leicsmac Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 Are there any candidates at all that would actually make headway in a way that May could not on the total mess the UK has on its hands now?
AKCJ Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 45 minutes ago, LiberalFox said: She was the worst PM since David Cameron. TM enacted A50 and agreed the basis for leaving the EU but couldn't get it past her own MPs and it was never going to satisfy the majority of Brexit voters who have unreasonable expectations. The irony is that if she had got more votes in her snap election we'd probably be outside the EU now. Do you think? I personally think she was the best PM since Cameron.
Finnegan Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 What the **** is happening in Sheffield? Two boys, 13 and 14, dead from a family with six kids. Four other children in hospital, ranging from 7 months to 11 years old. Parents arrested. Breaking now.
Wymsey Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 6 minutes ago, Finnegan said: What the **** is happening in Sheffield? Two boys, 13 and 14, dead from a family with six kids. Four other children in hospital, ranging from 7 months to 11 years old. Parents arrested. Breaking now. Hope it's not another Mick Philpott situation.. Horrible.
Finnegan Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 Just now, Wymeswold fox said: Hope it's not another Mick Philpott situation.. Horrible. No mention or evidence of a fire in the coverage, social media speculation of shootings being denied by the police. It's just being called an "incident", horrible.
Captain... Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 31 minutes ago, leicsmac said: Are there any candidates at all that would actually make headway in a way that May could not on the total mess the UK has on its hands now? Yes, May was dealt shit hand, Cameron handed over the keys but left a giant steaming turd on her desk. Instead tackling it she shouted about how turd means turd positioned herself as a hardline brexiteer when she wasn’t then tried to shore up her position with a snap election all the time not dealing with the big steaming turd. She weakened her position spouted a load of guff that made it impossible to make any progress without contradicting then triggered article 50 without any sort of plan. In euphemistic terms she started trying to remove the turd without any gloves on yet was trying not to get her hands dirty. She spread it around without actually cleaning it up. She eventually tried to come up with a compromise failed so tried the exact same thing 3 more teams with the same results. Now the turd is seemingly smeared all round number 10 and there is suspiciously more turd than when she started (Boris sniggering in the corner doing his belt up). Any sensible person dealing with a turd gets rid of it in the quickest way possible and for that it would have been the softest of all Brexits nobody voted for a hard Brexit nobody voted for years of chaos and uncertainty, a soft Brexit with a Norway deal would have kept this country strong and stable whilst taking a significant step back from the Eu.
Voll Blau Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 Hunt's confirmed he's running... http://www.farnhamherald.com/article.cfm?id=135809&headline=VIDEO: Jeremy Hunt confirms Tory leadership bid at Haslemere Festival§ionIs=news&searchyear=2019
davieG Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 3 minutes ago, Voll Blau said: Hunt's confirmed he's running... http://www.farnhamherald.com/article.cfm?id=135809&headline=VIDEO: Jeremy Hunt confirms Tory leadership bid at Haslemere Festival§ionIs=news&searchyear=2019 They should all be running scared.
Leicester_Loyal Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 10 minutes ago, Captain... said: Yes, May was dealt shit hand, Cameron handed over the keys but left a giant steaming turd on her desk. Instead tackling it she shouted about how turd means turd positioned herself as a hardline brexiteer when she wasn’t then tried to shore up her position with a snap election all the time not dealing with the big steaming turd. She weakened her position spouted a load of guff that made it impossible to make any progress without contradicting then triggered article 50 without any sort of plan. In euphemistic terms she started trying to remove the turd without any gloves on yet was trying not to get her hands dirty. She spread it around without actually cleaning it up. She eventually tried to come up with a compromise failed so tried the exact same thing 3 more teams with the same results. Now the turd is seemingly smeared all round number 10 and there is suspiciously more turd than when she started (Boris sniggering in the corner doing his belt up). Any sensible person dealing with a turd gets rid of it in the quickest way possible and for that it would have been the softest of all Brexits nobody voted for a hard Brexit nobody voted for years of chaos and uncertainty, a soft Brexit with a Norway deal would have kept this country strong and stable whilst taking a significant step back from the Eu. She has tried to pretty much get the softest of all Brexits and it hasn't got through for the very reason that it's not peoples idea of Brexit. Also some people did vote for a hard Brexit, some listened to Cameron when he was our PM and stated after 2 years if there isn't a trade deal, we go WTO.
Leicester_Loyal Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 2 hours ago, Buce said: I don't really have any knowledge of this but I'm not sure it's something you can lay at May's door - wouldn't that be a government decision, rather than a personal one? She personally blocked an amnesty for NI veterans, while allowing ones from Iraq, Afghan and elsewhere. What's the difference between them? It should be one rule for all.
Leicester_Loyal Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 10 minutes ago, Voll Blau said: Hunt's confirmed he's running... http://www.farnhamherald.com/article.cfm?id=135809&headline=VIDEO: Jeremy Hunt confirms Tory leadership bid at Haslemere Festival§ionIs=news&searchyear=2019 Another slimy snake, he's got no chance. I'd trust him even less than May!
