The problem is that our players are quitters.

[vanity]

3 minutes ago, chicagofox said:

The problem right now is the damn manager. His selections and tactics are why we are on a horrendous run. Some players are well beyond their best and others will never be as good as we hoped. But he is the twat who selects them, manages them, and decides how they should play. It’s a fallacy to think that these players are unmanageable. A good manager could do very well with this squad. And Puel is not even a good manager ( and I’m referencing now, not anything he may have achieved earlier in his career).

Puel's tactics are fine, there are plenty of elite teams that employ similar tactics.

 

His personnel selection is admittedly inscrutable. I blow a gasket every morning I see the line-up of late.

 

Idk why people persist with this myth. I suppose it has to do with wanting to believe the best of our favorites. But they are playing soft and slow, they are telling us who they are week in, week out at this point. 

 

It is time to believe them. This is who they are. And we can do better.

[lgfualol]

A lot of them have **** all to play for is the problem. Are most of them going to move to better clubs? No. Better wages? No. There is no incentive for them to play with the passion they showed during the title win. 

 

From the old guard title winners, only Vardy can still go on to better things. Mahrez left Leicester in January, he is just having a run about in our shirt every week until he doesnt have to anymore.

 

Most of the new players dont really seem that settled in. Doesnt really feel like a team anymore.

 

Once Puel gets the sack and the old guard players feel a bit threatened, they'll up their game enough to get through the Summer and keep the doubters away. Then it will restart UNLESS someone comes in with some balls or changes are made, sentiment is ****ed off.

 

So yes they are quitters until either someone with bollocks shakes things up or the press start criticising them.

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

15 minutes ago, l444ry said:

This is a brilliant point. I sit behind the dugout area and watch the coaching staff closely. Agree 100% that something seems different.

I watched the game on a dodgy stream and Puel’s solitary walk to the tunnel seemed to be reflective of this.

 

After slagging him off today from behind my keyboard I’m starting to feel sorry for him!

[Sir Shep]

The problem for me is that we as fans don’t exactly know what we want, we see our club sack arguably the best manager we’ve had , we then laud Sir Shakey but quickly realise that he’s not up to the job, then we troll Southampton fans having walloped them on their own ground before realising that they were actually right. 

 

The trouble is, whilst we sit in 9th place, I can’t help but think we should be doing better yet I’d have killed to have this problem a few seasons ago. 

 

What do do fans want to see exactly as whilst I accept Puel is not going to last here, I can’t see anyone else doing much better. 

 

 

 

[l444ry]

1 minute ago, bmouth_fox said:

I watched the game on a dodgy stream and Puel’s solitary walk to the tunnel seemed to be reflective of this.

 

After slagging him off today from behind my keyboard I’m starting to feel sorry for him!

Nobody should like to slag off a manager but football takes no prisoners. 

[MC Prussian]

I'm not buying into the "player power" argument either, not fully. When you fail to communicate your ideas to the players, how are they supposed to react? How are they supposed to implement the new strategy, and that during an ongoing season? This lot needed somebody to look up to for guidance on the pitch - and maybe also a tighter hand in the dressing room.

In comes Claude Puel, barely able to string two sentences in English together, relying on a translator.

However, as I've said before, some players and their commitment need to be questioned. There also, there's a handful of individuals who've become too accustomed to putting the blue shirt on.

Edited 28 April 2018 by MC Prussian

[Rogstanley]

If I had to guess I’d say there’s a few players who think they’re bigger than the manager. Might not necessarily be Mahrez although I wish we’d sold him and he can leave for free tonight as far as I care. For some reason I always think of Wes Morgan as a potential toxic influence although I’ve no evidence for it obviously. Vardy never gets mentioned as he usually seems to put a shift in but we know his character is a bit shifty (think casino incident).

 

Whoever the toxic faction consists of and whatever the basis of it is, it couldn’t be more obvious that it exists. You don’t go from great to crap under three consecutive managers, like clockwork, without an underlying reason, and the only constant in this is the players.

 

Edited 28 April 2018 by Rogstanley

[Izzy]

7 minutes ago, Sir Shep said:

The problem for me is that we as fans don’t exactly know what we want, we see our club sack arguably the best manager we’ve had , we then laud Sir Shakey but quickly realise that he’s not up to the job, then we troll Southampton fans having walloped them on their own ground before realising that they were actually right. 

 

The trouble is, whilst we sit in 9th place, I can’t help but think we should be doing better yet I’d have killed to have this problem a few seasons ago. 

