Railway strikes?

[Unabomber]

2 hours ago, Apollo said:

The pay rise they're asking for is a joke, Mick Lynch and his mob are a horrible lot

Wow

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

3 hours ago, Alfie.meadsy said:

I don’t get the Privatisation of the railways. Because they should be providing a public service and putting all the money back into the Railway. Went on EMR a few times seats are always awful in terms of being clean. When I used to travel on the previous operator (East Midlands Trains) it never happened.  

 

EMR are definitely one of the country's better efforts too from my experience. I'm sure plenty of here if local to Leicester will have used CrossCountry at some point, dire. The Brum - Stansted service is insane let alone the one that starts and ends in Leicester.

 

TransPennine up here and Avanti West Coast are catastrophic n all. EMR streets ahead.

Edited 28 December 2022 by Miquel The Work Geordie

[Alfie.meadsy]

7 minutes ago, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

 

EMR are definitely one of the country's better efforts too from my experience. I'm sure plenty of here if local to Leicester will have used CrossCountry at some point, dire. The Brum - Stansted service is insane let alone the one that starts and ends in Leicester.

 

TransPennine up here and Avanti West Coast are catastrophic n all. EMR streets ahead.

I use that Cross Country service to get to the Leicester games it is always a nightmare…

[Alfie.meadsy]

8 minutes ago, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

 

EMR are definitely one of the country's better efforts too from my experience. I'm sure plenty of here if local to Leicester will have used CrossCountry at some point, dire. The Brum - Stansted service is insane let alone the one that starts and ends in Leicester.

 

TransPennine up here and Avanti West Coast are catastrophic n all. EMR streets ahead.

I don’t get what happened Virgin where brilliant and then Avanti came in and made it one of the worst train companies…

[Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot]

8 minutes ago, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

 

EMR are definitely one of the country's better efforts too from my experience. I'm sure plenty of here if local to Leicester will have used CrossCountry at some point, dire. The Brum - Stansted service is insane let alone the one that starts and ends in Leicester.

 

TransPennine up here and Avanti West Coast are catastrophic n all. EMR streets ahead.

My main issue with emr is if they have a train on to London from Nottingham, which is the one I get because it stops at Leicester, they'll have, say, 7 coaches and 3 of them are first class, with about 5-15 people in them, overall, yet the back 4 coaches are absolutely rammed. Never made sense to me. 

[CosbehFox]

15 minutes ago, Alfie.meadsy said:

I don’t get what happened Virgin where brilliant and then Avanti came in and made it one of the worst train companies…

Yep and the directors at Avanti been granted a bonus this winter for good performance 

[Alfie.meadsy]

6 minutes ago, CosbehFox said:

Yep and the directors at Avanti been granted a bonus this winter for good performance 

It is mad honesty. They get bonuses while the service and staff suffer….

[Sly]

If I own a business. I’m in it to make money.

 

I’ll offer my employees terms and conditions that are within law but what I perceive to be a good remuneration package. 
 

If they don’t agree with that, they’re free to leave. If I offer you amended terms to your original agreement, then that for me is altering your contract and your free to take redundancy if you don’t accept it. 
 

I don’t agree with striking action in any form. You’re paid to do a job is my opinion. 

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

40 minutes ago, Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot said:

My main issue with emr is if they have a train on to London from Nottingham, which is the one I get because it stops at Leicester, they'll have, say, 7 coaches and 3 of them are first class, with about 5-15 people in them, overall, yet the back 4 coaches are absolutely rammed. Never made sense to me. 

 

Yeah I used to do Notts - Leics daily and don't necessarily disagree with the amount of first class seating, but treat yourself brother and get a First! 

[Milo]

2 hours ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Cheers Deb.