Captain... Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 5 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: She has tried to pretty much get the softest of all Brexits and it hasn't got through for the very reason that it's not peoples idea of Brexit. Also some people did vote for a hard Brexit, some listened to Cameron when he was our PM and stated after 2 years if there isn't a trade deal, we go WTO. Nobody voted for it because it wasn’t an option on the ballot paper you may have voted with the hope we deliver a hard Brexit/No Deal Brexit but nobody voted for any type of Brexit you voted to leave the EU and that could have been delivered by now. Coming out with the Brexit means Brexit line painted herself into a corner. A soft Brexit following a Norway or Switzerland model would resolve all the issue around NI and all the chaos over trade and customs unions and maintained the status quo as best as possible. Yes it would have pissed off a lot of people who voted for Brexit and a large chunk of her own party but it would have got cross party support and probably got over the line and it would have got rid of that turd allowing her to actually lead the country. She could have delivered a Norway EFTA deal and if people were still not happy they would have their say in the next election. Instead she delivered nothing sowed chaos and doubt has driven a wedge between her own part the opposition party and the entire country. I do feel sorry for her but she has largely brought it on herself.
Foxin_Mad Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 What a great choice we have. And the liar Corbyn is still leader of the opposition. How Labour still got such a large vote share is baffling. Blind loyalty. I am not sure what the point of a GE would be.
Jon the Hat Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 What a ****ing waste of three years she has been. Should have been forced out after the failed election. God knows where from here - I think Boris committed to renegotiate with WTO Brexit if not might get it done. We will probably see other serious candidates stepping clear to let him take the job for a couple of years imo.
Buce Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 7 minutes ago, Foxin_Mad said: What a great choice we have. And the liar Corbyn is still leader of the opposition. How Labour still got such a large vote share is baffling. Blind loyalty. I am not sure what the point of a GE would be. We? None at all unless you are a member of the Tory Party, and I'm too smart and you're too young for that...
Leicester_Loyal Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 29 minutes ago, Captain... said: Nobody voted for it because it wasn’t an option on the ballot paper you may have voted with the hope we deliver a hard Brexit/No Deal Brexit but nobody voted for any type of Brexit you voted to leave the EU and that could have been delivered by now. Coming out with the Brexit means Brexit line painted herself into a corner. The withdrawl agreement is worse than remaining in the EU (and rightly so). The EU were never going to make it easy and they've played their hand very well. The next PM needs to set a deadline, if this deal can't be improved (The EU claim it can't) then we need to leave on the deadline without a deal. If the deal can be improved, then hopefully it can get through the HoC. EDIT: Boris has just commented that he will leave without a deal if one cannot be agreed by the deadline.
Guest Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 26 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: The withdrawl agreement is worse than remaining in the EU (and rightly so). The EU were never going to make it easy and they've played their hand very well. The next PM needs to set a deadline, if this deal can't be improved (The EU claim it can't) then we need to leave on the deadline without a deal. If the deal can be improved, then hopefully it can get through the HoC. EDIT: Boris has just commented that he will leave without a deal if one cannot be agreed by the deadline. I think he sounds exactly like your sort of leader. Maybe Britain really is going to the dogs.
Guest Kopfkino Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 10 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: The withdrawl agreement is worse than remaining in the EU (and rightly so). The EU were never going to make it easy and they've played their hand very well. The next PM needs to set a deadline, if this deal can't be improved (The EU claim it can't) then we need to leave on the deadline without a deal. If the deal can be improved, then hopefully it can get through the HoC. EDIT: Boris has just commented that he will leave without a deal if one cannot be agreed by the deadline. What do you think happens when we leave without a deal? What do you think the EU will demand when after 2 weeks we ask to negotiate a future relationship? Or are we just going to have no sort of close relationship with our nearest neighbours? I'll answer it for you. We end up agreeing to the same terms as the WA. But only this time we'll be negotiating from an even worse position with no transition period and a worsening international standing having reneged on our commitments. What improvements do you want making? How do you solve the Irish trilemma? You're living in cuckoo land, you're believing in some kind of abstract world fed to you by people that have consistently shown themselves to have no idea and you obviously refuse to face up to the realities of the modern world. People voted to leave for what I believe were mostly completely understandable and legitimate reasons. Unfortunately, a fraction of them have let themselves be taken on a ride by a bunch of chancers that can only use rhetoric to address problems. People are addicted to confidence rather than ability and action.
