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Countryfox

Centre half ... lots going on.

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Thought we might need a dedicated centre half thread ..   seems to be a lot going on concerning this position at the moment ..  who might leave (too old, not good enough and being poached are 3 separate reasons) ...  and how it all fits together.  
 

 

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1 hour ago, Countryfox said:

Thought we might need a dedicated centre half thread ..   seems to be a lot going on concerning this position at the moment ..  who might leave (too old, not good enough and being poached are 3 separate reasons) ...  and how it all fits together.  
 

 

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..I have just watched the YouTube highlights and I do not know why all the fuss!!!

  He looks bog standard, he looks so ordinary and unspectacular I kept waiting for some sign of composure and authority in his play.

  The lot of being a defender in his position is reading the game and positional sense. It is perhaps hard to pick up from edited highlights the niceties of his play and I am doing him a disservice.

  I would have opted for Benkovic over Soyuncu after watching YouTube a few years ago, as Caglars' inclination to barge through a player from the back was going to be hard to take out of his game. Benkovic however was tidy assured and his recovery play especially going to ground when making a tackle was for me a sign that he would go on to be a top class defender.

  So far it has not worked for Benkovic and with injuries he has not achieved what I believe he is capable of. If we need back up then if Benkovic is not the answer I don't see Demiral as the next option.

 

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25 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

..I have just watched the YouTube highlights and I do not know why all the fuss!!!

  He looks bog standard, he looks so ordinary and unspectacular I kept waiting for some sign of composure and authority in his play.

  The lot of being a defender in his position is reading the game and positional sense. It is perhaps hard to pick up from edited highlights the niceties of his play and I am doing him a disservice.

  I would have opted for Benkovic over Soyuncu after watching YouTube a few years ago, as Caglars' inclination to barge through a player from the back was going to be hard to take out of his game. Benkovic however was tidy assured and his recovery play especially going to ground when making a tackle was for me a sign that he would go on to be a top class defender.

  So far it has not worked for Benkovic and with injuries he has not achieved what I believe he is capable of. If we need back up then if Benkovic is not the answer I don't see Demiral as the next option.

 

 

I don't know a lot about the players mentioned so thats interesting ...    the Celtic player and the one from St Etienne do sound like players that Brendan could work with ...

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8 minutes ago, Paddy. said:

Bothers me a bit that @henrik_62, who seems to know his onions, rates Benko as one of the best CBs he's seen for a while up at Celtic, and thinks that Ajer is fairly average. Swapping a good young player & cash for a fairly average player bothers me a bit 

It bothers me that our two targets appear to be Rodgers old mates, one injury prone and way past his best and the other is hard to judge playing in a very poor league. I hoped our scouting team would continue to be trusted and not messed with upon Congertons arrival.

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6 minutes ago, Paddy. said:

Bothers me a bit that @henrik_62, who seems to know his onions, rates Benko as one of the best CBs he's seen for a while up at Celtic, and thinks that Ajer is fairly average. Swapping a good young player & cash for a fairly average player bothers me a bit 


No disrespect to Henry but I’ll put my trust in Brendan ...   :thumbup:

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I do wonder if there's a bit of a divide between our scouts/recruitment staff who want and specialise in young talents (and with a very high success rate) and the Rodgers/Congerton camp who are seemingly after more experienced players. 

 

Just a hunch but it would be such a shame to change what's been an incredibly successful strategy.

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11 minutes ago, Paddy. said:

Bothers me a bit that @henrik_62, who seems to know his onions, rates Benko as one of the best CBs he's seen for a while up at Celtic, and thinks that Ajer is fairly average. Swapping a good young player & cash for a fairly average player bothers me a bit 

He definitely rated Ajer when Rodgers was their manager. Seemed to be able to get the best out of him and was the main reason he became a centre half.

 

Benkovic is clearly a great talent but he's made out of glass.

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17 minutes ago, sdb said:

I do wonder if there's a bit of a divide between our scouts/recruitment staff who want and specialise in young talents (and with a very high success rate) and the Rodgers/Congerton camp who are seemingly after more experienced players. 

 

Just a hunch but it would be such a shame to change what's been an incredibly successful strategy.

What makes you say that? Under Rodgers we signed Youri, James Justin and brought through the likes of Barnes. All young players and have only signed Perez at 26. 

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2 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

What makes you say that? Under Rodgers we signed Youri, James Justin and brought through the likes of Barnes. All young players and have only signed Perez at 26. 

Tielemans was signed initially under Puel. I'd say Justin was one down to the scouts, he's barely featured though despite some promising performances.

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6 minutes ago, lcfcsnow said:

Tielemans was signed initially under Puel. I'd say Justin was one down to the scouts, he's barely featured though despite some promising performances.

Initially signed on loan under Puel, but permanently signed under Rodgers, so depends how you want to look at it. May have been a scout spot for Justin, but assume Rodgers had input. 

