RUDKIN - How Does He Keep His Job?

[AjcW]

1 hour ago, LittlethorpeFox said:

Can somebody name me a better director of football and why? 

Do you mean in the world? Or the Premier League? Or the UK?

[Ric Flair]

4 minutes ago, Saxondale said:

Nobody on here knows what Mr Rudkin actually does in his job. I HATE how he is the Foxestalk scapegoat for everything transfer / player contract-related.

 

 

 

Yet because nobody knows, he's bombproof. Doesn't add up. Football is a results business, managers, coaches and players get measured by such. However, they are employed and report to others who have a massive bearing on how easily they can achieve success on which they get measured on. It would prove prudent to sometimes review all footballing operations when you've gone through as many managers and players as we have in the last few years and yet are in danger of stagnating.

[Saxondale]

1 minute ago, Ric Flair said:

Yet because nobody knows, he's bombproof. Doesn't add up. Football is a results business, managers, coaches and players get measured by such. However, they are employed and report to others who have a massive bearing on how easily they can achieve success on which they get measured on. It would prove prudent to sometimes review all footballing operations when you've gone through as many managers and players as we have in the last few years and yet are in danger of stagnating.

We don't know what's within his scope though. Does the Manager even report to him?

[Ric Flair]

7 minutes ago, Saxondale said:

We don't know what's within his scope though. Does the Manager even report to him?

He is head of all football operations. The manager is below him, but even if he doesn't report to the DOF he's got overall responsibility of the manager, the recruitment and general footballing matters. If he's devoid of any blame for anything that ever goes wrong at our club then that may answer a few things. Perhaps he's a DOF by name but is merely there for the owners to trust but not to do a lot.

[The whole world smiles]

18 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I'm seeing a growing consensus that because we have zero evidence of Rudkin's supposed mistakes and failings, due to the blurred lines between what's the managers remit, the recruitment directors remit and what's Rudkin's remit that he's doing a very good job. It's a shame managers don't get afforded such luxury when they are criticized and often sacked, given they rely on many other people performing to be deemed a success such as the players and then the recruitment director and director of football giving them the best possible players and support to do so. I don't particularly like the modern era where the DOF and manager aren't brought in together as a partnership, there's an instant divide and a hierarchy that the manager is less safe than the DOF. Whilst we've been through many managers due to under performance, we've had the same DOF and the same directors who it's quite easy to accuse of the same levels of underachievement as the managers. Yet the manager and sometimes the players are the easy option to bin off and replace, but has anybody stopped to consider if the manager isn't forming a great rapport and working relationship with the DOF then he's going to struggle to be as effective as he could be. At what point does a DOF whom is loved by the owners regardless of results come under scrutiny? The money wasted on players and managers year in, year out but never in our case is the whole footballing operation considered and measured on performance and if it is then I'm astounded at the outcome.

 

I'm sure many can argue who's responsible for the following mistakes and stick up for our DOF, but here is a valid list of gaffs you'd have to think fall under the overall area of Rudkin. If they don't, then who takes ultimate responsibility?

 

1) The Adrien Silva/Drinkwater debacle

2) Paying £13m more for Slimani on the last day of the window having chosen to resist signing him for just £15m a few weeks previous

3) The contract extensions and salary amounts for bit part players of Ulloa and James. Both of whom we had genuine interest from other clubs and could have generated revenue and freed up wages.

4) The release clause in Jamie Vardy's contract that had only been agreed and signed a few months before we won the league. This wasn't an old contract where our rise to prominence hadn't been predicted.

 5) Inability to move deadwood players. I appreciate this is one of the hardest things a DOF is expected to do, but given what often unrealistic expectation is put on managers it's where they prove their worth. So far we haven't gotten rid of a single player this summer who is in contract that we want rid of.

6) Failure to bring in players in the crucial final stages of transfer windows. I admit he has got better but last summers Silva debacle was horrifying and the previous few to last summer were a frustrating time.

 

There's a sample list, anybody who can think of any more, please feel free to come forward.

 

 

All good points but surely if he can take blame for things for things like that he also has to take credit along the same lines:

 

1. Signed Rhiyad Mahrez for 500k sold him for 60 million plus add ons (Must be up there as a record for the most profit a DOF has made from signing and selling the same player)

2. Signed Marcin Waslewski for free, (Marcin was made a big contribution in our brilliant 13/14 and 14/15 seasons)

3. Signed Danny Simpson for 2.5 million

4. Signed Cambiasso for free

5. Got Rob Huth on loan which kept us up.

6. Got Rob Huth on a permanent for 5 million which was massive in us winning the league.

7. Got Ngolo Kante for 6.5 Million. Then sold him to chelsea who were not champions league to get an extra 10 million on his release clause .