Leicester_Loyal Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 We will see. The EU project is going so well in France, Germany, Greece and various other countries at the moment. Have you seen how much more money the major economies will have to stump up to cover us leaving the 27? Why are we paying £39 billion to put ourselves in a worse position. It's hilarious some of the comments on here, such as the one above about us refusing to face up to the realities of the modern world. What makes your opinion better than mine? None of us know how a no deal will affect the country. We'll see what occurs once a new leader is elected. There must be a lot of people like me who obviously refuse to face up to the realities of the situation, especially considering the BP is polling 1% behind Labour in the GE polls. PS. The country must be going to the dogs
Guest Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 3 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: We will see. The EU project is going so well in France, Germany, Greece and various other countries at the moment. Have you seen how much more money the major economies will have to stump up to cover us leaving the 27? Why are we paying £39 billion to put ourselves in a worse position. It's hilarious some of the comments on here, such as the one above about us refusing to face up to the realities of the modern world. What makes your opinion better than mine? None of us know how a no deal will affect the country. We'll see what occurs once a new leader is elected. There must be a lot of people like me who obviously refuse to face up to the realities of the situation, especially considering the BP is polling 1% behind Labour in the GE polls. PS. The country must be going to the dogs You are right there are a lot of people like you. Perhaps you could explain how things are going so badly in France. I'd like to hear it, so that I can see how well you understand the situation and therefore how much credence I can give to the rest of your views. Do you think that Britain are so strong that they can dictate trade terms with the EU, US, China? Especially from a no deal situation. Please don't see this as in any way a personal attack nor denigration. I have a general low view of humans and our understanding of complex matters, my question is to help me understand NOT to put you down.
leicsmac Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 6 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: We will see. The EU project is going so well in France, Germany, Greece and various other countries at the moment. Have you seen how much more money the major economies will have to stump up to cover us leaving the 27? Why are we paying £39 billion to put ourselves in a worse position. It's hilarious some of the comments on here, such as the one above about us refusing to face up to the realities of the modern world. What makes your opinion better than mine? None of us know how a no deal will affect the country. We'll see what occurs once a new leader is elected. There must be a lot of people like me who obviously refuse to face up to the realities of the situation, especially considering the BP is polling 1% behind Labour in the GE polls. PS. The country must be going to the dogs I admire the steadfastness shown here. However, a question: what exactly does the UK possess, in terms of either goods or service, that the rest of the world wants in sufficient quantity that it would be more advantageous to the UK to negotiate for it alone rather than as a bloc? Like FIF above, I'm genuinely curious as to what those advocating for a harder Brexit think the UK's ace-in-the-hole actually is when it comes to dealing with say, China or a Trump-ran USA with their own clear designs on nationalist supremacy.
Guest Kopfkino Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 1 minute ago, leicsmac said: I admire the steadfastness shown here. However, a question: what exactly does the UK possess, in terms of either goods or service, that the rest of the world wants in sufficient quantity that it would be more advantageous to the UK to negotiate for it alone rather than as a bloc? Like FIF above, I'm genuinely curious as to what those advocating for a harder Brexit think the UK's ace-in-the-hole actually is when it comes to dealing with say, China or a Trump-ran USA with their own clear designs on nationalist supremacy. Well I'd hazard a guess that if he supports a no deal, he's not much of a free trader anyway. But the UK could sign away agriculture for example in return for increased access to the US market for UK services. Tbf I don't really know enough about China's trade policy to know what they'd want but the UK could again secure more access for its services. I'm not saying that's an optimal thing to do but its an option. The general point being is it 'better' to negotiate as a bloc because its more powerful or is it better to negotiate alone with the ability to leverage facets of your trade policy more easily and actually have a debate over trade policy?
Guest Kopfkino Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 20 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: We will see. The EU project is going so well in France, Germany, Greece and various other countries at the moment. Have you seen how much more money the major economies will have to stump up to cover us leaving the 27? Why are we paying £39 billion to put ourselves in a worse position. It's hilarious some of the comments on here, such as the one above about us refusing to face up to the realities of the modern world. What makes your opinion better than mine? None of us know how a no deal will affect the country. We'll see what occurs once a new leader is elected. There must be a lot of people like me who obviously refuse to face up to the realities of the situation, especially considering the BP is polling 1% behind Labour in the GE polls. PS. The country must be going to the dogs Okay, convince me otherwise that it is a fully thought through position that acknowledges the implications. What is the problem with the Withdrawal Agreement? What are the benefits of leaving without a deal? What happens at the Irish border? In the event of no deal, what does our future relationship with the EU look like and how do we get there?
Buce Posted 24 May 2019 Posted 24 May 2019 35 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said: We will see. The EU project is going so well in France, Germany, Greece and various other countries at the moment. Have you seen how much more money the major economies will have to stump up to cover us leaving the 27? Why are we paying £39 billion to put ourselves in a worse position. It's hilarious some of the comments on here, such as the one above about us refusing to face up to the realities of the modern world. What makes your opinion better than mine? None of us know how a no deal will affect the country. We'll see what occurs once a new leader is elected. There must be a lot of people like me who obviously refuse to face up to the realities of the situation, especially considering the BP is polling 1% behind Labour in the GE polls. PS. The country must be going to the dogs 3 Because so far opinion is all you've given - you haven't substantiated it with reasoned argument.
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