Exercise

[Izzy]

On 29/05/2018 at 14:24, Swan Lesta said:

I suppose the point I was trying to make was that you can train far more effectively in terms of both results and recovery if you split your weights sessions into muscle groups. If you do all body twice a week then you won't recover in time and risk plateauing and not seeing gains.

 

I drink a couple of whey protein shakes a day with milk, avoid bread at lunch where possible and eat meat and 4 veg every night! I also drink half a bottle of gin which is less helpful.

How do you know how often to rest/recover mate? I had a free PT session yesterday that just focused on upper body. It lasted an hour but I've felt absolutely fvcked today 

 

I've got a second PT session next week which is all about lower body so I'm expecting the same again! It's all new to me and I'm mid forties with health issues anyway but I'm determined to make this work. My initial feelings are to do one upper body session, one lower body session, one Core group class and one Pilates class a week but I'm not sure that's enough to make a difference?

 

I guess we're all different so we need to listen to our own bodies...

 

P.S. I don't eat that much so what protein shakes would you recommend? (sorry for all the questions but you seem like an expert in all this )

[Costock_Fox]

55 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

How do you know how often to rest/recover mate? I had a free PT session yesterday that just focused on upper body. It lasted an hour but I've felt absolutely fvcked today 

 

I've got a second PT session next week which is all about lower body so I'm expecting the same again! It's all new to me and I'm mid forties with health issues anyway but I'm determined to make this work. My initial feelings are to do one upper body session, one lower body session, one Core group class and one Pilates class a week but I'm not sure that's enough to make a difference?

 

I guess we're all different so we need to listen to our own bodies...

 

P.S. I don't eat that much so what protein shakes would you recommend? (sorry for all the questions but you seem like an expert in all this )

If you aren’t doing it now but do that seriously that will make a difference and your upper body will definitely ache like hell, probably for a whole week till your next session for the first few.

 

Diet is about 85% of the changes your body will make so if you do that with a good diet you will see good improvements.

 

Sorry to hijack that btw just thought I would answer.

[Izzy]

2 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

If you aren’t doing it now but do that seriously that will make a difference and your upper body will definitely ache like hell, probably for a whole week till your next session for the first few.

 

Diet is about 85% of the changes your body will make so if you do that with a good diet you will see good improvements.

 

Sorry to hijack that btw just thought I would answer.

Thanks dude. Appreciate your expertise on this 

 

I was surprised how much the personal trainer talked about diet too. I don't eat very much because of my health issues but what I do eat is very bland (white meat, rice etc.) I probably only have 1500 calories per day so I'll never be very big.

 

I've just ordered some of that Protein shake mix so hopefully that will help 

 

I couldn't believe how much I ached today though. I was obviously exercising muscles that I haven't used in years 

[Costock_Fox]

1 hour ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

Thanks dude. Appreciate your expertise on this 

 

I was surprised how much the personal trainer talked about diet too. I don't eat very much because of my health issues but what I do eat is very bland (white meat, rice etc.) I probably only have 1500 calories per day so I'll never be very big.

 

I've just ordered some of that Protein shake mix so hopefully that will help 

 

I couldn't believe how much I ached today though. I was obviously exercising muscles that I haven't used in years 

My Protein website is decent for stuff like that. I don’t have protein at the minute but they are really cheap, deliver and some of them taste really good. 

 

Ive been on an exercise bike at work for 5 hours today and am doing the same tomorrow. General fitness wise I feel great, my arse on the other hand....

[Nick]

12 hours ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

How do you know how often to rest/recover mate? I had a free PT session yesterday that just focused on upper body. It lasted an hour but I've felt absolutely fvcked today 

 

I've got a second PT session next week which is all about lower body so I'm expecting the same again! It's all new to me and I'm mid forties with health issues anyway but I'm determined to make this work. My initial feelings are to do one upper body session, one lower body session, one Core group class and one Pilates class a week but I'm not sure that's enough to make a difference?

 

I guess we're all different so we need to listen to our own bodies...