 

What do do fans want to see exactly as whilst I accept Puel is not going to last here, I can’t see anyone else doing much better. 

 

Winning the PL has really fvcked us up as fans.

 

We don't know our arse from our elbow any more 

[ZeGuy]

1 hour ago, Royston. said:

Only bid was late late late from man city.

Our negotiation was reasonable but there just wasnt enough time left.

Nah, he wasn't worth the trouble. We should have shipped him and we won't get more than 50-60M if any bid comes.

Edited 28 April 2018 by ZeGuy

[chicagofox]

31 minutes ago, vanity said:

Puel's tactics are fine

I respectfully disagree. 

[MPH]

1 hour ago, brucey said:

I don't believe they are quitters, but they certainly lack the motivation to start.

 

it could of read as:

 

” I don't believe they are quitters, but they certainly lack the motivation to keep going..”

 

 

[City1884]

I don’t buy into this whole “the players have downed tools” nonsense.

 

I’ve been to nearly every game, and from what i’ve seen first hand, the players haven’t “downed tools”, they seem to have adapted their play considerably since Puel arrived, but the changes haven’t had positive results.

 

When we have the ball, we play slow, “methodical” passing, across the back four, and then the midfield 4.

Left, right, back, right, left, back.

We slowly move up the pitch to the edge of the opponents area, by which time they have 10 men behind the ball.

Then we look for space, find none, so end up playing backwards and across again.

 

Crosses are non existent under Puel until the final 10 minutes. (Which then ends up being the only time we put the opponent under real pressure).

 

There are no swift counter attacks, no crosses into the box, and that leaves you trying to pass through (at least) 10 men, with very little space, which it doesn’t seem we have the passing playmakers to do effectively.

 

Then we lose the ball, and get hit hard and fast, like we used to do against teams.

 

Even Schmeichel (before his injury) had adapted his play to holding the ball for the full 6 seconds, clearing his area, and making short passes out at the back under Puel. You could see that change a mile off.

Given that his long and quick distribution was a huge positive attribute to his game, who apart from Puel made that change??

 

Oh, and don’t get me started on the substitutions and team selection issues, I suppose the players are to blame for that also?

 

Albrighton at right back? First sub at 75 minutes? More subs on 90 minutes while losing???!

(Not today obviously).

 

I will concede that the players have lost faith in how he is trying to make them play, but I don’t believe they have “downed tools”. They still seem to be trying to play his way, but “his way” doesn’t work. It didn’t for Southampton, and it doesn’t for us.

 

I’m all for giving a manager time, and generally believe stability breeds success, but on this occasion, Puel needs to go.

 

 

[Kendal Fox]

1 hour ago, vanity said:

Yes. Yes. Yes.

 

I'm going to wuote myself here: Riyad's walkabout was the turning point in our season. Before that, we had 35 points in 24 games, good for 1.45 points per fixture on average. That works out to 55.1 points in a season. However, in the ten games since Riyad went on strike, we've managed only 11 points in 10 games, which is 1.1 points per fixture on average. That works out to 41.8 points in a season. Enormous difference. 

 

If we look deeper, it is worth noting that our performance against sides outside the top-6 has declined drastically. Before Riyad's strike, we were averaging 1.93 points per match against the bottom-13 ("b-13"). (we had 8 wins, 5 draws, and 2 losses). But after the strike, we have 2 wins, 4 draws, and 3 losses against non-top-6 sides, which is 1.11 points per game. That is a difference of .82 points per game, which would leave us with 21 points fewer over the course of a season. We were chugging along great with Puel, then Riyad went AWOL, then the team never got right. 

 

Riyad's one of our best players, but we will have the money to sign an excellent set of replacements. We need players on the field who want to be here. 

•  

Thank you for going to the trouble of providing the stats to back this particular angle up. It really is foolish to ignore the argument that Mahrez/Man City have had a devastating impact on the last 3rd of our season.

 

Back in late Jan, we were clearly turning the corner and talk of European football really was credible. I don't mean to be a broken record about Puel deserving more time, but I feel he'll largely be taking a fall for Mahrez if we sack him now.

 

 

Edited 28 April 2018 by Kendal Fox

[The Doctor]

33 minutes ago, City1884 said:

I don’t buy into this whole “the players have downed tools” nonsense.

 

I’ve been to nearly every game, and from what i’ve seen first hand, the players haven’t “downed tools”, they seem to have adapted their play considerably since Puel arrived, but the changes haven’t had positive results.

 

When we have the ball, we play slow, “methodical” passing, across the back four, and then the midfield 4.

