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Premier League Thread 2019/20

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10 minutes ago, henrik_62 said:

Mata I'll give you but come on, your not having Rashford or Martial in your starting XI? Ahead of folk like Gray and Albrighton?  If you signed either of those two tomorrow this place would be in raptures.

Rashford’s terrible out wide, he’s a striker and he’s not getting in ahead of Vardy. I’d have Martial in the starting line up tbf, you’re right on that one but I’m a huge, huge fan of Barnes and I think he’s going to have a blinder next season.

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12 minutes ago, henrik_62 said:

Mata I'll give you but come on, your not having Rashford or Martial in your starting XI? Ahead of folk like Gray and Albrighton?  If you signed either of those two tomorrow this place would be in raptures.

 

I'd start Barnes over Martial but Rashford over Perez, personally. 

 

Attitude and application is everything, I don't understand why this still escapes people. There's a reason we're Champions of England more recently than Manchester United, its because they've absolutely forgotten that. 

 

Fergie would never have had a team that half arsed week in week out. There's a reason he got Pogba the **** out of the club. I wouldn't select him over Tielemans in a month of Sundays. 

 

I don't care how many fifa skill moves a player can do or if he can smash it top bins from eighty yards once every six months. What good is Pogba being able to absolutely DOMINATE a game of football (which he no doubt can) if he only does it once every ten games? 

 

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1 minute ago, mazarron fox said:

But you say 4 of Man Utd get straight in our side and 7 gets in theirs? I don’t think you are saying that but our collectiveness will be greater ( no Sanchez on 500k a week etc ) so the collective of the whole is greater than the parts. That’s what won us the league

I'm not saying it's as black and white and that, I said those 4 as I think it's hard to argue against, the rest depending on people's opinions could be debated all day.

 

I'm not talking about finance or how much money players are on or anything like that I'm talking about a squad of footballers and general depth of the squad and imo Man Utd still have the better squad.

 

Of course Leicester have a more cohesive unit and are getting more out of what they have, I alluded to exactly that in a previous post. 

 

Leciester can and hopefully may well finish ahead of Man Utd, Chelsea or Arsenal this season but at this point in time, looking at the squads and overall strength in depth in general imo I find it hard to believe Leicester have a stronger squad than any of them.  As poor, disjointed and in turmoil as they all were last season they still all finished ahead of you guys.

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2 minutes ago, Stadt said:

Rashford’s terrible out wide, he’s a striker and he’s not getting in ahead of Vardy. I’d have Martial in the starting line up tbf, you’re right on that one but I’m a huge, huge fan of Barnes and I think he’s going to have a blinder next season.

Rashford wherever you were to play him would enhance the Leciester starting IX no end, no doubt about it.  The guy is an England international, scoring in latter stages of the Champions League and has had Barcelona and Real Madrid after him.

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7 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I'd start Barnes over Martial but Rashford over Perez, personally. 

 

Attitude and application is everything, I don't understand why this still escapes people. There's a reason we're Champions of England more recently than Manchester United, its because they've absolutely forgotten that. 

 

Fergie would never have had a team that half arsed week in week out. There's a reason he got Pogba the **** out of the club. I wouldn't select him over Tielemans in a month of Sundays. 

 

I don't care how many fifa skill moves a player can do or if he can smash it top bins from eighty yards once every six months. What good is Pogba being able to absolutely DOMINATE a game of football (which he no doubt can) if he only does it once every ten games? 

 

I'm not a fan of Pogba in the main but your not telling me he wouldn't get in the Leicester team, come on, the guy is a world cup winner and despite being in a mediocre Man Utd side last season managed 13 league goals and 9 assists and is being courted by the likes of Real Madrid and Juventus.  None of your current midfielders, even Tielemans if you want to take his average over a season come close to that.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Finnegan said:

@MattP @henrik_62

 

Strength in depth is nice but it's not really worth a lot to have a bench stronger than ours if your starting eleven is pump. 

 

I wrote a pretty massive post about those three clubs the other day and I can't be arsed repeating all from scratch but the general jist was:

 

Chelsea - solid defence, best defensive mid in the world, zero creativity, zero goal threat. Willian, Pedro and Giroud aren't getting anyone in to the Champions League and they can't buy new. 

