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davieG

2018/19 U23s, Development, U19s etc

By davieG, in Leicester City Forum

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sacreblueits442

sacreblueits442

Posted
Posted

....we are not looking good recently and the fact that we have sent players out on loan really should not be an excuse for the poor performances from individuals.

  Derby appeared to have a plan and a style of play, we looked like a park football team as Deby played through us, was first to the 50/50s and looked significantly more technical than us.

The loan deals handed out has obviously had an impact and I wonder what is the feelings of Beaglehole regarding losing his players and would this have been a request from Puel or the DoF to instigate the loans. Beaglehole wants to win the league, he is not going to achieve this with this style of play and I wonder if we need a new coach to improve our technique and playing style.

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SemperEadem

SemperEadem

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Posted
3 hours ago, LCFC FOX said:

Seems more atmosphere tonight than normal premier league games 

About 30 younger lads went tonight with wavers and the UFS drum.

A few there are active members but mainly it was guys who are interested in vocal support but can’t get tickets up the top of SK1.

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cal21212121

cal21212121

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Posted
2 hours ago, sacreblueits442 said:

....we are not looking good recently and the fact that we have sent players out on loan really should not be an excuse for the poor performances from individuals.

  Derby appeared to have a plan and a style of play, we looked like a park football team as Deby played through us, was first to the 50/50s and looked significantly more technical than us.

The loan deals handed out has obviously had an impact and I wonder what is the feelings of Beaglehole regarding losing his players and would this have been a request from Puel or the DoF to instigate the loans. Beaglehole wants to win the league, he is not going to achieve this with this style of play and I wonder if we need a new coach to improve our technique and playing style.

Think you're reading a bit too much into a couple of performances. For starters with Hughes back CB should no longer be an issue, though I still don't rate Ramsay at RB but that shouldn't matter too much.

I doubt Puel is too fussed about which ones go out on loan when they aren't in first team contention. The decision lies with Rudkin, the player and actually having a right move lined up.

Personally I feel they have been stronger when lined up with 3 in midfield, I didn't watch the game but it looked more of a 442. Once players are back to fitness Loft can be binned and we can play one striker in Muskwe, move wright into a more central role or bring Leshabela (assuming he's injured) back in. The defence will look better when ughalumba returns from suspension also.

Getting the arse with the development team and management over two results is ridiculous, they are developing players, they will have inconsistencies in their game. Stupid mistakes will happen, but they will disappear with coaching and experience.

If we lined up with:

Johansson

Ramsey Hughes Pascanu Ughalumba

Sherif dewsbury-hall wright (Leshabela?)

Ndukwu Muskwe shade

That is a very strong side that will do well at that level.

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LCFC FOX

LCFC FOX

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6 hours ago, baker11 said:

About 30 younger lads went tonight with wavers and the UFS drum.

A few there are active members but mainly it was guys who are interested in vocal support but can’t get tickets up the top of SK1.

Good for them. 

 

It’s a shame space is limited. It’s probably the reasoning UFS can’t grow and are falling behind to palace and Huddersfield?

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Ric Flair

Ric Flair

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8 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

I'm uneasy with us prioritising winning the league at this level if that was the case. It's obviously not a bad thing to win the league but it should always be secondary to the development of our players.

Yeah, I think it comes down to what's likely to result in the best chance of players coming in to the first team. I cant remember the last academy player that didnt go on loan before making a first team appearance for us. Therefore, the chances Nduwku, Wright, Shade, Dewsbury-Hall, Leshabela, Pascanu, Hughes, Johanssen, Tee and Ughumbela of going to in to our first team right now is pretty much non-existent.

 

I'd loan as many out as possible and then bring the 17/18 year olds in to the U23's. It's quite astounding how few get a chance at that age for us.

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foxes21

foxes21

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Man Utd and Southampton have two of the best academies in the country, but their u23s aren’t even in the first division. 

 

They don’t prioritise winning the league, they want to develop their young talents by either sending them out on loan or integrating them with the first team squad.  

 

We should be aiming to do the same. 

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Langston

Langston

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1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

Yeah, I think it comes down to what's likely to result in the best chance of players coming in to the first team. I cant remember the last academy player that didnt go on loan before making a first team appearance for us. Therefore, the chances Nduwku, Wright, Shade, Dewsbury-Hall, Leshabela, Pascanu, Hughes, Johanssen, Tee and Ughumbela of going to in to our first team right now is pretty much non-existent.

 

I'd loan as many out as possible and then bring the 17/18 year olds in to the U23's. It's quite astounding how few get a chance at that age for us.

 

Josh Knight I'd have thought, could be wrong mind!

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Ric Flair

Ric Flair

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41 minutes ago, Langston said:

 

Josh Knight I'd have thought, could be wrong mind!

Yeah think it was, yet that was under Shakespeare and he's not had a sniff since I dont think? Surprising he's only just go out on loan as well, it's clear he's been ready for at least League One for a while.

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Foxy-Lady

Foxy-Lady

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On ‎16‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 10:41, foxes21 said:

Man Utd and Southampton have two of the best academies in the country, but their u23s aren’t even in the first division. 

 

They don’t prioritise winning the league, they want to develop their young talents by either sending them out on loan or integrating them with the first team squad.  

 

We should be aiming to do the same. 

Spot on....!!!!

Been saying this for absolutely ages.

 

Very short-sighted strategy to focus on winning development leagues but I do start to detect a slight change of emphasis in recent weeks as the whole emphasis of the club moves towards developing younger players properly and providing proper pathways....which is a strategy that will be heavily reliant on structured player development as opposed to winning trophies.