Left, right, back, right, left, back.

We slowly move up the pitch to the edge of the opponents area, by which time they have 10 men behind the ball.

Then we look for space, find none, so end up playing backwards and across again.

 

Crosses are non existent under Puel until the final 10 minutes. (Which then ends up being the only time we put the opponent under real pressure).

 

There are no swift counter attacks, no crosses into the box, and that leaves you trying to pass through (at least) 10 men, with very little space, which it doesn’t seem we have the passing playmakers to do effectively.

 

Then we lose the ball, and get hit hard and fast, like we used to do against teams.

 

Even Schmeichel (before his injury) had adapted his play to holding the ball for the full 6 seconds, clearing his area, and making short passes out at the back under Puel. You could see that change a mile off.

Given that his long and quick distribution was a huge positive attribute to his game, who apart from Puel made that change??

 

Oh, and don’t get me started on the substitutions and team selection issues, I suppose the players are to blame for that also?

 

Albrighton at right back? First sub at 75 minutes? More subs on 90 minutes while losing???!

(Not today obviously).

 

I will concede that the players have lost faith in how he is trying to make them play, but I don’t believe they have “downed tools”. They still seem to be trying to play his way, but “his way” doesn’t work. It didn’t for Southampton, and it doesn’t for us.

 

I’m all for giving a manager time, and generally believe stability breeds success, but on this occasion, Puel needs to go.

 

 

It's not just about the pace we're playing  (or rather not playing) with that leads to complaints of downing tools, it's a lack of effort and desire on show - players not busting guts to get back and make blocks or to get on the end of balls in, standing off players constantly, not really making a concerted effort to close down or win possession back. It just seems so lackadaisical in most aspects of play now, and that's not just tactics - whatever you think of Puel his tactical instructions are obviously not "if they're breaking, amble back and maybe wave half a foot at it"

[deep blue]

37 minutes ago, Kendal Fox said:

Thank you for going to the trouble of providing the stats to back this particular angle up. It really is foolish to ignore the argument that Mahrez/Man City have had a devastating impact on the last 3rd of our season.

 

Back in late Jan, we were clearly turning the corner and talk of European football really was credible. I don't mean to be a broken record about Puel deserving more time, but I feel he'll largely be taking a fall for Mahrez if we sack him now.

 

 

Even if that's largely true, Puel is at fault for reintegrating Mahrez so quickly into the squad and continualĺy selecting him irrespective of performance or commitment.

[NorthfieldsFox]

Manger or players ? 

 

Can’t sack the players 

 

so another good man sacked by this squad 

 

1) Claudio 

2) Craig 

3) Claude 

 

rotten To the core squad OR useless mangers 

 

I want change and I want it now 

[joachim1965]

There is no excuse whatever for professional footballers to not give 100%. No excuse at all, it is unprofessional and shows a severe lack of respect for the people who pay a high percentage of their take home pay to go and watch and support them. I couldn't give a flying fvck if they don't like the manager, have some pride ffs.

[MC Prussian]

40 minutes ago, Kendal Fox said:

Thank you for going to the trouble of providing the stats to back this particular angle up. It really is foolish to ignore the argument that Mahrez/Man City have had a devastating impact on the last 3rd of our season.

 

Back in late Jan, we were clearly turning the corner and talk of European football really was credible. I don't mean to be a broken record about Puel deserving more time, but I feel he'll largely be taking a fall for Mahrez if we sack him now.

 

 

We can all put some blame on Mahrez (and I'm sure his and his entourage's antics in January did play a part), let's not forget we had also lost three matches and gotten a draw in mid- to late December last year before that after a superb start under Puel.

That includes a loss against Watford away (Molla Wagué ) and... Crystal Palace at home.

 

We've also been told numerous times that Puel was supposed to be good at dealing with troublemakers following the experience with Ben Arfa at Nice - and seeing that he and Mahrez speak the same language, I'm a bit surprised he's failed to coax the best out of Mahrez in the past nine matches.

[Kendal Fox]

Just now, deep blue said:

Even if that's largely true, Puel is at fault for reintegrating Mahrez so quickly into the squad and continualĺy selecting him irrespective of performance or commitment.

I can see your point.

 

But I can also see the pressure he might be under to keep Mahrez in the starting lineup. If he dropped him, there'd no doubt be many who'd accuse him of punishing Mahrez just to make a point.

 

It might also be that he felt Mahrez might actually play well in order to get his dream move in the Summer, that coupled with Diabate being very green. I agree it's gone on too long with Mahrez though.