 

Arsenal - two superb strikers. A mid table midfield (being generous) and a relegation fodder back four. Honestly the worst defence in the top half, there hasn't been an Arsenal defence that bad in my lifetime. They have no money. 

 

Man Utd - a flat track bully striker that's hugely over weight and looks like he's leaving, a lazy prima Donna midfielder who probably also leaves. DDG and Rashford the only two that get in our starting lineup. They need considerable rebuild at full back, centre back, centre mid, on the wing and up front. They have the worst record of spending in the top half. 

Yet those 3 sides still finished comfortably ahead of us last season despite all being pretty shit throughout. I do agree with you that we should be challenging these sides, along with West Ham, Wolves and Everton. We 'could' challenge top 6 but I think we're just as likely to finish 10th.

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3 minutes ago, henrik_62 said:

I'm not a fan of Pogba in the main but your not telling me he wouldn't get in the Leicester team, come on, the guy is a world cup winner and despite being mediocre last season managed 13 league goals and 9 assists and is being courted by the likes of Real Madrid and Juventus.

 

Regardless of whether or not Pogba is better individually than Tielemans (I'm actually not entirely convinced he is as a play making number 8 ) - our team would be collectively worse with Pogba instead of YT. 

 

You cannot, cannot, cannot under estimate the impact of having the right personalities in your team. 

 

Look at the amount of quality at PSG and how absolutely ****ing terrible they were in Europe this year. There is far more to a footballer than their technical ability. 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, RowlattsFox said:

Yet those 3 sides still finished comfortably ahead of us last season despite all being pretty shit throughout. I do agree with you that we should be challenging these sides, along with West Ham, Wolves and Everton. We 'could' challenge top 6 but I think we're just as likely to finish 10th.

 

We were managed by Claude Puel for most of the year and signed our best midfielder on loan in January. 

 

Meanwhile Chelsea have lost Hazard, none of them have signed anyone significant and look at our form vs theirs post Brendan. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

Regardless of whether or not Pogba is better individually than Tielemans (I'm actually not entirely convinced he is as a play making number 8 ) - our team would be collectively worse with Pogba instead of YT. 

 

You cannot, cannot, cannot under estimate the impact of having the right personalities in your team. 

 

Look at the amount of quality at PSG and how absolutely ****ing terrible they were in Europe this year. There is far more to a footballer than their technical ability. 

 

 

If people are genuinely of the belief that Pogba wouldn't get a game for Leicester then I'm out, heads have gone!

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2 minutes ago, henrik_62 said:

If people are genuinely of the belief that Pogba wouldn't get a game for Leicester then I'm out, heads have gone!

I’d have him over Tielemans and Maddison on purely ability. This is all hypothetical anyway but we’ve consistently had great personalities in the squad, he just wouldn’t fit in here.

 

This is a bit of a weak comparison but it’s like saying you’d rather have Leigh Griffiths over Morelos. Morelos is a better player purely because of his talent but you’d rather Griffiths because he’s not an enigma

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Just now, Stadt said:

I’d have him over Tielemans and Maddison on purely ability. This is all hypothetical anyway but we’ve consistently had great personalities in the squad, he just wouldn’t fit in here.

 

This is a bit of a weak comparison but it’s like saying you’d rather have Leigh Griffiths over Morelos. Morelos is a better player purely because of his talent but you’d rather Griffiths because he’s not an enigma

Not really, based on the last two seasons I'd rather have Morelos as Griffiths has been terrible and Morelos is the top goalscorer in the country.

 

Pogba irrespective of his personality, would play every week for Leicester and greatly enhance the side.

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7 minutes ago, henrik_62 said:

If people are genuinely of the belief that Pogba wouldn't get a game for Leicester then I'm out, heads have gone!

I think everybody has explained perfectly well and fair why they believe Pogba wouldn’t get a game here. It’s no ones fault but your own you’re being a bit thick over this 

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6 minutes ago, Samilktray said:

I think everybody has explained perfectly well and fair why they believe Pogba wouldn’t get a game here. It’s no ones fault but your own you’re being a bit thick over this 

Not being thick at all, processed all the explanations just find it very very very hard to believe and take seriously.