8. Got Fuchs on a free

9. Signed Gray for 5 million

10 Signed Shinji for 8 million

11. Sold Schlupp for 16 million

12. Signed Ndidi for 14 Million

13. Signed Harry for 17 Million (everton signed keane for 30 million to give you some perspective)

14. Sold an injured Drinkwater for 35 million (obviously we ****ed up his replacement but still impressive business)

15. Signed Evans for 3 million months after Man City had a 18 million and arsenal had a 25 million bid rejected.

[Ric Flair]

13 minutes ago, The whole world smiles said:

All good points but surely if he can take blame for things for things like that he also has to take credit along the same lines:

 

1. Signed Rhiyad Mahrez for 500k sold him for 60 million plus add ons (Must be up there as a record for the most profit a DOF has made from signing and selling the same player)

2. Signed Marcin Waslewski for free, (Marcin was made a big contribution in our brilliant 13/14 and 14/15 seasons)

3. Signed Danny Simpson for 2.5 million

4. Signed Cambiasso for free

5. Got Rob Huth on loan which kept us up.

6. Got Rob Huth on a permanent for 5 million which was massive in us winning the league.

7. Got Ngolo Kante for 6.5 Million. Then sold him to chelsea who were not champions league to get an extra 10 million on his release clause .

8. Got Fuchs on a free

9. Signed Gray for 5 million

10 Signed Shinji for 8 million

11. Sold Schlupp for 16 million

12. Signed Ndidi for 14 Million

13. Signed Harry for 17 Million (everton signed keane for 30 million to give you some perspective)

14. Sold an injured Drinkwater for 35 million (obviously we ****ed up his replacement but still impressive business)

15. Signed Evans for 3 million months after Man City had a 18 million and arsenal had a 25 million bid rejected.

A fair few of those he wasn't director of football at the time but I'm not saying he hasn't done some good things at this club. I'm questioning at a time when we move managers on at least once a year due to underperformance and we have a lot of deadwood in the squad that we overpaid for and cannot get rid of, and that we are supposedly trying to become one of the best clubs in the country then I think we should expect better from EVERY facet of our club. 

[Smudge]

I have no idea how the club works but what makes most sense to me is that he is the owner's go between.

I'd hazard a guess that they are the driving force on what goes on and Rudkin acts on their orders.

It also wouldn't surprise me if their generosity has sometimes clouded their judgement regarding contracts etc. 

[The whole world smiles]

3 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

A fair few of those he wasn't director of football at the time but I'm not saying he hasn't done some good things at this club. I'm questioning at a time when we move managers on at least once a year due to underperformance and we have a lot of deadwood in the squad that we overpaid for and cannot get rid of, and that we are supposedly trying to become one of the best clubs in the country then I think we should expect better from EVERY facet of our club. 

He became DOF December 2014 and all of those points happened after that.

 

How much he was involved in that incredible list of 15 pieces of football business is debatable just like your list is debatable. but whats not debatable is this:

 

- Since December 2014 when Rudkin took his current role the club has enjoyed a period of financial and football success that has been unprecedented in its 134 year history. 

 

- The Owners clearly like him and rate his ability.

 

now I don't know if he's completely useless like some will have you believe or an astute football, business genius like i'm trying to suggest for the sake of balance. But baring in mind the above 2 facts i'm prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt anyone who doesn't is either looking for a scapegoat or just wants a reason to moan and be negative about the club in my opinion.

[Babylon]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

I'm seeing a growing consensus that because we have zero evidence of Rudkin's supposed mistakes and failings, due to the blurred lines between what's the managers remit, the recruitment directors remit and what's Rudkin's remit that he's doing a very good job. It's a shame managers don't get afforded such luxury when they are criticized and often sacked, given they rely on many other people performing to be deemed a success such as the players and then the recruitment director and director of football giving them the best possible players and support to do so. I don't particularly like the modern era where the DOF and manager aren't brought in together as a partnership, there's an instant divide and a hierarchy that the manager is less safe than the DOF. Whilst we've been through many managers due to under performance, we've had the same DOF and the same directors who it's quite easy to accuse of the same levels of underachievement as the managers. Yet the manager and sometimes the players are the easy option to bin off and replace, but has anybody stopped to consider if the manager isn't forming a great rapport and working relationship with the DOF then he's going to struggle to be as effective as he could be. At what point does a DOF whom is loved by the owners regardless of results come under scrutiny? The money wasted on players and managers year in, year out but never in our case is the whole footballing operation considered and measured on performance and if it is then I'm astounded at the outcome.

 

I'm sure many can argue who's responsible for the following mistakes and stick up for our DOF, but here is a valid list of gaffs you'd have to think fall under the overall area of Rudkin. If they don't, then who takes ultimate responsibility?

