Safe standing - time to act

[KrefelderFox666]

Well done Wolves, a superb run football club who listen to the fans. They are showing most clubs up, including us (on and off the pitch).

[Ian Nacho]

13 hours ago, StanSP said:

 

Knowing our fan base, only 48% of season ticket holders would be in favour, something like that. 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

40 minutes ago, Ian Nacho said:

Knowing our fan base, only 48% of season ticket holders would be in favour, something like that. 

Interesting that they only surveyed their South Bank, which stands game in game out, IE the people that it would affect and directly benefit.  

 

If we did it and polled all ST holders for example, then the results would be skewed by people who would have no intention of using it anyway even if it did come in. 

[UniFox21]

3 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

Interesting that they only surveyed their South Bank, which stands game in game out, IE the people that it would affect and directly benefit.  

 

If we did it and polled all ST holders for example, then the results would be skewed by people who would have no intention of using it anyway even if it did come in. 

Surely if they polled STH, then all those in favour could opt for a relocation to that section? 

I'm sure we'd manage to get a decent amount down for it to be used. 

 

 

But i wouldn't expect to see these rail seats until we have the stadium expansion, would make sense to implement them then I think.

[Voll Blau]

Yeah, I think a poll here would have to be of all season ticket holders - then be used to work out an area/areas large enough to accommodate the number who voted yes. There's never been a traditional end at our new ground in the same way the South Bank is at Wolves, so any vote would need to reflect the fact there are both current standers, and people who want to stand but don't at present, all over the ground.

[Stadt]

I think the club would be terrified of having to move people, they’d rather pander to a smaller status quo then potentially please more fans.

[walkerleeds]

Fair play Wolves.

 

We will undoubtedly be the last in the country to implement this, but when we eventually do, any thoughts on where it might be? Could mean the end of standing in L1/K1/J blocks or SK1 surely? 

[Jackubu]

4 minutes ago, walkerleeds said:

Fair play Wolves.

 

We will undoubtedly be the last in the country to implement this, but when we eventually do, any thoughts on where it might be? Could mean the end of standing in L1/K1/J blocks or SK1 surely? 

Logic would suggest it'd be one of those areas but I'd be surprised if it then resulted in a blanket ban elsewhere

[yorkie1999]

1 hour ago, Jackubu said:

Logic would suggest it'd be one of those areas but I'd be surprised if it then resulted in a blanket ban elsewhere

I'd be surprised if it didn't result in a blanket ban in other areas, after all that is the whole point of a safe standing area, to have somewhere you can stand which is designated as being safe which then means the other areas are unsafe to stand. Don't get me wrong, i'm all for it and i suspect it'll be where i'm currently sat, in the corner of sk1 as it's the only feasible place to have it, or maybe the corner of sk4 which would then be opposite (diagonally) the away fans but then it would intrude on the boxes.

[UniFox21]

May get pelted for this, and I appreciate UFS are only trying to strengthen the push for safe standing to increase our atmosphere, but the "we demand safe standing now" doesn't hit me as the best way to go. They aren't big enough to start demanding to the club and get a response. 

 

I don't know if that seems like BS and not clue what's said behind closed doors, they just don't hit me as a big enough group to push LCFC on such a big issue. 

 

If some how you could get a vote going, to this forum, the season ticket holders or something similar then you'd get a large data set you can chuck at Leicester and be like "there is demand, we have  numbers saying people would want and move for this to happen" 

 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

2 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

May get pelted for this, and I appreciate UFS are only trying to strengthen the push for safe standing to increase our atmosphere, but the "we demand safe standing now" doesn't hit me as the best way to go. They aren't big enough to start demanding to the club and get a response. 

 

I don't know if that seems like BS and not clue what's said behind closed doors, they just don't hit me as a big enough group to push LCFC on such a big issue. 

 

If some how you could get a vote going, to this forum, the season ticket holders or something similar then you'd get a large data set you can chuck at Leicester and be like "there is demand, we have  numbers saying people would want and move for this to happen" 

 

http://www.unionfs.co.uk/safe-standing-survey.html

 

Already done it pal. 

[SemperEadem]

3 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

May get pelted for this, and I appreciate UFS are only trying to strengthen the push for safe standing to increase our atmosphere, but the "we demand safe standing now" doesn't hit me as the best way to go. They aren't big enough to start demanding to the club and get a response. 