This is not a philosophy that will sit with Beaglehole's "win-at-all-costs" hoofball mentality so will be interesting to see what happens from hereon with the coaching set-up...

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Stadt

Stadt

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It's so short sighted the argument that Beaglehole must be doing something right if Barnes, Chilwell and Choudhury have all come through recently. It's fairly obvious these are players that needed a chance at first team level which it seems Beaglehole is actually a barrier to by trying to win the U23s and a reluctance to loan players out (whether that's him or Rudkin it's still pathetic). 

 

It's a concern of mine that we're building top of the range facilities and we're leaving a bloke that has a height fetish in charge of the under 23s, whilst Rudkin is DoF and academy director I can't see it changing.

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Guest

Guest

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Whilst I don't disagree with what most of you are saying, I'm afraid I don't agree with filling the U23s team with u18s or u16s. one or two exceptional players yes, or an occasional appearance as a target for younger players but for me the u23s is aimed at those 19 to 21/22 year olds not on loan that you are hopeful will succeed in professional football.

 

It may not be about winning the league but it is certainly not about losing games.

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Foxy-Lady

Foxy-Lady

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6 hours ago, Stadt said:

It's so short sighted the argument that Beaglehole must be doing something right if Barnes, Chilwell and Choudhury have all come through recently. It's fairly obvious these are players that needed a chance at first team level which it seems Beaglehole is actually a barrier to by trying to win the U23s and a reluctance to loan players out (whether that's him or Rudkin it's still pathetic). 

 

It's a concern of mine that we're building top of the range facilities and we're leaving a bloke that has a height fetish in charge of the under 23s, whilst Rudkin is DoF and academy director I can't see it changing.

In fairness to Rudkin (and I am not a big fan!) I think he might be one of the driving forces behind the club strategy which appears to be moving towards generating revenues by focussing on young players and develop them into first team players and/or saleable assets....and the best way to achieve this is to STOP the obsession which focuses on height/physicality and winning meaningless development leagues. (ie Beaglehole)

Hopefully, the emphasis is now more fully focussed on development and proper pathways as opposed to winning and crowing about it on the clubs social media mouthpiece... 

 

(PS Chilwell & Barnes were both desperate to get away from the clubs U23s set-up which probably sums it up perfectly for me!)

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Guest

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13 minutes ago, Foxy-Lady said:

In fairness to Rudkin (and I am not a big fan!) I think he might be one of the driving forces behind the club strategy which appears to be moving towards generating revenues by focussing on young players and develop them into first team players and/or saleable assets....and the best way to achieve this is to STOP the obsession which focuses on height/physicality and winning meaningless development leagues. (ie Beaglehole)

Hopefully, the emphasis is now more fully focussed on development and proper pathways as opposed to winning and crowing about it on the clubs social media mouthpiece... 

 

(PS Chilwell & Barnes were both desperate to get away from the clubs U23s set-up which probably sums it up perfectly for me!)

 

I would've thought EVERY footballer would be desperate to get away from U23 football and play REAL football in the league whichever U23 club they play for. Surely that is the intermediate goal for them all. A chance to show that they can be a professional in a league team heading eventually to the Prem or Europe.

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Foxy-Lady

Foxy-Lady

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, FIF said:

Whilst I don't disagree with what most of you are saying, I'm afraid I don't agree with filling the U23s team with u18s or u16s. one or two exceptional players yes, or an occasional appearance as a target for younger players but for me the u23s is aimed at those 19 to 21/22 year olds not on loan that you are hopeful will succeed in professional football.

 

It may not be about winning the league but it is certainly not about losing games.

I think there is a balance that needs to be found on this point as you are probably right that elevating U16s and U18s too early just for the sake it may prove counter-productive.

BUT... equally, 22-23 year olds playing in U23s football for any prolonged period of time are simply treading water as they are probably not going to reach the level required to play professionally (certainly not in the PL for LCFC) and at the same time, they are blocking up pathways for younger players with greater potential

 

I have made the point before on this site that the U23s league was previously the U21s league until 3 season ago when the age range was extended to give opportunity to 22-23 year olds who were falling out of the game too early as they had nowhere to play.

Unfortunately, like many well intended ideas, by extending the age range, it has merely added to the problems we face of developing 'younger' talents in this country (17-19 year olds) as their opportunities to play at a higher level have become more & more limited due to the player congestion above them........case in point being LCFC U23s where the emphasis in recent seasons has been on age/physicality in their quest to win the 'meaningless' U23 PL2 Development league title.

 

Really need to move the emphasis away from "win at all costs" with Yth development in this country and its ironic that the best teams ive seen playing against LCFC u23s this season were Reading, Forest and Exeter......none of who even play in the PL2 Premier Division!

Edited by Foxy-Lady
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Foxy-Lady

Foxy-Lady

Posted
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, FIF said:

 

I would've thought EVERY footballer would be desperate to get away from U23 football and play REAL football in the league whichever U23 club they play for. Surely that is the intermediate goal for them all. A chance to show that they can be a professional in a league team heading eventually to the Prem or Europe.

Totally agree......but this was for 'other' reasons as well...it wasn't just U23s football they were keen to get away from........and im sure you know what I mean by that!   

 

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davieG

davieG

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9 minutes ago, Foxy-Lady said:

BUT... equally, 22-23 year olds playing in U23s football for any prolonged period of time are simply treading water as they are probably not going to reach the level required to play professionally

This is the key point for me, if they're that age and still not anywhere near the 1st team squad they need to be loaned out if they're deemed to have serious potential to break into a PL squad if not they need to be sold as soon as we can find a suitable level team for them and I don't mean just dump them.

 

I don't see the U23s awash with 1st team squad potential certainly not from those in the 22/23 age bracket.

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