Leicester at risk of another Premier League PSR charge over latest accounts

[Lcfcwigstonblue]

23 minutes ago, StonyFox said:

The fact we don't seem to be close to bringing any players in yet makes me think it's close, and the club aren't 100% sure on whether we have breached or not.

 

Chelsea have sold hotels and their womens team to themselves, the latter for £150m apparently! Our women's team isn't worth that much, but surely we could have sold it for £10-15m to cover the estimated £12m breach. 

Not sure why we haven’t sold Belvoir drive to King Power Racing 

[st albans fox]

I think Swiss ramble will struggle to predict our wage bill for last season. Some players will have been on a 30% reduction, some won’t. 

[Tommy G]

35 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

No chance this happens. Only a very small group of people would be privy to our accounts in full, and it would suicidal for someone to reveal such sensitive data for a cheat pay off. It would become obvious very quickly who would have done it.

This

 

Literally cant believe what I'm reading on this forum sometimes.

 

What is also in the public domain is a full set of accounts, and depsite being a full set they don't disclose enough information to make an informed decision on PSR anyway. Plus it's a year out of date!!

[coolhandfox]

Important things to keep in mind with the Swiss Ramble article.

 

 

First paragrah

 

It’s quite difficult to forecast Leicester financials, as they were relegated from the Premier League to the Championship at the end of 2022/23, exacerbated by the fact that the previous season covered 13 months.

 

Ramble uses the terms assumed and guesstimate on two key elements.

 

On that basis, broadcasting income will more than halve from £115m to £52m, while I have assumed that commercial will fall by a third from £44m to £30m (still on the high side for the Championship).

 

Wages should have substantially fallen from a very high £205m in the top flight to a “guesstimated” £95m. This would still be one of the highest in the Championship, though it will include a promotion bonus of around £20m.

 

This analysis is built on a lengthy list of assumptions, but it seems to me that Leicester City are the Premier League club most at risk of failing PSR

 

He has us fail PSR by 12m.

 

I would say he could be easily 20m out ether way.

 

[Babylon]

1 hour ago, SouthStandUpperTier said:

But we have already had to submit our 23/24 accounts to the PL, along with Everton, Forest and Chelsea I believe. So I guess some figures could be being leaked out to journos with good contacts.

And as I said, if that was the case I don't think you'd see the language we are seeing... "Estimates", "Maybe", "Potentially", "Could".

[Number 6]

1 hour ago, StonyFox said:

The fact we don't seem to be close to bringing any players in yet makes me think it's close, and the club aren't 100% sure on whether we have breached or not.

 

Chelsea have sold hotels and their womens team to themselves, the latter for £150m apparently! Our women's team isn't worth that much, but surely we could have sold it for £10-15m to cover the estimated £12m breach. 

It's going to be close whatever the result but these are different periods; we've got a -£90m dropping off for the latest period, even the SR projection which has us breaching suggests we could be approx. -£80m this year and comply. 

 

We'd potentially be in the dangerous position of getting a points deduction but having headroom to gamble on buying players to stay up.

 

Lack of January transfers points to issues in our recruitment process rather than a PSR breach.

Edited 8 January by Number 6

[dannythefox]

6 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Important things to keep in mind with the Swiss Ramble article.

 

 

First paragrah

 

It’s quite difficult to forecast Leicester financials, as they were relegated from the Premier League to the Championship at the end of 2022/23, exacerbated by the fact that the previous season covered 13 months.

 

Ramble uses the terms assumed and guesstimate on two key elements.

 

On that basis, broadcasting income will more than halve from £115m to £52m, while I have assumed that commercial will fall by a third from £44m to £30m (still on the high side for the Championship).

 

Wages should have substantially fallen from a very high £205m in the top flight to a “guesstimated” £95m. This would still be one of the highest in the Championship, though it will include a promotion bonus of around £20m.