 

P.S. I don't eat that much so what protein shakes would you recommend? (sorry for all the questions but you seem like an expert in all this )

Recovery will improve as you go. Let your body for now be the guide as to when you can go again. Some weeks I give myself an extra rest day or two if my body still hurts - for muscle growth you need to give the body time to rebuild and if you don’t you risk both injury and reduction in development. Sleeping and diet is really quite important as these are the two key factors to recovery. I use  Myprotein - just the whey stuff and have a milk based shake after workouts and sometimes before bed to aid growth and recovery. Up your protein dose slowly though or you will smell worse than a dead dogs bottom and your wife and kids will leave you. 

 

That workout routine looks good... maybe even a bit too much to start with! - a few weeks of that and you’ll certainly notice a difference in mood and strength - go for it. You will in time wain in motivation.... My motto is anything is better than nothing because ‘nothing’ makes you feel guilty, sad and a bit like you’ve copped out or failed and ‘something’ means you’ve kept the momentum going even if you’ve gone to the gym and just done a few lengths in the pool and left for home. For me, I have gym equipment at home and sometimes it’s about changing what I do to give me motivation. On a day when I’m just dreading a five mile run or a bunch of weights or circuits I do a few rounds on the heavy bag, perhaps just do sit-ups with a Swiss ball and a weight plate or go to madbarz site and do their push-up routines for a bit of variation because something is always better than nothing unless you’re body is knackered and tired.

Edited 1 June 2018 by Nick

[Milo]

10 hours ago, Costock_Fox said:

Ive been on an exercise bike at work for 5 hours today 

Busy, then??! 

 

Didn’t they notice?

[leicesterlad1989]

On ‎29‎/‎05‎/‎2018 at 07:52, Swan Lesta said:

Saturday: Chest

Sunday: Rest or Cycle

Monday: Run and Arms

Tuesday: Core and Legs

Wednesday: Chest 

Thursday: Run and and Arms

Friday: Rest

 

 

 

Arms & chest twice but nothing for your back?

[Izzy]

18 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

Recovery will improve as you go. Let your body for now be the guide as to when you can go again. Some weeks I give myself an extra rest day or two if my body still hurts - for muscle growth you need to give the body time to rebuild and if you don’t you risk both injury and reduction in development. Sleeping and diet is really quite important as these are the two key factors to recovery. I use  Myprotein - just the whey stuff and have a milk based shake after workouts and sometimes before bed to aid growth and recovery. Up your protein dose slowly though or you will smell worse than a dead dogs bottom and your wife and kids will leave you. 

 

That workout routine looks good... maybe even a bit too much to start with! - a few weeks of that and you’ll certainly notice a difference in mood and strength - go for it. You will in time wain in motivation.... My motto is anything is better than nothing because ‘nothing’ makes you feel guilty, sad and a bit like you’ve copped out or failed and ‘something’ means you’ve kept the momentum going even if you’ve gone to the gym and just done a few lengths in the pool and left for home. For me, I have gym equipment at home and sometimes it’s about changing what I do to give me motivation. On a day when I’m just dreading a five mile run or a bunch of weights or circuits I do a few rounds on the heavy bag, perhaps just do sit-ups with a Swiss ball and a weight plate or go to madbarz site and do their push-up routines for a bit of variation because something is always better than nothing unless you’re body is knackered and tired.

 

Thanks for the reply mate - very helpful 

 

I've just ordered some stuff off Myprotein - 40% off too! I know I'm a bit over enthusiastic at the moment as it's all new but hopefully I'll keep it going 

[Nick]

1 minute ago, leicesterlad1989 said:

Arms & chest twice but nothing for your back?

I do back stuff throughout the week as part of my core and legs with kettlebells and deadlifts and as part of my arm routines (chin ups) and my chest workouts... I just don’t dedicate a day to it for a couple of reasons, one is that I have had spinal surgery so like to space out the back pressure and two is the kit I have at home to specifically do back exercise is limited.

[leicesterlad1989]

12 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

I do back stuff throughout the week as part of my core and legs with kettlebells and deadlifts and as part of my arm routines (chin ups) and my chest workouts... I just don’t dedicate a day to it for a couple of reasons, one is that I have had spinal surgery so like to space out the back pressure and two is the kit I have at home to specifically do back exercise is limited.

Ah, that's fair enough. Do you own a barbell? You could add barbell rows too. I find those, along with deadlifts, are the only two back exercises I need.

 

The thought of training arms twice a week would bore me, however I get what you are doing.

 

I am however training for a powerlifting competition, so my goals are different.