 

I don't know if that seems like BS and not clue what's said behind closed doors, they just don't hit me as a big enough group to push LCFC on such a big issue. 

 

If some how you could get a vote going, to this forum, the season ticket holders or something similar then you'd get a large data set you can chuck at Leicester and be like "there is demand, we have  numbers saying people would want and move for this to happen" 

 

Been done, they didn't even have the courtesy to reply.

Edited 15 May 2019 by SemperEadem

[yorkie1999]

1 minute ago, UniFox21 said:

May get pelted for this, and I appreciate UFS are only trying to strengthen the push for safe standing to increase our atmosphere, but the "we demand safe standing now" doesn't hit me as the best way to go. They aren't big enough to start demanding to the club and get a response. 

 

I don't know if that seems like BS and not clue what's said behind closed doors, they just don't hit me as a big enough group to push LCFC on such a big issue. 

 

If some how you could get a vote going, to this forum, the season ticket holders or something similar then you'd get a large data set you can chuck at Leicester and be like "there is demand, we have  numbers saying people would want and move for this to happen" 

 

It shouldn't be like that though, it should be the club pushing the supporters to have it, it's in the clubs interest to create the best atmosphere possible to help motivate the players. They can have as many coaches and motivational advisers to the players as they want, but if the players walk out to a crap atmosphere, they'll play crap. 

[UniFox21]

9 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

http://www.unionfs.co.uk/safe-standing-survey.html

 

Already done it pal. 

 

8 minutes ago, SemperEadem said:

Been done, they didn't even have the courtesy to reply.

Had a scan through the survey, first thing that hit me was 1267 responses; ~4% of the average attendance and 900 STH, ~4% again. The response numbers aren't big enough to show there is consistent support for the movement. You need bigger response numbers to show that there is significant interest in having it fitted. Lets say 70% of the responses actually go through with wanting it in, thats only 900 ish people. The response there would be there isn't enough support for it.

I appreciate that it's difficult to get people to answer surveys and harder still to get it to be seen by people, but I'm thinking that's what it needs to be in order to get this noticed as something that's wanted by a large number of people. If you turned up with a survey of 10K responses for instance, thats 1/3 of the ground, if you then show that a vast number want standing or would welcome it in an area, then there's a much higher chance of getting it implemented.

 

But as i said, this wasn't meant to be a dig at what's been tried or trying, simply giving my opinion on what I've seen and read. 

 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

3 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

 

Had a scan through the survey, first thing that hit me was 1267 responses; ~4% of the average attendance and 900 STH, ~4% again. The response numbers aren't big enough to show there is consistent support for the movement. You need bigger response numbers to show that there is significant interest in having it fitted. Lets say 70% of the responses actually go through with wanting it in, thats only 900 ish people. The response there would be there isn't enough support for it.

I appreciate that it's difficult to get people to answer surveys and harder still to get it to be seen by people, but I'm thinking that's what it needs to be in order to get this noticed as something that's wanted by a large number of people. If you turned up with a survey of 10K responses for instance, thats 1/3 of the ground, if you then show that a vast number want standing or would welcome it in an area, then there's a much higher chance of getting it implemented.

 

But as i said, this wasn't meant to be a dig at what's been tried or trying, simply giving my opinion on what I've seen and read. 

 

The numbers wouldn't change significantly if it got 5000 or 10000 replies, the responses were up and down at the start and then after 200/300 or so they leveled out and remained pretty steady until we closed it. 

 

How would you propose we got 10000 responses without access to the club's emailing list? 

[coolhandfox]

2 hours ago, Stadt said:

I think the club would be terrified of having to move people, they’d rather pander to a smaller status quo then potentially please more fans.

Pander to who, and how do you know they are smaller group that the people who want to stand? 

 

 

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, yorkie1999 said:

It shouldn't be like that though, it should be the club pushing the supporters to have it, it's in the clubs interest to create the best atmosphere possible to help motivate the players. They can have as many coaches and motivational advisers to the players as they want, but if the players walk out to a crap atmosphere, they'll play crap. 