 

JJ hasn't played a huge amount due to how well Ricardo and Chillwell have played, and Fuchs has deputised for Chillwell when injured. But Justin was always given cup games and a fair few opportunities since Christmas where he's always done well. 

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1 hour ago, Paddy. said:

Bothers me a bit that @henrik_62, who seems to know his onions, rates Benko as one of the best CBs he's seen for a while up at Celtic, and thinks that Ajer is fairly average. Swapping a good young player & cash for a fairly average player bothers me a bit 

I do hope Benkovic comes good for us he's young, new to UK & still learning but is there something our team have seen in training?

If he is sold then i have faith in the scouting team in thinking, Ajer, a player being linked to AC Milan, Real Madrid, Man City, Spurs & Everton to name but 5 teams will be a good signing & probably better than Benko for now & future.


Benkovic is only linked to Celtic via a swap deal with us, no other linked clubs, he also didn't really get rave reviews from Bristol City supporters on his loan either so on that evidence Ajer is the better prospect no :dunno:
 

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1 hour ago, lcfcsnow said:

It bothers me that our two targets appear to be Rodgers old mates, one injury prone and way past his best and the other is hard to judge playing in a very poor league. I hoped our scouting team would continue to be trusted and not messed with upon Congertons arrival.

In fairness it could absolutely be lazy journalism linking randoms to us, and players are always linked back to former coaches.

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49 minutes ago, Nicolo Barella said:

In fairness it could absolutely be lazy journalism linking randoms to us, and players are always linked back to former coaches.

Thats Sports journalism...create a thought,Base a story,Let it flow, the readers and Social Media will do the rest...simples

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2 hours ago, Paddy. said:

Bothers me a bit that @henrik_62, who seems to know his onions, rates Benko as one of the best CBs he's seen for a while up at Celtic, and thinks that Ajer is fairly average. Swapping a good young player & cash for a fairly average player bothers me a bit 

 

2 hours ago, AKCJ said:

He definitely rated Ajer when Rodgers was their manager. Seemed to be able to get the best out of him and was the main reason he became a centre half.

 

Benkovic is clearly a great talent but he's made out of glass.

We have ourselves a bit of a paradox. 

 

Brendan rates Ajer, but he remembers him from last year. Not how he has developed now. 

 

@henrik_62 rates Benkovic, but he remembers him from last year. Not how he has developed now. 

 

I think the issue is that both have gone backwards and not forwards. If Brendon doesnt see a future for Benkovic, than a swap will be the best move. 

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I reckon Holding onto Benkovic, getting him more involved, would be shrewd and prudent...

He's shown he's got talent, he's just 22 , touching 23,thats a babe in Woods for a CB..

Alot of players have suffered injuries in their young careers,then found a course and path to Recover ,then Step  up their potential...

Evans,Milner,Gerrard.  If the Club now support him,they will I am sure find a top und loyal player..

 

The Lockdown has given a many a injuries-Player breathing space,

the Club should trust in their initial grounds for that First idea of investment...

Why in this unknown period ,Waste the moment or the money...

If we do get this season restarted and completed then he and Kaputska,should get some Motivation and some gametime from the bench..

.Especially while  it  seems more subs can be used.

Keep him....!!

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47 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

I reckon Holding onto Benkovic, getting him more involved, would be shrewd and prudent...

He's shown he's got talent, he's just 22 , touching 23,thats a babe in Woods for a CB..

Alot of players have suffered injuries in their young careers,then found a course and path to Recover ,then Step  up their potential...

Evans,Milner,Gerrard.  If the Club now support him,they will I am sure find a top und loyal player..

 

The Lockdown has given a many a injuries-Player breathing space,

the Club should trust in their initial grounds for that First idea of investment...

Why in this unknown period ,Waste the moment or the money...

If we do get this season restarted and completed then he and Kaputska,should get some Motivation and some gametime from the bench..

.Especially while  it  seems more subs can be used.

Keep him....!!


Maybe ..  but I don’t think we have that luxury ...   Evans age/injuries and Cags being lured away ..  and even the option to play 3 at the back ...    I’d use him to upgrade now and let Brendan polish another diamond...   ASAP.

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2 hours ago, BKLFox said:

I do hope Benkovic comes good for us he's young, new to UK & still learning but is there something our team have seen in training?

If he is sold then i have faith in the scouting team in thinking, Ajer, a player being linked to AC Milan, Real Madrid, Man City, Spurs & Everton to name but 5 teams will be a good signing & probably better than Benko for now & future.


Benkovic is only linked to Celtic via a swap deal with us, no other linked clubs, he also didn't really get rave reviews from Bristol City supporters on his loan either so on that evidence Ajer is the better prospect no :dunno:
 

He did look pretty awful during his spell in Bristol. Slow, lacking in confidence, unfit and I hate to say it looked out of his depth.

 

Probably just rustiness and I imagine my expectations were a tad inflated from the rave reviews he got in Scotland but he was very disappointing. 

 

However If the stories are true re Rodgers being willing to offload maybe Benko actually just isn't very good. Who knows. 

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