 

Irrespective of his personality, ego, etc Pogba would walk into every midfield in the EPL bar none.  I don't particularly like the guy but to argue anything other than that takes some doing, particularly to argue he wouldn't get in a side who finished around mid table.

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1 hour ago, Finnegan said:

@MattP @henrik_62

 

Strength in depth is nice but it's not really worth a lot to have a bench stronger than ours if your starting eleven is pump. 

 

I wrote a pretty massive post about those three clubs the other day and I can't be arsed repeating all from scratch but the general jist was:

 

Chelsea - solid defence, best defensive mid in the world, zero creativity, zero goal threat. Willian, Pedro and Giroud aren't getting anyone in to the Champions League and they can't buy new. 

 

Arsenal - two superb strikers. A mid table midfield (being generous) and a relegation fodder back four. Honestly the worst defence in the top half, there hasn't been an Arsenal defence that bad in my lifetime. They have no money. 

 

Man Utd - a flat track bully striker that's hugely over weight and looks like he's leaving, a lazy prima Donna midfielder who probably also leaves. DDG and Rashford the only two that get in our starting lineup. They need considerable rebuild at full back, centre back, centre mid, on the wing and up front. They have the worst record of spending in the top half. 

I actually agree with you on all the points you make - but the fact still stands these squads still finished miles ahead of us last season.

 

Given this point of view do you actually expect us to finish above them all this season?

 

I'm slightly worried our expectations are getting a bit outrageous here, I'd be delighted to get close to the top 6 - I just don't see top 4 as realistic just quite yet.

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5 minutes ago, MattP said:

I actually agree with you on all the points you make - but the fact still stands these squads still finished miles ahead of us last season.

 

Given this point of view do you actually expect us to finish above them all this season?

 

I'm slightly worried our expectations are getting a bit outrageous here, I'd be delighted to get close to the top 6 - I just don't see top 4 as realistic just quite yet.

 

As stated above, we were managed by Puel for most of last year and only got Tielemans up and running for a few months. 

 

Rodgers, Tielemans and to a lesser extent Barnes and Perez make us a significantly different team to the one that finished last year not to mention Ricardo, Chilwell, Evans and Maddison are now all settled in to the side. 

 

Meanwhile every one of those three clubs have gone backwards. 

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5 minutes ago, henrik_62 said:

Not being thick at all, processed all the explanations just find it very very very hard to believe and take seriously.

 

Irrespective of his personality, ego, etc Pogba would walk into every midfield in the EPL bar none.  I don't particularly like the guy but to argue anything other than that takes some doing, particularly to argue he wouldn't get in a side who finished around mid table.

Pogba has a negative overall impact on the team because he's a c*nt, Tielemans and Maddison are good lads who have a positive overall impact. No one's denying that Pogba is a better player than both but the negative impact he brings on things such as morale of the rest of the team outweighs what he can do on the pitch in comparison to our players.

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6 minutes ago, matty98 said:

Pogba has a negative overall impact on the team because he's a c*nt, Tielemans and Maddison are good lads who have a positive overall impact. No one's denying that Pogba is a better player than both but the negative impact he brings on things such as morale of the rest of the team outweighs what he can do on the pitch in comparison to our players.

I get the issues with his ego and personality but with all that in the mix he still contributed 13 league goals and 9 assists last season, miles more than any Leicester midfielder and I'd put money on, that those numbers will be far greater than any Leicester midfielder will achieve this season also.  For these sort of numbers alone I therefore find it hard to fathom that any midfielder, with however much baggage, that can deliver that in terms of goals and assists wouldn't get into the Leicester side.

 

For all his alleged negative impact take out those goals and assists from that Man Utd team last season and you'd be lucky if they'd be in the top half.

 

As much as Pogba is a twat, look at how he plays for France, look at the World Cup he had, maybe Man Utd are as much the problem as Pogba himself for the toxic situation that club finds themselves in.

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2 minutes ago, matty98 said:

Pogba has a negative overall impact on the team because he's a c*nt, Tielemans and Maddison are good lads who have a positive overall impact. No one's denying that Pogba is a better player than both but the negative impact he brings on things such as morale of the rest of the team outweighs what he can do on the pitch in comparison to our players.

 

I'm genuinely at a loss to understand how people can actually watch football and not appreciate the value of a players mental strength. 

