General News Thread

[Bellend Sebastian]

1 hour ago, Salisbury Fox said:

I have seen this posted numerous times on here about the Dublin Convention and not just by you and so not trying having a go at you. The evidence shows that it didn’t really stack up when we were in the EU and I would suggest that it certainly wouldn’t now if we had remained.

 

 

Obviously it's impossible that Andrew Neil would ever be ignorant of the facts or knowingly lie, but what he's done here is made the reader think that because small numbers of asylum seekers were returned under the Dublin agreement then its lapsing under Brexit couldn't possibly be the reason why there was a sudden massive increase in people seeking asylum here immediately afterwards. 

 

It's like decriminalising murder because not that many people get convicted of it, then moaning when suddenly there seem to be a lot more murders than there were before

[Heathrow fox]

3 hours ago, CornwallFox said:

In reality though, he tried to means test the winter fuel payment, which actually is fair enough, probably could've been a higher cut off point but they were using the pension credit cut off point to mean zero admin costs.

 

75% of farms sold last year were sold to institutional investors over farmers, which was targeted by inheritance tax. 

 

And he called out people threatening to burn down hotels as far right. 

 

Beyond that, nothing good they've done has been reported and the right wing media has been ridiculous. 

 

He's not done much wrong. The state of the country after the Tories will take a while to fix. What did people expect? 

 

It's utterly crazy he's that disliked, mainly based on the use of social media bots and lies. 

Starmer promised growth during the election campaign.He made it the main pledge.So far we have had very little if any improvement and already know it’s going to be slow for the foreseeable.

So for that they have failed.

 

It’s not just the usual suspects who are critical.He is just as unpopular on what is now called the left wing of our society.That includes Blue Labour.The Workers Party and a whole host of progressive LW social media platforms.

 

It’s the lack of positivity that stands out.Andy Burnham has come to the fore recently as a possible replacement.Not his biggest fan but at least he would bring some bloody energy.Instead all we have to look forward to is Wes Streeting 

 

[Jon the Hat]

Feels like Starmer has a lot of the attributes to be an excellent MP, just not enough of them to be an excellent PM.  He is clearly smart, has some good ideas, but lacks TV Charisma to sell them (it's quite different to personal Charisma), the conviction to stick to them, and the political savvy to realise what will fly and what won't.

 

Farage on the other hand has a few good ideas, many terrible ones, but seems to know instinctively which ones fly, comes across far better on TV (but probably worse in Person), and also has the help of some nasty algorithms which appear to show people the only the bits they agree with. 

Edited 2 October 2025 by Jon the Hat

[CornwallFox]

3 hours ago, Heathrow fox said:

Starmer promised growth during the election campaign.He made it the main pledge.So far we have had very little if any improvement and already know it’s going to be slow for the foreseeable.

So for that they have failed.

 

It’s not just the usual suspects who are critical.He is just as unpopular on what is now called the left wing of our society.That includes Blue Labour.The Workers Party and a whole host of progressive LW social media platforms.

 

It’s the lack of positivity that stands out.Andy Burnham has come to the fore recently as a possible replacement.Not his biggest fan but at least he would bring some bloody energy.Instead all we have to look forward to is Wes Streeting 

 

Fair enough comment on the lack of energy and positivity in the first year. I think he was trying to get people to be realistic but maybe a more expensive initial package of positive changes would've been better to show a fresh start for the country. 

 

On growth, in fairness it takes 18 months for government policy to show results generally. Their last budget/spending review initiated something like £100bn in investments which you would expect to lead to growth, and GB energy should also create growth as it expands. They just need time to show through in the real world. 

 

I think the one fundamental issue for the government is cost of living. Not just the current inflation level, but inflation over the last 5 years is a combined 20+% and we all know food and energy prices are massively up in comparison to wages. You would think labour could've taken more direct action to force price reductions (given profits have soared a threat of windfall taxes on supermarkets would be a good start) as even the status quo isn't good enough.

Edited 2 October 2025 by CornwallFox

[CornwallFox]

4 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

Feels like Starmer has a lot of the attributes to be an excellent MP, just not enough of them to be an excellent PM.  He is clearly smart, has some good ideas, but lacks TV Charisma to sell them (it's quite different to personal Charisma), the conviction to stick to them, and the political savvy to realise what will fly and what won't.