 

This analysis is built on a lengthy list of assumptions, but it seems to me that Leicester City are the Premier League club most at risk of failing PSR

 

He has us fail PSR by 12m.

 

I would say he could be easily 20m out ether way.

 

Someone will do very well to guess the 12m when there’s a lot of info they’re unsure of. I’d be disappointed after selling KDH we’re still going to break the rules. Also basically just shitting on every manager we employ through these times because any point deduction 100% we won’t stay up, hardly fair on any manager we bring in. Whoever is to blame must be dealt with the club been in a bad state since Vichi passed.

[Babylon]

12 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Important things to keep in mind with the Swiss Ramble article.

 

 

First paragrah

 

It’s quite difficult to forecast Leicester financials, as they were relegated from the Premier League to the Championship at the end of 2022/23, exacerbated by the fact that the previous season covered 13 months.

 

Ramble uses the terms assumed and guesstimate on two key elements.

 

On that basis, broadcasting income will more than halve from £115m to £52m, while I have assumed that commercial will fall by a third from £44m to £30m (still on the high side for the Championship).

 

Wages should have substantially fallen from a very high £205m in the top flight to a “guesstimated” £95m. This would still be one of the highest in the Championship, though it will include a promotion bonus of around £20m.

 

This analysis is built on a lengthy list of assumptions, but it seems to me that Leicester City are the Premier League club most at risk of failing PSR

 

He has us fail PSR by 12m.

 

I would say he could be easily 20m out ether way.

 

Ha.. rather important context. Basically everything is guess work still and as you say, it could be pretty much anything good or bad. 

[HankMarvin]

6 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Ha.. rather important context. Basically everything is guess work still and as you say, it could be pretty much anything good or bad. 

Question for you, when the club extended accounts to 13 months which obviously includes an additional 12th of total wages and operating costs.

Is the next set of accounts only 11 months or is the 13th month included on the next set of accounts as 12 months?

 

“As the change was made to align the club's accounting with the rest of its business. The 13th month had an impact on the club's accounts in a number of ways: 

Expenses: The club's wage bill increased by £24 million, player amortisation rose by £5 million, and other expenses increased by £4 million”

[Lambert09]

20 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

It's going to be close whatever the result but these aredDifferent periods; we've got a -£90m dropping off for the latest period, even the SR projection which has us breaching suggests we could be approx. -£80m this year and comply. 

 

We'd potentially be in the dangerous position of getting a points deduction but having headroom to gamble on buying players to stay up.

 

Lack of January transfers points to issues in our recruitment process rather than a PSR breach.

Or there’s a possibility that if we get a points deduction the club will sign players with a long term aim rather than a plug the gap right back good for this season only etc. 

Edited 8 January by Lambert09

[Number 6]

Just now, Lambert09 said:

Or there’s a possibility that if we get a points deduction the club will sign players with a long term aim rather than a plug the gap right back good for them his season only etc. 

Definitely if there was to be a really hefty deduction. Though if we were going with the long term strategy then I think you'd wait until the summer.

[RonnieTodger]

The Swiss Ramble really need a logo

[Claudio Fannieri]

3 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Swiss Ramble is the best of the best but I do wonder if the training ground sponsorship has been picked up by all these financial experts trying to project potential figures.

I thought that was announced after the accounting deadline so was effective for this season rather than last, but maybe wrong

[stb1996]

18 minutes ago, HankMarvin said:

Question for you, when the club extended accounts to 13 months which obviously includes an additional 12th of total wages and operating costs.

Is the next set of accounts only 11 months or is the 13th month included on the next set of accounts as 12 months?