[The Wizard]

Tis what it tis.. Shazam !

[jayfox26]

Easy to say the players have downed tools but the question would have to be asked. Why? People say Claudio was let down by the players, and I agree to an extent that he was, but it also seemed that Claudio tried to change things (maybe for the better maybe not) and the players didn't seem to agree with the changes in routines and tactics etc. Puel has tried to change things and again the players clearly haven't bought into his ways and tactics and don't agree with the way he is leading the team. Of course players have an obligation to do their job regardless of whether they agree or disagree with decisions made by the manager but if you're a player and you feel the team is playing against your strengths rather than to your strengths then of course you're going to struggle to settle and find consistent form. I don't agree that the players turned on shakey as we just had an unfortunate fixture list and didn't have chance to gather any form or momentum at the start of the season. The players can't be blamed for that. And I also agree with others that the mahrez tantrum didn't help matters and it's clear our form has got worse and worse since then and we seem to be completely bereft of any team spirit. Possibly some players didn't like the fact Mahrez was welcomed back into the team and it was all brushed under the carpet. 

 

While i agree that alot of the old guard need moving on, I would suggest the reason for this is because some of them are no longer good enough for the level we are trying to achieve rather than them causing unrest in the dressing room and deliberately not trying and giving up. I would suggest the only player that has caused dressing room unrest is Mahrez, for obvious reasons, but none of us know what goes on behind closed doors and exactly how bad the problems within the club are. 

 

Finally, Puel only has himself to blame for his ridiculous team selections and tactics. He has said he doesnt have the players to fit his style yet leaves Dragovic, a player who totally fits his style, on the bench and continually plays Morgan, the absolute opposite of his style of play. Drago kept a clean sheet against Southampton and then gets dropped today??? Of course the issues within the club run deeper than Puel but he isn't the right man to overhaul us and it is too easy to just say the players have given up. 

[Kendal Fox]

5 minutes ago, MC Prussian said:

We can all put some blame on Mahrez (and I'm sure his and his entourage's antics in January did play a part), let's not forget we had also lost three matches and gotten a draw in mid- to late December last year before that after a superb start under Puel.

That includes a loss against Watford away (Molla Wagué ) and... Crystal Palace at home.

 

We've also been told numerous times that Puel was supposed to be good at dealing with troublemakers following the experience with Ben Arfa at Nice - and seeing that he and Mahrez speak the same language, I'm a bit surprised he's failed to coax the best out of Mahrez in the past nine matches.

Yes there were the dropped points and notable blips against Watford ( though a game in which were the better side) and Palace at home. But I took the consideration that Puel was still relatively new at that time and that there'd be a few bad days here and there during the early days.

 

But it's the way we played when things were going well (and we recovered well after the festive games I thought) that I took heart from. I really felt the team were starting to show a more progressive style then we'd seen under Shakey or Ranieri.

I don't know, perhaps I'm wrong. But at least we should give Puel the last 3 games of this season, we're obviously safe. If we lose all 3 then yes, get rid, but also get rid of half the first team too. It's foolish to ignore the pattern that's been established since we won the league. And should we bin Puel alone, it'd be foolish to ignore the probability that the next manager will endure the same as the previous 3 once certain players get bored.

[RutlanderFox]

Footballers are pretty much just children in adult bodies. They have played football alone all their lives and maybe lack the maturity that other adults do 

[oadby.fox]

I think there is a little bit of truth in what most sensible posters have said, whether it is in Puel's favour or not. 

 

Mahrez's strop had an effect, changing managers in the way that we have has had an effect, the highs of the great escape, league win and champions league has also been contrasted with crashing back home to earth-type performances that have been abysmal and embarrassing. 

 

We all know that this group of players can play better than they have been playing, but we also know that the recruitment has been poor over the past two years and it feels like the players we have signed have either not been selected in line with any progressive vision, or that whoever has been managing them hasn't effectively moulded them into the team and properly utilised them. Could it be too much player power and unrest? Maybe we need a team therapist!

 

I don't know much about what goes on behind the scenes, but for me the motivation has to come from the manager. If Mahrez has upset the dressing room then maybe don't put him right back into the team and continue to select him above others who are performing better, if Dragovic is playing well then let him have a run and drop Morgan, if there is a poor performance then do something to rectify it, try a different approach. 

[Kendal Fox]

2 hours ago, sm1 said:

Interesting angle. Our form has definitely fell off a cliff after the Mahrez fiasco.

Yep. No coincidence to me, it certainly has.