 

Without boring you all with all the details it's essentially reskilling a lot of us, asking us to have individual rosters, working more nights, more weekends, reducing team sizes, new contracts for new starters or on promotion (on worse money in general and on worse money for working nights and weekends), 12 hour shifts becoming 8, meaning more shifts every 6 weeks. I already do 3 weekends in 6 and mostly night shifts, I don't want to do anymore. There's plenty of other things as well.

 

I'm not really fussed about most of these changes, they'll never work, I've waited years for certain courses, if they introduce 2 different disciplines into my skills matrix then all I'll be doing is re-doing courses for 4 months out of 12, as there's so many. This was how it was years ago and it was changed because it was inefficient and ineffective. The Government is using the 'Modernisation' terms to the public, but it's essentially attacking terms and conditions.

 

That's why the deal has been rejected, if they offered us 2% but said you can keep your terms and conditions then we'd happily sign up to it.

 

I don't really agree with the politics that gets brought into it and consider myself centre to slightly right rather than far left which seems to stem from the RMT.

 

@Milo I missed your other post, what options do you think are open to us? We've essentially been told either you accept or the changing are coming in anyway, and that's what they're trying, consultation has started and the documents have been sent out, voluntary redundancies are occurring in March (3.3k applied for it, only around 800 are getting it, which shows how many employees want out)

 

Striking is the last option, and we've been in pay talks for years. When you walk into a room and NR just say no, no payrise, goodbye, what else could we do? Striking so far has got us a few improvements on the original offer, we'd have never have got them without striking sadly.

 

Also the deal for the TOCs was agreed, it was ready to be signed then the Government wanted to insert Driver Only Operation into the deal, which they knew was never going to be accepted. I think they're doing it on purpose, not sure why though, very strange.

 

Not everyone is on 50k a year, train drivers yeah, they are, but your average bloke on the tools on track isn't earning 60k, he's on a 23k-30k salary, has a 24/7 shift pattern, works 3 weekends in 6 and works mostly nights. It's also a lot of responsibility, essentially one mistake can kill us, one wrong call can lead you into serious trouble, one bad day at work and you could have killed passengers on a train and be facing years in prison.

 

EDIT: Also forgot to say they want to reduce maintenance that we do by 50%, which from a safety point of view is absolutely mental, but as usual, boots on the ground won't be listened to and sadly we'll end up with another train accident where hopefully no-one is hurt, which it'll then revert back to exactly how it is now.

Great reply to an emotive topic.

 

You do what you need do...is what you should do.

 

I maybe have a slightly skewed and biased opinion of the hierarchy of the RMT. in my defence this is borne out by being in and around them for many many years. Personally, I don't like what they stand for (again, for clarity, and before the nutters bombard me it is just the hierarchy of the RMT that I disagree with, not all and any trade unions).  

 

But - they don't represent me. 

 

Their actions do, however, effect me.

 

In a couple of thousand ways (and counting). 

 

Anyway, we're in an odd time, things are a bit mad and people are feeling the strain. 

 

 

[grobyfox1990]

1 hour ago, Sly said:

If I own a business. I’m in it to make money.

 

I’ll offer my employees terms and conditions that are within law but what I perceive to be a good remuneration package. 
 

If they don’t agree with that, they’re free to leave. If I offer you amended terms to your original agreement, then that for me is altering your contract and your free to take redundancy if you don’t accept it. 
 

I don’t agree with striking action in any form. You’re paid to do a job is my opinion. 

And I completely agree with you if the supply of employees outstrips demand. In my game we are very often told there’s a queue of suckers waiting to take your seat so shut the f4ck up and come in in Sunday whether it’s your mums birthday or not tw4tface. Not quite the same in public services in the uk I’d imagine. And if it was, they wouldn’t be on strike, they’d all be replaced 

[grobyfox1990]

3 hours ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Cheers Deb.