 

Farage on the other hand has a few good ideas, many terrible ones, but seems to know instinctively which ones fly, comes across far better on TV (but probably worse in Person), and also has the help of some nasty algorithms which appear to show people the only the bits they agree with. 

I had high hopes for starmar, maybe you're right and he can't overcome this lack of ability to connect. I hope for all our sakes he can though!

[Jon the Hat]

16 hours ago, Vowels said:

AI? Or staffed?

 

If staffed, who is going to staff it once all the immigrants have been sent 'home' ?

All the medical professionals who are fed up with meeting the public / patients and who would otherwise quit the NHS?

[Jon the Hat]

Just now, CornwallFox said:

I had high hopes for starmar, maybe you're right and he can't overcome this lack of ability to connect. I hope for all our sakes he can though!

Sadly I think you either have it or you don't.

[Greg2607]

11 hours ago, Parafox said:

When was the last time there was a decent, honourable, fair, effective, non self serving , well meaning, pro-populace government?

 

Looking back over my voting life of 40 plus years, I really can't think of one.

My personal view, is that the whole mechanism of party politics, doesn't serve the population. 

 

The discourse and point scoring and pointing out of all flaws, just leads to a population that doesn't have a positive view of government. 

 

I don't see it ever changing in that regard. 

 

I would however like to see some form of PR. at least that way all of the good ideas should come to the surface and have a greater chance of becoming reality. 

 

Nearly all of the major parties have valid ideas. But there is no space in our politics for these to be discussed.  It's a very "all or nothing" approach with FPTP.  

 

and where generally between half and two thirds of people don't vote for the party in charge, they feel disenfranchised. 

 

It all needs tearing up and staring again. 

[Zear0]

9 hours ago, Heathrow fox said:

Starmer promised growth during the election campaign.He made it the main pledge.So far we have had very little if any improvement and already know it’s going to be slow for the foreseeable.

So for that they have failed.

 

It’s not just the usual suspects who are critical.He is just as unpopular on what is now called the left wing of our society.That includes Blue Labour.The Workers Party and a whole host of progressive LW social media platforms.

 

It’s the lack of positivity that stands out.Andy Burnham has come to the fore recently as a possible replacement.Not his biggest fan but at least he would bring some bloody energy.Instead all we have to look forward to is Wes Streeting 

 

This the UK with the strongest growth in the G7? 

[Dr The Singh]

11 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

This the UK with the strongest growth in the G7? 

Counteracted by the highest inflation of the G7 and growth has dropped and forecast from being Conservative and going to Labour.

Edited 2 October 2025 by Dr The Singh

[Dr The Singh]

12 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

This the UK with the strongest growth in the G7? 

Wait till November budget and watch the economy tank

[CosbehFox]

9 hours ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

Obviously it's impossible that Andrew Neil would ever be ignorant of the facts or knowingly lie, but what he's done here is made the reader think that because small numbers of asylum seekers were returned under the Dublin agreement then its lapsing under Brexit couldn't possibly be the reason why there was a sudden massive increase in people seeking asylum here immediately afterwards. 

 

It's like decriminalising murder because not that many people get convicted of it, then moaning when suddenly there seem to be a lot more murders than there were before

Someone pointed out very well in the replies

 

https://x.com/dolandeclares/status/1973343842876453305

Edited 2 October 2025 by CosbehFox

[CosbehFox]

Some nuance to the dominating topic of the last 3 months  

Edited 2 October 2025 by CosbehFox

[Vowels]

28 minutes ago, CosbehFox said:

Some nuance to the dominating topic of the last 3 months  

* that they know about.

[CosbehFox]

5 minutes ago, Vowels said:

* that they know about.

Which has been the case since the data was captured within that graph. 

[Tommy G]

7 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

Feels like Starmer has a lot of the attributes to be an excellent MP, just not enough of them to be an excellent PM.  He is clearly smart, has some good ideas, but lacks TV Charisma to sell them (it's quite different to personal Charisma), the conviction to stick to them, and the political savvy to realise what will fly and what won't.

 

Farage on the other hand has a few good ideas, many terrible ones, but seems to know instinctively which ones fly, comes across far better on TV (but probably worse in Person), and also has the help of some nasty algorithms which appear to show people the only the bits they agree with. 