 

1) The Adrien Silva/Drinkwater debacle

2) Paying £13m more for Slimani on the last day of the window having chosen to resist signing him for just £15m a few weeks previous

3) The contract extensions and salary amounts for bit part players of Ulloa and James. Both of whom we had genuine interest from other clubs and could have generated revenue and freed up wages.

4) The release clause in Jamie Vardy's contract that had only been agreed and signed a few months before we won the league. This wasn't an old contract where our rise to prominence hadn't been predicted.

5) Inability to move deadwood players. I appreciate this is one of the hardest things a DOF is expected to do, but given what often unrealistic expectation is put on managers it's where they prove their worth. So far we haven't gotten rid of a single player this summer who is in contract that we want rid of.

6) Failure to bring in players in the crucial final stages of transfer windows. I admit he has got better but last summers Silva debacle was horrifying and the previous few to last summer were a frustrating time.

 

There's a sample list, anybody who can think of any more, please feel free to come forward.

 

 

You seem to be bundling loads of different opinions together and coming up with the fact people think he's doing a good job. I've seen few people say he's doing a good job, merely pointing out if you are the sort of person who tries to pin everything on him, then he should also get the credit for when things go right for us (not going to happen is it).

 

I think he's doing a better job, when he first started we were incredibly slow with transfers. The contract clause muck ups that we hear the club will no longer accept (admitting a mistake), the Silva fiasco. I was heavily critical of him going back a two years and even a year. But we've starting to get deals done far earlier, and again if the clause stuff is true then he's learning from his mistakes. As I said a long time ago, he's clearly learning on the job by his own mistakes... not the best of ideas for a premier league club to be doing that. But we might actually end up with a decent, experienced DOF.

 

[Babylon]

59 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Yet because nobody knows, he's bombproof. Doesn't add up. Football is a results business, managers, coaches and players get measured by such. However, they are employed and report to others who have a massive bearing on how easily they can achieve success on which they get measured on. It would prove prudent to sometimes review all footballing operations when you've gone through as many managers and players as we have in the last few years and yet are in danger of stagnating.

Bombproof? Is that a joke, he's been one of the most critisised members of staff at Leicester I can remember. What people get fed up with is the constant muck slinging in his direction when there is really no need, a bit like this thread popping up when we're IMO one signing away from a pretty good window.

[Ric Flair]

25 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Bombproof? Is that a joke, he's been one of the most critisised members of staff at Leicester I can remember. What people get fed up with is the constant muck slinging in his direction when there is really no need, a bit like this thread popping up when we're IMO one signing away from a pretty good window.

Bombproof in the eyes of those in charge of whether he has a job or not. 

[Ric Flair]

31 minutes ago, The whole world smiles said:

He became DOF December 2014 and all of those points happened after that.

 

How much he was involved in that incredible list of 15 pieces of football business is debatable just like your list is debatable. but whats not debatable is this:

 

- Since December 2014 when Rudkin took his current role the club has enjoyed a period of financial and football success that has been unprecedented in its 134 year history. 

 

- The Owners clearly like him and rate his ability.

 

now I don't know if he's completely useless like some will have you believe or an astute football, business genius like i'm trying to suggest for the sake of balance. But baring in mind the above 2 facts i'm prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt anyone who doesn't is either looking for a scapegoat or just wants a reason to moan and be negative about the club in my opinion.

My point still stands then, if he became DOF in December 2014 he wasn't responsible for getting Cambiasso, Wasilweski, Simpson or Mahrez to sign.

[CosbehFox]

1 hour ago, The whole world smiles said:

All good points but surely if he can take blame for things for things like that he also has to take credit along the same lines:

 

1. Signed Rhiyad Mahrez for 500k sold him for 60 million plus add ons (Must be up there as a record for the most profit a DOF has made from signing and selling the same player)

2. Signed Marcin Waslewski for free, (Marcin was made a big contribution in our brilliant 13/14 and 14/15 seasons)

3. Signed Danny Simpson for 2.5 million

4. Signed Cambiasso for free

5. Got Rob Huth on loan which kept us up.

6. Got Rob Huth on a permanent for 5 million which was massive in us winning the league.

7. Got Ngolo Kante for 6.5 Million. Then sold him to chelsea who were not champions league to get an extra 10 million on his release clause .

8. Got Fuchs on a free

9. Signed Gray for 5 million

10 Signed Shinji for 8 million

11. Sold Schlupp for 16 million

12. Signed Ndidi for 14 Million

13. Signed Harry for 17 Million (everton signed keane for 30 million to give you some perspective)

14. Sold an injured Drinkwater for 35 million (obviously we ****ed up his replacement but still impressive business)

15. Signed Evans for 3 million months after Man City had a 18 million and arsenal had a 25 million bid rejected.

 

1-4 - He wasn't Director of Football at the time, Terry Robinson was.

5-10 He was DoF but Walsh was doing massive parts of the role. 