 

Without boring you all with all the details it's essentially reskilling a lot of us, asking us to have individual rosters, working more nights, more weekends, reducing team sizes, new contracts for new starters or on promotion (on worse money in general and on worse money for working nights and weekends), 12 hour shifts becoming 8, meaning more shifts every 6 weeks. I already do 3 weekends in 6 and mostly night shifts, I don't want to do anymore. There's plenty of other things as well.

 

I'm not really fussed about most of these changes, they'll never work, I've waited years for certain courses, if they introduce 2 different disciplines into my skills matrix then all I'll be doing is re-doing courses for 4 months out of 12, as there's so many. This was how it was years ago and it was changed because it was inefficient and ineffective. The Government is using the 'Modernisation' terms to the public, but it's essentially attacking terms and conditions.

 

That's why the deal has been rejected, if they offered us 2% but said you can keep your terms and conditions then we'd happily sign up to it.

 

I don't really agree with the politics that gets brought into it and consider myself centre to slightly right rather than far left which seems to stem from the RMT.

 

@Milo I missed your other post, what options do you think are open to us? We've essentially been told either you accept or the changing are coming in anyway, and that's what they're trying, consultation has started and the documents have been sent out, voluntary redundancies are occurring in March (3.3k applied for it, only around 800 are getting it, which shows how many employees want out)

 

Striking is the last option, and we've been in pay talks for years. When you walk into a room and NR just say no, no payrise, goodbye, what else could we do? Striking so far has got us a few improvements on the original offer, we'd have never have got them without striking sadly.

 

Also the deal for the TOCs was agreed, it was ready to be signed then the Government wanted to insert Driver Only Operation into the deal, which they knew was never going to be accepted. I think they're doing it on purpose, not sure why though, very strange.

 

Not everyone is on 50k a year, train drivers yeah, they are, but your average bloke on the tools on track isn't earning 60k, he's on a 23k-30k salary, has a 24/7 shift pattern, works 3 weekends in 6 and works mostly nights. It's also a lot of responsibility, essentially one mistake can kill us, one wrong call can lead you into serious trouble, one bad day at work and you could have killed passengers on a train and be facing years in prison.

 

EDIT: Also forgot to say they want to reduce maintenance that we do by 50%, which from a safety point of view is absolutely mental, but as usual, boots on the ground won't be listened to and sadly we'll end up with another train accident where hopefully no-one is hurt, which it'll then revert back to exactly how it is now.

Great post. Please keep us up to date! 

[Legend_in_blue]

It no longer surprises me that the media continue to focus on pay in these disputes rather than workers rights.  The govt will continue to encourage this in an effort to turn the public against the unions and public sector workers.

 

Mick Lynch is absolutely right.  It's not just about pay, it's about workers rights and the erosion of these over time as the govt continues to make cuts to all aspects of public service.  There is nothing left to cut and people have had enough.  

 

Public services should not be run as businesses - but that in itself is where all current issues stem from.

 

 

[fuchsntf]

5 hours ago, Apollo said:

The pay rise they're asking for is a joke, Mick Lynch and his mob are a horrible lot

So are the politicians & mean money grabbing businessmen..in fact a lot worse.!!

[ozleicester]

Unless you are a business owner who employs others to work for you, i am amazed that anyone doesnt support unions and strike action.

Yes it will cause some difficulties and frustration, but it is the ONLY power a worker has, that is to withdraw their labor.

If the rail and other strikes are supported and succeed... YOU will benefit too, their struggle and success will flow on to your workplace.

 

[Hollism]

Haven’t been on a train in years. Ended up going back to someone’s after the work Christmas party, walk of shame the next morning to the train station, waited in the freezing cold to then figure out the time I’d looked up online was actually showing the next available train the next morning.

 

Fuming. Was a long bloody bus ride. She weren’t worth it.

[fox_up_north]

Trains, like the NHS, are clinging on for dear life and seem to be held together with hope and elbow grease. 

 

They should just nationalise it and have minimum standards. Can't remember the last time I got a train that was on time. Plus, the idea that you can have competition on the railways is folly, as they're single tracks. 

