US Presidential Election 2020

[Jattdogg]

16 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

If a doctor ran a check up and declared Bernie fit to run would that sway your opinion? Because that has actually happened.

 

It's absolutely fair to question his health on the basis of his age, but once that question has been answered by a qualified professional continuing to question it moves from fair to vindictive imo.

 

Clearly he is fit now im just concerned about next year, year 2, 3 etc. Is that an over reaction/concern, yes it probably is. If i look to my own family (only 1 grandparent made it to their 80's, died at 89) he was very smart, with it, healthy and would jog in his early 80s......but then got sick one day, had a partial leg amuptation and it was just a decline from there over the years.

 

Just to be clear I am not a bernie or trump supporter/fan as its not my country. Do i detest one more than the other, definitely yes lol. 

 

I just think the dems would be best served going with someone who i believe could make it through 2 terms. I dont think bernie can but that's just my personal opinion. I do have concerns any of the other candidates could actually beat trump though. But hey, Bernie looks likely to win if he keeps this up so all the power to him i suppose. He might just prove me wrong!

[Carl the Llama]

2 minutes ago, Jattdogg said:

Clearly he is fit now im just concerned about next year, year 2, 3 etc. Is that an over reaction/concern, yes it probably is. If i look to my own family (only 1 grandparent made it to their 80's, died at 89) he was very smart, with it, healthy and would jog in his early 80s......but then got sick one day, had a partial leg amuptation and it was just a decline from there over the years.

 

Just to be clear I am not a bernie or trump supporter/fan as its not my country. Do i detest one more than the other, definitely yes lol. 

 

I just think the dems would be best served going with someone who i believe could make it through 2 terms. I dont think bernie can but that's just my personal opinion. I do have concerns any of the other candidates could actually beat trump though. But hey, Bernie looks likely to win if he keeps this up so all the power to him i suppose. He might just prove me wrong!

Making it through the 2 terms is a valid concern but I would always prioritise having the best candidate first and putting age aside for one second none of the other candidates come close.

[Detroit Blues]

In an ideal world, Trump and Bernie would both be too old to be president, but I do not think we're going to have an alternative option. If we were doing a death pool, I think it would be a toss up between them. Bernie is 4-5 years older than Trump (and recently had a heart attack). On the other hand, Trump is clearly obese due to a terrible diet and refusing to exercise. He also may, or may not be taking speed (amphetamines). 

 

[Carl the Llama]

2 hours ago, Detroit Blues said:

In an ideal world, Trump and Bernie would both be too old to be president, but I do not think we're going to have an alternative option. If we were doing a death pool, I think it would be a toss up between them. Bernie is 4-5 years older than Trump (and recently had a heart attack). On the other hand, Trump is clearly obese due to a terrible diet and refusing to exercise. He also may, or may not be taking speed (amphetamines). 

 

There was an image doing the rounds not long back of Trump sitting at his desk and behind him was an open drawer overflowing with adderall boxes iirc

[Stadt]

Trump genuinely believes you have a finite amount of energy and that if you exercise you use it up  

[Guest MattP]

2 hours ago, Detroit Blues said:

In an ideal world, Trump and Bernie would both be too old to be president, but I do not think we're going to have an alternative option. If we were doing a death pool, I think it would be a toss up between them. Bernie is 4-5 years older than Trump (and recently had a heart attack). On the other hand, Trump is clearly obese due to a terrible diet and refusing to exercise. He also may, or may not be taking speed (amphetamines). 

I'm taking a bet on a Bernie assassination if he wins the election.

 

Security services obviously do an amazing job but some hardened gun nut only needs to get lucky once.

[Dr The Singh]

Is there a equivalent of Kieth Vaz in this election....we need to support that person

[Aus Fox]

9 hours ago, Dr The Singh said:

Is there a equivalent of Kieth Vaz in this election....we need to support that person

It’s uncanny really...

[Guest MattP]

FFS Bernie

 

You might get away with this in front of your fans but you'll be be torn to absolutely bits when questioned about it forensically in a politically neutral studio debate.

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/world/bernie-sanders-admits-he-is-clueless-about-cost-of-policies-prtnbllvd?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1582565651

 

Concerns among moderate Democrats about Bernie Sanders’s electability grew yesterday when he admitted that he had no idea how much his proposals would cost, even as he added universal childcare to his raft of policies.