 

Drinkwater, Simpson, Fuchs and Okazaki are Premier League winners and Milner, Wijnaldum and Henderson are Champions League winners for the same reason. It's not about fairytale a and flukes or magic, it's just that there's more to football than technical ability. 

 

Klopp and Guardiola wouldn't touch Pogba with a barge pole regardless of how good he's capable of being on the odd special occasion he steps up. 

 

United are rotten to the core because they've had a policy of signing people like Pogba, Sanchez and Martial entirely on technical ability with zero consideration for how their personalities fit in to the equation. It's why they're languishing way off the Premier League pace. 

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2 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I'm genuinely at a loss to understand how people can actually watch football and not appreciate the value of a players mental strength. 

 

Drinkwater, Simpson, Fuchs and Okazaki are Premier League winners and Milner, Wijnaldum and Henderson are Champions League winners for the same reason. It's not about fairytale a and flukes or magic, it's just that there's more to football than technical ability. 

 

Klopp and Guardiola wouldn't touch Pogba with a barge pole regardless of how good he's capable of being on the odd special occasion he steps up. 

 

United are rotten to the core because they've had a policy of signing people like Pogba, Sanchez and Martial entirely on technical ability with zero consideration for how their personalities fit in to the equation. It's why they're languishing way off the Premier League pace. 

Pogba's won a world cup, scored in the final and generally had a great tournament, I'm sure that reflects a decent level of mental strength, won Serie A a few times too and a Europa League.

 

In any case I'm not debating his character, I'm in agreement he's a twat, that wasn't the point I was debating, my bone of contention was despite his character people saying he wouldn't get a game for Leicester which I'll say again is very very hard to believe.

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The reason why so many are talking about us potentially making top six is because of the signings we have made, the talent in our squad and because who our manager is.

 

Pundits aren't talking about West Ham because they are a few strikers short, now they are getting in Haller though, then maybe people will start talking about them as potential top six challengers. Pundits aren't talking about Everton because like West Ham they are a few strikers short, West Ham have now acted, Everton currently haven't. Pundits aren't talking about Wolves because right now they don't have the squad depth. Out of all those teams, right now we are the best equipped to challenge. 

 

Then you look at the trio of Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, all three are stacked with problems. Man Utd for me are in a transition period, on paper they have some quality players but Solskjaer's mindset seems to be, buy some younger players who will develop in time, it might take a couple of season's for United to be back at their best. Chelsea have a transfer ban and have lost their best player, for them to get top four then Lampard has to work a miracle. As for Arsenal it's same old, same old for them, a top four quality attack with a defence that isn't even top six quality. 

 

In the next few weeks you fully expect West Ham, Wolves and Everton to improve their squads but so will we. This is a massive chance to chase down Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal. Us, West Ham, Wolves and Everton probably won't get a better chance than this, it's going to be interesting, very interesting.

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Just now, kingfox said:

The reason why so many are talking about us potentially making top six is because of the signings we have made, the talent in our squad and because who our manager is.

 

Pundits aren't talking about West Ham because they are a few strikers short, now they are getting in Haller though, then maybe people will start talking about them as potential top six challengers. Pundits aren't talking about Everton because like West Ham they are a few strikers short, West Ham have now acted, Everton currently haven't. Pundits aren't talking about Wolves because right now they don't have the squad depth. Out of all those teams, right now we are the best equipped to challenge. 

 

Then you look at the trio of Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal, all three are stacked with problems. Man Utd for me are in a transition period, on paper they have some quality players but Solskjaer's mindset seems to be, buy some younger players who will develop in time, it might take a couple of season's for United to be back at their best. Chelsea have a transfer ban and have lost their best player, for them to get top four then Lampard has to work a miracle. As for Arsenal it's same old, same old for them, a top four quality attack with a defence that isn't even top six quality. 

 

In the next few weeks you fully expect West Ham, Wolves and Everton to improve their squads but so will we. This is a massive chance to chase down Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal. Us, West Ham, Wolves and Everton probably won't get a better chance than this, it's going to be interesting, very interesting.

Agreed think it will make for great entertainment and hopefully a very open league this year, beneath the top 2 or 3 anyway as they seem a few levels above the rest.

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