Absolute *** of our time Pt.MXXVI

[urban.spaceman]

On 06/12/2022 at 06:05, Milo said:

RMT and the cowards that hide behind them with a second honourable mention from me. 
 

Got a problem with your employer? Boo fvcking hoo. Poor you. 

10000%.

Add to that list all the other cowards on strike or considering industrial action this year:

 

Bus workers

Freight workers

Barristers

Baristas

Telecommunications workers

Teachers

Amazon workers

Refuse workers

Firefighters

Postal workers

Nurses

Ambulance staff

Civil servants

Air travel workers

Lecturers

University staff

 

And my absolute favourite this year:

Daily Express journalists.

 

On 06/12/2022 at 06:05, Milo said:

Cost me just over a thousand pounds in November and will be about the same this month. That make you happy? 
 

Fvck off back to the seventies. 
 

Cvnts. 

I'm sorry you're out of pocket but given the list above can you not see there's clearly something wrong with the system? 

 

Nobody actually wants to strike, people strike because they're left with no other recourse.

 

Don't fall for the government's rhetoric when they're the ones you should be be blaming.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

On 06/12/2022 at 06:05, Milo said:

RMT and the cowards that hide behind them with a second honourable mention from me. 
 

Got a problem with your employer? Boo fvcking hoo. Poor you. 
 

Cost me just over a thousand pounds in November and will be about the same this month. That make you happy? 
 

Fvck off back to the seventies. 
 

Cvnts. 
 

I don't imagine they went on strike to upset you.

Although with your attitude towards their struggle I do imagine that you being so upset would be looked on as a nice little bonus.

 

Seriously though, if you're a rail passenger who doesn't want strikes, it'd be in your interests to support the workers - who also don't want strikes, by the way. If they get what they want, or any reasonable step towards it, they'll call off the strikes.

[Tommy G]

David Fuller

[Milo]

19 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

10000%.

Add to that list all the other cowards on strike or considering industrial action this year:

 

Bus workers

Freight workers

Barristers

Baristas

Telecommunications workers

Teachers

Amazon workers

Refuse workers

Firefighters

Postal workers

Nurses

Ambulance staff

Civil servants

Air travel workers

Lecturers

University staff

 

And my absolute favourite this year:

Daily Express journalists.

 

I'm sorry you're out of pocket but given the list above can you not see there's clearly something wrong with the system? 

 

Nobody actually wants to strike, people strike because they're left with no other recourse.

 

Don't fall for the government's rhetoric when they're the ones you should be be blaming.

I’m not sure why you went to the effort of writing such a long list, or assuming I’ve been duped by government rhetoric. 
 

People that work for a train company, in my opinion, shouldn’t have the ridiculously disproportionate power to grind an economy to a halt because they object to the colour of the waistcoats, or whatever the fvck their problem de jour is. 
 

 

 

[Dahnsouff]

22 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

10000%.

Add to that list all the other cowards on strike or considering industrial action this year:

 

Bus workers

Freight workers

Barristers

Baristas

Telecommunications workers

Teachers

Amazon workers

Refuse workers

Firefighters

Postal workers

Nurses

Ambulance staff

Civil servants

Air travel workers

Lecturers

University staff

 

And my absolute favourite this year:

Daily Express journalists.

 

I'm sorry you're out of pocket but given the list above can you not see there's clearly something wrong with the system? 

 

Nobody actually wants to strike, people strike because they're left with no other recourse.

 

Don't fall for the government's rhetoric when they're the ones you should be be blaming.

Sure you are right and they deserve more pay, these services are largely critical for society after all.

it’s a very difficult subject, and if they are getting a bigger pay rise over the last 10 years than a private sector worker who also contributes, who does not have a union to support them, who does not get the benefits of early retirement, shouldn’t they also get a pay rise?  Sure your answer would be yes, and quite right too!

 

But that’s not how the private sector works or usually can. Difficult topic, not that I am suggesting we should withhold from one sector to balance the other.

 

 

[Parafox]

3 hours ago, Milo said:

I’m not sure why you went to the effort of writing such a long list, or assuming I’ve been duped by government rhetoric. 
 

People that work for a train company, in my opinion, shouldn’t have the ridiculously disproportionate power to grind an economy to a halt because they object to the colour of the waistcoats, or whatever the fvck their problem de jour is. 
 

 

 

FFS really? 

 

People don't strike without decent reasons. You do know, I hope, that these people lose money and don't get paid if they're on strike?

 

It's something they're willing to commit to and lose pay for in order to get some kind of result for a decent outcome. They're not asking for a huge deal just something that is reasonable. Negotiations on either side start at the extremes and by negotiating, a mutually agreeable result can and should be found.

 

Something that IMO Thatcher never really understood.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

8 minutes ago, Parafox said:

You do know, I hope, that these people lose money and don't get paid if they're on strike?

It astounded me to discover that quite a lot of people don't seem to know this!