 

Mr Sanders, 78, who has become the frontrunner in the Democratic race to take on President Trump after a big win in the Nevada caucus at the weekend, told CBS that childcare provision, costed at $1.5 trillion over a decade, would be covered by a “tax on wealth”.

[somebum]

Nobody is going to vote Sanders he's too old. Shame though he seems ok

[twoleftfeet]

surely Bernie should of just said its fully costed, just like the successful prime minister of the UK Jeremy Corbyn did.

[Beechey]

1 hour ago, MattP said:

FFS Bernie

 

You might get away with this in front of your fans but you'll be be torn to absolutely bits when questioned about it forensically in a politically neutral studio debate.

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/world/bernie-sanders-admits-he-is-clueless-about-cost-of-policies-prtnbllvd?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1582565651

 

Concerns among moderate Democrats about Bernie Sanders’s electability grew yesterday when he admitted that he had no idea how much his proposals would cost, even as he added universal childcare to his raft of policies.

 

Mr Sanders, 78, who has become the frontrunner in the Democratic race to take on President Trump after a big win in the Nevada caucus at the weekend, told CBS that childcare provision, costed at $1.5 trillion over a decade, would be covered by a “tax on wealth”.

In fairness, $150 billion per year for the US frankly is peanuts. The US deficit is now running at $1100 billion per year.

Before Trump, it was about $580 billion. He's been a disaster for fiscal conservatism.

Edited 25 February 2020 by Beechey

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, MattP said:

FFS Bernie

 

You might get away with this in front of your fans but you'll be be torn to absolutely bits when questioned about it forensically in a politically neutral studio debate.

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/world/bernie-sanders-admits-he-is-clueless-about-cost-of-policies-prtnbllvd?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1582565651

 

Concerns among moderate Democrats about Bernie Sanders’s electability grew yesterday when he admitted that he had no idea how much his proposals would cost, even as he added universal childcare to his raft of policies.

 

Mr Sanders, 78, who has become the frontrunner in the Democratic race to take on President Trump after a big win in the Nevada caucus at the weekend, told CBS that childcare provision, costed at $1.5 trillion over a decade, would be covered by a “tax on wealth”.

 

5 minutes ago, Beechey said:

In fairness, $150 billion per year for the US frankly is peanuts. The US deficit is now running at $1100 billion per year.

Before Trump, it was about $580 billion. He's been a disaster for fiscal conservatism.

Don't worry, he's just taking his lead from the US military and their budget costings.

[Guest MattP]

7 minutes ago, Beechey said:

In fairness, $150 billion per year for the US frankly is peanuts. The US deficit is now running at $1100 billion per year.

Before Trump, it was about $580 billion. He's been a disaster for fiscal conservatism.

Something I've said a few times on here, pure boom and bust politics.

 

I feel sorry for who has to pick up the shit when the latter part comes.

[Dr The Singh]

I hope Dianne Abbot gets into Bernie's cabinet, she will be am asset to him.

[Detroit Blues]

6 hours ago, Beechey said:

In fairness, $150 billion per year for the US frankly is peanuts. The US deficit is now running at $1100 billion per year.

Before Trump, it was about $580 billion. He's been a disaster for fiscal conservatism.

Fiscal conservatism a thing Republicans pretend to care about when they are not in power. When they are in power, we end up spending trillions of dollars on middle eastern conflicts and tax cuts for the rich. 

Edited 25 February 2020 by Detroit Blues

[Guest MattP]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/24/us/bernie-sanders-fidel-castro-florida.html

 

The stupidly of it beggars belief, Trump shouldn't have to lift a finger to hold Florida against him.

 

Going to be very hard for the Democrats to win without it, will need to pretty much sweep the whole of the rust belt back.

 

How can people in such high positions be so dumb?

[leicsmac]

8 minutes ago, MattP said:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/24/us/bernie-sanders-fidel-castro-florida.html

 

The stupidly of it beggars belief, Trump shouldn't have to lift a finger to hold Florida against him.

 

Going to be very hard for the Democrats to win without it, will need to pretty much sweep the whole of the rust belt back.

 

How can people in such high positions be so dumb?

...or just Ohio and Pennsylvania.

 

And of course this assumes a significant potion of the Florida Hispanic community a.) care at all about Cuban policy and b.) Take Bernies comments out of context in the way demonstrated here while still being swing voters who wouldn't rail against "fvckin COMMIES" normally anyway.

[Guest MattP]

23 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

...or just Ohio and Pennsylvania.