[Nick]

1 minute ago, leicesterlad1989 said:

Ah, that's fair enough. Do you own a barbell? You could add barbell rows too. I find those, along with deadlifts, are the only two back exercises I need.

 

The thought of training arms twice a week would bore me, however I get what you are doing.

 

I am however training for a powerlifting competition, so my goals are different.

Yeah I’ve got a commercial Olympic bench, dip station, curl bar and dumbells up to 30kg. I’m doing deadlifts, incline overheads, dips, dumbell rows and incline presses and a range of pull & pushups throughout the week - Im no expert and certainly not a competitor! I bench 80kg on the flat as my standard start weight but can do 105kg maybe two reps! I’m just getting back into it really and building up the equipment in one of my barns. 

 

Powerlifting sounds pretty crazy - how’s it going?

[Costock_Fox]

47 minutes ago, Milo said:

Busy, then??! 

 

Didn’t they notice?

Never busy mate, last 2 days in the job.

[leicesterlad1989]

1 hour ago, Swan Lesta said:

Yeah I’ve got a commercial Olympic bench, dip station, curl bar and dumbells up to 30kg. I’m doing deadlifts, incline overheads, dips, dumbell rows and incline presses and a range of pull & pushups throughout the week - Im no expert and certainly not a competitor! I bench 80kg on the flat as my standard start weight but can do 105kg maybe two reps! I’m just getting back into it really and building up the equipment in one of my barns. 

 

Powerlifting sounds pretty crazy - how’s it going?

I wish I had the space to build my own gym. Would make things so much more convenient.

 

105kg bench is a good weight to push. What do you deadlift?

 

Well I started training for powerlifting in January this year and I've stuck with it. Looking at finding a local meet. It's bloody brutal at times but it's equally rewarding. It's more about the weight being lifted than aesthetics, so means I don't have to watch what I eat too much..providing I can meet my weight class! 

[Nick]

9 minutes ago, leicesterlad1989 said:

I wish I had the space to build my own gym. Would make things so much more convenient.

 

105kg bench is a good weight to push. What do you deadlift?

 

Well I started training for powerlifting in January this year and I've stuck with it. Looking at finding a local meet. It's bloody brutal at times but it's equally rewarding. It's more about the weight being lifted than aesthetics, so means I don't have to watch what I eat too much..providing I can meet my weight class! 

I dead lift next to nothing at the moment as my back is a slow build following the damage I’ve done to it over the years doing mountain marathons. I’m 40 so I’m just trying to build a bit of muscle and stay in shape to prevent turning 50 in a decades time and looming like the other 50 year olds down the pub!

 

Sounds like a really good sport - I hope you stick with it buddy.

[leicesterlad1989]

58 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

I dead lift next to nothing at the moment as my back is a slow build following the damage I’ve done to it over the years doing mountain marathons. I’m 40 so I’m just trying to build a bit of muscle and stay in shape to prevent turning 50 in a decades time and looming like the other 50 year olds down the pub!

 

Sounds like a really good sport - I hope you stick with it buddy.

Without meaning to sound patronising, form and technique are key. If you are ever in any doubt, Youtube a fella called Mike Rippetoe. Videos are very good and informative.

 

Funnily enough my dad decided at 55 to start running after years of looking like the olduns down the pub. Ironically he lost the weight and looks equally as old!

 

Cheers mate.

[Buce]

 

I thought this might make for an interesting read:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2018/jun/04/are-you-eating-too-much-protein

Are you eating too much protein? Some sources aren't as healthy as you think

For years we’ve been fed the line that a diet of red meat, supplements and protein shakes can have real health benefits. If only it were that simple

 

For the past two decades, the benefits of high-protein nutritional regimes have been relentlessly marketed to the general public, largely through the booming diet, fitness and protein supplement industries. However, while this has lined corporate pockets – the whey protein supplement industry alone was worth $9.2bn (£6.9bn) in 2015 – scientific research has suggested time and again that it may be harming our health.

Adding to the mound of evidence, a recently published study by researchers at the University of Eastern Finland, who tracked 2,400 middle-aged men over the course of 22 years, reported that a high-protein diet resulted in a 49% greater risk of heart failure. Many large, long-term population studies have also found that people who consume large amounts of protein, especially in the form of red and processed meat, are more likely to be obese or develop type 2 diabetes, cardiovascular disease and colon cancer.