[Milo]

55 minutes ago, Parafox said:

FFS really? 

 

People don't strike without decent reasons. You do know, I hope, that these people lose money and don't get paid if they're on strike?

 

It's something they're willing to commit to and lose pay for in order to get some kind of result for a decent outcome. They're not asking for a huge deal just something that is reasonable. Negotiations on either side start at the extremes and by negotiating, a mutually agreeable result can and should be found.

 

Something that IMO Thatcher never really understood.

My point was for people that are striking on railways, and not all those who choose to strike. 
 

More specifically, my point was against the RMT, which I made clear. 
 

They’re cvnts, and deserve a mention in this thread. 
 

 

I have absolutely no problem if you don’t share this view. 

[Alf Bentley]

6 hours ago, Milo said:

 

People that work for a train company, in my opinion, shouldn’t have the ridiculously disproportionate power to grind an economy to a halt because they object to the colour of the waistcoats, or whatever the fvck their problem de jour is. 
 

 

I've heard no mention of the colour of waistcoats.

 

I've only paid superficial attention, but union objections I've heard include:

- Pay rises well below inflation

- Closure of ticket offices with job losses

- Contracts changed to include compulsory Sunday working

- Driver-only trains, with drivers operating carriage doors (perceived as a safety risk, as well as entailing job losses)

 

There might or might not be reasons why the unions should be flexible on some of those issues, but they certainly don't seem frivolous "problems de jour" in the way you suggest.

 

If you view the right of rail workers to strike as ridiculously disproportionate, what are you proposing instead? A genuinely neutral arbitrator? Workers obliged to accept whatever terms employers deign to offer them?

Strikes only being legal in sectors where they can have no impact on anybody would be a bit pointless.

 

As others have pointed out, workers wouldn't be willing to lose pay by striking needlessly - especially during a cost of living crisis and in the run-up to Christmas. They presumably feel that important issues are at stake - not frivolous grievances as you suggest.

[Oxfordfox83]

1 hour ago, LiberalFox said:

 

I'm not in the best mood. But I don't think people choosing to strike actually belong here no matter how much you disagree with their actions. 

That, if you’ll excuse the comparison, is a Tory level of almost apologising, then backing out of the apology and just going back to the argument on your own terms.

Edited 7 December 2022 by Oxfordfox83

[filthyfox]

I work for a Council.

My pay is worth 30% less than it was when I joined owing to inflation. 

 

This years "cost of living " increase was 6% for me=a further loss of at least 4% in wage value.

 

I do not support strikes as a means to an end.

 

I support a 3 day strike followed by a sustained, 6 month work to rule.

 

The Unions moan, yet all they offer are strikes. I cannot support this as its a weak solution.

 

So.... imagine binmen on strike for 3 days.  THEN no overtime to empty bins to catch up, and a normal working day with no extra hours attached.   THAT my friends, is anarchy.

 

The same would happen for taxi applications, pub licences, planning applications, land searches, road works, environmental health complaints.  And this could well happen next year.

[Jon the Hat]

5 hours ago, filthyfox said:

I work for a Council.

My pay is worth 30% less than it was when I joined owing to inflation. 

 

This years "cost of living " increase was 6% for me=a further loss of at least 4% in wage value.

 

I do not support strikes as a means to an end.

 

I support a 3 day strike followed by a sustained, 6 month work to rule.

 

The Unions moan, yet all they offer are strikes. I cannot support this as its a weak solution.

 

So.... imagine binmen on strike for 3 days.  THEN no overtime to empty bins to catch up, and a normal working day with no extra hours attached.   THAT my friends, is anarchy.

 

The same would happen for taxi applications, pub licences, planning applications, land searches, road works, environmental health complaints.  And this could well happen next year.

30%?  Really?  I mean this suggests you spend 100% of your income every month on the bucket of goods in the CPI calculation which is pretty weird.

[Dahnsouff]

8 hours ago, Alf Bentley said:

..

 

 

 

- Pay rises well below inflation

 

...

 

That cannot be a reason to strike at this time, however if this is off the back of this being historically underpaid/low rises over the last few years, then yes, fair enough

 

To strike at a point of high inflation and demand an above inflation payrise, when many are getting 5% at best in the economy as large, is hardly likely to raise much empathy.

[ozleicester]

8 hours ago, filthyfox said:

I work for a Council.

My pay is worth 30% less than it was when I joined owing to inflation. 

 

This years "cost of living " increase was 6% for me=a further loss of at least 4% in wage value.

 

I do not support strikes as a means to an end.

 

I support a 3 day strike followed by a sustained, 6 month work to rule.

 

The Unions moan, yet all they offer are strikes. I cannot support this as its a weak solution.

 

So.... imagine binmen on strike for 3 days.  THEN no overtime to empty bins to catch up, and a normal working day with no extra hours attached.   THAT my friends, is anarchy.

