along time to decide..still not sure if I'm 100% but hey ho!!! There is no right answer - it's a massively complex question and your personal circumstances will have an impact on which way you vote... the key thing is, you've voted. In some ways, i wonder if it would be better to be on the losing side because at least then you've got the completely useless backup point of "well I didn't vote for that, it's other's fault!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 She's the best one on the Remain side. Wow, I thought she has been rude and lost herself in rage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raj Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 There is no right answer - it's a massively complex question and your personal circumstances will have an impact on which way you vote... the key thing is, you've voted. In some ways, i wonder if it would be better to be on the losing side because at least then you've got the completely useless backup point of "well I didn't vote for that, it's other's fault!" Personal circumstances bit is the one for me.I feel the level of risk/uncertainty if leaving with regards possible recession etc is too great to risk it after all the years of getting back on our feet. Also the list of remainers far outweighs the list of leavers with regards who ID prefer to listen to. Good luck in voting though...be glad when it's over!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Love how sadiq thinks quoting Martin Lewis the money saving expert, give supremacy over the economic debate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Personal circumstances bit is the one for me. I feel the level of risk/uncertainty if leaving with regards possible recession etc is too great to risk it after all the years of getting back on our feet. Also the list of remainers far outweighs the list of leavers with regards who ID prefer to listen to. Good luck in voting though...be glad when it's over!!! Yeah... sorry, this ain't over even come Friday - there will be a slow rumble long after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Yeah... sorry, this ain't over even come Friday - there will be a slow rumble long after. Not a chance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Love how sadiq thinks quoting Martin Lewis the money saving expert, give supremacy over the economic debate That won't be an accident - they'll have tested that in focus groups. He's a "trusted" non political voice. However, he did say he was only about 55% in, based on his aversion to risk. One key thing - this needed a proper break, even my attention span started zoning 20 minutes ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 This debate has ruined politics in the UK for good. Could any of us these twerps, none has shown any balance. This argument is not black and white, it's 10000 shades of grey. But no one has discussed the grey bits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 That won't be an accident - they'll have tested that in focus groups. He's a "trusted" non political voice. However, he did say he was only about 55% in, based on his aversion to risk. One key thing - this needed a proper break, even my attention span started zoning 20 minutes ago. I've enjoyed it, I didn't struggle to keep attention. Loved seeing sadiq squirm when bores quoted him the second time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 I've enjoyed it, I didn't struggle to keep attention. Loved seeing sadiq squirm when bores[b/] quoted him the second time. Your unfortunate slip betrays you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny the fox Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 That won't be an accident - they'll have tested that in focus groups. He's a "trusted" non political voice. However, he did say he was only about 55% in, based on his aversion to risk. One key thing - this needed a proper break, even my attention span started zoning 20 minutes ago. martin lewis will not be happy being dragged into the debate.., he wants to stay neutral for obvious reasons...how the fook khan got elected is beyond me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Your unfortunate slip betrays you! , he isn't boring right now. Even Apple autocorrect wants remain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny the fox Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 This debate has ruined politics in the UK for good. Could any of us these twerps, none has shown any balance. This argument is not black and white, it's 10000 shades of grey. But no one has discussed the grey bits leave colour out of it.. I brought it up once but I think I got away with it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 leave colour out of it.. I brought it up once but I think I got away with it... That's the war you fool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webbo Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Same old bollox we've heard before. I can't believe anyone would change their mind either way based on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Same old bollox we've heard before. I can't believe anyone would change their mind either way based on that.Agreed. Got bored of it, to be fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monk Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Whatever the result, Cameron is finished. Forked will self destruct over the next few months. Whatever the result, Cameron is finished. Tories will self destruct over the next few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Why are all these MPs talking with fist pump action with thumb forward. Just cus some psychologists say it's a non confrontational, dominant posture. I find it annoying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 Minister on Turkey on news night, is not happy with The remain campaign, calling them liars. , who the hell do we trust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 I was disappointed all round. Apart from claiming they'd listened to experts, the Remainers were so negative they gave the impression that our great nation was some sort of wind-up dancing toy that couldn't stand up without holding hands like the smallest makeweight in a Ring-A-ring-A'-roses circle. And the Leavers couldn't give a straight or accurate answer to anything and instead gave the impression they really hadn't thought through the prospect of winning at all when what I wanted was inspiration and the feeling of wanting to embrace a brave new trading adventure. Cameron's absence spoke volumes for a bloke whose honesty and credibility has been found out like a "blind" beggar displaying A1 eyesight. Not only did Cameron promise he'd cut immigration he did so having been plainly told it was impossible. So much for sincerity. No wonder he didn't want to face the fallout, because coupled with his worthless negotiations with the EU, it would have been a double body blow that would have flattened him faster than anything even Muhammad Ali could have delivered in his heyday. I liked Boris Johnson's reference to German car trading with the UK being a big antidote to any chance of penal tarifs being imposed on our leaving, and I liked his "Independence Day" finale. But there was embarrassing non-stop sidesteppping when it came to immigration intentions, vaguery in answer to whether we'd have a United States of Europe in 40 years, a lot of mist over questions on the speed of Turkey's accession and nothing that carried conviction about our real economic prospects after leaving and why such opinions had been formed - which seemed to be because they hadn't got any. I was also amazed at the brief "defence" debate and reference to years of peace thanks to the EU when in fact it'd be more truthful to say it was thanks to NATO and the US in the beginning and despite EU and US provocation more recently. Quite apart from the million lives lost in Bosnia and more in Ukraine (the latter partly due to EU ambitions) there was no mention of the current but considerable tensions with Russia, especially on and around the Polish border. Safer with the EU? When the EU doesn't have an army and Putin could drive through Nato defences in three days if they took a chance on US reaction? I'm not convinced! The "workers rights" part of the exchange was a damp squib with effective liquid antidote provided by the Wetherspoons boss, so where I was left in the end was more or less where Istarted .... wondering when we were going to get straight, convincing answers to relevent questions instead of endlessly repetitive counter-punches. One fact did strike me though - the question of our influence in the EU and comment that of 70 votes against EU proposals by the UK, not once did our opinion prevail. I wasn't surprised. The EU takes our contributions but gives us precious little influence on its remorseless drive towards federalism. I ended up feeling we were being pulled this way and that by combative amateurs rather than visionaries with a genuine plan of credible alternative action. Even the much repeated "Take Back Control" rallying cry sounded muted. As if no-one was quite convinced of how much control we could take back without pain or penalty. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzy Posted 21 June 2016 Share Posted 21 June 2016 I've read this thread occasionally over the last few weeks, and have come to the conclusion that: a) I don't give a shit what the result is b) I haven't got the time, passion or energy to contribute c) The result makes no odds to me whatsoever I'll continue to live my sheltered life in the soft underbelly of white middle class Buckinghamshire, and make the best I can of whatever hand I'm dealt. Too much moaning, blaming, fear, paranoia and negative campaigning for my liking. I'll probably vote remain because my grandfather fought in the war blah, blah, blah, but whatever the outcome, it's ultimately down to me to take personal responsibility for my life and the decisions I make. This referendum will be next weeks chip paper soon, and then they'll be another mass debate about some other external factors that people let influence and dictate their lives. Maybe I'm just selfish but I choose only to control what I can control and avoid the noise, interference and hysteria that surrounds me. I hope you all get the outcome you want, but it pains me to see some people almost handing over control of ther own destiny and well being to politicians. In the words of William H. Johnsen: "If it's to be, it's up to me".... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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