Completely agree, but the problem is those behind the scenes at the club (who by and large don't appear to be matchgoing football fans in the sense we'd understand), think that stuff like clappers and free merchandise do that perfectly well. I'm sure one official has mentioned in a meeting recently that they don't believe there is any problem with our atmosphere at all.

 

They either don't understand, or don't trust, that something which would allow supporters to create an atmosphere which is actually good would be far more beneficial than their marketing gimmicks. The maddening thing is that being a leader on this, rather than hiding away from it, would also have provided better PR for the club than anything they've ever done - which seems to be the one thing they care about above anything else.

Edited 15 May 2019 by Voll Blau

[UniFox21]

1 minute ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

The numbers wouldn't change significantly if it got 5000 or 10000 replies, the responses were up and down at the start and then after 200/300 or so they leveled out and remained pretty steady until we closed it. 

 

How would you propose we got 10000 responses without access to the club's emailing list? 

It would be more about the statistical significance of the numbers, the higher the amount asked, the more robust the numbers are for when the club run all the feasibility stats. 

 

 

First game of the season or similar, get in early, get by the turnstiles or by seats and go around asking everyone who comes in whether they'd support the implementing of safe standing or not. Bloody pain to do, and time consuming as hell, but if you get to peoples faces and ask them directly they can't avoid the question as you would in an online survey. If not at a game, at the shop on a big release or signing session. Or continue to hassle the club to hold or allow the sending out of a survey so they can see the response themselves. But assuming they wouldn't want to do that or allow it. 

[coolhandfox]

4 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

The numbers wouldn't change significantly if it got 5000 or 10000 replies, the responses were up and down at the start and then after 200/300 or so they leveled out and remained pretty steady until we closed it. 

 

How would you propose we got 10000 responses without access to the club's emailing list? 

How can you quantify the numbers will not over a larger sample size? 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

2 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

How can you quantify the numbers will not over a larger sample size? 

I'm not claiming to be a data scientist, but I sat there for 5 days watching the responses come in and they were pretty steady, actually with a bit of pick up of support towards the end. The killer factor would be if they asked people who would actually consider using it, or everyone. If you sit down and would like to continue sitting down, that's cool, but it would suck if those people denied people wanting to stand safely the chance to do so. 

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, UniFox21 said:

It would be more about the statistical significance of the numbers, the higher the amount asked, the more robust the numbers are for when the club run all the feasibility stats. 

 

 

First game of the season or similar, get in early, get by the turnstiles or by seats and go around asking everyone who comes in whether they'd support the implementing of safe standing or not. Bloody pain to do, and time consuming as hell, but if you get to peoples faces and ask them directly they can't avoid the question as you would in an online survey. If not at a game, at the shop on a big release or signing session. Or continue to hassle the club to hold or allow the sending out of a survey so they can see the response themselves. But assuming they wouldn't want to do that or allow it. 

Have you ever tried to get people to sign a petition for anything before? You'd really struggle to get the numbers stopping that you think are feasible on a matchday, and even less would give you the time of day to explain what you're actually advocating.

[yorkie1999]

9 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

The numbers wouldn't change significantly if it got 5000 or 10000 replies, the responses were up and down at the start and then after 200/300 or so they leveled out and remained pretty steady until we closed it. 

 

How would you propose we got 10000 responses without access to the club's emailing list? 

By standing outside the ground conducting a survey with the fans. 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

3 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

By standing outside the ground conducting a survey with the fans. 

10 thousand people? As Voll said have you ever tried to get people to talk to you in the street to answer a survey? Not sure if I could take that level of rejection and I like a beer pre match  

Edited 15 May 2019 by Sol thewall Bamba

[coolhandfox]

2 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

 

They either don't understand, or don't trust, that something which would allow supporters to create an atmosphere which is actually good would be far more beneficial than their marketing gimmicks. The maddening thing is that being a leader on this, rather than hiding away from it, would also have provided better PR for the club than anything they've ever done - which seems to be the one thing they care about above anything else.

 Taking a club from the Championship to the PL title, is the biggest PR coup they could have every achieved.

 

Putting in safe stand wouldn't even register, unless you're interested in the topic, Wolves news hardly has the world captivated?

[Christoph]

What would be ideal if they made it where the seats were high up so your standing but get to lean on something.