 

“As the change was made to align the club's accounting with the rest of its business. The 13th month had an impact on the club's accounts in a number of ways: 

Expenses: The club's wage bill increased by £24 million, player amortisation rose by £5 million, and other expenses increased by £4 million”

I believe it'll be 12 months going forward, but our accounting date will always be end of July rather than June. So the 12 month period has shifted back by a month, and we had the one 13th month period to bridge the gap

[Globalfox]

The reality is no one knows and there are so many moving parts unless you see a copy of what the club submitted you never will. The last 2 sets of accounts had us at losses of 181million. PSR allows certain deductions. I think that with the deductions and the KDH sale it probably came just below the 105 million. This year TV income will be up so maybe it’s going to be tight or they are predicting a sale. What has been submitted is a predictive set of accounts so maybe they are stretching the prediction. Of course they may still claim we were not part of the EPL so last year not to be included. It’s definitely a tight rope.

[HybridFox]

It's not football anymore 🎵

[ClaphamFox]

The Mercury has finally picked up the story. The good news: the article claims that the sale of KDH will count towards the 2021-24 revenue. The not so good news: it reckons our allowable losses for the period will be £83m, not £105m.

 

https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/what-ruud-van-nistelrooy-wants-9846388

Edited 8 January by ClaphamFox

[Skidmark]

Like I said a few weeks ago.

 

Nothing to worry about. Certain transfers are included in these accounts that cover the PSR. 
 

Club is confident as they know they're okay. The Enzo pay out and the staff pay out was a surprise 10m in the back pocket that helped. 
 

KDH deal was agreed before too as both clubs needed to for PSR, just announced later. 
 

The club in a mess is Chelsea. 

[Spudulike]

Seems to follow Enzo around. Probably get mardy again and say that he wasn't told.

[Pliskin]

13 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

The Mercury has finally picked up the story. The good news: the article claims that the sale of KDH will count towards the 2021-24 revenue. The not so good news: it reckons our allowable losses for the period will be £83m, not £105m.

 

https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/what-ruud-van-nistelrooy-wants-9846388

What have other promoted teams allowable losses been in the past? 

[The_77]

1 hour ago, coolhandfox said:

Important things to keep in mind with the Swiss Ramble article.

 

 

First paragrah

 

It’s quite difficult to forecast Leicester financials, as they were relegated from the Premier League to the Championship at the end of 2022/23, exacerbated by the fact that the previous season covered 13 months.

 

Ramble uses the terms assumed and guesstimate on two key elements.

 

On that basis, broadcasting income will more than halve from £115m to £52m, while I have assumed that commercial will fall by a third from £44m to £30m (still on the high side for the Championship).

 

Wages should have substantially fallen from a very high £205m in the top flight to a “guesstimated” £95m. This would still be one of the highest in the Championship, though it will include a promotion bonus of around £20m.

 

This analysis is built on a lengthy list of assumptions, but it seems to me that Leicester City are the Premier League club most at risk of failing PSR

 

He has us fail PSR by 12m.

 

I would say he could be easily 20m out ether way.

 

I’m not so confident in his guesstimate that our wage bill was reduced by more than 50% in the Championship…

[HankMarvin]

1 minute ago, Pliskin said:

What have other promoted teams allowable losses been in the past? 

It’s not this seasons accounts 

[Bert]

1 minute ago, The_77 said:

I’m not so confident in his guesstimate that our wage bill was reduced by more than 50% in the Championship…

I wouldn’t be surprised. Maddison, Tielemans, Evans, Soyuncu, Amartey, Barnes, Perez, Castagne & Bertrand off the wage bill with everyone else taking a pay cut who stayed, along with Rodgers who was on huge amounts also coming off…. 

[coolhandfox]

39 minutes ago, The_77 said:

I’m not so confident in his guesstimate that our wage bill was reduced by more than 50% in the Championship…

It don't know, it could be more it could be less.

 

Unless you have the accounts in front of you its plain guess work.

 

Edited 8 January by coolhandfox

[coolhandfox]

There seem to be a narrative amongst a group of City fans that RVN will be kept in the dark by the club with regards to PSR when he agreed to become manager.

 

He's was a team mate of Enzo and clearly stated they had had conversations about the City job, I pretty sure Enzo would have gave Ruud a good idea of how the clubs works.

Edited 8 January by coolhandfox