Starmer is just very uncharismatic, lacks identity and has managed to alienate a lot of his own party and support already - he's picked weak cabinet apart from Wes Streeting - I thought he was awful at the start  but he's really impressed me since.

 

 

[Robo61]

14 hours ago, CornwallFox said:

Difference is the rate of change. 

A slow increase recently is not the same as the spike under Truss, which never really came back down, hence a small increase now being called record.

We also forget that spike would have significantly higher had she not resigned.

[Tommy G]

7 hours ago, CornwallFox said:

I had high hopes for starmar, maybe you're right and he can't overcome this lack of ability to connect. I hope for all our sakes he can though!

Compare him to both Blair and Cameron - so we have a balanced view. Both had energy, charisma and strong leadership despite what you thought of their political stance (no need to reply about the Iraq War or Brexit, thats not what my point is). 

 

Starmer doesn't have it. Andy Burnham or Wes Streeting are both ahead of him in that regard.

[st albans fox]

If the effects of us leaving the Dublin convention were so obvious re illegal migration to our shores, why did no one on the remain side shout about it ?  I mean even a couple of percent of changed minds would have made all the difference!  
 

or did no one on the remain side envisage the issue snowballing as it has  (in which case it would be harsh to blame the brexiteers for not seeing it either).  It would be an unforeseen consequence. 

[leicsmac]

Perhaps it's rose-tinted specs, but in terms of actual progress in required areas to help people who need or needed to be helped, pre-Iraq Blair government was easily the best of the last roughly fifty years. Had the right blueprint and the charisma to get the public on board with it. 

 

But moving onto the present day, we're in a different era. Politics seems so much more fast food right now, thanks to instant digital solutions in some places people then expect instant solutions everywhere else too. 

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

If the effects of us leaving the Dublin convention were so obvious re illegal migration to our shores, why did no one on the remain side shout about it ?  I mean even a couple of percent of changed minds would have made all the difference!  
 

or did no one on the remain side envisage the issue snowballing as it has  (in which case it would be harsh to blame the brexiteers for not seeing it either).  It would be an unforeseen consequence. 

Two thoughts about that:

 

- given the way the campaign played out, I'm not sure that anything the Remain side would have said on the matter would have made much difference 

 

- I'm inclined to think that unforeseen consequences are so consequences and do lie with the people who created the situation in which they were capable of happening only. 

[st albans fox]

7 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Two thoughts about that:

 

- given the way the campaign played out, I'm not sure that anything the Remain side would have said on the matter would have made much difference 

 

- I'm inclined to think that unforeseen consequences are so consequences and do lie with the people who created the situation in which they were capable of happening only. 

I’ve just been down a brexit rabbit hole and Cameron did warn that the Calais camps would be effectively moved to Folkestone without the protection of the existing EU agreements.  So the message was there but clearly it wasn’t made effectively. 
 

your point 1 is relevant here. 

Edited 2 October 2025 by st albans fox

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

I’ve just been down a brexit rabbit hole and Cameron did warn that the Calais camps would be effectively moved to Folkestone without the protection of the existing EU agreements.  So the message was there but clearly it wasn’t made effectively. 

And unfortunately that appears to be merely one of a number of matters where ineffective messaging combined with either "innocent" or wilful ignorance has led or is leading to undesirable consequences. 

[Trav Le Bleu]

1 hour ago, CosbehFox said:

Some nuance to the dominating topic of the last 3 months  

That includes legal migrants of course (who are much easier to count). One of the main effects of Brexit was essentially swapping cheap labour from Europe with cheap labour from Africa and Asia.

[bovril]

1 hour ago, CosbehFox said:

Some nuance to the dominating topic of the last 3 months  

This is quite noticeable in London and I imagine a lot of English cities in that service jobs that seemed to be done mostly by Europeans, especially Spanish, Italians and Eastern Europeans, are now almost exclusively done by Indians, to the extent that some chain cafes, supermarkets and stores like boots are staffed totally by Indians. It's a big change and I'm surprised that 'nuance' you mention is lost in the debate. The change may have happened anyway even without Brexit, since a lot of Eastern Europeans are returning home from Western Europe as their countries' economies improve. But it is always fascinating that millions of Farage curious Brits appear to see this as a 'betrayal' of Brexit.