 

And of course this assumes a significant potion of the Florida Hispanic community a.) care at all about Cuban policy and b.) Take Bernies comments out of context in the way demonstrated here while still being swing voters who wouldn't rail against "fvckin COMMIES" normally anyway.

Given Obama's relations with Castro was given as a big reason for Florida going Republican, this sort of thing seems suicidal.

 

This sort of thing might be a throwaway for white American students, but for Cubans in Florida who will probably have had family executed, tortured and imprisoned by that leadership I'd imagine it's not so trivial.

 

That's two cock ups from Sanders in two days and you've turned a blind eye to both, don't turn into the political opposite of a Trump voter. 

Edited 26 February 2020 by MattP

[leicsmac]

6 minutes ago, MattP said:

Given Obama's relations with Castro was given as a big reason for Florida going Republican, this sort of thing seems suicidal.

 

This sort of thing might be a throwaway for white American students, but for Cubans in Florida who will probably have had family executed, tortured and imprisoned by that leadership I'd imagine it's not so trivial.

 

That's two cock ups from Sanders in two days and you've turned a blind eye to both, don't turn into the political opposite of a Trump voter. 

I'd be interested in a source on that first part once my flight lands - and my point is that this is likely not going to affect many people who wouldn't vote for Trump over Sanders anyway.

 

WRT the costing thing, I think I addressed it by saying that the US government seems to have an unlimited, unquestioned wealth of cash for bombing (or planning to bomb) whoever the flavour of the month is, but seem to worry about the bottom line when it comes to actually helping people without using weaponry...which is a bit funny.

[Guest MattP]

2 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

I'd be interested in a source on that first part once my flight lands - and my point is that this is likely not going to affect many people who wouldn't vote for Trump over Sanders anyway.

 

WRT the costing thing, I think I addressed it by saying that the US government seems to have an unlimited, unquestioned wealth of cash for bombing (or planning to bomb) whoever the flavour of the month is, but seem to worry about the bottom line when it comes to actually helping people without using weaponry...which is a bit funny.

No source, just my recollections from the electoral analysis - it was widely believed Clinton had it sewn up after Trump has "bashed" Hispanics, Obama cosying up to Castro was given as a reason many of those turned on the Democrats which is hardly surprising given the history.

 

On the budget, I thought you were being sarcastic when addressing that - I didnt realise you were making a genuine point. The US military has a budget with fiscal elasticity built into it's calculations, this isn't in the same ballpark as a bloke on stage promising trillions with no idea where it's going to come from.

 

Shouting "we've always got money for war" is politics from student protest matches, it has no place in serious political discussion.

[oxford blue]

On 25/02/2020 at 18:01, Dr The Singh said:

I hope Dianne Abbot gets into Bernie's cabinet, she will be am asset to him.

Perhaps this is why she has said she doesn't want a position in new leader's shadow cabinet?

[MC Prussian]

Four more years of Trump, then in comes a shining light.

[leicsmac]

12 hours ago, MattP said:

No source, just my recollections from the electoral analysis - it was widely believed Clinton had it sewn up after Trump has "bashed" Hispanics, Obama cosying up to Castro was given as a reason many of those turned on the Democrats which is hardly surprising given the history.

 

On the budget, I thought you were being sarcastic when addressing that - I didnt realise you were making a genuine point. The US military has a budget with fiscal elasticity built into it's calculations, this isn't in the same ballpark as a bloke on stage promising trillions with no idea where it's going to come from.

 

Shouting "we've always got money for war" is politics from student protest matches, it has no place in serious political discussion.

Fair enough, will have to stand as it is then. I'm not convinced but who knows?

 

I'm sorry, discussing the US military budget and its "elasticity" (read: as much money as is needed, no questions asked) and the way it is treated as some kind of sacred cow is absolutely a reasonable point for serious political discussion.

[Guest MattP]

8 hours ago, leicsmac said:

I'm sorry, discussing the US military budget and its "elasticity" (read: as much money as is needed, no questions asked) and the way it is treated as some kind of sacred cow is absolutely a reasonable point for serious political discussion.

The way you talk it's like the US has a military budget that sky rockets every year no questions asked. That's just not the truth is it?

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/272473/us-military-spending-from-2000-to-2012/

 

So we have a base of somewhere between 600-700 billion and sometimes it's more and sometimes it's less. This isn't remotely comparable to a bloke just standing on a stage promising trillions but having no idea where it will come from.