So why have we been persuaded into eating more and more protein? Thomas Sanders, professor of nutrition and dietetics at King’s College London, says the idea of a protein gap in our diet was first broached by a professor at MIT, Nevin Scrimshaw, in the 1960s. He claimed that the protein that comes from plant sources such as vegetables was deficient in vital amino acids and that we therefore needed to eat more animal protein.

“A lot of this work was supported by the food animal industry in the US, which was all for getting people to eat more meat,” Sanders says. “But then it was shown that, by eating a variety of plant-based foods, you can get all the amino acids you need, and the theory was debunked by 1972. More recently, it has been revived by the health food industry, the diet industry and some of the farming lobbies.”

One of the main drivers for increased protein consumption has been the gym culture that took off in the late 1990s, and the accompanying trend for putting on muscle mass. But scientists believe that the idea of requiring additional protein in your diet to build up muscle, either through meat or supplements such as protein shakes, is a myth.

“There are some quite nice trials which now show that giving people extra protein doesn’t actually increase muscle mass,” Sanders says. “What builds up muscle is exercise and load bearing, and the body has ways of conserving its existing protein to do that. If you eat more protein, the body just breaks it down into ammonia and urea and you excrete it.”

 

In fact, compared to other mammals, humans are actually naturally adapted for a relatively low protein intake, requiring protein to make up just 10% of our daily calorie requirement. This equates to around 50-60 grams for the average person, but the National Diet and Nutritional Survey has found that we typically eat considerably more – in the region of 75-100 grams.

Over the past 50 years, research has consistently found that whenever we tinker with our natural protein needs, it can have adverse consequences, at all phases of our lives. Human breast milk is quite low in protein: when cow’s milk formula was first used to create an artificial replacement for breast milk, the excessive protein content was found to cause accelerated growth rates in early life. This became associated with an increased risk of developing chronic diseases such as cancer in later life, forcing the formula to be adapted to have a lower protein content.

In adults, high intakes of particular protein sources, for example red meats such as lamb, beef and pork, as well as processed or charred meat, have been linked to a variety of chronic illnesses. But while these trends have been known for a long time, scientists have only relatively recently accumulated evidence showing why this is the case.

The link between red or processed meat and heart disease is a particularly complex one, but one clue could be the content of these proteins. Red meat is very high in iron, while processed meats are typically high in salt, both known to be bad for the heart in large concentrations. In addition, excessive protein increases the amount of urea the body produces, putting greater strain on the kidneys. This increases through life, as renal function declines naturally with age. Unsurprisingly, studies have consistently found links between kidney disease and diets high in red meat.

“Chronic renal disease also contributes to cardiovascular problems, particularly heart failure, as the kidneys regulate things like blood pressure,” Sanders says. “I suspect one of the reasons why high protein intake may be linked to heart failure could be related to the kidneys not coping as well.”

Scientists have also developed theories as to why large amounts of red and processed meat can lead to colon cancer, particularly when the meat is overcooked. Chemical reactions between the heat and amino acids in the protein can release a variety of chemical compounds, such as heterocyclic amines and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, that are thought to be carcinogenic. In addition, the high amount of nitrates found in processed foods can cause heavy inflammation in the gut, leading to the accelerated cell division that is characteristic of cancer.

Microbiome research has further suggested that high-protein diets can alter the pH and therefore the natural bacterial flora of the gut, with potential carcinogenic consequences. “If you look at people eating a diet without much meat, they have a totally different bacterial flora to people living on high-meat diets,” Sanders says. “And these bacteria degrade the bile in the gut into secondary bile acids that are thought to promote the growth of tumours.”

But not all protein has been associated with these negative consequences. Protein sourced from poultry, dairy and plants such as beans, peas and nuts, is thought to have a neutral or even beneficial impact on kidney and heart health, provided it is consumed in moderation.

Perhaps one of the biggest problems with high-protein diets is that the excess protein typically indicates an imbalanced diet, as it comes with a deficiency in another crucial food source. “A balanced diet is one that meets all your nutrient requirements and prevents chronic disease,” Sanders says. “High-protein diets are often low in fibre, and we think colorectal cancer and obesity are linked to low intakes of fibre. There has been so much negativity about fat over the years, but you see in the big population studies that weight gain typically occurs when a big proportion of the diet comes from animal protein.”