[The whole world smiles]

2 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

My point still stands then, if he became DOF in December 2014 he wasn't responsible for getting Cambiasso, Wasilweski, Simpson or Mahrez to sign.

sorry my bad got confused I thought he was instated halfway through the championship winning season season not the great escape. but the other 11 points are still pretty impressive and massively outweigh the negative if your in the business attributing every piece of business to him good or bad.

[The whole world smiles]

2 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

 

1-4 - He wasn't Director of Football at the time, Terry Robinson was.

5-10 He was DoF but Walsh was doing massive parts of the role. 

kind of proves my point. people want to blame him for the bad and praise someone else for the good thats happened at the football club. Also if Walsh is such an astute football man who was able to carry out two roles simultaneously how do you explain the truly, genuinely shocking business Everton did during his time there?  

[CosbehFox]

3 minutes ago, The whole world smiles said:

kind of proves my point. people want to blame him for the bad and praise someone else for the good thats happened at the football club. Also if Walsh is such an astute football man who was able to carry out two roles simultaneously how do you explain the truly, genuinely shocking business Everton did during his time there?  

Woah here - I am not over praising Walsh nor am I questioning his credentials . I am saying for a number of your points him and Rudkin shared roles which oversaw those signings. Maybe Rudkin was influential in taming his over ambition at times. However, it's pretty clear there's been more negatives than positives since Walsh's departure (Ric's points are just a tip really). Maybe they worked better as a pair. 

 

The relationship came to ahead at the end of the title winning season. Certain parts of the club thought Walsh was deserving DoF, others felt Rudkin was including the manager at the time. 

 

[Ric Flair]

8 minutes ago, The whole world smiles said:

kind of proves my point. people want to blame him for the bad and praise someone else for the good thats happened at the football club. Also if Walsh is such an astute football man who was able to carry out two roles simultaneously how do you explain the truly, genuinely shocking business Everton did during his time there?  

I don't want to blame him for the bad and disregard the good, my biggest gripe is we are ruthless with our underperforming managers but never seem to review the performances of our director of football and certain other executives. If we do, then they obviously aren't measured on how their work impacgs the footballing side of the business which I find very odd.

[Clever Fox]

31 minutes ago, The whole world smiles said:

kind of proves my point. people want to blame him for the bad and praise someone else for the good thats happened at the football club. Also if Walsh is such an astute football man who was able to carry out two roles simultaneously how do you explain the truly, genuinely shocking business Everton did during his time there?  

Walsh wasn't responsible for most of the signings when he went to Everton. He was appointed by the owner over Koemans head for which  Koeman took exception as his contract stated he was responsible for signings. Koeman refused to work with Walsh and it was only when things were going belly up at Everton that he accepted Walsh. By then it was too late Koeman was sacked and Walsh went before Siiva was appointed.

Walsh with Pearson were definitely responsible for signing Vardy, Mahrez, Kante among others.

Rightly or wrongly Walsh should have got the DoF job which is what pissed him off. Rudkin just happened to be in the right place at the time.

 People more qualified get overlooked for promotion in business all the time. 

[Clever Fox]

2 hours ago, Ted Maul said:

To bring in an experienced DOF who can negotiate better deals with better players and do things in a timely manner?

Yes, That possibly would have been the smart thing to do. But SW and the Owners decided to appoint from within the Club.

You have to also remember neither had a lot of Football experience and possibly felt they didn't want to trust an outsider.

Rudkin was a Coach at the Club on a daily basis and they obviously saw something in him.

[filbertway]

It's the contracts that get me. We give people contracts way beyond their ability and then get stuck with these players for about 4 or 5 years.

[LittlethorpeFox]

2 hours ago, AjcW said:

Do you mean in the world? Or the Premier League? Or the UK?

anywhere  -you need to justify why he has done better than JR though with the resources available and in comparison to the club they're working at

[mozartfox]

On the assumption the DoF is responsible for the performance of the Scouting Crew (who we have been told previously spend literally hours studying video tapes of potential new acquisitions).  Can someone offer up an credible excuse why this aspect of Football Operations has, on the face of it, avoided an overhaul?  May be it has and it has not been made public news like the Silva debacle?? Please no comments referring to the successes, as these are what they should be doing.

[FoxyPalace.com]

I wonder imagine a BIG pot of KINGPOWER bum hole grease helps!

 

 

[yorkie1999]

I can't see how Rudkin can be blamed, or praised for that matter, for transfers. It's his job to be a middle man between the manager/s and the board. Scouts spot players, managers decide what type of player they want and dof's communicate with the board about funding and the direction the team/s are trying to pursue and then sign the player for whatever budget they've been given. He's a former coach so he knows a about the ins and outs of players and how football clubs work, so is trusted by both sides 

[Fox92]

Nothing will happen to him. The owners obviously rate/ trust him.