 

The same would happen for taxi applications, pub licences, planning applications, land searches, road works, environmental health complaints.  And this could well happen next year.

Step one, if you arent already-  join a Union
Step two - Vote the Tories out and NEVER let them back
Step 3 - Strike

[filthyfox]

21 minutes ago, ozleicester said:

Step one, if you arent already-  join a Union
Step two - Vote the Tories out and NEVER let them back
Step 3 - Strike

Unions are a complete bunch of wet lettuce.

As I said before, all they offer is strike action.  No more, no less 

 

I cannot vote Tory- my MP is one of the richest people in the UK, with the second largest walled estate in the country, how can he properly represent me?

 

Strikes are not the only way.  I believe in work to rule. A war of attrition that can go on indefinitely, and also ensures that those customers in the greatest need get served.  In my 18 years of Council working, ONLY strikes have been mooted.  And we actually did strike twice against the Labour Government.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

9 hours ago, filthyfox said:

So.... imagine binmen on strike for 3 days.  THEN no overtime to empty bins to catch up, and a normal working day with no extra hours attached.   THAT my friends, is anarchy.

Well, it isn't really anarchy. It's some bins taking longer to be emptied.

[kenny]

1 hour ago, ozleicester said:

Step one, if you arent already-  join a Union
Step two - Vote the Tories out and NEVER let them back
Step 3 - Strike

To clarify, you join a union.

 

You vote out the current party, I assume for a left leaning one eg labour?

 

Then go on strike anyway?

 

I can believe that some think this is the way to go.

[BKLFox]

Not many winners in any strike action least of all for those millionaires in the armed forces that will be told to pick up the slack & cancel any christmas leave they had despite being away from their families for 6-8mths of the year already

[Daggers]

On 07/12/2022 at 01:19, LiberalFox said:

Jon the Hat. 

 

On 07/12/2022 at 01:24, Jon the Hat said:

Liberal Fox.

 

[grobyfox1990]

Absolutely support all the strikes, first world country turning into a non-functioning state grinding to a halt before our eyes. Someone's got to do something about it and it's not going to be me.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

27 minutes ago, BKLFox said:

Not many winners in any strike action least of all for those millionaires in the armed forces that will be told to pick up the slack & cancel any christmas leave they had despite being away from their families for 6-8mths of the year already

Well I fully expect that some on here will be along post haste to tell them that if they have a problem with their employer, or the terms of their job, then boo-hoo, poor them, other people also have to work at Christmas don't you know, suck it up losers.

Won't they?

[Foxdiamond]

The strikes are not all about just pay but changes to working practices and cuts to jobs. Before condeming the strikers who lose pay when striking please look at the employers and this shambles of a government. 

[FoxesDeb]

1 hour ago, gerblod said:

I'm not your mate. You're well aware of that, so you're using sarcasm. A wasted word where I'm concerned.

 

You don't explain what assumptions you consider I've made in my reply to you. Do that and there's a firm basis for discussion.

 

I've no idea what "FT" is the acronym for, so I can't respond to your fifth paragraph accurately.

 

What I will state is that the RMT are, unless they're a cover for a secret cell of radical revolutionaries, just another union representing a strata of workers generally perceived as working-class - those people who are expected to work the hardest in the dirtiest and dangerous jobs for the least amount of recompense.

 

If you believe that the RMT union has a a different agenda than representing its members, then tell me what that is, and I can respond pertinently.

 

You've used the word fascist. Was that aimed at me? Let's remind ourselves of what fascism means:

 

"Fascism : a way of organizing a society in which a government ruled by a dictator controls the lives of the people and in which people are not allowed to disagree with the government."

 

Sunak proposing legislation to prevent fire service workers withdrawing their labour is, in my view, a fascistic proposal. I'd remind Sunak and any such bully boys that leaving ones job is a surefire way of withdrawing one's labour. But, with huge cost of living rises, only a fool or a wealthy person could /would do that. How many independently wealthy people are there in the RMT?

So, effectively, we're living in a country where the government is taking away our right to economic free passage by restricting our income and our right to choose not to work. What happens when a soldier is standing on the footplate of a locomotive with a rifle pointed at the driver.

Never underestimate the ruthlessness of rulers.

As for "weird" , I can live with that.

FT = FoxesTalk 

[Parafox]

1 hour ago, Manley Farrington-Brown said:

Well I fully expect that some on here will be along post haste to tell them that if they have a problem with their employer, or the terms of their job, then boo-hoo, poor them, other people also have to work at Christmas don't you know, suck it up losers.

Won't they?

Emergency service workers are not allowed leave over the Christmas period. If they want time off, they have to arrange a shift swap with someone on rest days. That's certainly my experience within EMAS.

[Daggers]

It’s like politics has infested every thread in genchat atm.

 

@Mark - why not give them a hidden, by application only, sub forum to argue about sensible left wing views and hysterically crazy batshit right wing nonsense?