[ozleicester]

1 hour ago, Buce said:

 

I thought this might make for an interesting read:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2018/jun/04/are-you-eating-too-much-protein

Are you eating too much protein? Some sources aren't as healthy as you think

For years we’ve been fed the

As i understand it.. there is no WHO recommended daily intake of protein which pretty well suggests that we get adequate from pretty much anything

Edited 4 June 2018 by ozleicester

[Buce]

1 minute ago, ozleicester said:

As i undertsand it.. there in no WHO recomended daily intake of protien

 

There isn’t. 

 

But among the body building community, there is a falacious belief that to gain muscle you need to consume 1.5 grams of protein per kilo of body weight. The supplement companies propogate the myth to sell protein shakes etc. 

[David Guiza]

14 minutes ago, ozleicester said:

As i understand it.. there is no WHO recommended daily intake of protein which pretty well suggests that we get adequate from pretty much anything

 

 

8 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

There isn’t. 

 

But among the body building community, there is a falacious belief that to gain muscle you need to consume 1.5 grams of protein per kilo of body weight. The supplement companies propogate the myth to sell protein shakes etc. 

Unless you abstain from eating meat and then suddenly the world and his wife thinks you could die at any moment from a protein deficiency. Well done, fellow survivors. 

 

[Izzy]

This gym malarky is fascinating.

 

The first few weeks I went I was fvcked afterwards but since last Thursday I've had this amazing boost of energy.

 

I've always needed a 'cat nap' in the afternoons but I've noticed I'm not needing them as much now. I'm also eating more than usual and finally putting some weight ON!

 

Just hope I stick with it. I'm sure I will because I feel better both physically and mentally which is great.

 

Wish I'd given up golf and started this years ago   

[Buce]

42 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

This gym malarky is fascinating.

 

The first few weeks I went I was fvcked afterwards but since last Thursday I've had this amazing boost of energy.

 

I've always needed a 'cat nap' in the afternoons but I've noticed I'm not needing them as much now. I'm also eating more than usual and finally putting some weight ON!

 

Just hope I stick with it. I'm sure I will because I feel better both physically and mentally which is great.

 

Wish I'd given up golf and started this years ago   

 

It seems counter-intuitive, doesn't it?

 

Taking advantage of the longer days, I recently changed my hiking route from one that was 10 miles, to another that is twice that. Two days of inactivity because of my leg and I'm champing at the bit, with more energy than I know what to do with.

 

I'm really pleased for you, bro - keep it up!

[Izzy]

6 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

It seems counter-intuitive, doesn't it?

 

Taking advantage of the longer days, I recently changed my hiking route from one that was 10 miles, to another that is twice that. Two days of inactivity because of my leg and I'm champing at the bit, with more energy than I know what to do with.

 

I'm really pleased for you, bro - keep it up!

It's weird mate, I don't get it!

 

I'm not complaining though  Maybe it's also the extra calories I'm consuming after exercise that's also giving me more energy. I'm sure it's all related and the old endorphins are kicking in.

 

Also (and don't tell anyone) but my sex drive has gone through the roof! The wife says it's like having a new man 

[Buce]

1 hour ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

It's weird mate, I don't get it!

 

I'm not complaining though  Maybe it's also the extra calories I'm consuming after exercise that's also giving me more energy. I'm sure it's all related and the old endorphins are kicking in.

 

 

I've said it before, mate - I think that most ill health is largely self-inflicted through poor lifestyle habits, and the best medicine you can get is proper nutrition and exercise.

 

1 hour ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

 

Also (and don't tell anyone) but my sex drive has gone through the roof! The wife says it's like having a new man 

 

 

That would be down to increased testosterone production (a known phenomenon of increased exercise in older men) and increased self-esteem - nothing kills desire more than feeling crap about yourself.

[oxford blue]

The merit of high protein shakes is discussed in the Times today. Dr Porter says they "can guarantee an adequate intake (of protein) and deliver the protein when most needed (soon after a workout. However, milk works as well and contains other nutrients as well." He sugges semi or skimmed milk as being as effective - and much cheaper.

[Lovejoy]

Shed 3kgs in a week which I'm really pleased with. Cut down carbs in the day time and been lifting more instead of cardio. Still putting away too many beers , but if I cut that down as well I think the progress will increase even further.