 

I'd rather trains be crap and at least run by Britain than be crap and shareholders in Germany get millions. 

[Leicester_Loyal]

11 minutes ago, fox_up_north said:

I'd rather trains be crap and at least run by Britain than be crap and shareholders in Germany get millions. 

British Rail was renowned, our railways today are a joke.

 

Most of us accept that there isn't a lot of money, and rightly so pennies need to be counted, but they're saying this whilst shareholders of TOCs earn millions, and they pay contracting firms (not the actual contracting lads, they're on a few quid more an hour), 5x our hourly wage, every day. Money is being filtered off into pockets somewhere, it's corrupt.

[yorkie1999]

14 hours ago, Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot said:

My main issue with emr is if they have a train on to London from Nottingham, which is the one I get because it stops at Leicester, they'll have, say, 7 coaches and 3 of them are first class, with about 5-15 people in them, overall, yet the back 4 coaches are absolutely rammed. Never made sense to me. 

What deodorant are you using?

[Bordersfox]

5 hours ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

British Rail was renowned, our railways today are a joke.

 

Most of us accept that there isn't a lot of money, and rightly so pennies need to be counted, but they're saying this whilst shareholders of TOCs earn millions, and they pay contracting firms (not the actual contracting lads, they're on a few quid more an hour), 5x our hourly wage, every day. Money is being filtered off into pockets somewhere, it's corrupt.

Your last sentence is entirely accurate.  

 

Pennies need to be counted other than when it's bailing out bankers, spunking obscene money on utterly failed track and trace and dodgy PPE supplied by Hancock's mate down the pub etc etc 

 

We still haven't got to grips with the offshore tax dodgers, non dom's and the like.  The number of billionaires in the UK is up 20% since the pandemic - were they on the front line providing vital services, were they fvck.  Yet we are told by the right wing media the problem is ordinary working people trying to get a decent pay rise.

 

What really saddens me is when other ordinary hard working people fall for this cornucopia of dogshit.  

[Bordersfox]

13 hours ago, ozleicester said:

Unless you are a business owner who employs others to work for you, i am amazed that anyone doesnt support unions and strike action.

Yes it will cause some difficulties and frustration, but it is the ONLY power a worker has, that is to withdraw their labor.

If the rail and other strikes are supported and succeed... YOU will benefit too, their struggle and success will flow on to your workplace.

 

I am a business owner who employs others.  I fully support the strikes.  Yes it's a pain in the arse but what else can they do like you say.  

 

Ultimately we all benefit from properly paid workers for a whole raft of reasons from general happiness, lower crime and so on. 

 

If you want to look at it selfishly these are the sorts of people who will not be hoarding their extra money, like the wealthy do, but spending it on essentials - thus pumping more money back into the economy which badly needs a shot in the arm.  

[Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot]

2 hours ago, yorkie1999 said:

What deodorant are you using?

What? 😂

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

23 minutes ago, Bordersfox said:

What really saddens me is when other ordinary hard working people fall for this cornucopia of dogshit.

I saw Cornucopia of Dogshit at the Charlotte in 1987. They were crap.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

25 minutes ago, Bordersfox said:

What really saddens me is when other ordinary hard working people fall for this cornucopia of dogshit.

Divide and rule works, I'm afraid.

[Houdini Logic]

18 hours ago, Sly said:

If I own a business. I’m in it to make money.

 

I’ll offer my employees terms and conditions that are within law but what I perceive to be a good remuneration package. 
 

If they don’t agree with that, they’re free to leave. If I offer you amended terms to your original agreement, then that for me is altering your contract and your free to take redundancy if you don’t accept it. 
 

I don’t agree with striking action in any form. You’re paid to do a job is my opinion. 

But why should an employer be able to alter your terms? That's kind of the point. It's a written agreement. Employees aren't allowed to change it as they please, so why should the employer be able to?